ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Where Eagles dare! Discuss Nigerian related football (soccer) topics here.

Moderators: Moderator Team, phpBB2 - Administrators

User avatar
Bell
Egg
Egg
Posts: 7032
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:43 pm
ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Bell »

It looks to me unnecessary to limit the number of players used in tournaments. Currently, for the men's WC, that number is 23. I think the size of a squad should be left to each country to decide.

The only reason I can think of is to reduce costs. If so, why not simply say that individual countries are responsible for costs over 23 players and will have to provide their own facilities beyond what FIFA provides? FIFA can also limit the number of players allowed in the field during match day which makes sense but has nothing to do with squad size.

I can see where a team is hit by unusual injuries heavily decimating a particular position and needing to bring certain people in but can't as things are today because of squad limit. Or maybe some players in the squad are not panning out. Why shouldn't they be able to call on other players as long as they have the right nationality?
Bell
Image
User avatar
danfo driver
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 27005
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:48 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by danfo driver »

For the same reason substitutes on the bench and substitution is limited, (1) to increase competition and (2) fairness and equality
"it is better to be excited now and disappointed later, than it is to be disappointed now and later." - Marcus Aurelius, 178AD
metalalloy wrote: Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?
User avatar
Bell
Egg
Egg
Posts: 7032
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:43 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Bell »

danfo driver wrote:For the same reason substitutes on the bench and substitution is limited, (1) to increase competition and (2) fairness and equality
I'M SORRY BUT...

...I don't see how limiting squad size increases competitiveness and fairness.
Bell
Image
User avatar
The YeyeMan
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 17823
Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:51 am
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by The YeyeMan »

23 is an upper limit. If you wan carry 17 players go World Cup that's your business.

As a manager you have to manage your resources and pick your best 23 players - whether you're a country like Brazil with a grand history and a massive pool of players to choose from or whether you're Iceland with a smaller pool and talent ratio - so the number is an equaliser.
danfo driver quotes:
"Great! Now it begins." - Jan 25, 2024
-
Cellular quotes:
"The Yeyeman is hardly ever vulgar when dealing with anyone. " - Mar 23, 2018
"Thank God na oyibo be coach." - Nov 16, 2017
"I will take Trump over Clinton but I am in the minority." - Jul 19, 2016

© The YeyeMan 2024
This post is provided AS IS with no warranties and confers no rights.
It is not authorised by CyberEagles. You assume all risk for your use. All rights reserved.
User avatar
Kabalega
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 18727
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2008 6:44 pm
Location: Here
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Kabalega »

Why do you need more than 2 players per position and 3 goalies?

I believe that a team can petition FIFA if they need new players especially goalies but it rarely happens.
That is one reason why teams like Brazil play easy friendlies before the World Cup.

A team can take extra players, they just will not get the FIFA "accreditation" to participate in official FIFA functions.
“If your opponent is of choleric temper, seek to irritate him. Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant.”- Sun Tzu
User avatar
Orion
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 11369
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2004 1:41 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Orion »

Bell wrote:It looks to me unnecessary to limit the number of players used in tournaments. Currently, for the men's WC, that number is 23. I think the size of a squad should be left to each country to decide.

The only reason I can think of is to reduce costs. If so, why not simply say that individual countries are responsible for costs over 23 players and will have to provide their own facilities beyond what FIFA provides? FIFA can also limit the number of players allowed in the field during match day which makes sense but has nothing to do with squad size.

I can see where a team is hit by unusual injuries heavily decimating a particular position and needing to bring certain people in but can't as things are today because of squad limit. Or maybe some players in the squad are not panning out. Why shouldn't they be able to call on other players as long as they have the right nationality?
Bell
Have you thought about the unfair advantage this idea would introduce?

I know the richer nations already have an advantage in terms of training facilities, administration, organisation etc. But this would be taking it to another level of unfairness. The richer nations would come with more players as they can afford it hence they would have more depth during the tourney. Imagine a rich country like Germany that can put 3-4 world class teams together. They would have an unfair advantage during a tournament even over countries like Brazil, Argentina and Spain.

There has to be a point where you draw the line to create fairness and genuine competition, which the current system tries to do – i.e. only 11 players on the pitch at one time per team, only 3 subs and only 23 players in total to choose from once at the tournament.
"I Think, Therefore I am" - Rene Descartes
User avatar
danfo driver
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 27005
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:48 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by danfo driver »

Bell wrote:
danfo driver wrote:For the same reason substitutes on the bench and substitution is limited, (1) to increase competition and (2) fairness and equality
I'M SORRY BUT...

