A TRIBUTE TO SEGUN ODEGBAMI - AFRICA'S GREATEST NO 7

[Catalyst]

1naija again have you seen Segun play live?

This is the problem I see with the arguement for Segun's greatness i.e. NOSTALGIA!!!

That my friend is NEVER good enough to endorse one as great.

NOSTALGIA

Main Entry: nos·tal·gia
Pronunciation: nä-'stal-j&, n&- also no-, nO-; n&-'stäl-
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin, from Greek nostos return home + New Latin -algia; akin to Greek neisthai to return, Old English genesan to survive, Sanskrit nasate he approaches
1 : the state of being homesick : HOMESICKNESS
2 : a wistful or excessively sentimental yearning for return to or of some past period or irrecoverable condition; also : something that evokes nostalgia

http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?b ... =nostalgia

[SUYA]

Fegwu

Sharrrap my fren -- while you have the dictionary out put it to good use and find the correct spelling of "arguement". After all before this thread you thought Odegbami was an ex running back for the Cleveland Browns.

[paj]

paj,

The misquote was my mistake - when I launched "edit" instead of "quote". I have removed the mistake and the reply to it. The post I intended is now up there, above. Sorry about the mishap.

..and umm..what happened to MY post? BIA..HACKER STILL DEY HIA?
Pa

[Sampo]

paj,

The misquote was my mistake - when I launched "edit" instead of "quote". I have removed the mistake and the reply to it. The post I intended is now up there, above. Sorry about the mishap.

..and umm..what happened to MY post? BIA..HACKER STILL DEY HIA?
Pa

Yours was a response to MY mistake. I was the one that misquoted. Both of them had to go in the cleanup... NO, it was not the cracker This explains my apology.

[1naija]

TO ME MILLA, KAMARA, CHUKWU, HASSAN OR RAZAK CARRIES AS MUCH UMPF AS WHOMEVER. DRIBBLE NA DRIBBLE AND GOAL NA GOAL. KPOM KWEM !

So what part of my conclussion that Odegbami was a great local champion do you disagree with.

I SAW HIM 4 TIMES PLAYING FOR IICC, NIGERIA, NIGERIA AND NIGERIA - SEE ABOVE FOR GREAT PLAYERS and you can add Owusu to that list.

Again, this validates my conclussion that he was a great local champion.

....... afterall Odegbami and co used to think the same way when they played against Tunisia, Algeria and Egypt.
>>>THAT IS NOT TRUE. THE ONLY DAFTNESS IN HIM IS WHEN HE SPEAKS ABOUT IGBOS... AND FOR THE RECORD NIGERIA POSTED A WINNING RECORD AGAINST ALL NORTH AFRICANS TEAMS EXCEPT 1 DURING HIS REGIN.....ITS JUST THAT THEY LOST THE MOST IMPORTANT ONES.

Algeria's overall win record against Nigeria is 6 - 4. Four of their six wins were against the Odegbami Green Eagles. Odegbami used to destroy and mesmerize teams like Upper Volta, Uganda and Tanzania, and then freeze against Tunisia, Morrocco and Algeria. I am sure you saw that live.


sampo, you are wrong to assume that everyone that does not agree with you that Odegbami was the greatest player on the planet is young, or did not see him play.

[Sampo]

sampo, you are wrong to assume that everyone that does not agree with you that Odegbami was the greatest player on the planet is young, or did not see him play.

1naija,

Where did you get that assertion from? You haven't answered those who posed the question to you. Now you turned this way.. Slow down on the fabrication.. (underlined above). What I wrote was to hint on some sources of proper documentation of Odegbami - for those who might have missed out on a glimpse of him and sincerely want to find out. Can you point out where I stated the above - either implicitly or tacitly? This thread is a tribute to Africa's Greatest No 7 - which is what you dispute. You believe this to be Finidi George. The majority appear to disagree with you on this.

[SUYA]

1naija.....stop frying dodo without fire we are 3-4 and 2 ties against Algeria lifetime so where does this 4-6 come from. And since when did Algeria make up all of North Africa?

[Enugu II]

NOTES:

The Algerian team that Odegbami played against was perhaps Algeria's best ever squad including Lakhdar Belloumi and Rabah Madjer who went on to beat Germany 2-1 in the WC in 1982 (?). Just for perspective.

As for results against African teams, let it be known that Finidi's SE had a 1-1 record against Sierra Leone.

Thus, what do we make of those results?

[SUYA]

E2 may your children gown up to be tall and smart like their Father.......but arent your reaching a little too far with names like Lakhdar Belloumi and Rabah Madjer with 1naija? I mean not only are they not blond but he does not recognize Milla, Kamara and Owusu. However the posting the NGR - SL head to head is priceless !!!

