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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:17 pm 
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airwolex wrote:
ohsee wrote:
airwolex wrote:

Why is Kelechi any different? Because he is more talented? From what I know about the Nigerian system there's every likelihood he falsified his age. That's why I think he should start playing for Nigeria NOW.

Mumu, go and sit down in the corner. You don't even understand what I just told you.


You don't understand jack baba...so Kelechi is different because why? He's in ManCity? You are so naive it beggars belief. :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:


Nna, na some of yous dey cause di wahala... come with your over the top anecdotes...

No one is saying that age cheating does not exist.

In Kelechi's case, he must have started far back to begin the falsification... because we watched him grow...

You come bring up a story about a security guard that fiam, he issues himself a passport that drops his age by purportedly 13 years... yes, he can do that because he was not on a national radar. Jos like my maiguard can drop his own age... but the moment your guy claims he played for the Naijarian national team or the "greater tomorrow" teams he don timestamp his age be dat.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:22 pm 
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skillful wrote:
If their is no substantial evidence to prove age cheating then we should leave the topic. On a personal note if i was a player and my true age and people were saying am overage I would put it to bed by posting my birth certificate and and the school I attended. If we cant get info on somebody born in the last 20 years............we should be called 4th world :D


That is not how it works.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:39 pm 
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FATHER TIKO wrote:
CIC, you still dey argue your case with physical appearance?

And your attempt to compare the photos of Sterling & Kelechi flies in the face of all logic.
Sterling's small physique suggests very few players look younger than him; even players who are much younger (again, the danger of using physical appearance to ascertain age)

Put Sterling & Ibe side by side, I'm willing to bet, you CIC, would argue that Ibe is older than Sterling.

My brother, no one is trying to force the age thing down your throat.

My worry is why you prefer to dismiss overwhelming evidence against your perception of Kelechi's age.

:lol: :lol: Father T, you either rule pics out or you rule them in. You were all cheering when pics alleging Kelechi as 13 when they were taken were posted. The pic of Sterling didn't really show his stature - it was a portrait.

Ibe looks to be in Sterling's age group - he is just a year younger. Kelechi looks much older than both!

This ish can be put to rest if we knew a bit more about Kelechi's background. If his folks were relatively comfortable, chances are he would have started school at 5/6 and left secondary school at 15/16. That would be more reliable than trying to insist that MRI scans mean we have minimised the problem to 1% or something.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:43 pm 
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ohsee wrote:
None of the statements you make above are worthy of comment. You simply continue to apply a vast generalization to all cases, including a specific case where your vast generalization is a huge stretch. No one is denying that there is fraud. But you are denying that there can be any genuine cases.

:lol: But you are generalising about MRI scans in a country where we can't say with any honesty that the scans were done properly! Genuine cases are possible, my argument is about the probability of those cases. We all saw a genuine U-17 being told he failed the test! :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:47 pm 
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Cellular wrote:
skillful wrote:
If their is no substantial evidence to prove age cheating then we should leave the topic. On a personal note if i was a player and my true age and people were saying am overage I would put it to bed by posting my birth certificate and and the school I attended. If we cant get info on somebody born in the last 20 years............we should be called 4th world :D


That is not how it works.

How does it work ?

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 5:52 pm 
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ohsee wrote:
Ah. If your agenda were simply to tell the truth that you don't know how old Kelechi is, you would say it and leave it at that. Your agenda in all this debate has been clear, and it is not only to cast doubt on his declared age, but to also insinuate that he is older. That is very different from a neutral statement that we just don't know. In fact, later on in the paragraph above, you contradict yourself and state your agenda clearly: "For me it is a safer bet to think he is older." That there is what you have been trying to do all thread with your terribly weak stereotyping argument. So be careful. You are accusing our footballers of age fraud. There is also something known as intellectual dishonesty or fraud. :idea:

Nna, go back to all my posts here. The first two or three were jokes. A few others were about whether Sterling's tweet was age-related. When I started talking about Kelechi's age, I always made clear that I didn't know his real age, but if I had to bet I would bet he was older. While I'm only interested in the truth, I can look at the known facts and circumstances and suggest what I think is more likely.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 6:23 pm 
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cic old boy wrote:
FATHER TIKO wrote:
CIC, you still dey argue your case with physical appearance?

