KUDOS to Obafemi Martins!!

[cic old boy]

What Lagos state do or don't do has nothing to do with a man giving back to his community . Texas is by all means a rich state yet people including football, basketball, and baseball players donate equipment and money to hospitals across the state all the time. People that can give should not dictate how others should give. You and Ayo should go and donate instead of using a governor's performance as excuse.

This is the type of thoughtlessness that one has to endure here at too frequent intervals. You either didn't read the MLK quote or you didn't understand it.

Charity is great, but a system that produces beggars isn't right and can't be changed merely by charity. You can give back to your community as much as you like. But a community in which state provision is almost non-existent and charity is sometimes the only option, is on the brink of disaster. If there is no running water in your village, nothing stops you from donating a borehole there. It doesn't mean it is right that the govt hasn't provided running water.

My school's old boys association are building a dormitory in the school b/c of the degraded conditions the students sleep in. Leonard Blavatnik donated £75m to Oxford to set a school of govt. The two are charitable donations, but not quite the same. Oxford can function very well without that donation, while my old school is a complete mess without the contributions of old boys.

You should park your thoughts about Texas and hospitals b/c I don't want to go into another discussion about healthcare in America. Needless to talk about California - even richer than Texas - yet many of the millions of uninsured there have to take advantage of free treatment and healthcare checks run by charities that operate in Third World countries.

Where did I dictate how Oba should give? How many times have I asked you to put down the bottle of Johnnie Walker?

[cic old boy]

Both are NOT mutually-exclusive...

Trust me, as someone who actually lives in this country, without Lagos I would have absolutely the barest hope (if any at all) for Nigeria. Obviously there’s still a lot to be done but Lagos has by far the best public health, transport and education systems in Nigeria, including completely free maternal services (albeit IMHO falls way short in social housing). Furthermore, Lagos tries very hard to economically empower its residents (including the physically-disabled) by, among other things, providing free adult education, artisanal training and providing interest-free loans (under the LSETF) for SMEs - regardless of state of origin! It is the only state that I am aware of in Nigeria that has a full-fledged Office of Disability Affairs, with specific social and economic programs for physically-disabled residents (not just indigenes).

That’s largely why folks (and not just Nigerians) keep streaming into Lagos every day. One result is that despite the primordial drivel by the Oba of Lagos during the last elections of folks ending up in the Lagoon, Ibos still ended up in the Lagos State Assembly and even represent Lagos in the National Assembly. Of course, this mass migration is also ironically a primary reason why Lagos may struggle to adequately cater for all of its residents. Any city/state/nation that has had a (substantial non-tax paying) population explosion of over 400% over the last 30 years would struggle to keep pace in terms of hard and/or soft infrastructure, especially when handcuffed by a largely inept federal superstructure. For the sad but factual reality is that outside of Lagos, much of Nigeria broaches Failed State dimensions.

My brother, I never suggested anything was mutually exclusive. My point is about the reliance on charity where the state has failed in its duty to its citizens.

Lagos is the richest state in the country. So being marginally better than the rest goes with the territory. But this is a case of in the country of the blind...

Have you ever used any of those services you say are available in Lagos? Have you ever entered a public hospital there? I have found from Fashola's time that most of the claims exist only on the pages of newspapers. After reports claiming improvements in healthcare in the state, Fashola still sent his dad abroad for treatment.

I was in Lagos early last month and it was clear that the well-off (and I include you in this) and the rest exist in separate worlds.
https://www.naijiant.com/articles/lagos ... velopment/

I don't agree that people stream to Lagos b/c of its welfare provision. It is the lack of opportunities elsewhere that drives people to Lagos. This is related to the uneven nature of the siting of critical infrastructure and other projects, and Lagos' strategic advantage of being a former capital and commercial capital.

[Cellular]

Good job OBAGOAL. May God reward you abundantly.

[cic old boy]

While we do our good works let us not forget that the real solution lies in a world in which charity will have become unnecessary.
Chinua Achebe

[Gotti]

My brother, I never suggested anything was mutually exclusive. My point is about the reliance on charity where the state has failed in its duty to its citizens.

Lagos is the richest state in the country. So being marginally better than the rest goes with the territory. But this is a case of in the country of the blind...

Have you ever used any of those services you say are available in Lagos? Have you ever entered a public hospital there? I have found from Fashola's time that most of the claims exist only on the pages of newspapers. After reports claiming improvements in healthcare in the state, Fashola still sent his dad abroad for treatment.

