CL Final 2018.....Basket Keeper 1 vs Ogbuagu Zizou 3.......

[txj]

For those who are still wondering whether "taking out your opponent is a strategy

Funny how you completely forgot to mention the push in the back by the Liverpool #4 Van Dijk on Ramos leading to the collision.
I suppose that doesnt match your one-sided narrative

Did he also push his elbow?
It is what it is. Ramos is a true warrior....Moving on...

[charlie]

For those who are still wondering whether "taking out your opponent is a strategy

Funny how you completely forgot to mention the push in the back by the Liverpool #4 Van Dijk on Ramos leading to the collision.
I suppose that doesnt match your one-sided narrative

Did he also push his elbow?
It is what it is. Ramos is a true warrior....Moving on...

No silly, He was pushed in the back (or are you going to deny that).
He also was not looking at the keeper when his elbow struck the keepers face.
I can understand the keepers complaint though,..he was looking at the ball too when he got hit (clearly didnt see the push leading to the contact).

This was a case for a penalty against Liverpool by the letter of the law,..but given the contact that typically takes place during crosses, set plays, etc, its perfectly fine to carry on.

You all need to stop whinning. Its truly pathetic. Football is a contact sport (You EPL junkies should know).
These kind of things happen every single day and it is just part of the game.

[txj]

For those who are still wondering whether "taking out your opponent is a strategy

Funny how you completely forgot to mention the push in the back by the Liverpool #4 Van Dijk on Ramos leading to the collision.
I suppose that doesnt match your one-sided narrative

Did he also push his elbow?
It is what it is. Ramos is a true warrior....Moving on...

No silly, He was pushed in the back (or are you going to deny that).
He also was not looking at the keeper when his elbow struck the keepers face.
I can understand the keepers complaint though,..he was looking at the ball too when he got hit (clearly didnt see the push leading to the contact).

This was a case for a penalty against Liverpool by the letter of the law,..but given the contact that typically takes place during crosses, set plays, etc, its perfectly fine to carry on.

You all need to stop whinning. Its truly pathetic. Football is a contact sport (You EPL junkies should know).
These kind of things happen every single day and it is just part of the game.

Its not about whining; I already moved on.

2ndly, no way it was PK; that's not in any discussion except to someone totally ignorant about the game.

3rd, and most importantly, the elbow was thrown from flexing and jerking the arm. Its not a typical contact. I watch La Liga and Ramos far more than you do, and I know his tendencies.

[anikulapo]

@Tx, Chief Oga at that, a bit of discourse on the abuse down the right (Real's left) and the ineffectual introduction of Adam Lallana.

Marcello only became a factor in the game after Salah left...

Marcelo was already enjoying himself in the first 10minutes he was playing just outside the Liverpool 18 area and even had a scuffed shot at goal. Liverpool were outclassed for the majority of the game

Read my exchanges with Waffi so you can learn the game.

Kai! txj, the Soccer Socrates, biko help us to tell everybody how superior you are . Oga Football Phoolosopher, we all kneel at your feet, and enjoy the wisdoms that flow from your lips, abi na keyboard. We wonder why Liverpool has not hired you as exalted and superior adviser to Klopp? Some people say that those who cant, teach, but we know they are wrong from reading your marvelous works.

Between Waffi's and my comments, there's enough info to educate you about this game.

Beyond that, you'll need to return to Rant and Rave where u belong...

Lawd Have Mercy mo gbe ohhh

[charlie]

For those who are still wondering whether "taking out your opponent is a strategy

Funny how you completely forgot to mention the push in the back by the Liverpool #4 Van Dijk on Ramos leading to the collision.
I suppose that doesnt match your one-sided narrative

Did he also push his elbow?
It is what it is. Ramos is a true warrior....Moving on...

No silly, He was pushed in the back (or are you going to deny that).
He also was not looking at the keeper when his elbow struck the keepers face.
I can understand the keepers complaint though,..he was looking at the ball too when he got hit (clearly didnt see the push leading to the contact).

This was a case for a penalty against Liverpool by the letter of the law,..but given the contact that typically takes place during crosses, set plays, etc, its perfectly fine to carry on.

You all need to stop whinning. Its truly pathetic. Football is a contact sport (You EPL junkies should know).
These kind of things happen every single day and it is just part of the game.

Its not about whining; I already moved on.

2ndly, no way it was PK; that's not in any discussion except to someone totally ignorant about the game.

3rd, and most importantly, the elbow was thrown from flexing and jerking the arm. Its not a typical contact. I watch La Liga and Ramos far more than you do, and I know his tendencies.

A defender pushing an opposing player in the back in the 18 is not a foul/penalty offense???


Oya, come an tell me about my "ignorance of the game"

The only reason why that is not discussed by many of you yapping about fake "intentional elbows" is because it doesnt match your narrative of Ramos being a dirty player (which I will freely admit as a Madrid fan that he is in many cases,...but not this one).

Listen bruv,...if you really want to "move on" as you say,...just accept the loss like a Man (or Woman,...what ever you are) and stop complaining.

[Waffiman]

Sad to come this far and lose from two GK errors. Very painful...