And your attempt to compare the photos of Sterling & Kelechi flies in the face of all logic.
Sterling's small physique suggests very few players look younger than him; even players who are much younger (again, the danger of using physical appearance to ascertain age)

Put Sterling & Ibe side by side, I'm willing to bet, you CIC, would argue that Ibe is older than Sterling.

My brother, no one is trying to force the age thing down your throat.

My worry is why you prefer to dismiss overwhelming evidence against your perception of Kelechi's age.

:lol: :lol: Father T, you either rule pics out or you rule them in. You were all cheering when pics alleging Kelechi as 13 when they were taken were posted. The pic of Sterling didn't really show his stature - it was a portrait.

Ibe looks to be in Sterling's age group - he is just a year younger. Kelechi looks much older than both!

This ish can be put to rest if we knew a bit more about Kelechi's background. If his folks were relatively comfortable, chances are he would have started school at 5/6 and left secondary school at 15/16. That would be more reliable than trying to insist that MRI scans mean we have minimised the problem to 1% or something.


You don dey shift goal-posts now o!

Na who start him argument with physical appearance?
What has been the basis of my argument since this thread started?

Judging age solely on the basis of physical appearance is a no-no!!
Remember my example of Rooney.

The photos were simply to show you the paucity of your argument; that even using your own basis, Kelechi's physical appearance, measured over a certain time-line, negates your perception of his age.
Apparently, that clear evidence still wasn't sufficient for you.

Ibe looks more mature than Sterling in my book.
If he had grown up in 9ja, I'll wager, you'll doubt he's younger than Sterling.
That's the unreliability of judging age solely by physical appearance.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 6:54 pm 
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I have one question o. Can we now judge age by pictures? For several years we were told you can't tell a person's age by pictures but all of a sudden pictures have become indisputable facts. The fact is some of these players have siblings so we should be able to estimate their ages based on their siblings ages. Abi?

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:33 pm 
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airwolex wrote:
Samora Machel wrote:
airwolex wrote:
Nigerians cheat at every age grade competition. You can't do things like that and act indignant when you are called out, that's not reasoning properly, that's being obnoxious.

Only last week I spoke to a local coach in the Ikeja area that has a youth club and he confirmed that the cheating is still going on and they are all powerless to stop it.

I don't know why the footballers on this forum are quiet on this issue but I know several Basketballers including one that still plays for this Country who falsified their ages.

For basketball the incentive is to go to America (first high school then College). If they can make a career of it fine if they can't they get their papers. You can't begrudge them because most are dirt poor and it's better to be an age cheat than a drug mule.

I know of a guy who's 28 and went back to high school as a 15 year old. If I posted his picture here you would think he was closer to 15 than 28, is that the kind of guy that a Basketball fan should be excited about as a future star? Jokers!

My advise for him was that once he got there on no account should he touch any of the highschool girls, remember you are old enough to be their father. Good thing he is a smart boy...or man.


Chief is this a joke :lol: :lol: :lol:


I'm dead serious...fantastic hardworking guy, was playing bball and was a security guard in a bank on a salary of about 150 dollars a month, I didn't even know he was that old till he told me. I was happy that he finally got a visa after almost 7 years of trying . TBH I thought he was 22 so I was blown away when he told me his age, to be a 28 year old and have to pretend to be 15 amongst guys young enough to be your nephew is horrible. Should be finishing soon and no...this is not an aberration. I honestly think people like Damunk do not know the scale of the cheating and that's why he gives guys the benefit of the doubt.
Actually I don't give the 'benefit of the doubt' without good reason. Giving everyone the benefit of the doubt is just as silly as painting everyone with the same brush and sticking with it, come what may.
By now we should all be able to be more objective.