...I don't see how limiting squad size increases competitiveness and fairness.
Bell
:lol: :lol: :lol:
"it is better to be excited now and disappointed later, than it is to be disappointed now and later." - Marcus Aurelius, 178AD
metalalloy wrote: Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?
Enugu II
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 23629
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 2:39 am
Location: Super Eagles Homeland
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Enugu II »

Bell wrote:It looks to me unnecessary to limit the number of players used in tournaments. Currently, for the men's WC, that number is 23. I think the size of a squad should be left to each country to decide.

The only reason I can think of is to reduce costs. If so, why not simply say that individual countries are responsible for costs over 23 players and will have to provide their own facilities beyond what FIFA provides? FIFA can also limit the number of players allowed in the field during match day which makes sense but has nothing to do with squad size.

I can see where a team is hit by unusual injuries heavily decimating a particular position and needing to bring certain people in but can't as things are today because of squad limit. Or maybe some players in the squad are not panning out. Why shouldn't they be able to call on other players as long as they have the right nationality?
Bell
Bell,

You do realize that FIFA pays for accommodation pertaining to those guys? FIFA has numerous costs and football is under a budget. It is same reason teams must vacate tournament as soon as they are eliminated. Costs. Yes, NTs may bring as many as they want if in fact they are paying. Currently, several NTs take stand-by players to the tournaments and pay for those but they can only get on squad lists via injury appeals.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
User avatar
joao
Egg
Egg
Posts: 6969
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:16 am
Location: Cut-N-Shoot, TX
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by joao »

Bell, did you realize that the host country is in charge of logistics for the teams attending
a tournament? Think about lodging, feeding, transporting, ...etc.
That's also the reason why once a team is eliminated, it has to ship out or take care of
itself from then on.
Cheers!!!
"We now live in a nation where doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge,
governments destroy freedom, the press destroys information, religion destroys morals, and our banks destroy the economy.”

― Chris Hedges
User avatar
Gotti
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 32049
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:20 am
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Gotti »

Oga Bell, because no host country can afford Nigerian-sized squads...
A few years ago we took a delegation of over 500 persons to the UN General Assembly.
#ENDSARS #BLM
#ENDPOLICEBRUTALITY


#FREESENEGAL
User avatar
ohenhen1
Flying Eagle
Flying Eagle
Posts: 69426
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 5:46 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by ohenhen1 »

Not all countries can afford it.
Winners do it the right way.

http://www.weareimpact.com/livebroadcast.aspx
User avatar
Odas
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 26722
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2004 10:58 pm
Location: Ukwuani
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Odas »

Gotti wrote:Oga Bell, because no host country can afford Nigerian-sized squads...
A few years ago we took a delegation of over 500 persons to the UN General Assembly.
Wow :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:! What reason did we - as a nation - give exactly for such a number?
And the BIBLE says: The race is NOT for the swift, neither is the battle for the strong nor ... but time and chance makes them all.
Ecclesiastes 1:18: For in much wisdom is much grief and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow.
User avatar
pajimoh
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 32654
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:32 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by pajimoh »

Make I add my own

Bell, I hope you realize it's cheaper to construct this bench for subs
Image
than this one

Image

:tic: :sneaky: :arrow:
Super Eagles - Fly Above The Storm!!!
User avatar
danfo driver
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 27005
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:48 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by danfo driver »

Odas wrote:
Gotti wrote:Oga Bell, because no host country can afford Nigerian-sized squads...
A few years ago we took a delegation of over 500 persons to the UN General Assembly.
Wow :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:! What reason did we - as a nation - give exactly for such a number?

Bro, have you not attended village meeting at the neighboring village? Or attended a traditional wedding ceremony? The more people in your entourage, the more it is seen that you have taken the mission seriously! As a groom, take only 4 people to your in laws house and they will ask the gateman to show you the way out!
"it is better to be excited now and disappointed later, than it is to be disappointed now and later." - Marcus Aurelius, 178AD
metalalloy wrote: Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?
User avatar
chendosplastic
Egg
Egg
Posts: 9025
Joined: Tue May 04, 2004 9:38 am
Location: iteakwa aka Port Harcourt
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by chendosplastic »

Not to worry, Bell. You know we are gradually ramping up. Recall we used to play without subs - 11 players alone per match. Now we can sub 3 per match. Perhaps by the time you are 87yrs we would have clibmed to your plateau of limitless number of players. Patience.
"The history book on the shelf is always repeating itself" - ABBA.
"Facts, Logic, truth is the way....stop ranting via emotions; seeing things through the prism of ethnicity is comfortable but ultimately a road to perdition." - airwolex.
User avatar
danfo driver
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 27005
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:48 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by danfo driver »

chendosplastic wrote:Not to worry, Bell. You know we are gradually ramping up. Recall we used to play without subs - 11 players alone per match. Now we can sub 3 per match. Perhaps by the time you are 87yrs we would have clibmed to your plateau of limitless number of players. Patience.