The two gk errors hurt but your team was also outclassed in all respects by Madrid. Even when Sallah was in the game, Liverpool didn't create any chances. More over reliance on gra gra.

"Gra gra" is an unfair discription. Nothing rough about the high intensity pressing game.

But I made a comment somewhere about the teams before the game and the midfield.

It is fact, Liverpool run, run and run after the ball, Real Madrid in contrast, let the ball do all the running for them. This key factor was made manifest in that midfield with Modric and Kroos especially.

No disrespect to Henderson and co, but their hustle and pressing did not create a thing. Instead the ball control of the Real Madrid midfield, was the foundation for their victory.

It's quite ignorant to say its gra gra. And it's not designed to necessarily 'create a thing', but to facilitate the next step.

It's a little like the City game at the Ettihad when I repeatedly tried to draw attention to the game b/f the Mane RC.

Here it's the game b/4 the Salah injury, which LFC shaded, dropping Mane into the #10 role to begin the transition following the press...

In spite of Madrid's ball control, LFC controlled the half spaces which meant RM had to repeatedly reset the build up; no space for Marcello on the right; little space for CR7, etc...

The battle in MF, and by extension the game, prior to the injury, was not about ball control, but dominance of the half spaces

Fair enough. I did not go into detail cos I wznted to address the "gra gra" point mainly.

The purpose of the press it about the next step, which is about dominance of the ball and space, which on turn can lead to creativity especially if the ball is won with plenty of space to exploit.

However with Salah, Liverpool were indeed edging it, but they did not create a chance. Mane in the 10 role was a problem, but it did not hurt Real Madrid in terms of chances or getting the early goal they needed. I always felt Real Madrid handled this phase of play quite well. The resetting of their midfield was a good defensive response. This is one aspect of the game Zidane's Real Madrid does not get enough credit for.

Ball control was what Real Madrid did when they got ball compared to what Liverpool did. Real Madrid mastered the ball best when it mattered. They varied their play making it difficult for Liverpool's pressing. They inter played with short passes across, and between the lines, and went long when they had to. For example, Bale's goal. That was a result of direct play, they did not need numbers, the ball did all the running to the point of Bale's volley.

Zidane was canny. He made the key substitution in the game when he saw he need a pacy outlet to counter the pressing game of Liverpool. The 2nd goal was due to an error by Karius, and to be fair, Liverpool were taking risks defending one on one vos they needed a goal. But that 3rd goal came from Real Madrid escaping the press with another piece of direct play after a duration of ball retention with short quick passing moves in the eye of the press.

What we will never know if Liverpool would have won with Salah on the pitch, but I think would have won. This is why I said Liverpool were very unlucky.

They did indeed create chances; all saved by Navas- two from Mane and one from Trent. Their shot pass routine to counter the press was well expected- hence the dominance of the short spaces between the lines. Which is why the biggest miss for LFC going into the game was Ox, because of the next phase where his breakaway pace is decisive.

For me, it was not so much the short pass routine, the decisive factor was the absence of key players which made the tactic ultimately effective. Afterall City are better in the build-up/ball control phase than RM, yet LFC overcame them decisively....

We had luck throughout the series; think we used it all up b/4 the final

On ZZ, his in-game mgt has always been underrated, as one who follows La Liga closely. No team in football has the wealth of talent as Madrid; but nobody has used such wealth of resources as well as ZZ..

The mix of short passing and the strategic long-ball is a thing of beauty. But defensively, LFC controlled much of that until things started going south...

Liverpool need to get into the market big time- not so much in numbers but complementary quality to what it already has...

My bad, I wanted to say they did not create a big chance, the type they do on a regular basis.

The loss of Salah was pivotal. It was effectively the difference for Liverpool. Some here are saying Marcelo got wide when Salah was on the pitch. He did once or twice but merely getting forward is not the point. Real Madrid started with a diamond 4-4-2, Isco just behind Benzema and Ronaldo. But Marcelo is encourage to go forward providing width and overloading the left side. It is usually from Marcelo's forward forays, RM drags the opposition out of shape and quickly look to exploit space with very quick use of the ball to Ronaldo especially.

But in that period Salah was on the pitch, RM just could not set any playing tempo. Marcelo could not go forward, cos he was marking Salah. What's worse Salah cutting in dragged Marcelo in towards the CDs creating plenty of space for Arnold to exploit. They really did not make much of it, but had Salah stayed on it was a matter of time.

Salah's presence had two effects. RM had no width to attack, cos Marcelo could not provide it with any consistency. Second was, by dragging Marcelo in, it was creating space and width for Arnold.

When you factor in Liverpool's aggressive pressing, they not only made RM defend in the 3rd block, they also prevented RM from playing with any consistency from the 3rd block. They took away RM wide attack and created one for themselves in the process.

But another key to Liverpool earlier control was how they took out Isco. This was done with the intelligence and aggression putting him in a cage and the use of zonal pressing to squeeze the lines. They have studied Isco, they took out all his passing lanes, consequently, Isco dropping deep or in advanced positions offered nothing in attack, midfield or defence. Zidane had no choice but to take him off.

