Arsenal 3 Vs Liverpool 3

[bepanda]

Is Ospina really that bad, he can't be given a chance? Is there a reason we can't blame the second goal on Cech either? This is the 100th time he concedes a goal like that. I think most players know that by now. You don't need power to beat him, just place the ball in the corner and Cech will never get to it. Mane scored a similar goal at Anfield.
Cech has completely lost any springs he has in his legs. He wins high balls because he is tall, not because he jumps. Because he can't jump anymore.
Same reason Cech has never saved a PK for Arsenal. Just push the ball in the corner and he is beaten, He makes saves, because the ball is shot directly at him. I'm sorry, that is not the level of a EPL top keeper.
Are these things not obvious to Wenger? Details like these are the main reason I have lost trust in Wenger for years. His judgement is completely clouded.

Pissed with the defending on that third goal....and Cech's flap!
Good comeback but we are not good enough, nonetheless feel better than I felt at HT.

I don't see how you can blame Cech for that goal. He did not flap, he made a solid attempt at saving that ball and got unlucky. It was not close to what Mignolet did.

I think the dissonance here comes from one thing...many Arsenal fans expect Cech to be one of the best goalies in the league i.e. at the level of De Gea.
Fact is, he isn't that. Those days are long gone. Once you accept that then it's understandable why he didn't save that but if you have the perception that he is still a world class goalie then he simply has to save those.
Is he world class to me? No. Not at all.

[Ayo Akinfe]

Arsenal need to buy a world class keeper if they want to ever win the Premiership. I can see Francis Uzoho coming good with time as he has more talent than what I currently see out there.

[anikulapo]

I'm seriously beginning to wonder if our giant kid goalie Matt Macey might be the best goalie on our roster. All three goals should have been saved by Cech ....

Worst of which was third .... Pathetic

[Skylolo]

Pissed with the defending on that third goal....and Cech's flap!

Good comeback but we are not good enough, nonetheless feel better than I felt at HT.

I don't see how you can blame Cech for that goal. He did not flap, he made a solid attempt at saving that ball and got unlucky. It was not close to what Mignolet did.

I think the dissonance here comes from one thing...many Arsenal fans expect Cech to be one of the best goalies in the league i.e. at the level of De Gea.
Fact is, he isn't that. Those days are long gone. Once you accept that then it's understandable why he didn't save that but if you have the perception that he is still a world class goalie then he simply has to save those.

Is he world class to me? No. Not at all.

I felt that hand should have been stronger to push the ball further away.

AW has been talking about Cech playing untill 40 like Van der Saar, I wish him well but with his performances in the last year I hope he does not play until he is 40 with us.

[txj]

@Tx, Liverpool are not winning the league any time soon. More importantly however, perhaps one could revisit the debate re: Simon Soft Mint Mignolet. Pathetic. Till Liverpool invest in a proper defence, they'll remain a laughing stock. And not any old stock, Knorr one pot chicken stock.

The problem in football is that there are too many dullards involved in the game. And u know, I'm not one for cliches and buzz words...

At this time last season the uproar was about Guardiola's inability to coach defense and tackling. But while the uproar was in full steam he was repeatedly lamenting failure to take chances!

This season's buzz word is clean sheets. Retarded pundits manufacturing stupid buzz words and like dutiful minions, the unsuspecting fans lap it up...

Suddenly playing against Stoke on a cold Tuesday becomes the standard for measuring excellence!
One leg good, two legs better!!!! P-o-t-a-t-o ooooo.

LFC lost (yes they did!) this game PRIMARILY because they did not take their chances. As the late Al Davis once said, 'just win baby'...

Its not the failure to invest in defence that is primarily failing LFC, its the lack of a controlling midfielder.

True Mignolet is a poor GK; that was always the case...

Just cus football is in the realm of sports and entertainment, is not reason to abandon intelligence....

[Coach]

@Chief Oga Tx, t'is somewhat disingenuos to dismiss the above argument when 23 sits snuggly in the goals against column. 20 games played, 23 goals conceded, over a goal a game and yet talk of defence is supposedly cliché. Casually dissected with consummate easy by Tottenham, comfortably opened up three times in 5 minutes (faster than Sevilla's), yet defending is no more than cliché. Granted Liverpool are punching well above their weight with a back four that has no business playing at the top four. Not a single component would start for any of the top six, injuries and suspensions included. Cliché of course. When Simon Soft Mint Mignolet or L'Oreal Can't Karius man the posts with the acumen of a limbless scarecrow, cliché presumably. Dejan Senderos Lovren, cliché, UnRagnar Klavan signed purely as an ode to the Amazon series presumably, cliché. Beloved has been just as pathetic and one had the temerity to point at the table and tell no lies. Two Michael Katsidis swinging wildly like kids in a playground. Neither is doing anything of note, league or champions, for some time. Cliché? OK then.

