How Guardiola is revolutionizing English football

Chief Ogbunigwe · Post by **Chief Ogbunigwe** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:47 am

txj wrote:@ Waffi,
Maslov is one of the true greats in football. Interestingly, Pep in some of his earlier interviews, references his work.

Innovation in football does not occur in a vacuum; it builds on what was preceding...

Prior to his arrival in England, the EPL was always presented as Pep waterloo, where those fancy tiki-taka ideas will turn turkey. It is true, his work with City cannot be viewed in isolation from those who came before him, beginning with Wenger. But he has taken what was, to new heights, and not just in his tactical formulations but the ability to use playing systems in a manner that enhances player freshness. Its been stunning how little he has rotated the squad given the games/competitions. Yes, he has rotated, but not at the level one would have thought...

Its a huge mistake to reduce this to finances. True they have spent a lot of money, but he could've used those same players playing counterattacking football, like Jose was doing with Ronaldo and co in Madrid, even against Levante!

But I still think he got lucky this season that LFC screwed up its transfer dealings in the summer....but that's just me

Ironically, Maslov is ranked below Valeriy Lobanovskiy in Russia/USSR. Did Maslov coach the national team in 1958 WW, where Brazil defeated them with the legendary Lev Yashin in goal?

platinum · Post by **platinum** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:20 am

Chief Ogbunigwe wrote:
txj wrote:@ Waffi,
Maslov is one of the true greats in football. Interestingly, Pep in some of his earlier interviews, references his work.

Innovation in football does not occur in a vacuum; it builds on what was preceding...

Prior to his arrival in England, the EPL was always presented as Pep waterloo, where those fancy tiki-taka ideas will turn turkey. It is true, his work with City cannot be viewed in isolation from those who came before him, beginning with Wenger. But he has taken what was, to new heights, and not just in his tactical formulations but the ability to use playing systems in a manner that enhances player freshness. Its been stunning how little he has rotated the squad given the games/competitions. Yes, he has rotated, but not at the level one would have thought...

Its a huge mistake to reduce this to finances. True they have spent a lot of money, but he could've used those same players playing counterattacking football, like Jose was doing with Ronaldo and co in Madrid, even against Levante!

But I still think he got lucky this season that LFC screwed up its transfer dealings in the summer....but that's just me
Ironically, Maslov is ranked below Valeriy Lobanovskiy in Russia/USSR. Did Maslov coach the national team in 1958 WW, where Brazil defeated them with the legendary Lev Yashin in goal?

True story. Lobanovsky is a god of Russian footie.

ohsee · Post by **ohsee** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:54 am

charlie wrote:
Chief Ogbunigwe wrote:
charlie wrote:Any coach can win big trophies if they have a blank check to buy the best players in the world.
.
You probably didn’t think this through. You sound like a bitter Arsenal fan.
Ad hominem. If you have a counter point, make it.
If you dont, STFU.

Chief, learn to recognize irony so you don't make yourself look bad by insulting an elder who agrees with you.

platinum · Post by **platinum** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:29 pm

ohsee wrote:
charlie wrote:
Chief Ogbunigwe wrote:
charlie wrote:Any coach can win big trophies if they have a blank check to buy the best players in the world.
.
You probably didn’t think this through. You sound like a bitter Arsenal fan.
Ad hominem. If you have a counter point, make it.
If you dont, STFU.
Chief, learn to recognize irony so you don't make yourself look bad by insulting an elder who agrees with you.

charlie get hot belle, Chief O go soon send am go 'pick pin' for corner of forum

balo · Post by **balo** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:06 pm

He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!

Post by **Waffiman** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:14 pm

Chief Ogbunigwe wrote:
txj wrote:@ Waffi,
Maslov is one of the true greats in football. Interestingly, Pep in some of his earlier interviews, references his work.

Innovation in football does not occur in a vacuum; it builds on what was preceding...

Prior to his arrival in England, the EPL was always presented as Pep waterloo, where those fancy tiki-taka ideas will turn turkey. It is true, his work with City cannot be viewed in isolation from those who came before him, beginning with Wenger. But he has taken what was, to new heights, and not just in his tactical formulations but the ability to use playing systems in a manner that enhances player freshness. Its been stunning how little he has rotated the squad given the games/competitions. Yes, he has rotated, but not at the level one would have thought...

