Louis Van Gaal Not At Fault for Man Utd Problems

[tfco]

I guess Van Gaal will be the first coach in the world that's not at fault for his team's problems over a season of 50+ games. He's not working in a unique environment neither can he declare force majeure. Are injuries responsible for the often idiotic play on the pitch? Even LVG won't absolve himself in this way.

you are so anti-LVG, you must be lapping up what you read in the media.

LVG goes and JM comes in, and then what?

Damian, CBJ, Lingard etc find themselves at Vitesse Arnheim.

How many players did Chelsea have on loan last season?

I see, we've won 3 games and scored 11 goals so it's the season even though it's been a long time coming. Out of the CL, in 5th place and any silverware is a long long way away at this point. We beat Brewery, Midtyilland and Assanal (even Stevie Wonder saw that coming). But we got clubbered by Norwich, Bournemouth, Stoke, Sunderland etc. Not to talk of our lowest goals and points in premiership history. 27 games, 44 points, 36 goals, WOW what a manager! Truth is we have been poor under Van Gaal and the fans and ex players are justified to say so. Rio broke it down...spent 250m and it's reserves that are keeping him afloat. A season transformed by injury to his first team players?? He certainly didn't plan it.

It's simple, he went and got REAL Manchester United players who know how to put teams like Assanal in their place. Rumour is that it was Giggs idea to bring Rashford into the team, there may be some truth to that given that LVG tapped Giggs after the first goal. These are core guys who know what it means to play for Man Utd. I give LVG credit for that dive next to the 4th official tho, had me in stitches. He should show up on the sidelines more.

Btw, I've never advocated for Mourinho, dunno where you got that from.

after all that essay, you still want LVG out.

Who should come in? Giggs?

[felarey]

I guess Van Gaal will be the first coach in the world that's not at fault for his team's problems over a season of 50+ games. He's not working in a unique environment neither can he declare force majeure. Are injuries responsible for the often idiotic play on the pitch? Even LVG won't absolve himself in this way.

you are so anti-LVG, you must be lapping up what you read in the media.

LVG goes and JM comes in, and then what?

Damian, CBJ, Lingard etc find themselves at Vitesse Arnheim.

How many players did Chelsea have on loan last season?

I see, we've won 3 games and scored 11 goals so it's the season even though it's been a long time coming. Out of the CL, in 5th place and any silverware is a long long way away at this point. We beat Brewery, Midtyilland and Assanal (even Stevie Wonder saw that coming). But we got clubbered by Norwich, Bournemouth, Stoke, Sunderland etc. Not to talk of our lowest goals and points in premiership history. 27 games, 44 points, 36 goals, WOW what a manager! Truth is we have been poor under Van Gaal and the fans and ex players are justified to say so. Rio broke it down...spent 250m and it's reserves that are keeping him afloat. A season transformed by injury to his first team players?? He certainly didn't plan it.

It's simple, he went and got REAL Manchester United players who know how to put teams like Assanal in their place. Rumour is that it was Giggs idea to bring Rashford into the team, there may be some truth to that given that LVG tapped Giggs after the first goal. These are core guys who know what it means to play for Man Utd. I give LVG credit for that dive next to the 4th official tho, had me in stitches. He should show up on the sidelines more.

Btw, I've never advocated for Mourinho, dunno where you got that from.

after all that essay, you still want LVG out.

Who should come in? Giggs?

LVG is the Man Utd manager, ofcourse I want him to succeed. But I'm not going to sugar coat what is a massive underachievement. If he can't achieve, then he needs to go, as Utd is not a place for mediocrity. While we're here mumbling on CE, he picks up a 100,000 pounds check every week, gets to spend 200m at his discretion over 4 months and is the manager of Man Utd. To whom much is given, much is expected.

Sir Matt Busby and Sir Alex already taught us how to play! Giggs spent 20 yrs under the tutelage of THE MASTER, how can that go wrong? Surely, it would have been a better investment to allow Giggs to learn the ropes than allowing LVG to learn as we're doing now. Truth is LVG wasn't brought in for him to grow.