[ROSSIKE]

NOTES:

The Algerian team that Odegbami played against was perhaps Algeria's best ever squad including Lakhdar Belloumi and Rabah Madjer who went on to beat Germany 2-1 in the WC in 1982 (?). Just for perspective.

Enugu, thank you very much for that reminder.

You see, that Algerian team of the early 80s was world class. You had to be a world class team to beat Germany in 1982.

Tunisia, whom only qualified narrowly at our expense in 1978, gave a very good account of themselves, beating Mexico 3-1 in the opening stages.

Or what about the Camerounian squad of 1982? They were a strong team that represented the continent creditably, by not losing a single game, even against the world's best sides.

What characterises those three teams I've mentioned is their credible performances on the international stage, and their collective familiarity, and intense fear, of the defence splitting skills of Segun Odegbami.

If Mathematical could scare THEM, you bet he would double scare the rest of the soccer world - if they'd met him.

[theDunamis]

NOTES:

The Algerian team that Odegbami played against was perhaps Algeria's best ever squad including Lakhdar Belloumi and Rabah Madjer who went on to beat Germany 2-1 in the WC in 1982 (?). Just for perspective.

Enugu, thank you very much for that reminder.

You see, that Algerian team of the early 80s was world class. You had to be a world class team to beat Germany in 1982.

Tunisia, whom only qualified narrowly at our expense in 1978, gave a very good account of themselves, beating Mexico 3-1 in the opening stages.

Or what about the Camerounian squad of 1982? They were a strong team that represented the continent creditably, by not losing a single game, even against the world's best sides.

What characterises those three teams I've mentioned is their credible performances on the international stage, and their collective familiarity, and intense fear, of the defence splitting skills of Segun Odegbami.

If Mathematical could scare THEM, you bet he would double scare the rest of the soccer world - if they'd met him.

You guys are making too much sense. Please stop. Don't you guys know that world class players only play in Europe and against Finidi - Logic de 1Naija!!!!

[Globero]

sampo, you are wrong to assume that everyone that does not agree with you that Odegbami was the greatest player on the planet is young, or did not see him play.

1naija,

Where did you get that assertion from? You haven't answered those who posed the question to you. Now you turned this way.. Slow down on the fabrication.. (underlined above). What I wrote was to hint on some sources of proper documentation of Odegbami - for those who might have missed out on a glimpse of him and sincerely want to find out. Can you point out where I stated the above - either implicitly or tacitly? This thread is a tribute to Africa's Greatest No 7 - which is what you dispute. You believe this to be Finidi George. The majority appear to disagree with you on this.

I may not be considered part of the majority as my opinion falls more in line with 1naija's take on Finidi George. Odegbami did his thing but just as was postulated Finidi also did his and then qualified us agaunst the same Algerian teams you guys are arguing about. Finidi was the best #7 in the world at a time and that, my friends deserves more respect that you can ever give to Odegbami since he never achieved anything more than Finidi did. No if's, no but's, no maybe's - it just did'nt happen .

[Catalyst]

Fegwu

Sharrrap my fren -- while you have the dictionary out put it to good use and find the correct spelling of "arguement". After all before this thread you thought Odegbami was an ex running back for the Cleveland Browns.

Sorry sir

[1naija]

sampo, you are wrong to assume that everyone that does not agree with you that Odegbami was the greatest player on the planet is young, or did not see him play.

1naija,

Where did you get that assertion from? You haven't answered those who posed the question to you. Now you turned this way.. Slow down on the fabrication.. (underlined above). What I wrote was to hint on some sources of proper documentation of Odegbami - for those who might have missed out on a glimpse of him and sincerely want to find out. Can you point out where I stated the above - either implicitly or tacitly? This thread is a tribute to Africa's Greatest No 7 - which is what you dispute. You believe this to be Finidi George. The majority appear to disagree with you on this.

I may not be considered part of the majority as my opinion falls more in line with 1naija's take on Finidi George. Odegbami did his thing but just as was postulated Finidi also did his and then qualified us agaunst the same Algerian teams you guys are arguing about. Finidi was the best #7 in the world at a time and that, my friends deserves more respect that you can ever give to Odegbami since he never achieved anything more than Finidi did. No if's, no but's, no maybe's - it just did'nt happen .

Globero, why are you making sense? Do you want SUYA to ask you how many times you saw Odegbami and IICC take on Rangers in the early 70s when 4 corners equalled one goal?

EII, the Odegbami Eagles lost to Zimbabwe and Uganda several times, and never beat Siera Leone in Freetown either so I don't know what difference the fact that the Finidi Eagles lost Sierra Leone makes. By the same token we can say the Odegbami Eagles never beat Spain, Bulgaria, or Greece, however, they did get spanked 3 - 0 by Iceland.