The numerous MRI tests, the very public career progression backed up by photographs and the video evidence chronicling the lives of this batch of kids - and specifically the young man in question, Kelechi - and seeing them physically grow before our very eyes should be enough to cause any reasonable person to back off from an entrenched position, based on history. And even if we know it is still happening at the local level,we also KNOW that those kids wont get past the heavy-duty U17 screening once it gets to the national and international level any more.

God, if we were to think this way in our various professions, we'd all have been sacked and replaced by younger, more open-minded individuals, nurtured on evidence-based practice a long time ago!

How can anyone be using what applied to Osondu, Dimeji Lawal and more recently Chukwudi to a kid that has gone through a whole batch of checks and controls, both locally and by FIFA?

This 'I must be right' rigidity of thought, believing one is in control of the rights and wrongs of the Universe is a sure sign of senility.
Y'all are too young for this!!!! :taunt: :taunt: :taunt: :taunt: :taunt:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:38 pm 
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1naija wrote:
I have one question o. Can we now judge age by pictures? For several years we were told you can't tell a person's age by pictures but all of a sudden pictures have become indisputable facts. The fact is some of these players have siblings so we should be able to estimate their ages based on their siblings ages. Abi?
Since when?
Who do you see here using pictures as indisputable 'fact'? Are you a Disinformant? :taunt:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:53 pm 
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1naija wrote:
I have one question o. Can we now judge age by pictures? For several years we were told you can't tell a person's age by pictures but all of a sudden pictures have become indisputable facts. The fact is some of these players have siblings so we should be able to estimate their ages based on their siblings ages. Abi?

Uncle comot here go and find somewhere to sit jo :boo:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:56 pm 
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A well organized & sensible nation does not rely on MRIs & "photographs and video evidence " to prove the age of its citizens

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 8:42 pm 
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YemiBrazil wrote:
1naija wrote:
I have one question o. Can we now judge age by pictures? For several years we were told you can't tell a person's age by pictures but all of a sudden pictures have become indisputable facts. The fact is some of these players have siblings so we should be able to estimate their ages based on their siblings ages. Abi?

Uncle comot here go and find somewhere to sit jo :boo:


Na jealousy and Guilty conscience dey do you. Picture or no picture your own age is set...67

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:33 pm 
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airwolex wrote:
ohsee wrote:
airwolex wrote:

Why is Kelechi any different? Because he is more talented? From what I know about the Nigerian system there's every likelihood he falsified his age. That's why I think he should start playing for Nigeria NOW.

Mumu, go and sit down in the corner. You don't even understand what I just told you.


You don't understand jack baba...so Kelechi is different because why? He's in ManCity? You are so naive it beggars belief. :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

My friend, and you are so dense it beggars belief. Have you read the thread? We have been making arguments for 13 pages that HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH WHETHER KELECHI IS AT MAN CITY OR NOT, OR WHETHER HE IS TALENTED OR NOT.

Mumu, I have asked you to tackle those arguments, arguments that make a case for why this U-17 team should be seen differently, but goofs like you come and post without caring to find out what has already been said. READ THE THREAD, THEN COME AND ARGUE AGAINST THE POINTS RAISED instead of producing the usual thoughtless and stupid generalizations. At least cic has been trying to argue against the evidence that has been produced. Jeez.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:41 pm 
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cic old boy wrote:
ohsee wrote:
None of the statements you make above are worthy of comment. You simply continue to apply a vast generalization to all cases, including a specific case where your vast generalization is a huge stretch. No one is denying that there is fraud. But you are denying that there can be any genuine cases.