I was in Lagos early last month and it was clear that the well-off (and I include you in this) and the rest exist in separate worlds.
https://www.naijiant.com/articles/lagos ... velopment/

I don't agree that people stream to Lagos b/c of its welfare provision. It is the lack of opportunities elsewhere that drives people to Lagos. This is related to the uneven nature of the siting of critical infrastructure and other projects, and Lagos' strategic advantage of being a former capital and commercial capital.

No Bros, it’s not just marginally better - it’s world’s better!

While it’s great to see someone like Oba make these charitable donations of wheelchairs and stuff through his foundation, Lagos is not dependent on it. On the contrary, the Lagos State government routinely gives free wheelchairs to the disabled, in addition to providing government employment and (as previously noted) granting interest-free loans under LSETF and making grants under the state’s Disability Trust Fund - and again, not just to indigenes, but all residents regardless of state origin. All public buildings in Lagos have wheelchair access and ramps, and under the state’s law every new commercial, education and office building is required to have wheelchair access as well as reserved parking for the disabled.

Furthermore, by state law, all children with disability have a right to free education and medical services, and to public transportation (ie, the BRT buses which of course are equipped with wheelchair access and reserved space for the disabled). The law (specifically, the Special Persons’ Act of 2011 renders discrimination on account of disability a justiciable matter, provides free legal aid to persons with disability, priority in queues, publicly-provided accommodation and social services (including free ambulatory services). It also mandates all employers of 100 persons or more to reserve at least one percent of employment for the disabled (must confess that I personally cannot testify if this requirement has been rigorously enforced or observed).

So, no, Lagos is not waiting for the likes of Obafemi Martins to cater for the basics needs of its population (not just it’s citizens). And while I may not personally use public hospitals (although I did use a public mortuary when my mom passed away), neither do I do so in London or in NYC (or the US generally). Those of us who can afford private care frankly have no business putting unnecessary pressure on scare public resources and facilities, and our collective concern should be ensuring that these public facilities meet standards of acceptable care.

[Gotti]

While we do our good works let us not forget that the real solution lies in a world in which charity will have become unnecessary.
Chinua Achebe

Inspirational aspiration...
But till we get there (in Nigeria, Cuba, the US, UK, N. Korea, Venezuela, etc), all hands are welcome.

[Ayo Akinfe]

While we do our good works let us not forget that the real solution lies in a world in which charity will have become unnecessary.
Chinua Achebe

Gbam!

[cic old boy]

No Bros, it’s not just marginally better - it’s world’s better!

While it’s great to see someone like Oba make these charitable donations of wheelchairs and stuff through his foundation, Lagos is not dependent on it. On the contrary, the Lagos State government routinely gives free wheelchairs to the disabled, in addition to providing government employment and (as previously noted) granting interest-free loans under LSETF and making grants under the state’s Disability Trust Fund - and again, not just to indigenes, but all residents regardless of state origin. All public buildings in Lagos have wheelchair access and ramps, and under the state’s law every new commercial, education and office building is required to have wheelchair access as well as reserved parking for the disabled.

Furthermore, by state law, all children with disability have a right to free education and medical services, and to public transportation (ie, the BRT buses which of course are equipped with wheelchair access and reserved space for the disabled). The law (specifically, the Special Persons’ Act of 2011 renders discrimination on account of disability a justiciable matter, provides free legal aid to persons with disability, priority in queues, publicly-provided accommodation and social services (including free ambulatory services). It also mandates all employers of 100 persons or more to reserve at least one percent of employment for the disabled (must confess that I personally cannot testify if this requirement has been rigorously enforced or observed).

So, no, Lagos is not waiting for the likes of Obafemi Martins to cater for the basics needs of its population (not just it’s citizens). And while I may not personally use public hospitals (although I did use a public mortuary when my mom passed away), neither do I do so in London or in NYC (or the US generally). Those of us who can afford private care frankly have no business putting unnecessary pressure on scare public resources and facilities, and our collective concern should be ensuring that these public facilities meet standards of acceptable care.

I disagree that Lagos is a different world from the rest of Nigeria. Maybe different from the BH-ravaged NE, but not much different from any other state. Every state has a ministry of social welfare. What they do there is another story.

I saw enough of disabled beggars without wheelchairs in Lagos to doubt the claims about giving out free wheelchairs. Like I said earlier, I have learnt from Fashola's time to approach govt claims of achievements with a health warning.

My brother, even in my state, they claim all children, disabled or not, have a right to free education. What that means in practice is anyone's guess. I know most public schools hit parents with hidden fees. The constitution also states that all Nigerians should be free of discrimination and have the right to reside anywhere. It didn't stop Fashola from "deporting" beggars from Lagos.

Lagos is not waiting for Oba to do his bit b/c the govt doesn't give a flying f*ck about the poor and destitute and would rather loot resources meant for programmes of social uplift. This was just a convenient photo op for the governor.

I asked if you have used a public hospital in Lagos, not to know your preferences, but to see if you could share your experience and see if it backs up dodgy govt claims.

[Gotti]

My brother, I never suggested anything was mutually exclusive. My point is about the reliance on charity where the state has failed in its duty to its citizens.

Lagos is the richest state in the country. So being marginally better than the rest goes with the territory. But this is a case of in the country of the blind...

Have you ever used any of those services you say are available in Lagos? Have you ever entered a public hospital there? I have found from Fashola's time that most of the claims exist only on the pages of newspapers. After reports claiming improvements in healthcare in the state, Fashola still sent his dad abroad for treatment.

I was in Lagos early last month and it was clear that the well-off (and I include you in this) and the rest exist in separate worlds.
https://www.naijiant.com/articles/lagos ... velopment/

I don't agree that people stream to Lagos b/c of its welfare provision. It is the lack of opportunities elsewhere that drives people to Lagos. This is related to the uneven nature of the siting of critical infrastructure and other projects, and Lagos' strategic advantage of being a former capital and commercial capital.

Sadly, that’s the unfortunate situation that we find ourselves - along with the likes of the US (where the disparity is arguably much worse), the UK (which is getting worse by the day), and even supposedly communist China - because of the economic system that has taken ascendancy globally (and which has been further bastardized in Nigeria), but as we continuously and vigorously work towards a democratization of opportunities (which of course will still not necessarily result in an equalization of outcomes), we are not going to throw the baby out with the bath water.

My previous post, among other things, illustrates that it is not always about money or physical/hard infrastructure, but more often about ideas and vision. Accordingly, while you may well be correct that being a former federal capital was a significant foundation for Lagos’ success, that foundation has less to do with physical infrastructure but more to do with bringing most of Nigeria’s brightest, most ambitious and hardest-working folks to Lagos (of course Lagos takes a large piece of the credit for making them feel enough at home here over the past quarter of a century since the relocation of the federal capital to Abuja). In fact, rather than being assets, many federal infrastructure in Lagos have become economic liabilities and physical garbage - federal roads, including the impassable roads to the ports (Ahmadu Bello Road was almost completely washed away, with much of Victoria Island about to follow, before the LASG stepped in with a permanent solution costing it tens of billions of Naira), the crumbling National Stadium, National Theatre, NECOM House, the Federal Secretariat, etc., and the Badagry Expressway, which Lagos is currently completely rebuilding.

It is NOT federal infrastructure that led to the rise of Lekki as the fastest growing economic and residential district in West Africa (perhaps in all of sub-Saharan Africa), the development of the significant technology hubs in Yaba (and increasingly Lekki) or even the so-called Computer Village in Ikeja (with its overwhelming large population of non-indigenes). What Lagos does best (apart from the fact that it runs a much better functional government than the lot in Abuja and elsewhere in Nigeria) is that it essentially accommodates all from across Nigeria and the West Africa subregion looking for opportunities and (even when it is not actively supporting their efforts) is smart enough to get out of their way (or not to otherwise impede them). That’s why Lagos has/had better Ease of Doing Business indices than Nigeria itself - and why it has more than TWICE the GDP of Ghana (and in fact, more than the GDP of Ghana and Kenya COMBINED).

Trust me, we Lagosians are well aware of the huge amount of work to be done here, but if Lagos disappears into the Atlantic Ocean tomorrow, much of any future Nigeria ever had will sink with it.

[Gotti]

I asked if you have used a public hospital in Lagos, not to know your preferences, but to see if you could share your experience and see if it backs up dodgy govt claims.

As I indicated, I used the ambulatory services and mortuary for my mom, and it was just fine. I have no reason to believe that the rest of the services are not of an acceptable standard (albeit I am not in a position to personally testify thereto).

[cic old boy]

Sadly, that’s the unfortunate situation that we find ourselves - along with the likes of the US (where the disparity is arguably much worse), the UK (which is getting worse by the day), and even supposedly communist China - because of the economic system that has taken ascendancy globally (and which has been further bastardized in Nigeria), but as we continuously and vigorously work towards a democratization of opportunities (which of course will still not necessarily result in an equalization of outcomes), we are not going to throw the baby out with the bath water.

