Welcome to the EPL Señor Guardiola...

[theYemster]

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

So Man U should not be 6th by your budget context.

The fact that United misspent their budget doesn't in any way downplay the huge advantage Pep clearly benefited from.

Both Barca and Bayern are still winning their respective leagues since he left. That says a lot.

[theYemster]

Welcome history maker.

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

Please stop. Put some respect on his name. He is amazing.

Him being amazing and him having the advantage of benefiting from a deep wallet aren't mutually exclusive.

Both can be true.

[theYemster]

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

So Man U should not be 6th by your budget context.

If money was everything Alexis Sanchez would be tearing up everything right now.

Your logic only proves that overpaying for a player doesn't necessarily guaranty success; it doesn't however disprove my point that Pep's successes at those three clubs occurred after he outspent his rivals.

I didn't say it happened BECAUSE he outspent others; we won't/can't know that unless/until he wins with a smaller budget than his rivals.

Hence why I said, context is everything.

[Mr. Piffington]

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

So Man U should not be 6th by your budget context.

If money was everything Alexis Sanchez would be tearing up everything right now.

Your logic only proves that overpaying for a player doesn't necessarily guaranty success; it doesn't however disprove my point that Pep's successes at those three clubs occurred after he outspent his rivals.

I didn't say it happened BECAUSE he outspent others; we won't/can't know that unless/until he wins with a smaller budget than his rivals.

Hence why I said, context is everything.

I measure Pep differently. I look at the his teams play and how the dominate their opponents, I don’t care much for trophies.

[Coach]

@Yem, remember when United were breaking British transfer records left, right and centre? Never a doubt on Ferguson’s genius. At one point, weren’t United the biggest club in the world? No less a genius.

[cic old boy]

The fact that United misspent their budget doesn't in any way downplay the huge advantage Pep clearly benefited from.

Both Barca and Bayern are still winning their respective leagues since he left. That says a lot.

So the context is not just the budget but spending it well. Very soon, you will come to coaching your expensive players well. Like Cruyff said, I never saw a bag of money score a goal.

[theYemster]

@Yem, remember when United were breaking British transfer records left, right and centre? Never a doubt on Ferguson’s genius. At one point, weren’t United the biggest club in the world? No less a genius.

Fergie won the UCL with a bunch of academy kids. If I remember correctly the only big money players in their ranks back then were Cantona and Cole, and I believe Cantona retired before they won the UCL and was replaced by Dwight Yorke.

His subsequent teams were big money teams yes but that was largely to counter Chelsea/Abramovich. That said, as I stated earlier, Fergie unlike Pep already proved he could do it without the obscene expenditure.

[cic old boy]

Fergie won the UCL with a bunch of academy kids. If I remember correctly the only big money players in their ranks back then were Cantona and Cole, and I believe Cantona retired before they won the UCL and was replaced by Dwight Yorke.

His subsequent teams were big money teams yes but that was largely to counter Chelsea/Abramovich. That said, as I stated earlier, Fergie unlike Pep already proved he could do it without the obscene expenditure.

Not true. Apart from Cole, other big money signings included Stam, Yorke. The academy kids were Neville, Becks, Giggs, and Butt. The mainstay of that team - Keane, Schmeichel, Irwin were not from the academy. Pep won at Barca with mainly academy players too. You don't need to spend obscene money if your academy produces Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, etc.

[nemi2002]

Like Cryuff said, he has never seen a bag of money scorr a goal, neither has anyone here.

Pep is exceptional.

[Mr. Piffington]

@Yem, remember when United were breaking British transfer records left, right and centre? Never a doubt on Ferguson’s genius. At one point, weren’t United the biggest club in the world? No less a genius.

This is the crux of the issue. Nobody was crying when Ferguson’s United were winning and dominating for years but now that their reign is over it means the end of football.

[slyk]

Welcome history maker.

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

Please stop. Put some respect on his name. He is amazing.

Him being amazing and him having the advantage of benefiting from a deep wallet aren't mutually exclusive.

Both can be true.

Yes he has had money (a lot of it) to spend at all his clubs just as SIr Alex at United, Jose at Chelsea, Mancini and Pelligrini at City, Klopp at Liverpool. Pray tell which of all the aforementioned has ever won EVERYTHING on offer in England (Community Shield, Premier League, League Cup and FA Cup) while playing some of the best football on the planet. I say again, put some respect on his name.

[Coach]

Did Ferguson have financial advantage over his counterparts before the dawn of the Oligarchs?

[theYemster]

Fergie won the UCL with a bunch of academy kids. If I remember correctly the only big money players in their ranks back then were Cantona and Cole, and I believe Cantona retired before they won the UCL and was replaced by Dwight Yorke.

His subsequent teams were big money teams yes but that was largely to counter Chelsea/Abramovich. That said, as I stated earlier, Fergie unlike Pep already proved he could do it without the obscene expenditure.

Not true. Apart from Cole, other big money signings included Stam, Yorke. The academy kids were Neville, Becks, Giggs, and Butt. The mainstay of that team - Keane, Schmeichel, Irwin were not from the academy. Pep won at Barca with mainly academy players too. You don't need to spend obscene money if your academy produces Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, etc.

I didn't mean he only had academy kids in the team, I meant they formed a major part of the team he won with.

Gibbs, Phil Neville, Gary Neville, Beckham, Scholes, Butt, and youngster Olé who wasn't from the academy but still a kid nonetheless. Schmeichel was not a big money buy. Yes Staam and Keane were. Yorke came as replacement for Cantona. And unlike the United kids who were all brought into the academy under Fergie, Please Pep inheritted Messi, Iniesta and Xavi. Yes technically they came thru the academy but they were all stars and big money earners in the team when Pep took over. Messi was arguably the best player in Spain by then so please it's not the same.

Almost every player on the City team (certainly every starter) is a big money player. It's not the same.

And do not forget that Fergie already won titles including the CWC at Aberdeen beating European heavyweights. It's note worthy that since Fergie left both Aberdeen and United and both teams have struggled whereas both Barca and Bayern haven't missed a beat since Pep left. Their records before, during and after Pep are almost statistically identical.

Also, the fact that UEFA is on City's a$$ regarding FFP is also quite telling.

Anyways this isn't supposed to be a knock on Pep's abilities, just like I said, putting some context into that tweet.

[theYemster]

@Yem, remember when United were breaking British transfer records left, right and centre? Never a doubt on Ferguson’s genius. At one point, weren’t United the biggest club in the world? No less a genius.

This is the crux of the issue. Nobody was crying when Ferguson’s United were winning and dominating for years but now that their reign is over it means the end of football.

People were complaining as well, you just didn't pay attention.

That aside, I've not said Fergie and United didn't also spend obscene money, I said he also won with a bunch of academy kids as well.

[theYemster]

Like Cryuff said, he has never seen a bag of money scorr a goal, neither has anyone here.

Pep is exceptional.

If that's the case you might as well toss Papa Ajasco into the lineup.

Point Cruyff was making is that the players still had to deliver on the pitch. This is true, but it sure increases the odds of that performing if you buy most of the top players in the market.

[theYemster]

Welcome history maker.

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

Please stop. Put some respect on his name. He is amazing.

Him being amazing and him having the advantage of benefiting from a deep wallet aren't mutually exclusive.

Both can be true.

Yes he has had money (a lot of it) to spend at all his clubs just as SIr Alex at United, Jose at Chelsea, Mancini and Pelligrini at City, Klopp at Liverpool. Pray tell which of all the aforementioned has ever won EVERYTHING on offer in England (Community Shield, Premier League, League Cup and FA Cup) while playing some of the best football on the planet. I say again, put some respect on his name.

I've said the same about Chelsea. And Mancini and Pellegrini are both under the and City brush I paint Pep with. Never reckoned with their success at City.