Serie A allows 11 subs on the bench :D
"it is better to be excited now and disappointed later, than it is to be disappointed now and later." - Marcus Aurelius, 178AD
metalalloy wrote: Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?
User avatar
Rawlings
Egg
Egg
Posts: 9164
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:35 am
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Rawlings »

to stop Naija taking four hundred and nineteen (4-1-9) players to a tournament
Nwabali -- Aina, Bassey, TroostEkong, Sanusi --- Chukwueze, Aribo, Ndidi, Iwobi --- Osimhem, Sadiq Umar
User avatar
Gotti
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 32049
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:20 am
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Gotti »

danfo driver wrote:
Odas wrote:
Gotti wrote:Oga Bell, because no host country can afford Nigerian-sized squads...
A few years ago we took a delegation of over 500 persons to the UN General Assembly.
Wow :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:! What reason did we - as a nation - give exactly for such a number?
Bro, have you not attended village meeting at the neighboring village? Or attended a traditional wedding ceremony? The more people in your entourage, the more it is seen that you have taken the mission seriously! As a groom, take only 4 people to your in laws house and they will ask the gateman to show you the way out!
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
#ENDSARS #BLM
#ENDPOLICEBRUTALITY


#FREESENEGAL
User avatar
Bell
Egg
Egg
Posts: 7032
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:43 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Bell »

THANKS FOR YOUR RESPONSES


To summarize the responses you've all kindly provided, there are two reasons why FIFA limits squad size:

1) The cost
2) Level the playing field

The cost factor doesn't make sense to me because FIFA can stipulate that all costs over and above 23 should be borne by individual countries. Furthermore, those outside the 23 cannot be considered in official activities, winners medals or accorded rights given to the others (except, of course, as some have pointed out, in cases where a country petitions for an extra player).

Since both sides are allowed only 11 players at a time, that's all the leveling that's needed. In practice, a country would want to use its best 11 most of the time and would not go down too far into its national pool and risk losing. If a country can go deep to bring in new players that's proof of its superiority. Which is what the tournament is all about.

So I say, limiting squad size is a relic from the past that should be scrapped.
Bell
Image
User avatar
The YeyeMan
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 17823
Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2003 12:51 am
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by The YeyeMan »

Bell wrote:THANKS FOR YOUR RESPONSES


To summarize the responses you've all kindly provided, there are two reasons why FIFA limits squad size:

1) The cost
2) Level the playing field

The cost factor doesn't make sense to me because FIFA can stipulate that all costs over and above 23 should be borne by individual countries. Furthermore, those outside the 23 cannot be considered in official activities, winners medals or accorded rights given to the others (except, of course, as some have pointed out, in cases where a country petitions for an extra player).

Since both sides are allowed only 11 players at a time, that's all the leveling that's needed. In practice, a country would want to use its best 11 most of the time and would not go down too far into its national pool and risk losing. If a country can go deep to bring in new players that's proof of its superiority. Which is what the tournament is all about.

So I say, limiting squad size is a relic from the past that should be scrapped.
Bell
So the richer countries/FAs who can carry the cost burden of larger squads ultimately benefit? Yes, give the richer nations a further leg up. Bell, it's the FIFA World Cup not the GDP World Cup.
danfo driver quotes:
"Great! Now it begins." - Jan 25, 2024
-
Cellular quotes:
"The Yeyeman is hardly ever vulgar when dealing with anyone. " - Mar 23, 2018
"Thank God na oyibo be coach." - Nov 16, 2017
"I will take Trump over Clinton but I am in the minority." - Jul 19, 2016

© The YeyeMan 2024
This post is provided AS IS with no warranties and confers no rights.
It is not authorised by CyberEagles. You assume all risk for your use. All rights reserved.
Enugu II
Eaglet
Eaglet
Posts: 23629
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 2:39 am
Location: Super Eagles Homeland
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Enugu II »

The YeyeMan wrote:
Bell wrote:THANKS FOR YOUR RESPONSES


To summarize the responses you've all kindly provided, there are two reasons why FIFA limits squad size:

1) The cost
2) Level the playing field

The cost factor doesn't make sense to me because FIFA can stipulate that all costs over and above 23 should be borne by individual countries. Furthermore, those outside the 23 cannot be considered in official activities, winners medals or accorded rights given to the others (except, of course, as some have pointed out, in cases where a country petitions for an extra player).