[Kabalega]

ManU fans are spoiled brats! They deserve Mourinho who will ship the likes of Rashford, Memphis and Martial off to Everton, et al.

[felarey]

ManU fans are spoiled brats! They deserve Mourinho who will ship the likes of Rashford, Memphis and Martial off to Everton, et al.

The same way he shipped off Carvalho, Varane, Hazard, Cech, Ozil, Mikel etc. to Everton right???

[wiseone]

Please not Giggs. Appointing Giggs would be an ever bigger mistake than appointing Moyes. Giggs has a grand total of 3 games of management experience. His time as assistant-manager has actually hurt his chances of being manager IMO. There are two possible conclusions:

1) Giggs is an influential member of LVG's staff and has great input into team selection and tactics (which makes him culpable for the bad results); or

2) Giggs has little or no input into team selection and tactics. In which case why on earth would you appoint someone that cannot influence the club where he is the deputy commander?

If playing under Ferguson for several years is a qualification to manage Man Utd, then Roy Keane, Mark Hughes, Steve Bruce, Bryan Robson, Paul Ince, Solskjaer, and Alex McLeish are all better options than Giggs; because at least they have more experience than he does of managing a team in the EPL!

LVG is the Man Utd manager, ofcourse I want him to succeed. But I'm not going to sugar coat what is a massive underachievement. If he can't achieve, then he needs to go, as Utd is not a place for mediocrity. While we're here mumbling on CE, he picks up a 100,000 pounds check every week, gets to spend 200m at his discretion over 4 months and is the manager of Man Utd. To whom much is given, much is expected.

Sir Matt Busby and Sir Alex already taught us how to play! Giggs spent 20 yrs under the tutelage of THE MASTER, how can that go wrong? Surely, it would have been a better investment to allow Giggs to learn the ropes than allowing LVG to learn as we're doing now. Truth is LVG wasn't brought in for him to grow.

[tfco]

cue the comparison to Pep G.....

Please not Giggs. Appointing Giggs would be an ever bigger mistake than appointing Moyes. Giggs has a grand total of 3 games of management experience. His time as assistant-manager has actually hurt his chances of being manager IMO. There are two possible conclusions:

1) Giggs is an influential member of LVG's staff and has great input into team selection and tactics (which makes him culpable for the bad results); or

2) Giggs has little or no input into team selection and tactics. In which case why on earth would you appoint someone that cannot influence the club where he is the deputy commander?

If playing under Ferguson for several years is a qualification to manage Man Utd, then Roy Keane, Mark Hughes, Steve Bruce, Bryan Robson, Paul Ince, Solskjaer, and Alex Macleish are all better options than Giggs; because at least they have more experience than he does of managing a team in the EPL!

LVG is the Man Utd manager, ofcourse I want him to succeed. But I'm not going to sugar coat what is a massive underachievement. If he can't achieve, then he needs to go, as Utd is not a place for mediocrity. While we're here mumbling on CE, he picks up a 100,000 pounds check every week, gets to spend 200m at his discretion over 4 months and is the manager of Man Utd. To whom much is given, much is expected.

Sir Matt Busby and Sir Alex already taught us how to play! Giggs spent 20 yrs under the tutelage of THE MASTER, how can that go wrong? Surely, it would have been a better investment to allow Giggs to learn the ropes than allowing LVG to learn as we're doing now. Truth is LVG wasn't brought in for him to grow.

[tfco]

ManU fans are spoiled brats! They deserve Mourinho who will ship the likes of Rashford, Memphis and Martial off to Everton, et al.

did you watch the game?

all those hoof balls to Fellaini ....yuck

[felarey]

Please not Giggs. Appointing Giggs would be an ever bigger mistake than appointing Moyes. Giggs has a grand total of 3 games of management experience. His time as assistant-manager has actually hurt his chances of being manager IMO. There are two possible conclusions:

1) Giggs is an influential member of LVG's staff and has great input into team selection and tactics (which makes him culpable for the bad results); or

2) Giggs has little or no input into team selection and tactics. In which case why on earth would you appoint someone that cannot influence the club where he is the deputy commander?