My previous post, among other things, illustrates that it is not always about money or physical/hard infrastructure, but more often about ideas and vision. Accordingly, while you may well be correct that being a former federal capital was a significant foundation for Lagos’ success, that foundation has less to do with physical infrastructure but more to do with bringing most of Nigeria’s brightest, most ambitious and hardest-working folks to Lagos (of course Lagos takes a large piece of the credit for making them feel enough at home here over the past quarter of a century since the relocation of the federal capital to Abuja). In fact, rather than being assets, many federal infrastructure in Lagos have become economic liabilities and physical garbage - federal roads, including the impassable roads to the ports (Ahmadu Bello Road was almost completely washed away, with much of Victoria Island about to follow, before the LASG stepped in with a permanent solution costing it tens of billions of Naira), the crumbling National Stadium, National Theatre, NECOM House, the Federal Secretariat, etc., and the Badagry Expressway, which Lagos is currently completely rebuilding.

It is NOT federal infrastructure that led to the rise of Lekki as the fastest growing economic and residential district in West Africa (perhaps in all of sub-Saharan Africa), the development of the significant technology hubs in Yaba (and increasingly Lekki) or even the so-called Computer Village in Ikeja (with its overwhelming large population of non-indigenes). What Lagos does best (apart from the fact that it runs a much better functional government than the lot in Abuja and elsewhere in Nigeria) is that it essentially accommodates all from across Nigeria and the West Africa subregion looking for opportunities and (even when it is not actively supporting their efforts) is smart enough to get out of their way (or not to otherwise impede them). That’s why Lagos has/had better Ease of Doing Business indices than Nigeria itself - and why it has more than TWICE the GDP of Ghana (and in fact, more than the GDP of Ghana and Kenya COMBINED).

Trust me, we Lagosians are well aware of the huge amount of work to be done here, but if Lagos disappears into the Atlantic Ocean tomorrow, much of any future Nigeria ever had will sink with it.

My brother, there is inequality everywhere, but you can't say that it is arguably worse in the US and the same time say we have further bastardised the economic system in Nigeria. Further bastardisation is exactly why the inequality is worse in Nigeria. There is still the semblance of a welfare state in the US. You can still get a reasonable education in free public schools. These all help reduce inequality. You can check this for further info on Nigeria "extreme inequality":
https://www.oxfam.org/en/even-it-nigeri ... ty-numbers

I agree that the migration of young people of working age to Lagos has helped the place to grow economically. I have made similar points about the benefits of immigration to the UK/US. But those people voted with their feet b/c of the opportunities created by physical infrastructure. The concentration of federal infrastructure and the service industries created opportunities for the economic activities that attracted those people. I don't accept that Lagos is any more welcoming than any other part of Nigeria. That's just a myth that benefits from repetition. People adapt to their circumstances. As Lagos was political capital for decades, it got more cosmopolitan and the locals got more used to diversity than anywhere else. It is no different from London in comparison with Newcastle.

The argument about what is responsible for growth (not development) in Lagos is one I've had elsewhere:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=279032&hilit=lekki

Source: http://archive.unu.edu/unupress/unupboo ... 26ue0i.htm

A number of factors have combined to account for the pre-eminence of Lagos metropolis in the Nigerian urban system. These include its political and administrative roles as Nigeria's capital and seat of administration after the amalgamation of the Northern and Southern protectorates in 1914. By the late 1950s, with the approach of political independence, Lagos grew in importance as the economic, social, commercial, political, administrative, and financial hub of Nigeria. It remained the capital after independence and, when 12 states were created in 1967, Ikeja, within the metropolis, became the seat of administration for Lagos State.

A survey of manufacturing industry in Nigeria by the Federal Office of Statistics in 1984 (quoted in Lagos State Government, 1989) showed that 53 per cent of all manufacturing employment in Nigeria was located in Lagos State. In addition, Lagos State accounted for 62 per cent of gross industrial output and 61 per cent of the total national industrial value added. As of December 1985, 1,227 industrial establishments were identified in Lagos State, constituting more than 31 per cent of the national total (Lagos State Government, 1989). About 80 per cent of these industrial establishments and jobs are located in Lagos metropolis, illustrating continued concentration since 1976. A more recent survey of manufacturing establishments nationwide is not available.