:lol: But you are generalising about MRI scans in a country where we can't say with any honesty that the scans were done properly! Genuine cases are possible, my argument is about the probability of those cases. We all saw a genuine U-17 being told he failed the test! :lol:

You are still making the sort of bad arguments that would make any reasonable person laugh. I don't need to point them out, they will be obvious to everyone but you.

You need to provide evidence that the scans done before the U-17 WC were all flawed, because that is what you are arguing. The fact that subsequent FIFA random scans turned up NOTHING--as opposed to previous WCs--says you are dead wrong. Now you deal with that instead of obfuscating.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:47 pm 
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Damunk wrote:

God, if we were to think this way in our various professions, we'd all have been sacked and replaced by younger, more open-minded individuals, nurtured on evidence-based practice a long time ago!

How can anyone be using what applied to Osondu, Dimeji Lawal and more recently Chukwudi to a kid that has gone through a whole batch of checks and controls, both locally and by FIFA?

This 'I must be right' rigidity of thought, believing one is in control of the rights and wrongs of the Universe is a sure sign of senility.
Y'all are too young for this!!!! :taunt: :taunt: :taunt: :taunt: :taunt:

:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
Oga Dokita,
Abeg, help me to told dem. :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:49 pm 
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Rawlings wrote:
A well organized & sensible nation does not rely on MRIs & "photographs and video evidence " to prove the age of its citizens

This is 100% true. But we don't have any choice now, do we?

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 10:48 pm 
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ohsee wrote:
Rawlings wrote:
A well organized & sensible nation does not rely on MRIs & "photographs and video evidence " to prove the age of its citizens

This is 100% true. But we don't have any choice now, do we?


Oga,
we are waiting for you to take over the reigns of govt and effect a change
..at least you seem to have your head screwed right ...unlike our current leaders

Meanwhile, I will keep using https://www.how-old.net/ to determine the age of our players. It's as good/bad as MRI :laugh:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 11:42 pm 
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Let's be clear what the issue is here. The debate here id not Kelechi is 34 but is claiming to be 16 like some our past U17 defenders that used to tae kwon do messi in our 18. Those were extreme cases that I believe till this day should be investigated by ICPC. I think Iheanacho is in his late 20s and is no gaddem 18 years old. And as someone who has played soccer at the highest level (Bay Area soccer league and the Clear Lake co-ed league I can tell you first hand that there is no difference in performance for a 18 year old talented player and a 28 year old talented player. So I can authoritatively say no amount of pictures can make you tell the difference between a 28 year old and a 18 year. Now once you start entering your early 30 like. Our 16 years old prodigy that's a different story. And I can attest to this as a30 year old going on 31.

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Last edited by 1naija on Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 11:47 pm 
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Adokie's article on the 2013 U-17 team:


http://www.punchng.com/sports/penetrati ... ver-cheat/

U17 WC 2013: Why, then, did we ever cheat?

NOVEMBER 10, 2013 : ADOKIYE AMIESIMAKA

This piece went to press before the scheduled final match of the FIFA U17 World Cup in the UAE last Friday between Mexico (defending champions) and Nigeria (set to win the Cup a record 4th time). Having pulverised Mexico 6-1 in our earlier encounter only a couple of weeks ago in this competition and emphatically subdued every other opposition, an upset, though possible in football, would, in the circumstances, be as unlikely as it would be unprecedented in the history of any FIFA World Cup. It was expected, therefore, that these Manu Garba-tutored 14 to 17-year olds would bring the Cup home once again.

It was so delightful to watch them play with such exuberance as would be typical of their age bracket. Conversely, their exceptional composure in critical areas in front of goal and in defence and the confidence with which they executed intricate manoeuvres belied what was supposed to be their relative inexperience. Nevertheless, I am aware that we are specially endowed and we only need to groom our players early to enable them to compete favourably with their contemporaries from other parts of the world.

