Shearer: Only one world class player in the EPL

[Bigpokey24]

Ozil and Mikel are worldclass

[deanotito]

This is a bit of a circular argument. By Shearer's standards, I don't think any of the top leagues have more than 3 players in that category. Germany probably has Manuel Neuer; Spain has Messi, Ronaldo & Neymar. England has Aguero & Courtois. Italy has ......no one.

So, by these standards, there are only 6 World Class players in Europe?? I think pundits get overly emotional in their assessments sometimes, and Shearer is obviously no exception.

[Coach]

^De Gea wipes the floor with Courtois, twice on match-day.

[deanotito]

^De Gea wipes the floor with Courtois, twice on match-day.

Ok, throw in De Gea to replace Courtois. Still at 2

[cic old boy]

This is a bit of a circular argument. By Shearer's standards, I don't think any of the top leagues have more than 3 players in that category. Germany probably has Manuel Neuer; Spain has Messi, Ronaldo & Neymar. England has Aguero & Courtois. Italy has ......no one.

So, by these standards, there are only 6 World Class players in Europe?? I think pundits get overly emotional in their assessments sometimes, and Shearer is obviously no exception.

Germany - Alaba, Xabi Alonso, Robben, Phillip Lahm, Marco Reus, ...

Spain - Iniesta, Suarez. Pique, Modric, Kroos, Ramos, ...

[paj]

^De Gea wipes the floor with Courtois, twice on match-day.

We'd see about that now that we've refurbished our bus

[metalalloy]

This is a bit of a circular argument. By Shearer's standards, I don't think any of the top leagues have more than 3 players in that category. Germany probably has Manuel Neuer; Spain has Messi, Ronaldo & Neymar. England has Aguero & Courtois. Italy has ......no one.

So, by these standards, there are only 6 World Class players in Europe?? I think pundits get overly emotional in their assessments sometimes, and Shearer is obviously no exception.

Germany - Alaba, Xabi Alonso, Robben, Phillip Lahm, Marco Reus, ...

Spain - Iniesta, Suarez. Pique, Modric, Kroos, Ramos, ...

Aubameyang, and Lewandowksi arguably.
Griezmann, Bale

[deanotito]

This is a bit of a circular argument. By Shearer's standards, I don't think any of the top leagues have more than 3 players in that category. Germany probably has Manuel Neuer; Spain has Messi, Ronaldo & Neymar. England has Aguero & Courtois. Italy has ......no one.

So, by these standards, there are only 6 World Class players in Europe?? I think pundits get overly emotional in their assessments sometimes, and Shearer is obviously no exception.

Germany - Alaba, Xabi Alonso, Robben, Phillip Lahm, Marco Reus, ...

Spain - Iniesta, Suarez. Pique, Modric, Kroos, Ramos, ...

Shearer said:

‘For me it means a player who consistently performs at the highest level and has done for many years, and a player who could get into any of the recognised top-five teams in the world.

‘Someone who influences virtually every game he plays in. A player who grabs occasions, chances, titles, opportunities by the scruff of the neck.


I say:

If we're to take Shearer's definition seriously, and De Bruyne, Costa, Ozil, Zlatan don't make the cut, I have a hard time arguing for any others in Spain besides Messi, Ronaldo & Neymar. In Germany, have a hard time arguing for anyone beyond Neuer.

[kalamashaka]

All of this is just what each of us thinks or how we feel...it's not as if there is an objective criteria to decide what's 'world class' or not...or even what anyone means when they say 'world class, no?

P.S. Which teams (club & int'l) would not have Koscielny?

Kos is at the Arse b/c the big boys don't want him.

meh! Opinions...funny things, ain't they(?)

[cic old boy]

Shearer said:

‘For me it means a player who consistently performs at the highest level and has done for many years, and a player who could get into any of the recognised top-five teams in the world.

‘Someone who influences virtually every game he plays in. A player who grabs occasions, chances, titles, opportunities by the scruff of the neck.


I say:

If we're to take Shearer's definition seriously, and De Bruyne, Costa, Ozil, Zlatan don't make the cut, I have a hard time arguing for any others in Spain besides Messi, Ronaldo & Neymar. In Germany, have a hard time arguing for anyone beyond Neuer.

The people I mentioned tick the first box - they are already at the top five teams. Xabi Alonso for e.g has played for 2 of them, won WCs and Euros. Iniesta ticks both boxes. Watch Barca when he doesn't play and you would recognise his influence. Players like Alaba and Lahm would walk into any team in the world, including Barca and Real.

[cic old boy]

meh! Opinions...funny things, ain't they(?)

But it is a fact that the big boys take the Arse's best players - Henry, Fab, RVP, Nasri, Clichy, Song, etc. Kos doesn't figure on their radar b/c of his level.