Although Isco was not much of a factor when Salah came off cos Liverpool took him out of the game, Salah going off suddenly gave RM the attacking width and impetus they missed when Salah was on the pitch. Watching it, I saw familiar patterns of RM play. E.g. Modric and Kroos dropping into temporary FB positions allowing Cavanja and Marcelo push up. Or Modric and Kroos creating a temporary back 4, allowing FBs to push high up stretching the pitch.

This is what Zidane's RM are all about, their FBs being a major part of their attacking play. They push them high up, there front 3, going in narrow, creating an instant 5 man attack with mainly Kroos supporting from deep. Kroos and Modric have to provide defensive cover in transition. Their quality of individuals and play forces the opposition to defend in the 3rd block.

Salah going off gave them the chance to do this consistently. The first 20 minutes of the game saw RM be g unable to consistently play their game with any control. Liverpool controlled the contest with Salah on the pitch and edged it when he left cos Isco could not get into the game.

It must be said, the outstanding player on the day was Modric, He was pivotal in RM's resistance and drive to attack. Modric's touch, movement on and off the ball on and between the lines, his bravery when faced with 2 or 3 pressing, not to panic, but hold it till the very nano second then slip in the right pass was supreme play. He was genius on the day. He dragged RM into this game as Liverpool's energy levels dropped. He also exploited the outlet that was Bale the most. The stats show he made the most completed passes to Bale from midfield.

[ohsee]

@Tx, Chief Oga at that, a bit of discourse on the abuse down the right (Real's left) and the ineffectual introduction of Adam Lallana.

Marcello only became a factor in the game after Salah left...

Marcelo was already enjoying himself in the first 10minutes he was playing just outside the Liverpool 18 area and even had a scuffed shot at goal. Liverpool were outclassed for the majority of the game

Read my exchanges with Waffi so you can learn the game.

Kai! txj, the Soccer Socrates, biko help us to tell everybody how superior you are . Oga Football Phoolosopher, we all kneel at your feet, and enjoy the wisdoms that flow from your lips, abi na keyboard. We wonder why Liverpool has not hired you as exalted and superior adviser to Klopp? Some people say that those who cant, teach, but we know they are wrong from reading your marvelous works.

Between Waffi's and my comments, there's enough info to educate you about this game.

Beyond that, you'll need to return to Rant and Rave where u belong...

Soccer Socrates, I agree that you are teaching us now, wetin? You cant see that? Biko continue to teach us. As for those of you who are laffing, sharrap! Ticha txj does not teach us nonsense.

By the way, Soccer Socrates, you are wrong to say I belong in Rant and Rave. I was among the founding fathers of this site, the earliest posters when it was only an Eagles site. I mistakenly emigrated to Rant and Rave soon after you joined. Your deep and resounding football knowledge was too much for me.

[txj]

They did indeed create chances; all saved by Navas- two from Mane and one from Trent. Their shot pass routine to counter the press was well expected- hence the dominance of the short spaces between the lines. Which is why the biggest miss for LFC going into the game was Ox, because of the next phase where his breakaway pace is decisive.

For me, it was not so much the short pass routine, the decisive factor was the absence of key players which made the tactic ultimately effective. Afterall City are better in the build-up/ball control phase than RM, yet LFC overcame them decisively....

We had luck throughout the series; think we used it all up b/4 the final

On ZZ, his in-game mgt has always been underrated, as one who follows La Liga closely. No team in football has the wealth of talent as Madrid; but nobody has used such wealth of resources as well as ZZ..

The mix of short passing and the strategic long-ball is a thing of beauty. But defensively, LFC controlled much of that until things started going south...

Liverpool need to get into the market big time- not so much in numbers but complementary quality to what it already has...

My bad, I wanted to say they did not create a big chance, the type they do on a regular basis.

The loss of Salah was pivotal. It was effectively the difference for Liverpool. Some here are saying Marcelo got wide when Salah was on the pitch. He did once or twice but merely getting forward is not the point. Real Madrid started with a diamond 4-4-2, Isco just behind Benzema and Ronaldo. But Marcelo is encourage to go forward providing width and overloading the left side. It is usually from Marcelo's forward forays, RM drags the opposition out of shape and quickly look to exploit space with very quick use of the ball to Ronaldo especially.

But in that period Salah was on the pitch, RM just could not set any playing tempo. Marcelo could not go forward, cos he was marking Salah. What's worse Salah cutting in dragged Marcelo in towards the CDs creating plenty of space for Arnold to exploit. They really did not make much of it, but had Salah stayed on it was a matter of time.

Salah's presence had two effects. RM had no width to attack, cos Marcelo could not provide it with any consistency. Second was, by dragging Marcelo in, it was creating space and width for Arnold.

When you factor in Liverpool's aggressive pressing, they not only made RM defend in the 3rd block, they also prevented RM from playing with any consistency from the 3rd block. They took away RM wide attack and created one for themselves in the process.

But another key to Liverpool earlier control was how they took out Isco. This was done with the intelligence and aggression putting him in a cage and the use of zonal pressing to squeeze the lines. They have studied Isco, they took out all his passing lanes, consequently, Isco dropping deep or in advanced positions offered nothing in attack, midfield or defence. