Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by Waffiman »

Enugu II wrote:
Waffiman wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:
Waffiman wrote:
For the players, the end of the club versus country conflict is what they really welcome.

It won't end it. Managers will want the players to rest in the summer.

This is IMO an issue that is sure to come up. It comes up for the Olympics that takes place in the summer. However, the clubs would have to make the same argument against players who also play in the Euro.
It comes up because Olympics is not a FIFA sanctioned tournament. Clubs can stop their players from playing in Olympics because they are not forced by FIFA to comply.

Some African players were already passing up on the ANC cos clubs were putting their livelihoods in danger. For me, the summer move it as much more to do with summer ANC, than a desire to unify the world football calendar.
Waffi,

But clubs complained about CAF which was FIFA-sanctioned and also held in an international window for tournaments. It did not stop the complaints.
Yes, they complained but could not stop the players if called up. If players refused to go play, FIFA stopped the players from playing for club.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by Enugu II »

Waffiman wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Waffiman wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:
Waffiman wrote:
For the players, the end of the club versus country conflict is what they really welcome.

It won't end it. Managers will want the players to rest in the summer.

This is IMO an issue that is sure to come up. It comes up for the Olympics that takes place in the summer. However, the clubs would have to make the same argument against players who also play in the Euro.
It comes up because Olympics is not a FIFA sanctioned tournament. Clubs can stop their players from playing in Olympics because they are not forced by FIFA to comply.

Some African players were already passing up on the ANC cos clubs were putting their livelihoods in danger. For me, the summer move it as much more to do with summer ANC, than a desire to unify the world football calendar.
Waffi,

But clubs complained about CAF which was FIFA-sanctioned and also held in an international window for tournaments. It did not stop the complaints.
Yes, they complained but could not stop the players if called up. If players refused to go play, FIFA stopped the players from playing for club.
Waffi,

But the issue is not their ability to stop the player. Ohenhen1 points out that club v country row will not end i.e. the clubs will;l continue to complain even if they are not able to stop it. After all they were not able to stop players from AFCON but their complaints led to change from March to January and now from January to June. The issue is will complaints and whinning ever stop?
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by folem »

Enugu II wrote:
folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:This story captures the issues. Staying on 2-year cycle is clearly a recognition of the revenue issue that I had mentioned.
E II.

Thinking that a 2 year cycle means double revenue is simplistic. A 4 year cycle means at last 1 year to sell/market match packages and paraphernalia, more publicity and fan attention. It will ultimately lead to tourist packages for the event. In the long term you will probably get 4 times the current revenue stream that is based mainly on TV revenue projections.
folem,

Haba, you are not thinking like a sponsor. So if you are the big boss of Total Oil you will agree for CAF to move to 4-year cycle and forgo an advertising cycle that would have brought you attention for more periods in millions of bedrooms? Instead, you will gladly take the 4-year cycle without requesting a renegotiation or some plow back of your money? Total is glad that you are not representing them for sure.

No CEO worth his salt will do that. I guarantee you. Everyone is focused on making AFCON the same as Euro and Copa but not thinking of the business side which brings you that football. Well, some people will and do think of the business side.

Moreover, CAF has possibly accounted for dollars of Total money and its use for its other competitions going forward. With a dramatic change to less competition and the likely shortfall, CAF can only meet those commitments by finding additional sources of revenue to support its current outlay or ditch a 4-cycle plan. It seems to me that CAF has planned to stay safe instead of take the risk. I am not stating that this choice is better, instead it shows that this CAF management is not betting on itself to do better in terms of revenue.

JUST A NOTE
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If your analogy were to be true, FIFA will be holding WC every year, IOC will do same for summer Olympics (similar to ITF Davis Cup or WR 7s). The only way that will be possible will be to scrap qualifiers. If we desire inclusive qualifiers that all MA's participate in especially as some want the smaller teams play more competitive matches then qualifiers take up almost 15 months keeping in mind club football local/international engagements as well as friendlies. The spectacle of CAN is diminished by inadequate preparations, marketing and facilities. Expansion to 24 teams will make this even more obvious. The need to boost local tourism and the economy is also necessary and this will be enhanced with a 6-7 year preparation time for host countries. Total for example have CHAN and the club competitions in the sponsorship bag.

The issue of whining by clubs vs national teams will never stop but will continously be managed. The club's also think about pre season when players play national competitions post season. Players get injured on national duty but clubs are left to manage. FIFA now pay clubs for using their players at its flagship competition. It will be CAF doing same sooner rather than later as more revenue flow into its coffers.

If any of the ff nations were to bid to host WC; Morocco, Tunisia, Nigeria, Egypt, Angola: what dates will be in the proposals to FIFA?
Last edited by folem on Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by fabio »

Waffiman wrote:
All changes.

Also Ahmed has come in on a radical ticket of reform, I support him because I felt Hayatou was a dead horse killing our game. However, Ahmed is already making enemies of some that voted him in because they are beginning to see him as a stooge for Europe. He needs to be careful.

For the players, the end of the club versus country conflict is what they really welcome.
Nothing new, that's how most fans see him and Pinnick.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by peron33uk »

What!!!!

https://twitter.com/julietbawuah/status ... 6854685696

Why do they want to move ANC to China or Qatar????

:boo: :boo: :boo: :boo:
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by fabio »

peron33uk wrote:What!!!!

https://twitter.com/julietbawuah/status ... 6854685696

Why do they want to move ANC to China or Qatar????

:boo: :boo: :boo: :boo:
We don enter 1-chance with Ahmad and Pinnick!!!
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by peron33uk »

Also why in the world are they looking to add Foreign teams to the ANC???

http://www.africanews.com/2017/07/19/ca ... e-revenue/

It doesn't make sense apart from just wanting to make more money.

We might as well just join with the Asian Football Confederation.
When someone tells me "God bless you", I ask the question, which God?

God - is just a title as there are many (All false).
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

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peron33uk wrote:Also why in the world are they looking to add Foreign teams to the ANC???

http://www.africanews.com/2017/07/19/ca ... e-revenue/

It doesn't make sense apart from just wanting to make more money.

We might as well just join with the Asian Football Confederation.
3 or 4 invitees from other continents.

China or Qatar to host AFCON.

Carry on Ahmad!!!!
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by folem »

peron33uk wrote:Also why in the world are they looking to add Foreign teams to the ANC???

http://www.africanews.com/2017/07/19/ca ... e-revenue/

It doesn't make sense apart from just wanting to make more money.

We might as well just join with the Asian Football Confederation.
More money. EPL proposed a 39th match to be played in foreign countries. Italian Super Cup went foreign. NBA, NFL, MLB not far behind. CONMEBOL went to North America for Copa Centenario with foreign teams added. AFC Asia Cup went to Australia. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by folem »

fabio wrote:
peron33uk wrote:Also why in the world are they looking to add Foreign teams to the ANC???

http://www.africanews.com/2017/07/19/ca ... e-revenue/

It doesn't make sense apart from just wanting to make more money.

We might as well just join with the Asian Football Confederation.
3 or 4 invitees from other continents.

China or Qatar to host AFCON.

Carry on Ahmad!!!!
US also a potential host. It's out of the box thinking by CAF marketers. India, China ... hmm think of the money making possibilities. :mrgreen:
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by fabio »

folem wrote: US also a potential host. It's out of the box thinking by CAF marketers. India, China ... hmm think of the money making possibilities. :mrgreen:
Out of the box thinking. Maybe Saudi Arabia, London and Paris :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by peron33uk »

fabio wrote:
peron33uk wrote:Also why in the world are they looking to add Foreign teams to the ANC???

http://www.africanews.com/2017/07/19/ca ... e-revenue/

It doesn't make sense apart from just wanting to make more money.