Liverpool unlike the rest that mainly just had a wealthy benefactor, actually raised most the funds they spent and they more often than not spent wisely. They made smart investments buying low and selling high on players like Torres, Suarez, Coutinho. Klopp if you must know actually won back to back Bundesliga titles defeating the mighty Bayern juggernaut with one of the youngest squads ever and setting league records along the way. He's the last non Bayern coach to win it in close to a decade not to mention making three UCL finals now. Pep hasn't done that without the benefit of Messi, arguably the best (or second best) player in the world for over a decade.

[kajifu]

@Yem, remember when United were breaking British transfer records left, right and centre? Never a doubt on Ferguson’s genius. At one point, weren’t United the biggest club in the world? No less a genius.

This is the crux of the issue. Nobody was crying when Ferguson’s United were winning and dominating for years but now that their reign is over it means the end of football.[/quote
Not true people complain,may be you did not notice it

[kajifu]

Welcome history maker.

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

Please stop. Put some respect on his name. He is amazing.

Him being amazing and him having the advantage of benefiting from a deep wallet aren't mutually exclusive.

Both can be true.

Yes he has had money (a lot of it) to spend at all his clubs just as SIr Alex at United, Jose at Chelsea, Mancini and Pelligrini at City, Klopp at Liverpool. Pray tell which of all the aforementioned has ever won EVERYTHING on offer in England (Community Shield, Premier League, League Cup and FA Cup) while playing some of the best football on the planet. I say again, put some respect on his name.

I've said the same about Chelsea. And Mancini and Pellegrini are both under the and City brush I paint Pep with. Never reckoned with their success at City.

Liverpool unlike the rest that mainly just had a wealthy benefactor, actually raised most the funds they spent and they more often than not spent wisely. They made smart investments buying low and selling high on players like Torres, Suarez, Coutinho. Klopp if you must know actually won back to back Bundesliga titles defeating the mighty Bayern juggernaut with one of the youngest squads ever and setting league records along the way. He's the last non Bayern coach to win it in close to a decade not to mention making three UCL finals now. Pep hasn't done that without the benefit of Messi, arguably the best (or second best) player in the world for over a decade.

Well said,people failed to notice that Pep has succeed because he outspend the rest not saying he is not a great coach.Barca never miss him,Barca is doing fine since he left,they have won the CL something he has not done since he left Barca 8 years ago.Bayern won everything before he step in there and they never repeat it while he was there for 3 years.
Before him at city Mancini and Pellegrini were there and won league breaking records also while playing the best football in the league.

[slyk]

I've said the same about Chelsea. And Mancini and Pellegrini are both under the and City brush I paint Pep with. Never reckoned with their success at City.

Liverpool unlike the rest that mainly just had a wealthy benefactor, actually raised most the funds they spent and they more often than not spent wisely. They made smart investments buying low and selling high on players like Torres, Suarez, Coutinho. Klopp if you must know actually won back to back Bundesliga titles defeating the mighty Bayern juggernaut with one of the youngest squads ever and setting league records along the way. He's the last non Bayern coach to win it in close to a decade not to mention making three UCL finals now. Pep hasn't done that without the benefit of Messi, arguably the best (or second best) player in the world for over a decade.

So in a nutshell you are saying Pep is nothing special and has indeed done nothing special by winning everything in England this season. A simple yes or no will suffice here.

[slyk]

Welcome history maker.

Probably also the first manager to have back to back biggest budget in those leagues as well.

Context is everything.

Please stop. Put some respect on his name. He is amazing.

Him being amazing and him having the advantage of benefiting from a deep wallet aren't mutually exclusive.

Both can be true.

Yes he has had money (a lot of it) to spend at all his clubs just as SIr Alex at United, Jose at Chelsea, Mancini and Pelligrini at City, Klopp at Liverpool. Pray tell which of all the aforementioned has ever won EVERYTHING on offer in England (Community Shield, Premier League, League Cup and FA Cup) while playing some of the best football on the planet. I say again, put some respect on his name.