I agree with all you that Odegbami was great so I still don't understand the purpose of this debate. Is it the local Champion label that is bothering you guys? There is nothing you can do to change now, so just accept it for what it is. The man was a great local champion, period.

[Enugu II]

sampo, you are wrong to assume that everyone that does not agree with you that Odegbami was the greatest player on the planet is young, or did not see him play.

1naija,

Where did you get that assertion from? You haven't answered those who posed the question to you. Now you turned this way.. Slow down on the fabrication.. (underlined above). What I wrote was to hint on some sources of proper documentation of Odegbami - for those who might have missed out on a glimpse of him and sincerely want to find out. Can you point out where I stated the above - either implicitly or tacitly? This thread is a tribute to Africa's Greatest No 7 - which is what you dispute. You believe this to be Finidi George. The majority appear to disagree with you on this.

I may not be considered part of the majority as my opinion falls more in line with 1naija's take on Finidi George. Odegbami did his thing but just as was postulated Finidi also did his and then qualified us agaunst the same Algerian teams you guys are arguing about. Finidi was the best #7 in the world at a time and that, my friends deserves more respect that you can ever give to Odegbami since he never achieved anything more than Finidi did. No if's, no but's, no maybe's - it just did'nt happen .

Globero:

I just had to respond to this one (particularly the highlight in red). I bet you understand that the Cameroonian team that Finidi's SE had so much trouble against was easily pulverized by the Onyeanwuna's and Brodericks. There is a simple lesson on the above -- countries change.

While Cameroon was certainly not a force in the era of Onyeanwuna and Brodericks (note that in those days the likes of Ethiopia, Egypt, and Ghana ruled), they are today. While Algeria was a major team during the days of Odegbami they were simply not at that level when Finidi came along.

[Enugu II]

sampo, you are wrong to assume that everyone that does not agree with you that Odegbami was the greatest player on the planet is young, or did not see him play.

1naija,

Where did you get that assertion from? You haven't answered those who posed the question to you. Now you turned this way.. Slow down on the fabrication.. (underlined above). What I wrote was to hint on some sources of proper documentation of Odegbami - for those who might have missed out on a glimpse of him and sincerely want to find out. Can you point out where I stated the above - either implicitly or tacitly? This thread is a tribute to Africa's Greatest No 7 - which is what you dispute. You believe this to be Finidi George. The majority appear to disagree with you on this.

I may not be considered part of the majority as my opinion falls more in line with 1naija's take on Finidi George. Odegbami did his thing but just as was postulated Finidi also did his and then qualified us agaunst the same Algerian teams you guys are arguing about. Finidi was the best #7 in the world at a time and that, my friends deserves more respect that you can ever give to Odegbami since he never achieved anything more than Finidi did. No if's, no but's, no maybe's - it just did'nt happen .

Globero, why are you making sense? Do you want SUYA to ask you how many times you saw Odegbami and IICC take on Rangers in the early 70s when 4 corners equalled one goal?

EII, the Odegbami Eagles lost to Zimbabwe and Uganda several times, and never beat Siera Leone in Freetown either so I don't know what difference the fact that the Finidi Eagles lost Sierra Leone makes. By the same token we can say the Odegbami Eagles never beat Spain, Bulgaria, or Greece, however, they did get spanked 3 - 0 by Iceland.

I agree with all you that Odegbami was great so I still don't understand the purpose of this debate. Is it the local Champion label that is bothering you guys? There is nothing you can do to change now, so just accept it for what it is. The man was a great local champion, period.

1Naija:

If does not make a difference (which I agree), then why bring those comparisons up in the first place. What matters really is what each of those players while in the GWG of the SE. Fortunately, I saw both of them play and my take is that while it is arguable that they truly played the same position (because of role differences), if one must compare it seems clear to me that Odegbami was a better player and his personal laurels in similar contexts (AFOY etc) shows that. I bet that when CAF voted for its players of the millenium they were aware of Finidi's accomplishments but instead they chose to nominate Odegbami as Africa's best #7 in the past millenium.

[theYemster]

As much as it pains me to admit it, to a large extent I have to agree with the tribalist...Finidi was much better than Big Seg.

Somehow though, I can't help but wonder if 1naija's reason has less to do with the fact that Finidi was actually better and more to do with something else.

BTW 1naija by your reasoning can we safely conclude that your hero Amodu was also a local champion since he never excelled against the better teams while Pa Oni did try a tad...hmm?

[1naija]

As much as it pains me to admit it, to some extent I have to agree with the tribalist...Finidi was much better than Big Seg.

Somehow though, I can't help but wonder if 1naija's reason has less to do with the fact that Finidi was actually better and more to do with something else.

BTW 1naija by your reasoning can we safely conclude that your hero Amodu was also a local champion since he never excelled against the better teams while Pa Oni did try a tad...hmm?