Unfortunately, the flame of doubt regarding the eligibility of many of the players was stoked by the ‘NFF’ itself. Recall that within a period of only six months this year, as many of them as could have made an entire team were disqualified after complaints and protests were made locally and internationally concerning their “’NFF’-verified” ages.

Well, I want to take solace in recent assurances by our sports authorities that even FIFA attested that every member of our current squad passed the MRI test.

But even that confirmation raised serious questions for the ‘NFF’. I have seen all our controversial ‘youth teams’ since 1985 and this one would definitely rank among the best. If, indeed, our true U17s could be so dominant, why did our sports authorities consistently neglect to use them, preferring instead the self-limiting, development-stalling and reputation-damaging wrong-headed policy of using overage and ineligible players? How would it be explained that not even one of the entire current squad of players between the ages of 14 and 17 was listed as being in any secondary school?

While you may want to ponder over these questions too, let me share with you the thoughts of Most Reverend Felix Femi Ajakaye, Bishop of Ekiti Diocese of the Catholic Church, a distinguished and well-informed football fan who continued to follow our team’s progress from England where he was on an episcopal mission:

“Congratulations to you, my cherished Chief, and all the sincere stakeholders in the progress and development of the great game of football in our beloved country, Nigeria. Watching the present crop of Under-17 football team of Nigeria since the beginning of this year’s Under-17 World Cup, I can now say our effort in working for the promotion of youth football is gradually yielding fruitful results.

However, the struggle continues. We must maintain the pressure to be genuine. Yes, there is the need to get things right for things to be right with us.

We are now going to play Mexico in the final. This is a different game from the opening match in which we defeated them, 6-1. They are the defending Champions and having reached the final, they would like to believe that they can go all the way to winning the Cup. I hope our Eaglets will not be distracted by our overzealous politicians and officials of ‘NFF’.

Indeed, whatever happens, we must keep and monitor these young, skilful and talented players. They are committed and focused. They may form the crop of the future of Nigerian football. They remind me of our youthful days.

God bless Nigeria.”

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:04 am 
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Adokie article debated on CE in 2013
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=241719&start=23
Education service for the willfully ignorant.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:08 am 
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Rawlings wrote:
A well organized & sensible nation does not rely on MRIs & "photographs and video evidence " to prove the age of its citizens


and who exactly established that such information is lacking?

Where exactly is all this evidence...all I see here is baseless slander. Where are the verifiable facts.

Because objectively I see more facts supporting the youthfulness of Kelechi Iheanacho, than the nonexistent evidence against him.

We cannot launch so called investigations...based on sentiments and rhetoric.

Furthermore the ABSENCE of information is not the VALIDATION of the naysayers. A man is not guilty, simply on the basis of not having an alibi. Let us see your concrete evidence. Of course this is assuming that there isn't evidence supporting Iheanacho in the first place. Let us stop making speculations.

If we do not know certain things...we do not know. It is as simple as that. We can make further probes......but it is not our job to make baseless assumptions. It is because we are not to be held accountable for our misfirings, that we feel confident in this charade.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:20 am 
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1naija wrote:
Let's be clear what the issue is here. The debate here id not Kelechi is 34 but is claiming to be 16 like some our past U17 defenders that used to tae kwon do messi in our 18. Those were extreme cases that I believe till this day should be investigated by ICPC. I think Iheanacho is in his late 20s and is no gaddem 18 years old. And as someone who has played soccer at the highest level (Bay Area soccer league and the Clear Lake co-ed league I can tell you first hand that there is no difference in performance for a 18 year old talented player and a 28 year old talented player. So I can authoritatively say no amount of pictures can make you tell the difference between a 28 year old and a 18 year. Now once you start entering your early 30 like. Our 16 years old prodigy that's a different story. And I can attest to this as a30 year old going on 31.
Good you are 30 turning 31 . Wow,nature must have cheated you so badly . How come you look like you are in your late 60s . Obviously, life has not been very fair to you. No wonder you are always sad . Your incessant sadness is definitely justifiable


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