[benteke]

Is Sadio Mane now trying to hard to keep up with Salah, i noticed he chose to go for the spectacular goal and missed, all the time i watched him he always made very good decisions in the 18 area,

[Ayo Akinfe]

@Chief Oga Tx, t'is somewhat disingenuos to dismiss the above argument when 23 sits snuggly in the goals against column. 20 games played, 23 goals conceded, over a goal a game and yet talk of defence is supposedly cliché. Casually dissected with consummate easy by Tottenham, comfortably opened up three times in 5 minutes (faster than Sevilla's), yet defending is no more than cliché. Granted Liverpool are punching well above their weight with a back four that has no business playing at the top four. Not a single component would start for any of the top six, injuries and suspensions included. Cliché of course. When Simon Soft Mint Mignolet or L'Oreal Can't Karius man the posts with the acumen of a limbless scarecrow, cliché presumably. Dejan Senderos Lovren, cliché, UnRagnar Klavan signed purely as an ode to the Amazon series presumably, cliché. Beloved has been just as pathetic and one had the temerity to point at the table and tell no lies. Two Michael Katsidis swinging wildly like kids in a playground. Neither is doing anything of note, league or champions, for some time. Cliché? OK then.

Valid point about the Liverpool back five. Today we will witness El Classico. Would any of the Liverpool defenders get into either team?

[Coach]

Would any start for City's Carabao cup XI? Cliche...hasn't he retired? Decent leftback back in his Beloved days. Nonsense.

[balo]

Is Ospina really that bad, he can't be given a chance? Is there a reason we can't blame the second goal on Cech either? This is the 100th time he concedes a goal like that. I think most players know that by now. You don't need power to beat him, just place the ball in the corner and Cech will never get to it. Mane scored a similar goal at Anfield.
Cech has completely lost any springs he has in his legs. He wins high balls because he is tall, not because he jumps. Because he can't jump anymore.
Same reason Cech has never saved a PK for Arsenal. Just push the ball in the corner and he is beaten, He makes saves, because the ball is shot directly at him. I'm sorry, that is not the level of a EPL top keeper.
Are these things not obvious to Wenger? Details like these are the main reason I have lost trust in Wenger for years. His judgement is completely clouded.

Pissed with the defending on that third goal....and Cech's flap!
Good comeback but we are not good enough, nonetheless feel better than I felt at HT.

I don't see how you can blame Cech for that goal. He did not flap, he made a solid attempt at saving that ball and got unlucky. It was not close to what Mignolet did.

I think the dissonance here comes from one thing...many Arsenal fans expect Cech to be one of the best goalies in the league i.e. at the level of De Gea.
Fact is, he isn't that. Those days are long gone. Once you accept that then it's understandable why he didn't save that but if you have the perception that he is still a world class goalie then he simply has to save those.
Is he world class to me? No. Not at all.

Even De Gea may not save that second goal. It took some deflection and was almost inside the net before Cech saw it.

[Coach]

@?Bep, yes Ospina is garbage, an olive skinned Mignolet, zero area command and box presence, if Gandalf decides to build a defence around him, it'll be a case of the Almunia's, Hollywood saves and Carry On Klangers. Simply put, Ospina can do one. Do two if he likes.

[mcal]

Is Sadio Mane now trying to hard to keep up with Salah, i noticed he chose to go for the spectacular goal and missed, all the time i watched him he always made very good decisions in the 18 area,

...he and Salah were trying to out do each other. If they had scored all their clear chances (in the 1st half) Arsenal for dey for thick okra soup of recovering.

[Cito]

Arsenal has a Manchurian candidate for a coach. That transformation happened around 2004 or 2005.
There is also a swap for the real Belerin ala G.I. Joe: Rise of the Cobra. The real guy is being held somewhere while his swap is playing for Arsenal.

[txj]

@Chief Oga Tx, t'is somewhat disingenuos to dismiss the above argument when 23 sits snuggly in the goals against column. 20 games played, 23 goals conceded, over a goal a game and yet talk of defence is supposedly cliché. Casually dissected with consummate easy by Tottenham, comfortably opened up three times in 5 minutes (faster than Sevilla's), yet defending is no more than cliché. Granted Liverpool are punching well above their weight with a back four that has no business playing at the top four. Not a single component would start for any of the top six, injuries and suspensions included. Cliché of course. When Simon Soft Mint Mignolet or L'Oreal Can't Karius man the posts with the acumen of a limbless scarecrow, cliché presumably. Dejan Senderos Lovren, cliché, UnRagnar Klavan signed purely as an ode to the Amazon series presumably, cliché. Beloved has been just as pathetic and one had the temerity to point at the table and tell no lies. Two Michael Katsidis swinging wildly like kids in a playground. Neither is doing anything of note, league or champions, for some time. Cliché? OK then.

Defensive failings have to be put in context. In the context of other failings and assigned relative weights. That’s the difference between intelligence in football and mere cliche hunting.

After looking at the goals against column, take ia deeper look at the chances created vs goals scored.

While the defensive failings are obvious, it’s the chance conversion ratio that is the more significant factor.