We might as well just join with the Asian Football Confederation.
3 or 4 invitees from other continents.

China or Qatar to host AFCON.

Carry on Ahmad!!!!
Meanwhile at the CAF headquarters......................

Image

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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by Waffiman »

Enugu II wrote:
Waffiman wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Waffiman wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:
Waffiman wrote:
For the players, the end of the club versus country conflict is what they really welcome.

It won't end it. Managers will want the players to rest in the summer.

This is IMO an issue that is sure to come up. It comes up for the Olympics that takes place in the summer. However, the clubs would have to make the same argument against players who also play in the Euro.
It comes up because Olympics is not a FIFA sanctioned tournament. Clubs can stop their players from playing in Olympics because they are not forced by FIFA to comply.

Some African players were already passing up on the ANC cos clubs were putting their livelihoods in danger. For me, the summer move it as much more to do with summer ANC, than a desire to unify the world football calendar.
Waffi,

But clubs complained about CAF which was FIFA-sanctioned and also held in an international window for tournaments. It did not stop the complaints.
Yes, they complained but could not stop the players if called up. If players refused to go play, FIFA stopped the players from playing for club.
Waffi,

But the issue is not their ability to stop the player. Ohenhen1 points out that club v country row will not end i.e. the clubs will;l continue to complain even if they are not able to stop it. After all they were not able to stop players from AFCON but their complaints led to change from March to January and now from January to June. The issue is will complaints and whinning ever stop?
Clubs always complain about 'international call ups' and what they call 'meaningless friendlies' for all nations. I am not contesting this.

What we must not do is muddle things up. We must distinguish between other call ups and calls ups for the ANC tournament itself.

My focus is on the ANC and Ahmed's proposal being in line with FIFA's planned International calendar to tackle the issue of the ANC being in the middle of the European season. The clubs are not happy about the ANC's timing and over the years, we have seen conflicts develop from this. This is different from other call ups not related to the ANC.

I have always been opposed to the ANC being moved but I understand the reasons why such changes are now being implemented. For example, I know from speaking to a footballer, they like this change, he feels he and other footballers livelihoods are being affected by the ANC as clubs now ignore African players who have ANC commitments in Dec/Jan. I am told one consequence will be an increase of African players getting contracts in Europe. Given the short career span of these players, I cannot begrudge them the opportunity they have to earn their money. So, as much as I oppose the move of the ANC to June, I have to understand the arguments from other sides.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by Enugu II »

Waffiman wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Waffi,

But the issue is not their ability to stop the player. Ohenhen1 points out that club v country row will not end i.e. the clubs will;l continue to complain even if they are not able to stop it. After all they were not able to stop players from AFCON but their complaints led to change from March to January and now from January to June. The issue is will complaints and whinning ever stop?
Clubs always complain about 'international call ups' and what they call 'meaningless friendlies' for all nations. I am not contesting this.

What we must not do is muddle things up. We must distinguish between other call ups and calls ups for the ANC tournament itself.

My focus is on the ANC and Ahmed's proposal being in line with FIFA's planned International calendar to tackle the issue of the ANC being in the middle of the European season. The clubs are not happy about the ANC's timing and over the years, we have seen conflicts develop from this. This is different from other call ups not related to the ANC.

I have always been opposed to the ANC being moved but I understand the reasons why such changes are now being implemented. For example, I know from speaking to a footballer, they like this change, he feels he and other footballers livelihoods are being affected by the ANC as clubs now ignore African players who have ANC commitments in Dec/Jan. I am told one consequence will be an increase of African players getting contracts in Europe. Given the short career span of these players, I cannot begrudge them the opportunity they have to earn their money. So, as much as I oppose the move of the ANC to June, I have to understand the arguments from other sides.