If playing under Ferguson for several years is a qualification to manage Man Utd, then Roy Keane, Mark Hughes, Steve Bruce, Bryan Robson, Paul Ince, Solskjaer, and Alex Macleish are all better options than Giggs; because at least they have more experience than he does of managing a team in the EPL!

LVG is the Man Utd manager, ofcourse I want him to succeed. But I'm not going to sugar coat what is a massive underachievement. If he can't achieve, then he needs to go, as Utd is not a place for mediocrity. While we're here mumbling on CE, he picks up a 100,000 pounds check every week, gets to spend 200m at his discretion over 4 months and is the manager of Man Utd. To whom much is given, much is expected.

Sir Matt Busby and Sir Alex already taught us how to play! Giggs spent 20 yrs under the tutelage of THE MASTER, how can that go wrong? Surely, it would have been a better investment to allow Giggs to learn the ropes than allowing LVG to learn as we're doing now. Truth is LVG wasn't brought in for him to grow.

You are making up a lose-lose situation for him and then saying he lost. Bottomline is the likes of Sir Alex and Sir Bobby have never made a decision to put anyone other than Giggs amongst the ex players to be in charge of Man Utd. In terms of understanding the footballing curriculum, non of those players were around for up to 5 great teams Sir Alex built at Old Trafford so Giggs stands out in that regard. Could anyone have done better than Van Gaal? Nothing suggests we're better of now than under Moyes, results wise. Atleast Moyes got to the final rounds of the CL and had more points in the league.
My bet is Giggs couldn't have done much worse armed with our known curriculum and the support system around him, plus 250m. Sir Alex is still very much alive. We are a working man's team not a conventional European team that relies on stars. The Matt Busby ethos as well as Ferguson's is to assemble some young men that want to play football. Instead we sold the likes of Danny Welbeck (a local lad) and a host of first team players and are now losing our identity. Essentially, we've bet the whole farm on LVG and have nothing yet to show for it.

[wiseone]

Putting a guy with no experience of management in charge of one of the biggest clubs in the world, that is struggling to live up to its past reputation is not a very good idea. Before anyone shouts "Guardiola", he is one in a million! The world is littered with great players who became awful managers (Shearer, Gullit, Charlton, Robson, Maradona etc).

Everyone seems to think Giggs is qualified to coach Man Utd simply because he was a great player and played under SAF. So what?! Giggs is a big gamble. It is better to appoint him when the club has gone through a period of stability and success when the pressure is less. Appointing him now when the club is in transitional phase, struggling to carry the Glazer debt, and needs Champions League football as bad as a crackhead needs crack, is too much pressure.

"In terms of understanding the footballing curriculum, non of those players were around for up to 5 great teams Sir Alex built at Old Trafford" - Paul Scholes and Gary Neville?

You are making up a lose-lose situation for him and then saying he lost. Bottomline is the likes of Sir Alex and Sir Bobby have never made a decision to put anyone other than Giggs amongst the ex players to be in charge of Man Utd. In terms of understanding the footballing curriculum, non of those players were around for up to 5 great teams Sir Alex built at Old Trafford so Giggs stands out in that regard. Could anyone have done better than Van Gaal? Nothing suggests we're better of now than under Moyes, results wise. Atleast Moyes got to the final rounds of the CL and had more points in the league.
My bet is Giggs couldn't have done much worse armed with our known curriculum and the support system around him, plus 250m. Sir Alex is still very much alive. We are a working man's team not a conventional European team that relies on stars. The Matt Busby ethos as well as Ferguson's is to assemble some young men that want to play football. Instead we sold the likes of Danny Welbeck (a local lad) and a host of first team players and are now losing our identity. Essentially, we've bet the whole farm on LVG and have nothing yet to show for it.