A number of significant factors have stimulated the concentration of manufacturing activities in metropolitan Lagos. First, the presence in Lagos of the largest seaport in Nigeria offers minimum transportation costs for imported inputs from the port to the factory sites. This was particularly important from the late 1950s, when Nigeria adopted an import substitution industrialization strategy of development. Secondly, good transportation facilities linking Lagos to other parts of Nigeria are available. Thirdly, metropolitan Lagos has the largest concentration of skilled and semi-skilled manpower in Nigeria. For instance, the national survey of 1977 estimated that 40 per cent of the skilled manpower in Nigeria were employed in Lagos (quoted in Lagos State Government, 1989). Another estimate was that one in every four workers in the formal sector in Nigeria was employed in the city. Fourthly, there is a large and ready market both within the metropolis and at the national scale for the outputs of the manufacturing establishments. Fifthly, metropolitan Lagos has fairly well-developed basic infrastructural facilities to support manufacturing industries. Sixthly, Lagos has the premier national and international airport in Nigeria. Thus, it has a considerable advantage over any other centre in Nigeria in terms of communication by air.

Commercial activities in Lagos pre-date the manufacturing sector, because they accompanied the period of early contact with the outside world before the nineteenth century. They grew during the colonial period, as Lagos became a colony in 1860 and in 1914 the seat of the federal government of Nigeria. Lagos maintained the latter position until 1990.

The Nigerian financial system is dominated by metropolitan Lagos. Of the 50 commercial and merchant banks operating in Nigeria in 1988, about half had their head offices in Lagos. Others had branch offices in Lagos that may be considered pseudo head offices, based on the volume and value of transactions relative to other branches and the head office. All but one of the development finance institutions (i.e. the Nigerian Industrial Development Bank, the Nigerian Bank for Commerce and Industry, the Federal Savings Bank, and the Federal Mortgage Bank) have their head offices in Lagos - the only exception is the Nigerian Agricultural Bank, which is located in Kaduna. Along with the banking sector, the insurance industry in Nigeria is also dominated by metropolitan Lagos. Of the 83 insurance companies registered in Nigeria as of April 1982, 68 per cent had their head offices in Lagos, while virtually all the others had major branch offices in Lagos.

Nevertheless, over the decades, metropolitan Lagos has become the pre-eminent city in the Nigerian system. Lagos functioned as the political and administrative capital of Nigeria from the time the Northern and Southern provinces of Nigeria were amalgamated in 1914, through political independence in 1960, until the federal capital moved to Abuja in 1990. During this period it acquired leadership among Nigerian cities in terms of economic and social activities, particularly in manufacturing, trade, other services, and, most recently, finance, banking, and insurance. Despite the downturn in economic activities at the national level, metropolitan Lagos is still the premier manufacturing city not only in Nigeria, but also at a regional scale, for the west coast of Africa. It is the most important seaport, both in Nigeria and on the west coast of Africa, with substantial import and export trade both nationally and internationally. Metropolitan Lagos is the most important node for telecommunications and the most accessible city in Nigeria by land, air, and sea. It has thus attracted to itself the largest concentration of multinational corporations in Nigeria. It has become not only a West African regional centre but also a focus of international interaction at continental and to some extent at the world scale.

[Kako]

@ CIC Ikeja became the capital of Lagos state in 1976, not 1967.

[Gotti]

My brother, there is inequality everywhere, but you can't say that it is arguably worse in the US and the same time say we have further bastardised the economic system in Nigeria. Further bastardisation is exactly why the inequality is worse in Nigeria. There is still the semblance of a welfare state in the US. You can still get a reasonable education in free public schools. These all help reduce inequality. You can check this for further info on Nigeria "extreme inequality":
https://www.oxfam.org/en/even-it-nigeri ... ty-numbers

Bros, the top 1% in the US control 90% of the wealth...
Minimum wage is $15K per year, and has not gone up for years.

You got my "bastardization" remark, because it exactly goes to the fact that Nigeria has wholeheartedly adopted the private capital dominated system without the safety net that often goes with it. Nonetheless, wealth disparity in the US is "arguably" worse because the US is in the midst (and frankly has been for a while) of huge WEALTH DISTRIBUTION - from the poor to the super rich, as the social safety system keeps getting steadily eroded and slashed (healthcare, education, social housing, benefits) to pay for huge tax cuts for the wealthy and windfalls for defense contractors. The generality of the Nigerian populace never experienced the level of wealth and economic comfort experienced by the generality of US citizens, and the fact that swathes of the latter are getting poorer in real terms (it's been predicted that many Millennials will not enjoy as much wealth as their parents) in the midst of ever-growing mind-boggling private wealth is what makes wealth disparity in the US "arguably" worse.

PS: BTW, the infrastructure that attracts economic agents to Lagos (whether human or capital) hhas been largely built by the LASG or by private capital (with the odd exception). The federal government has not undertaken a single new infrastructural project in Lagos (roads, bridges, power plant, schools, hospital, airports, ports, etc) since the relocation of the federal capital over a quarter of a century ago!

[Coach]

Look at the beds and wheelchairs in 12 months time.
Pathetic.

[Gotti]

Look at the beds and wheelchairs in 12 months time.
Pathetic.

Why don't you offer your maintenance services?

[cic old boy]

Bros, the top 1% in the US control 90% of the wealth...
Minimum wage is $15K per year, and has not gone up for years.

You got my "bastardization" remark, because it exactly goes to the fact that Nigeria has wholeheartedly adopted the private capital dominated system without the safety net that often goes with it. Nonetheless, wealth disparity in the US is "arguably" worse because the US is in the midst (and frankly has been for a while) of huge WEALTH DISTRIBUTION - from the poor to the super rich, as the social safety system keeps getting steadily eroded and slashed (healthcare, education, social housing, benefits) to pay for huge tax cuts for the wealthy and windfalls for defense contractors. The generality of the Nigerian populace never experienced the level of wealth and economic comfort experienced by the generality of US citizens, and the fact that swathes of the latter are getting poorer in real terms (it's been predicted that many Millennials will not enjoy as much wealth as their parents) in the midst of ever-growing mind-boggling private wealth is what makes wealth disparity in the US "arguably" worse.

PS: BTW, the infrastructure that attracts economic agents to Lagos (whether human or capital) hhas been largely built by the LASG or by private capital (with the odd exception). The federal government has not undertaken a single new infrastructural project in Lagos (roads, bridges, power plant, schools, hospital, airports, ports, etc) since the relocation of the federal capital over a quarter of a century ago!

Nna, many Nigerians can't even get a minimum wage job and many states either refuse to pay the minimum wage and/or don't pay wages when due. And the minimum wage is $1,543.00 a year.

Yes, they have been robbing the poor to pay the rich in the US (and most Western nations) since the Reagan/Thatcher years, but they still have a long way to go to shove the noses of the majority of their people into the dirt poor conditions that is reality for the majority of Nigerians. Even in Lagos with all its economic advantages, about two-thirds of the population live in slums. And the govt that you claim is "trying" has been destroying those slums, making the dwellers homeless to make way for rich property developers.

PS: Whatever infrastructure built by the LSG is from money made from taxing businesses that took advantage of the federal presence and infrastructure such as the seaports and the airport. Take away that advantage given it by being a commercial and political capital and Lagos would have been no different from Ibadan. And take the grand larceny of Tinubu, Fashola and co away, and there would be little need for Oba Martins' benevolence!

[1naija]

What Lagos state do or don't do has nothing to do with a man giving back to his community . Texas is by all means a rich state yet people including football, basketball, and baseball players donate equipment and money to hospitals across the state all the time. People that can give should not dictate how others should give. You and Ayo should go and donate instead of using a governor's performance as excuse.

This is the type of thoughtlessness that one has to endure here at too frequent intervals. You either didn't read the MLK quote or you didn't understand it.

Charity is great, but a system that produces beggars isn't right and can't be changed merely by charity. You can give back to your community as much as you like. But a community in which state provision is almost non-existent and charity is sometimes the only option, is on the brink of disaster. If there is no running water in your village, nothing stops you from donating a borehole there. It doesn't mean it is right that the govt hasn't provided running water.

My school's old boys association are building a dormitory in the school b/c of the degraded conditions the students sleep in. Leonard Blavatnik donated £75m to Oxford to set a school of govt. The two are charitable donations, but not quite the same. Oxford can function very well without that donation, while my old school is a complete mess without the contributions of old boys.

You should park your thoughts about Texas and hospitals b/c I don't want to go into another discussion about healthcare in America. Needless to talk about California - even richer than Texas - yet many of the millions of uninsured there have to take advantage of free treatment and healthcare checks run by charities that operate in Third World countries.

Where did I dictate how Oba should give? How many times have I asked you to put down the bottle of Johnnie Walker?

Again, what has an unrelated quote from Matin Luther King got to do with Obafemi Martins donating Medical equipment to his community? It's either you didn't understand the relationship between the quote you posted and Obafemi Martin's unsolicited kind gesture or you were just being unappreciative of other peoples kindness.