I've said the same about Chelsea. And Mancini and Pellegrini are both under the and City brush I paint Pep with. Never reckoned with their success at City.

Liverpool unlike the rest that mainly just had a wealthy benefactor, actually raised most the funds they spent and they more often than not spent wisely. They made smart investments buying low and selling high on players like Torres, Suarez, Coutinho. Klopp if you must know actually won back to back Bundesliga titles defeating the mighty Bayern juggernaut with one of the youngest squads ever and setting league records along the way. He's the last non Bayern coach to win it in close to a decade not to mention making three UCL finals now. Pep hasn't done that without the benefit of Messi, arguably the best (or second best) player in the world for over a decade.

Well said,people failed to notice that Pep has succeed because he outspend the rest not saying he is not a great coach.Barca never miss him,Barca is doing fine since he left,they have won the CL something he has not done since he left Barca 8 years ago.Bayern won everything before he step in there and they never repeat it while he was there for 3 years.
Before him at city Mancini and Pellegrini were there and won league breaking records also while playing the best football in the league.

What are you going on about? Tell me which coach in England has ever won all the trophies on offer in a season. That is what Pep is being hailed for. Not because he won the league or he played fine soccer or he won the FA Cup. He won EVERYTHING. Yes spent money, a lot if it but so have many other before him but no one has ever won EVERYTHING. Argue all you want but he stands alone in that regard whether you like it or not.

[Chief Ogbunigwe]

@ The Yemster....we also need to put in context when BIG money became an issue in football. That is the era that the likes of Pep found themselves in.
Remember when Sir Alex, and to some extent, AW could get any player they wanted, even from EPL clubs, just because of their reputations and club's accomplishments? Remember Vidic once proclaiming that he was ready to trek to Manchester when he heard Sir Alex was interested in him?

Now the only way to get the best players is spend some MONEY!

[theYemster]

The fact that United misspent their budget doesn't in any way downplay the huge advantage Pep clearly benefited from.

Both Barca and Bayern are still winning their respective leagues since he left. That says a lot.

So the context is not just the budget but spending it well. Very soon, you will come to coaching your expensive players well. Like Cruyff said, I never saw a bag of money score a goal.

Pay attention, the context is the budget. United's failures despite also having a huge budget was mentioned as if somehow that negates the advantage Pep has had with the teams he's coached. It doesn't. The fact that United is struggling despite also having a huge budget is irrelevant. That's like trying to prove a negative.

Like I posted, none of those two former Pep teams have missed a beat since he left. Compare their records/performance before, during, and after Pep. Bayern's still winning the Bundesliga; Barca's still winning the La Liga. Compare with Dortmund since Klopp left, and Aberdeen/United since Fergie left. Compare Liverpool before Klopp with during Klopp. He's reached a European final in back to back to back seasons and just set a record on number of points in the league despite being a close runner up. And yeah, his team isn't under threat of sanctions from UEFA for financial doping.

[theYemster]

I've said the same about Chelsea. And Mancini and Pellegrini are both under the and City brush I paint Pep with. Never reckoned with their success at City.

Liverpool unlike the rest that mainly just had a wealthy benefactor, actually raised most the funds they spent and they more often than not spent wisely. They made smart investments buying low and selling high on players like Torres, Suarez, Coutinho. Klopp if you must know actually won back to back Bundesliga titles defeating the mighty Bayern juggernaut with one of the youngest squads ever and setting league records along the way. He's the last non Bayern coach to win it in close to a decade not to mention making three UCL finals now. Pep hasn't done that without the benefit of Messi, arguably the best (or second best) player in the world for over a decade.

So in a nutshell you are saying Pep is nothing special and has indeed done nothing special by winning everything in England this season. A simple yes or no will suffice here.

In a nutshell I'm saying his record that was posted earlier in this thread about winning back to back titles in the different leagues should be put in its proper context.

Never said he's not special, in fact I believe I said we won't know for sure until he accomplishes something while not having a huge advantage over his rivals. Other coaches I mentioned have done it, Pep hasn't...yet!