[Enugu II]

I guess Van Gaal will be the first coach in the world that's not at fault for his team's problems over a season of 50+ games. He's not working in a unique environment neither can he declare force majeure. Are injuries responsible for the often idiotic play on the pitch? Even LVG won't absolve himself in this way.

But isn't it refereshing that other factors, besides tactics, may explain a team's poor performance. The most simplistic thing is to always blame tactics and the coach. It gets old, you know.

[YemiBrazil]

Putting a guy with no experience of management in charge of one of the biggest clubs in the world, that is struggling to live up to its past reputation is not a very good idea. Before anyone shouts "Guardiola", he is one in a million! The world is littered with great players who became awful managers (Shearer, Gullit, Charlton, Robson, Maradona etc).

Everyone seems to think Giggs is qualified to coach Man Utd simply because he was a great player and played under SAF. So what?! Giggs is a big gamble. It is better to appoint him when the club has gone through a period of stability and success when the pressure is less. Appointing him now when the club is in transitional phase, struggling to carry the Glazer debt, and needs Champions League football as bad as a crackhead needs crack, is too much pressure.

"In terms of understanding the footballing curriculum, non of those players were around for up to 5 great teams Sir Alex built at Old Trafford" - Paul Scholes and Gary Neville?

You are making up a lose-lose situation for him and then saying he lost. Bottomline is the likes of Sir Alex and Sir Bobby have never made a decision to put anyone other than Giggs amongst the ex players to be in charge of Man Utd. In terms of understanding the footballing curriculum, non of those players were around for up to 5 great teams Sir Alex built at Old Trafford so Giggs stands out in that regard. Could anyone have done better than Van Gaal? Nothing suggests we're better of now than under Moyes, results wise. Atleast Moyes got to the final rounds of the CL and had more points in the league.
My bet is Giggs couldn't have done much worse armed with our known curriculum and the support system around him, plus 250m. Sir Alex is still very much alive. We are a working man's team not a conventional European team that relies on stars. The Matt Busby ethos as well as Ferguson's is to assemble some young men that want to play football. Instead we sold the likes of Danny Welbeck (a local lad) and a host of first team players and are now losing our identity. Essentially, we've bet the whole farm on LVG and have nothing yet to show for it.

Wiseone, you got it all wrong - the buzz around Giggs was definitely not 'simply because he was a great player and he played under SAF'. It appears that you are not aware of certain things about Ryan Giggs and coaching. You need to read Sir Alex's biographies to have a clear understanding of why Giggs stands out in terms of eventually managing Man United.
Also, in terms of professional training and qualifications, Ryan Giggs got his UEFA 'A' and 'B' licenses before acquiring his UEFA Pro License before retirement as a player. He rose to become the most respected of the leaders among the players on and off the pitch despite some personal challenges along the line.
He won't be the first to assume this kind of role so I don't understand where this sentiment against him comes from? He has worked with Sir Alex, he worked with Moyes and he has been working with Louis van Gaal. This is no dullard - almost his entire life has been all about football, training and matches! What are we on about?

[felarey]

I guess Van Gaal will be the first coach in the world that's not at fault for his team's problems over a season of 50+ games. He's not working in a unique environment neither can he declare force majeure. Are injuries responsible for the often idiotic play on the pitch? Even LVG won't absolve himself in this way.

But isn't it refereshing that other factors, besides tactics, may explain a team's poor performance. The most simplistic thing is to always blame tactics and the coach. It gets old, you know.

I 100% blame the tactics and the coach because he controls everything over a season and has maximum support. The injuries have actually lifted some pressure of him. Ok I'll blame his players too for 2%

[felarey]

Putting a guy with no experience of management in charge of one of the biggest clubs in the world, that is struggling to live up to its past reputation is not a very good idea. Before anyone shouts "Guardiola", he is one in a million! The world is littered with great players who became awful managers (Shearer, Gullit, Charlton, Robson, Maradona etc).