Its a huge mistake to reduce this to finances. True they have spent a lot of money, but he could've used those same players playing counterattacking football, like Jose was doing with Ronaldo and co in Madrid, even against Levante!

But I still think he got lucky this season that LFC screwed up its transfer dealings in the summer....but that's just me
Ironically, Maslov is ranked below Valeriy Lobanovskiy in Russia/USSR. Did Maslov coach the national team in 1958 WW, where Brazil defeated them with the legendary Lev Yashin in goal?

Of course he is. Lobanovsky had a far longer career. E.g. he manage Dynamo Kiev for 17 years, Maslov did for 6. Lobanovsky learnt a lot from Maslov and Maslov's teaching formed the foundation of his career.

Maslov was not the most liked of personalities cos he was stubborn. He was refused the USSR job cos of the conditions he set before taking the job. He was not the Manager in 1958, Gavriil Kachalin was.

Maslov was a pioneer who was not recognised in his time. It was Lobanovsky who hailed him and his contributions before he started getting his due. Like Maslov, IMHO Lobanovsky was a football genius. First man to compute data in football. One of my great memories was watching his Kiev side beat Arsenal in the CL at Wembley.

cchinukw · Post by **cchinukw** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 2:25 pm

benteke wrote:Nothing tangible in the article that talks about revolutionizing.
Pep is not the first manager to win things by moving one or two players to another role, and he shall not be the last.
He did it with Bayern, playing a fullback Lahm in midfield, but such situations are more a testament of the brilliance of the players involved in executing such daring tactics.

In this case i would like to pay tribute to Fernandinho, a great midfield player who does 3 jobs at once with so much ease.
He creates from deep lying positions, he is the main defensive midfielder and is also a centre back, he is the one who makes it easier for Pep to play Kevin and Silva in central midfield.
Credit to Pep for harnessing so much talent.

It's focus is more on they style of football played. Shifting the personnel explains a bit of the puzzle.

Mr. Piffington · Post by **Mr. Piffington** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:25 pm

balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!

But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

Post by **YUJAM** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:12 pm

Folks are just emotional because Pep has proved them wrong

I watched Lobanovsky's teams. I watched the Invincibles. And the truth is none of them is as tactically varied as Pep. Those teams did not have the possession stats his teams have. They dared not play as high up the field. They didn't have goalies that passed the ball like Pep's teams. In fact show me a coach that insisted that his teams especially the goalie play the ball out of the back. When it comes to tactical variation no one does it like Pep and we've seen hid this at all the teams he's coached. He can make in game adjustments as well as off game. We've seen him use some of the most brilliant tactics ever used with some truly groundbreaking.

Pep has revolutionized the game in England because he's playing a style that's never been seen in that league. Just the fact that teams are being forced to adjust to this style is reason to call his impact a revolution.

balo · Post by **balo** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:35 pm

Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.

Post by **YUJAM** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:48 pm

What exactly has fallen favorably for Pep? The fact that he is on course to break almost every record from goals scored, total pts, wins, away wins, margin of pt difference etc etc is all down to things falling favorably for Pep? Okaaaaay

balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.

balo · Post by **balo** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:00 pm

YUJAM wrote:What exactly has fallen favorably for Pep? The fact that he is on course to break almost every record from goals scored, total pts, wins, away wins, margin of pt difference etc etc is all down to things falling favorably for Pep? Okaaaaay

balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.

Yes. Is he the same Pep from last season or is this season Pep from some outer space?

metalalloy · Post by **metalalloy** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:23 pm

balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.

All the teams that started playing 3 in the back in the EPL will beg to differ.

The YeyeMan · Post by **The YeyeMan** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:35 pm

metalalloy wrote:
balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.
All the teams that started playing 3 in the back in the EPL will beg to differ.

Are you saying Pep started that trend?

benteke · Post by **benteke** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:51 pm

The YeyeMan wrote:
metalalloy wrote:
balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.
All the teams that started playing 3 in the back in the EPL will beg to differ.
Are you saying Pep started that trend?

Pep Guardiola invented everything that you see his Manchester City team doing. Even the way they dive is revolutionary

metalalloy · Post by **metalalloy** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:56 pm

The YeyeMan wrote:
metalalloy wrote:
balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.
All the teams that started playing 3 in the back in the EPL will beg to differ.
Are you saying Pep started that trend?