Since both sides are allowed only 11 players at a time, that's all the leveling that's needed. In practice, a country would want to use its best 11 most of the time and would not go down too far into its national pool and risk losing. If a country can go deep to bring in new players that's proof of its superiority. Which is what the tournament is all about.

So I say, limiting squad size is a relic from the past that should be scrapped.
Bell
So the richer countries/FAs who can carry the cost burden of larger squads ultimately benefit? Yes, give the richer nations a further leg up. Bell, it's the FIFA World Cup not the GDP World Cup.
TheYeyeman,

Am not sure Bell has fully evaluated the impact of what he thinks ought to be policy. Squad limits are indeed necessary not just in terms of FIFA costs but for different purposes including fairness across the board, etc. There are numerous interests and reasons. BTW, FIFA does not stop any one from carrying 100 players if they choose to. However, FIFA insists that only 23 of those can be registered and FIFA has agreed to fund only those. FIFA is also flexible by allowing injured players, conditionally, to be replaceable. Nigeria has infact taken more than 23 players to tournaments and the NFF paid for those who were not in the registered squad.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
User avatar
Bell
Egg
Egg
Posts: 7032
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:43 pm
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by Bell »

Enugu II wrote:
The YeyeMan wrote:
Bell wrote:THANKS FOR YOUR RESPONSES


To summarize the responses you've all kindly provided, there are two reasons why FIFA limits squad size:

1) The cost
2) Level the playing field

The cost factor doesn't make sense to me because FIFA can stipulate that all costs over and above 23 should be borne by individual countries. Furthermore, those outside the 23 cannot be considered in official activities, winners medals or accorded rights given to the others (except, of course, as some have pointed out, in cases where a country petitions for an extra player).

Since both sides are allowed only 11 players at a time, that's all the leveling that's needed. In practice, a country would want to use its best 11 most of the time and would not go down too far into its national pool and risk losing. If a country can go deep to bring in new players that's proof of its superiority. Which is what the tournament is all about.

So I say, limiting squad size is a relic from the past that should be scrapped.
Bell
So the richer countries/FAs who can carry the cost burden of larger squads ultimately benefit? Yes, give the richer nations a further leg up. Bell, it's the FIFA World Cup not the GDP World Cup.
TheYeyeman,

Am not sure Bell has fully evaluated the impact of what he thinks ought to be policy. Squad limits are indeed necessary not just in terms of FIFA costs but for different purposes including fairness across the board, etc. There are numerous interests and reasons. BTW, FIFA does not stop any one from carrying 100 players if they choose to. However, FIFA insists that only 23 of those can be registered and FIFA has agreed to fund only those. FIFA is also flexible by allowing injured players, conditionally, to be replaceable. Nigeria has infact taken more than 23 players to tournaments and the NFF paid for those who were not in the registered squad.
Enugu ii & theyeyeman,

Please refer to my hilite above. I wholeheartedly agree with it and if it's the case, which I'm sure it is, my question has been answered. But I don't buy this rich vs poor/leveling the playing field argument.
Bell
Image
peppersoup
Egg
Egg
Posts: 4081
Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 6:35 pm
Location: USA
Re: ANYONE KNOWS WHY FIFA LIMITS SQUAD SIZE FOR TOURNAMENTS?

Post by peppersoup »

danfo driver wrote:
Odas wrote:
Gotti wrote:Oga Bell, because no host country can afford Nigerian-sized squads...
A few years ago we took a delegation of over 500 persons to the UN General Assembly.
Wow :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:! What reason did we - as a nation - give exactly for such a number?

Bro, have you not attended village meeting at the neighboring village? Or attended a traditional wedding ceremony? The more people in your entourage, the more it is seen that you have taken the mission seriously! As a groom, take only 4 people to your in laws house and they will ask the gateman to show you the way out!
This man. Kai! you guys will make a good stand up comedians
"His Excellency President for Life, Field Marshal Al Hadji Doctor Idi Amin, VC, DSO, MC, Lord of All the Beasts of the Earth and Fishes of the Sea, and Conqueror of the British Empire in Africa in General and Uganda in Particular."

Post Reply