Please, don't poison this thread with your venom.

I don't think you know what the word tribalist means, or you would realise that you are more a tribalist than I can ever be. You can't point to a single person from my tribe that I have I promoted on this forum, but your record speaks for itself. I don't have time for you so you can go #$%$ yourself as usual. FvCKING *kindperson*!

[theYemster]

As much as it pains me to admit it, to some extent I have to agree with the tribalist...Finidi was much better than Big Seg.

Somehow though, I can't help but wonder if 1naija's reason has less to do with the fact that Finidi was actually better and more to do with something else.

BTW 1naija by your reasoning can we safely conclude that your hero Amodu was also a local champion since he never excelled against the better teams while Pa Oni did try a tad...hmm?

Please, don't poison this thread with your venom.

I don't think you know what the word tribalist means, or you would realise that you are more a tribalist than I can ever be. You can't point to a single person from my tribe that I have I promoted on this forum, but your record speaks for itself. I don't have time for you so you can go #$%$ yourself as usual. FvCKING *kindperson*!

I take that as a yes. Don't hate the messenger dude, hate the message...but then again, it's more or less your message so go figure. 8)

Happy New Year.

[Sampo]

I may not be considered part of the majority as my opinion falls more in line with 1naija's take on Finidi George. Odegbami did his thing but just as was postulated Finidi also did his and then qualified us agaunst the same Algerian teams you guys are arguing about. Finidi was the best #7 in the world at a time and that, my friends deserves more respect that you can ever give to Odegbami since he never achieved anything more than Finidi did. No if's, no but's, no maybe's - it just did'nt happen .

Globero,

The majority that I refer to transcend people on this thread or on the forum, even as most here agree. When CAF's Team of the Century was being selected, in spite of the relatively recent career of Finidi (and in spite of this World XI), why do you think they still chose Mathematical?

Simple! Because they saw both of them in action, knew better and rated players from Africa on greater criteria than who played in Europe or made it to the WC. Another miscue is to use Green Eagles' fall on the last berths (on each occasion of Africa WC qualifiers during Odegbami's time) as equivalent to the man's lack of ability in any of the criteria used in making the selection.

[Gotti]

Those who have argued on this thread that Segun Odegbami never played against "world-class" players really mean to say that he did not play against European and South American players -- because there were tons of "world-class" African players domiciled in Africa during the Odegbami era. In fact, virtually EVERY "world-class" African player of that era was domiciled in Africa.

The Camerounian team that proved it "world-class" bona fides by going unbeaten at the 1982 WC was almost entirely (if not entirely) homebased and could not even get past the group stage at that year's ANC. And I am reasonably certain that if Roger Milla did not come out semi-retirement to dazzle at the 1990 WC, many herein would confine him to "local champion" status.
______________________________
.

[Sampo]

Something also springs to mind regarding Odegbami's era: the quality of non-African oppositions he had to play against and how he fared.

Anyone remember the Brazilian Tours of 1977 or '78 - when Pele / Fluminense came to play friendlies with the elite Nigerian clubs? With the dazzling wizardry of those South Americans, our local top clubs still held their own. In particular, I remember Shooting Stars playing a draw with a world-class field of those Fluminense players. Guess what, nothing stopped Odegbami from playing true to character.

The same could be said of his performances in the Green Eagles' appearances at Moscow Olympics in 1980 - where one would agree that Eagles had an overall poor tournament. Very seldom did he just totally disappear against opponents, even in losses. Those touchline dribble runs and cut-in crosses were always his trademarks. That is, when he didn't go on to threaten the goalkeepers directly. PaJ is right that many arguing here are only looking at the statistical results of Green Eagles' matches to the total exclusion of the match performances. People remember the players' names and idolize them for their on-field real performances. Odegbami more than proved himself in this aspect and he was recognized throughout the continent for them.

[1naija]

Those who have argued on this thread that Segun Odegbami never played against "world-class" players really mean to say that he did not play against European and South American players -- because there were tons of "world-class" African players domiciled in Africa during the Odegbami era. In fact, virtually EVERY "world-class" African player of that era was domiciled in Africa.

The Camerounian team that proved it "world-class" bona fides by going unbeaten at the 1982 WC was almost entirely (if not entirely) homebased and could not even get past the group stage at that year's ANC. And I am reasonably certain that if Roger Milla did not come out semi-retirement to dazzle at the 1990 WC, many herein would confine him to "local champion" status.
______________________________
.

Well, you can't sit in Enugu or Ibadan and declare yourself world class. You have to compete against world class players to be called world class. If the 1982 Eagles were so great, why is it that it was the weak Cameroonian team that went to the WC instead?

This debate is about Odegbami, not Roger Milla. If you want us to discuss Roger Milla's greatness, start a thread about it or resurrect the existing thread on the topic.