Everyone seems to think Giggs is qualified to coach Man Utd simply because he was a great player and played under SAF. So what?! Giggs is a big gamble. It is better to appoint him when the club has gone through a period of stability and success when the pressure is less. Appointing him now when the club is in transitional phase, struggling to carry the Glazer debt, and needs Champions League football as bad as a crackhead needs crack, is too much pressure.

"In terms of understanding the footballing curriculum, non of those players were around for up to 5 great teams Sir Alex built at Old Trafford" - Paul Scholes and Gary Neville?

You are making up a lose-lose situation for him and then saying he lost. Bottomline is the likes of Sir Alex and Sir Bobby have never made a decision to put anyone other than Giggs amongst the ex players to be in charge of Man Utd. In terms of understanding the footballing curriculum, non of those players were around for up to 5 great teams Sir Alex built at Old Trafford so Giggs stands out in that regard. Could anyone have done better than Van Gaal? Nothing suggests we're better of now than under Moyes, results wise. Atleast Moyes got to the final rounds of the CL and had more points in the league.
My bet is Giggs couldn't have done much worse armed with our known curriculum and the support system around him, plus 250m. Sir Alex is still very much alive. We are a working man's team not a conventional European team that relies on stars. The Matt Busby ethos as well as Ferguson's is to assemble some young men that want to play football. Instead we sold the likes of Danny Welbeck (a local lad) and a host of first team players and are now losing our identity. Essentially, we've bet the whole farm on LVG and have nothing yet to show for it.

Wiseone, you got it all wrong - the buzz around Giggs was definitely not 'simply because he was a great player and he played under SAF'. It appears that you are not aware of certain things about Ryan Giggs and coaching. You need to read Sir Alex's biographies to have a clear understanding of why Giggs stands out in terms of eventually managing Man United.
Also, in terms of professional training and qualifications, Ryan Giggs got his UEFA 'A' and 'B' licenses before acquiring his UEFA Pro License before retirement as a player. He rose to become the most respected of the leaders among the players on and off the pitch despite some personal challenges along the line.
He won't be the first to assume this kind of role so I don't understand where this sentiment against him comes from? He has worked with Sir Alex, he worked with Moyes and he has been working with Louis van Gaal. This is no dullard - almost his entire life has been all about football, training and matches! What are we on about?

I was gonna talk about his qualifications too. We should remember Giggs was player-coach at one point and was in charge of the team after Moyes through pre-season until mid July when Van Gaal arrived joining them in the United States. Doesn't count...but we won that tourney

[wiseone]

YemiBrazil, and Felarey: I am not saying that Giggs can never manage Man Utd. I am saying now is not the right time to appoint him. The key part of my post was:

It is better to appoint him when the club has gone through a period of stability and success when the pressure is less. Appointing him now when the club is in transitional phase, struggling to carry the Glazer debt, and needs Champions League football as bad as a crackhead needs crack, is too much pressure.

[rasak74]

I guess Van Gaal will be the first coach in the world that's not at fault for his team's problems over a season of 50+ games. He's not working in a unique environment neither can he declare force majeure. Are injuries responsible for the often idiotic play on the pitch? Even LVG won't absolve himself in this way.

What is this idiotic play you talk about? Can you explain to us - in terms of tactical approach, in-game organization, etc - why you think it is idiotic?

Slowness moving the ball around with lots of side and back passes. Football not mature enough to penetrate organized defences. No short corners or quick free kicks for lack of imagination, hence all set pieces are sent high and forward into the box. The perfection of punting the ball up to Fellaini and playing 90 mins with 2 or 3 shots on goal on good days.

We need to go back and find our identity, football thought by Sirs Matt Busby and Alex Ferguson.