Waffi,

There is no muddling up, my brother. Clubs complained of call-ups for the AFCON tournament which was WITHIN THE FIFA INTERNATIONAL TOURNAMENT CALENDAR. I can understand if you are claiming that the AFCON in January was outside the current calendar. It was not. FIFA has two periods for International Tournaments and they were Winter and Summer. AFCON chose summer. It was not a violation of the calendar. The reason why it appeared disruptive is only because several European leagues refused to reduce the number of teams in their leagues. That is the issue.

Nevertheless, CAF's decision to NOW move to June will avoid the European season but may hurt the AFCON weather wise. Furthermore, how about the Mikel Obis, Ighalos, and Ideyes who now must leave the midseason of the Chinese league? How about countries that have players in the MLS who must now leave midseason?

Let's call a spade a spade, this is a decision to appease Europe even when it is hurting us. It is what it is.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by Enugu II »

Pinnick: Why we’re proposing 24 –team AFCON
By The NFF
http://www.thenff.com/2017/07/pinnick-w ... eam-afcon/
Updated: July 20, 2017



President of the Nigeria Football Federation and President of AFCON, Amaju Pinnick on Wednesday in Rabat told the gathering of African football’s decision makers why CAF’s flagship tournament should be expanded.

“This proposal is hinged on sporting, commercial and infrastructural reasons, and we believe that sooner than later, everyone would come to appreciate the position of the proponents of a bigger Africa Cup of Nations.



“George Weah from Liberia became the only African to have been named the World Player of the Year, same year he was voted the African Player of the Year and European Player of the Year. He is from a nation (Liberia) many would consider a minnow in the African game. If we have a bigger AFCON, there will definitely be more talented players coming onto the stage, and we could just discover that the next ‘Weah’ would come from either Djibouti or Botswana.

“For commercial reason, more corporate organizations and stakeholders will be involved and it is certainly a bigger cake for everyone. CAF will be richer and the Member Associations will surely benefit. When UEFA staged the European Championship in 2012, when it was a 16 –team event, they made a profit of $1.5 billion. Last year, when they staged a 24 –team event for the first time, they made $2.1 billion.

“Having a 24 –team AFCON will also compel the development of stadia facilities across the African continent, as CAF will certainly encourage co-hosting, and this will also ginger general infrastructural development in the continent.”
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

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Ahmad proposals are too radical. AFCON must be held on African soil and we don't need non African countries invited. I can live with 24 teams, even it is a bad idea. I can also live with playing in the summer. Just make sure the stadiums have good drainage systems and expect rain delays. I think a compromise is best.

1. Dont move the tournament to June.
2. Expand to 24 teams. Even though it is a bad idea.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by fabio »

Enugu II wrote:
Pinnick: Why we’re proposing 24 –team AFCON
By The NFF
http://www.thenff.com/2017/07/pinnick-w ... eam-afcon/
Updated: July 20, 2017



President of the Nigeria Football Federation and President of AFCON, Amaju Pinnick on Wednesday in Rabat told the gathering of African football’s decision makers why CAF’s flagship tournament should be expanded.

“This proposal is hinged on sporting, commercial and infrastructural reasons, and we believe that sooner than later, everyone would come to appreciate the position of the proponents of a bigger Africa Cup of Nations.



“George Weah from Liberia became the only African to have been named the World Player of the Year, same year he was voted the African Player of the Year and European Player of the Year. He is from a nation (Liberia) many would consider a minnow in the African game. If we have a bigger AFCON, there will definitely be more talented players coming onto the stage, and we could just discover that the next ‘Weah’ would come from either Djibouti or Botswana.

“For commercial reason, more corporate organizations and stakeholders will be involved and it is certainly a bigger cake for everyone. CAF will be richer and the Member Associations will surely benefit. When UEFA staged the European Championship in 2012, when it was a 16 –team event, they made a profit of $1.5 billion. Last year, when they staged a 24 –team event for the first time, they made $2.1 billion.