[Coach]

@Chief Oga Tx, simply put, Liverpool cannot defend and that inability will leave them staring at photos of Ian Rush in skimpy shorts and Candy emblazoned tops, if a league title is desired. No team conceding 23 goals by the halfway mark, has any business winning the league and WONT. Yes, Liverpool are enthralling pouring forward, the Coutinhos, the Firminos, the Saidos, the MoMo's. but ultimately, its the Klavans, the Lovrens and the various other black bags full of rubbish that ruin any chance they have. Three goals in a matter of seconds, two goal lead and pouring forward like illegals scurrying towards a breach in the border. And when the heat was on, look at how Gomez and Soft Mint responded. Naby Keita is not enough, the back five is garbage! Call it cliche, others will call it matter of fact. 40-50 goals conceded by the end of the season perhaps? Ridiculous!

[tfco]

@Tx, Liverpool are not winning the league any time soon. More importantly however, perhaps one could revisit the debate re: Simon Soft Mint Mignolet. Pathetic. Till Liverpool invest in a proper defence, they'll remain a laughing stock. And not any old stock, Knorr one pot chicken stock.

The problem in football is that there are too many dullards involved in the game. And u know, I'm not one for cliches and buzz words...

At this time last season the uproar was about Guardiola's inability to coach defense and tackling. But while the uproar was in full steam he was repeatedly lamenting failure to take chances!

This season's buzz word is clean sheets. Retarded pundits manufacturing stupid buzz words and like dutiful minions, the unsuspecting fans lap it up...

Suddenly playing against Stoke on a cold Tuesday becomes the standard for measuring excellence!
One leg good, two legs better!!!! P-o-t-a-t-o ooooo.
....

quit while you're behind.

TP has managed 2-3 teams since that phrase was 'the standard'.

p.s - issa joke

[Coach]

One game, three goals conceded.
Big Sam, 7 games, 2 goals against.
Defence is not the issue. Its Gael cliche.

[txj]

@Chief Oga Tx, simply put, Liverpool cannot defend and that inability will leave them staring at photos of Ian Rush in skimpy shorts and Candy emblazoned tops, if a league title is desired. No team conceding 23 goals by the halfway mark, has any business winning the league and WONT. Yes, Liverpool are enthralling pouring forward, the Coutinhos, the Firminos, the Saidos, the MoMo's. but ultimately, its the Klavans, the Lovrens and the various other black bags full of rubbish that ruin any chance they have. Three goals in a matter of seconds, two goal lead and pouring forward like illegals scurrying towards a breach in the border. And when the heat was on, look at how Gomez and Soft Mint responded. Naby Keita is not enough, the back five is garbage! Call it cliche, others will call it matter of fact. 40-50 goals conceded by the end of the season perhaps? Ridiculous!

Its actually not, esp if u allow urself to get away from the cliches and think. I'll say this, and then no more...

Its rather the failures of the CMs- Hendo, Can, Milner, Gini; all predominantly vertical MFs, which ensures that LFC are only truly effective playing at a certain tempo.

There are 2 main front-foot teams in the PL, City and LFC. The major differences between the two teams lies in the efficiency of the attack (CCR), and the technical abilities of KDB and Silva in controlling play.

For front foot teams, defensive ability is very closely allied with offensive ability. And in football, the old axiom is to maximize ur strengths and minimize ur weaknesses. Individually, City's defenders will not stand out as best pure defenders in the PL. But its always about context. Which is not to say they are not good, or that they are not better than LFC's.

That's why at this time last season, Pep was lamenting their poor CCR, while the whole cliche ridden universe of English football was talking about tackling!!!

Three individual errors stood out yesterday over a 10min span- Gomez, Mignolet (a poor GK) and Can (failing to track the runner).

That is what is open to the obvious eye. But the deeper issue lay ahead of the back four. From and LFC perspective, the game, esp at that time did not need to be played in the context of end to end football. It warranted control, and LFC do not have CMs who can give u that...

[The YeyeMan]

Good analysis of Liverpool's problems. They do lie in MF and interestingly Naby Keita isn't the player to solve that particular problem. Gini could control tempo.... his game is flexible than the others; even Matip could probably do a better job in MF than what Henderson is doing.

[Coach]

Nonsense, teams will always concede chances, even the Great Bristol City fashioned two against Paul Pogba and Sons. Liverpool supplement the mandatory two with a few extra on the house courtesy of comical defending and quite frankly, absolute incompetence in the fine art. What was Gomez doing? Where was the gegenpressure on Xhaka, who was marking Ozil? If it's not a marshmallow gloved goalkeeper it's attention deficit defending. There's nothing three Ngolo Kante's could do to help. Where's the line? Back four more staggered than a drunken walk home. Pathetic. As a collective, Liverpool can't defend for sh*te and as a result, will achieve their usual nothing this season.

[txj]

Good analysis of Liverpool's problems. They do lie in MF and interestingly Naby Keita isn't the player to solve that particular problem. Gini could control tempo.... his game is flexible than the others; even Matip could probably do a better job in MF than what Henderson is doing.

Surprised that Klopp hasn’t installed Gini in that role. Agreed re Naby, although he did play there at Salzburg

[Riche007]

Thunder fire these Looserfools

I just did!

[Waffiman]

I'm seriously beginning to wonder if our giant kid goalie Matt Macey might be the best goalie on our roster. All three goals should have been saved by Cech ....

Worst of which was third .... Pathetic

That deflection off Mustafi cannot be saved by any Keeper.