Understandable, but as you can see from our last 2 games we are no longer playing that way.
Moving forward we need to find a way to stay injury free and get a better ball winning mid like Vidal or Matuidi.

[felarey]

I guess Van Gaal will be the first coach in the world that's not at fault for his team's problems over a season of 50+ games. He's not working in a unique environment neither can he declare force majeure. Are injuries responsible for the often idiotic play on the pitch? Even LVG won't absolve himself in this way.

What is this idiotic play you talk about? Can you explain to us - in terms of tactical approach, in-game organization, etc - why you think it is idiotic?

Slowness moving the ball around with lots of side and back passes. Football not mature enough to penetrate organized defences. No short corners or quick free kicks for lack of imagination, hence all set pieces are sent high and forward into the box. The perfection of punting the ball up to Fellaini and playing 90 mins with 2 or 3 shots on goal on good days.

We need to go back and find our identity, football thought by Sirs Matt Busby and Alex Ferguson.

Understandable, but as you can see from our last 2 games we are no longer playing that way.
Moving forward we need to find a way to stay injury free and get a better ball winning mid like Vidal or Matuidi.

Hmmmnn... can we be sure about that? When Schweinstieger, Rooney and Schneiderlin are back on the pitch at the same time and we don't do that, I'll believe. For now, seems like we got lucky with some youngsters that went wild on the pitch. Can't trust a man that dove to the floor yet held on to his binder in such manner to change easily Mr. Philosophy is old school and very steadfast to his philosophy. In his mind, it's keeping the ball to control the game but we need results.

[tfco]

away at Chelsea - the game was not slow and tepid.

[Kabalega]

All ManU has to do is speed up their transition time. They did it against Arsenal (see the number of one touch passes). With speedy Gonzales' in Martial, Lingaard, Memphis, Januzaj, and now Rashford, they will score boat loads of goals.

Finally put a smile on Fergie.

[wiseone]

Notice that most of those players have not been in the team long enough to be infected by LVG's philosophy. They have not had their individuality coached out of them.

All ManU has to do is speed up their transition time. They did it against Arsenal (see the number of one touch passes). With speedy Gonzales' in Martial, Lingaard, Memphis, Januzaj, and now Rashford, they will score boat loads of goals.

Finally put a smile on Fergie.

[tfco]

All ManU has to do is speed up their transition time. They did it against Arsenal (see the number of one touch passes). With speedy Gonzales' in Martial, Lingaard, Memphis, Januzaj, and now Rashford, they will score boat loads of goals.

Finally put a smile on Fergie.

you watched. I see.

[marko]

can we al agree Morinho will never give these kids any opportunities, definitely not the manager we need

[cic old boy]

The same Fergie that WE are now calling the "master" was facing protests in his 1st three years at Manure.

For those of WE that have nothing to do with Manchester, "ta ra" is northern English slang for goodbye.

LVG should come good given the time. He took over a very mediocre team. Like everyone else he had hits and misses in the transfer market. But when you sign new players esp from abroad they need to time to adjust - Henry, Bergkamp and Drogba, none of them hit the ground running.

[wiseone]

I do not agree with the bolded text. He now manages a mediocre squad, but that was his doing (by getting rid of his best players). LVG had a team with:

1) The best winger in the world not called Ronaldo or Messi, who had just played in the World Cup final and who had just won the Champions League (and was MOTM in the CL final).

2) A player who was Chelsea's best player and two-time consecutive player of the year.

3) A player who was Arsenal's best player and the EPL top scorer two seasons earlier.

4) Some of the best young English players in the country (Welbeck, Smalling, Keane, Jones, Zaha).

WE are now calling the "master" was facing protests in his 1st three years at Manure.

For those of WE that have nothing to do with Manchester, "ta ra" is northern English slang for goodbye.

LVG should come good given the time. He took over a very mediocre team. Like everyone else he had hits and misses in the transfer market. But when you sign new players esp from abroad they need to time to adjust - Henry, Bergkamp and Drogba, none of them hit the ground running.