Obafemi didn't tell you he was doing it to help Lagos state goverment. He didn't tell you he was asked to donate as indicated in the MLK quote you posted. You should try and understand the context of quotes you post so you wont mis-apply them. MLK could not have been criticizing donation when the entire civil rights movement was sponsored through donation. We need to encourage people like Obafemi Martins. You should go and give and stop dictating how others should give just to justify your own position of not giving.

[cic old boy]

Again, what has an unrelated quote from Matin Luther King got to do with Obafemi Martins donating Medical equipment to his community. It's either you didn't understand the relationship between the quote you posted and Obafemi Martin's unsolicited kind gesture or you were just being unappreciative of other peoples kindness.

Obafemi didn't tell you he was doing it to help Lagos state goverment. He didn't tell you he was asked to donate as indicated in the MLK quote you posted. You should try and understand the contest of quotes you post so you wont mis-apply them. MLK could not have been criticizing donation when the entire civil rights movement was sponsored through donation. We need to encourage people like Obafemi Martins. You should go and give and stop dictating how others should give just to justify your own position of not giving.

MLK was talking about charity. What Oba did was charity. Are you really this thick? I hope you are joking!

I appreciated Oba's kindness and didn't appreciate the poor conditions of Lagos hospitals. So attacked the governor. Try and think b/4 posting.

The donation was for hospital beds and wheelchairs and it was made to the LSG. So he didn't have to tell me anything. Did you read the first post? Are you OK?

When MLK said "we are called to play the good Samaritan on life's roadside", it doesn't literally mean that a phone call is made to us! Damn! What da heck are you on??? MLK was a minister of the church. He was referring to the Christian calling to be charitable. That's what Oba was doing here.

MLK was not criticising donations. You are embarrassing yourself. He was acknowledged the Christian spirit of giving, but said giving was just an initial act. We must extend the giving to questioning the edifice that makes beggars of people and calling for it to be changed. That's exactly what I did. I praised Oba and said the LSG must be held accountable for ensuring hospitals are equipped and the disabled have what they need.

Once again, you are called to put down the bottle!

[Gotti]

Nna, many Nigerians can't even get a minimum wage job and many states either refuse to pay the minimum wage and/or don't pay wages when due. And the minimum wage is $1,543.00 a year.

Neither can many Americans - or the illegal immigrants paid under the table...
And btw, $1543 (or its Naira equivalent) goes a much longer way in Naija than $15K does in the US.

Nonetheless, not sure how any person could with a straight face be favorably comparing poverty in the US with its Nigerian counterpart (especially given that the US has approximately 40 times the GDP of Nigeria with only twice its population). There's absolutely NO rational reason why US citizens (including working citizens) should be living wretched poor lives in a country so filthy rich that the richest 100 persons control more wealth than the GDP of several countries combined, and the fact that it not only exists but is quite rampant is a blight and disgrace, and makes it "arguably" worse than Nigeria's. It's not as if the US has funding issues.

PS: While I am personally against demolishing slum without providing suitable alternatives (which sadly has not generally been the case), it is pretty much the same slum folks that the LASG "tries" to economically empower through micro-credit and grants (for everything from buying fishing nets, farm implements, pots and pan for their bukas, etc), providing artisanal training, adult education, free or subsidized healthcare, education and transportation (btw, school children in uniform ride BRT buses for FREE). Such economic and social empowerment is ultimately a more pragmatic means out of slum living.

[Gotti]

PS: Whatever infrastructure built by the LSG is from money made from taxing businesses that took advantage of the federal presence and infrastructure such as the seaports and the airport. Take away that advantage given it by being a commercial and political capital and Lagos would have been no different from Ibadan. And take the grand larceny of Tinubu, Fashola and co away, and there would be little need for Oba Martins' benevolence!

There are federal ports in Calabar, Port Harcourt, Onne, Warri, Koko, Bonny, Sapele, Qua Iboe, Okririka, Burutu, Escravos, Forcados, etc. There are federal airports dotted all over Nigeria (even in Enugu, where CIC is located ). And of course there are federal roads dotted all over Nigeria - many of which probably require the sort of major repairs that Lagos has undertaken on several federal roads in Lagos, and is currently undertaking with respect to the Badagry Expressway and the Airport Road, among others. Lagos does not even host any major federal industrial project (fertilizer, cement, steel, refineries, petrochemicals, etc), if any federal industrial project at all, and has barely one federal government built power plant (in comparison, Delta State has 3 and Abia State 2). On the other hand, valuable swathes of Lagos appropriated by the federal government under Eminent Domain when Lagos was the federal capital continues to lie in derelict waste over more than a quarter of a century (for instance, almost the entire stretch of Ahmadu Bello Way facing the bar beach is populated by empty rundown federal government properties and so-called state liaison offices), constituting a veritable blight and without any economic benefit to the state.