“Having a 24 –team AFCON will also compel the development of stadia facilities across the African continent, as CAF will certainly encourage co-hosting, and this will also ginger general infrastructural development in the continent.”
What has George Weah world footballer of the got to do with AFCON? Sometimes, Pinnick should just keep quiet.

Pinnick has always been a slave to Europe and UEFA!!!
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

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Once they see the effects of the rains. They will move the tournament back to January/February. 24 teams will water down the competition. I won't watch bad match ups. Expect 8-0 score lines at the AFCON.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by ohenhen1 »

fabio wrote:
folem wrote: US also a potential host. It's out of the box thinking by CAF marketers. India, China ... hmm think of the money making possibilities. :mrgreen:
Out of the box thinking. Maybe Saudi Arabia, London and Paris :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
Export more African jobs out of the continent.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by folem »

fabio wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Pinnick: Why we’re proposing 24 –team AFCON
By The NFF
http://www.thenff.com/2017/07/pinnick-w ... eam-afcon/
Updated: July 20, 2017



President of the Nigeria Football Federation and President of AFCON, Amaju Pinnick on Wednesday in Rabat told the gathering of African football’s decision makers why CAF’s flagship tournament should be expanded.

“This proposal is hinged on sporting, commercial and infrastructural reasons, and we believe that sooner than later, everyone would come to appreciate the position of the proponents of a bigger Africa Cup of Nations.



“George Weah from Liberia became the only African to have been named the World Player of the Year, same year he was voted the African Player of the Year and European Player of the Year. He is from a nation (Liberia) many would consider a minnow in the African game. If we have a bigger AFCON, there will definitely be more talented players coming onto the stage, and we could just discover that the next ‘Weah’ would come from either Djibouti or Botswana.

“For commercial reason, more corporate organizations and stakeholders will be involved and it is certainly a bigger cake for everyone. CAF will be richer and the Member Associations will surely benefit. When UEFA staged the European Championship in 2012, when it was a 16 –team event, they made a profit of $1.5 billion. Last year, when they staged a 24 –team event for the first time, they made $2.1 billion.

“Having a 24 –team AFCON will also compel the development of stadia facilities across the African continent, as CAF will certainly encourage co-hosting, and this will also ginger general infrastructural development in the continent.”
What has George Weah world footballer of the got to do with AFCON? Sometimes, Pinnick should just keep quiet.

Pinnick has always been a slave to Europe and UEFA!!!
Liberia & Botswana already played @ CAN. Liberia almost made it to 2002 WC. Pinnick is just a name dropper. Being a slave is not the issue, CAF will make more money.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by folem »

ohenhen1 wrote:Once they see the effects of the rains. They will move the tournament back to January/February. 24 teams will water down the competition. I won't watch bad match ups. Expect 8-0 score lines at the AFCON.
Majority of African leagues play through June. Rain will not dampen the show. 24 strong teams are available, my own grouse is hosting costs.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by ohenhen1 »

folem wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:Once they see the effects of the rains. They will move the tournament back to January/February. 24 teams will water down the competition. I won't watch bad match ups. Expect 8-0 score lines at the AFCON.
Majority of African leagues play through June. Rain will not dampen the show. 24 strong teams are available, my own grouse is hosting costs.

A 16 team AFCON is a bad tournament to watch in terms of quality of play. A 24 team tourney would be worse. The raining season is a factor. Just look at how they postponed the Rangers vs MFM matchup until the next day. I have seen highlights of several games when the pitch was unplayable due to heavy rain. Even the recent confed cup tie between Rivers Utd vs a North American side was like playing on a swimming pool. That was not football. The player will avoid the tournament because of risk of injury.


IF you have the tournament in June or July, expect delays.
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Re: Ahmad's PayBack Time: Cameroon May be Stripped of 2019

Post by folem »



How many of the 48 Group Stage matches in the recent CAF inter-club competitions played in June had rain issues?

There was rain at some matches in the last 3 editions of CAN.

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