[kalamashaka]

meh! Opinions...funny things, ain't they(?)

But it is a fact that the big boys take the Arse's best players - Henry, Fab, RVP, Nasri, Clichy, Song, etc. Kos doesn't figure on their radar b/c of his level.

So, to follow this logic to its conclusion,that means Bergkamp, Pires, Campbell, Kanu, Kolo etc were just average players because the 'big boys' didn't take them while Nasri, Clichy, Song, Adebayor were world class players because they were taken by the 'big boys' (as starters, no less)? have a think about what you're saying here...

[cic old boy]

So, to follow this logic to its conclusion,that means Bergkamp, Pires, Campbell, Kanu, Kolo etc were just average players because the 'big boys' didn't take them while Nasri, Clichy, Song, Adebayor were world class players because they were taken by the 'big boys' (as starters, no less)? have a think about what you're saying here...

Only Kanu and Bergkamp were world class on your list and they came to the Arse after not cutting it at big boys Inter.

[kalamashaka]

As said above they dumped Makelele, they dumped Robben, they dumped quite a few great players.

Those two are world class. Ozil is not.

wait o! but you said being dumped by Madrid was a sign of a lack of 'worldclassness', no? There are exceptions now?

[kalamashaka]

So, to follow this logic to its conclusion,that means Bergkamp, Pires, Campbell, Kanu, Kolo etc were just average players because the 'big boys' didn't take them while Nasri, Clichy, Song, Adebayor were world class players because they were taken by the 'big boys' (as starters, no less)? have a think about what you're saying here...

Only Kanu and Bergkamp were world class on your list and they came to the Arse after not cutting it at big boys Inter.

So being dumped or not being taken by a 'big boy' from 'small boy' Arsenal did not affect their world class status?

What about the ones that were taken by a 'big boy', was that proof of their worldclasstasticness as you implied earlier?

*just following your own logic*

[cic old boy]

wait o! but you said being dumped by Madrid was a sign of a lack of 'worldclassness', no? There are exceptions now?

There are exceptions to every rule. But, no matter, how you slice and dice it, Ozil was let go by Madrid b/c they didn't think he cut the mustard at their level.

[cic old boy]

So being dumped or not being taken by a 'big boy' from 'small boy' Arsenal did not affect their world class status?

What about the ones that were taken by a 'big boy', was that proof of their worldclasstasticness as you implied earlier?

*just following your own logic*

You are mixing things up. The Arse usually lose their best players to the big boys. I gave several examples. You came up with the likes of Bergy and Kanu who didn't leave for big clubs. But that could be b/c they had stepped won to come to the Arse and were burnt by their experience with the big boys. Fact still remains, once an Arse player gets to a certain level, the big boys take him away. The ones that usually remain, are not that special.

[kalamashaka]

So being dumped or not being taken by a 'big boy' from 'small boy' Arsenal did not affect their world class status?

What about the ones that were taken by a 'big boy', was that proof of their worldclasstasticness as you implied earlier?

*just following your own logic*

You are mixing things up. The Arse usually lose their best players to the big boys. I gave several examples. You came up with the likes of Bergy and Kanu who didn't leave for big clubs. But that could be b/c they had stepped won to come to the Arse and were burnt by their experience with the big boys. Fact still remains, once an Arse player gets to a certain level, the big boys take him away. The ones that usually remain, are not that special.

ha! You're all over the place...but it's cool, it's just opinions. We don't have to agree!

[kalamashaka]

wait o! but you said being dumped by Madrid was a sign of a lack of 'worldclassness', no? There are exceptions now?

There are exceptions to every rule. But, no matter, how you slice and dice it, Ozil was let go by Madrid b/c they didn't think he cut the mustard at their level.

being let go by Madrid or being taken by a big club à la Song does not necessarily say anything about the quality of a player

[cic old boy]

being let go by Madrid or being taken by a big club à la Song does not necessarily say anything about the quality of a player

So Madrid/Barca let their stars go and buy the crap instead!

[kalamashaka]

being let go by Madrid or being taken by a big club à la Song does not necessarily say anything about the quality of a player

So Madrid/Barca let their stars go and buy the crap instead!

Why don't you address what I actually said(?)

[kalamashaka]

[quote="cic old boy"[/quote]Fact still remains, once an Arse player gets to a certain level, the big boys take him away. The ones that usually remain, are not that special.[/quote]

So, just to recap, Adebayor, Nasri, Clichy, Song etc had reached that 'certain level' of worldclassness (seeing as they went to starters at a 'big boy') that the likes of Ozil and Koscielny have not attained?

[cic old boy]

Why don't you address what I actually said(?)

I followed what you said to its logical conclusion!