[GG of G]

PS: Whatever infrastructure built by the LSG is from money made from taxing businesses that took advantage of the federal presence and infrastructure such as the seaports and the airport. Take away that advantage given it by being a commercial and political capital and Lagos would have been no different from Ibadan. And take the grand larceny of Tinubu, Fashola and co away, and there would be little need for Oba Martins' benevolence!

There are federal ports in Calabar, Port Harcourt, Onne, Warri, Koko, Bonny, Sapele, Qua Iboe, Okririka, Burutu, Escravos, Forcados, etc. There are federal airports dotted all over Nigeria (even in Enugu, where CIC is located ). And of course there are federal roads dotted all over Nigeria - many of which probably require the sort of major repairs that Lagos has undertaken on several federal roads in Lagos, and is currently undertaking with respect to the Badagry Expressway and the Airport Road, among others. Lagos does not even host any major federal industrial project (fertilizer, cement, steel, refineries, petrochemicals, etc), if any federal industrial project at all, and has barely one federal government built power plant (in comparison, Delta State has 3 and Abia State 2). On the other hand, valuable swathes of Lagos appropriated by the federal government under Eminent Domain when Lagos was the federal capital continues to lie in derelict waste over more than a quarter of a century (for instance, almost the entire stretch of Ahmadu Bello Way facing the bar beach is populated by empty rundown federal government properties and so-called state liaison offices), constituting a veritable blight and without any economic benefit to the state.

I find the highlighted really really annoying, honestly - it's just ridiculous. Even the whole Bonny camp is a massive waste of real prime estate.

[Gotti]

Speaking of the federal government, it took the federal government's NNPC three whole years to relocate its pipelines on the Badagry Expressway right of way to enable construction to continue. Presently, the Army has yet to agree to the demolition of the parts of the Ojo Cantonment wall that encroaches on the same Badagry Expressway ROW and I think the Nigeria Police only recently agreed to the same. It took almost a decade to secure the ROW which the Nigeria Railway Corporation holds but do not use for Lagos to use to construct the Red Line of the state's light commuter rail project, and several years for the rights to build a rail-bridge over the Lagos Marina for the Blue Line because under Nigeria's bizarre federal system, the federal government controls the inland waterways - which is also largely why it is difficult to establish proper ferry services in Lagos (as operators have to be licensed and regulated by the federal government's National Inland Waterways Authority).

Bros, that is just some of the federal government's influence on the development of infrastructure in Lagos. It is NOT a helpful (not even benign) influence but rather often downright destructive.

[cic old boy]

There are federal ports in Calabar, Port Harcourt, Onne, Warri, Koko, Bonny, Sapele, Qua Iboe, Okririka, Burutu, Escravos, Forcados, etc. There are federal airports dotted all over Nigeria (even in Enugu, where CIC is located ). And of course there are federal roads dotted all over Nigeria - many of which probably require the sort of major repairs that Lagos has undertaken on several federal roads in Lagos, and is currently undertaking with respect to the Badagry Expressway and the Airport Road, among others. Lagos does not even host any major federal industrial project (fertilizer, cement, steel, refineries, petrochemicals, etc), if any federal industrial project at all, and has barely one federal government built power plant (in comparison, Delta State has 3 and Abia State 2). On the other hand, valuable swathes of Lagos appropriated by the federal government under Eminent Domain when Lagos was the federal capital continues to lie in derelict waste over more than a quarter of a century (for instance, almost the entire stretch of Ahmadu Bello Way facing the bar beach is populated by empty rundown federal government properties and so-called state liaison offices), constituting a veritable blight and without any economic benefit to the state.

I have flown from London to Enugu twice and only 2 international airlines ply that route b/c it is yet to be upgraded. It is the same with the seaports. Most stuff go to through Lagos b/c none of the others are functioning at a reasonable capacity. Until Abuja Airport was built, Lagos was mainly the only option for many international travellers.

The Nigerian constitution states: "The State shall direct its policy towards ensuring the promotion of a planned and balanced economic development". Inadequacies in terms of balanced economic development led to the siting of many facilities in Lagos and overpopulation in the place.