Are you now color blind? That would be the only explanation why you would failed to see what was clearly highlighted in my response. Perhaps you live in an alternate universe where pep coached chelsea, and they won the title last season playing 3 in the back

metalalloy · Post by **metalalloy** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:58 pm

benteke wrote:
The YeyeMan wrote:
metalalloy wrote:
balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.
All the teams that started playing 3 in the back in the EPL will beg to differ.
Are you saying Pep started that trend?
Pep Guardiola invented everything that you see his Manchester City team doing. Even the way they dive is revolutionary

Hopefully he invents a few brains for some folks in this thread.

Mr. Piffington · Post by **Mr. Piffington** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 6:27 pm

balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.

Chelsea were the run away leaders last year because with no champions league football they only had to focus on the league.

The rest of the excuses you listed aren't Pep and Man City's problems. They have been the best team so far this campaign and the league table proves it.

The YeyeMan · Post by **The YeyeMan** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 6:53 pm

metalalloy wrote:Are you now color blind? That would be the only explanation why you would failed to see what was clearly highlighted in my response. Perhaps you live in an alternate universe where pep coached chelsea, and they won the title last season playing 3 in the back

Yes, actually.

Try to be clear. Being funny isn't for you.

metalalloy · Post by **metalalloy** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:31 pm

The YeyeMan wrote:
metalalloy wrote:Are you now color blind? That would be the only explanation why you would failed to see what was clearly highlighted in my response. Perhaps you live in an alternate universe where pep coached chelsea, and they won the title last season playing 3 in the back
Yes, actually.

Try to be clear. Being funny isn't for you.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

the quote specifically talked about "last season" "chelsea" and "winning"

If Pep is what you deduce after reading all that, being "color blind" is the least of your problems

balo · Post by **balo** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:42 pm

Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:
Mr. Piffington wrote:
balo wrote:He couldn't revolutionize against Wigan. Just saying!
Squabble not 4ble!
But they revolutionized against the vast majority of the teams they played so far this season and are 16 points clear and a trophy in the bag. Just saying.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.

This season, a lot of things fell favorably for Pep.

Liverpool with defensive woes.
Man U with injury woes
Chelsea - penny-pinching and a knuckle-head coach
Arsenal - lost the plot with Wenger
Man C - buying right.
SPURS - Injuries (Wanyama and Alderw....)

Remove all the indices above and the league becomes tighter. I am not saying Pep is a bad coach, but he didn't revo anything.
Chelsea were the run away leaders last year because with no champions league football they only had to focus on the league.

The rest of the excuses you listed aren't Pep and Man City's problems. They have been the best team so far this campaign and the league table proves it.

Pep is such a revolutionary, he wasn't part of the EPL last season.
He should be winning the EPL for the next few seasons until he moves on.
Unless Wigan makes it to the EPL.

The YeyeMan · Post by **The YeyeMan** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:06 pm

metalalloy wrote:
The YeyeMan wrote:
metalalloy wrote:Are you now color blind? That would be the only explanation why you would failed to see what was clearly highlighted in my response. Perhaps you live in an alternate universe where pep coached chelsea, and they won the title last season playing 3 in the back
Yes, actually.

Try to be clear. Being funny isn't for you.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.
the quote specifically talked about "last season" "chelsea" and "winning"

If Pep is what you deduce after reading all that, being "color blind" is the least of your problems

So you think Pep invented three at the back? This guy!

balo · Post by **balo** » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:11 pm

The YeyeMan wrote:
metalalloy wrote:
The YeyeMan wrote:
metalalloy wrote:Are you now color blind? That would be the only explanation why you would failed to see what was clearly highlighted in my response. Perhaps you live in an alternate universe where pep coached chelsea, and they won the title last season playing 3 in the back
Yes, actually.

Try to be clear. Being funny isn't for you.

It doesn't mean he revolutionized anything. Last season, Chelsea were the runaway team. They did not revolutionize jack to be winners.
the quote specifically talked about "last season" "chelsea" and "winning"

If Pep is what you deduce after reading all that, being "color blind" is the least of your problems
So you think Pep invented three at the back? This guy!

I think Conte "invented" 3 at the back. Says Metalalloy

Cybereagles

How Guardiola is revolutionizing English football

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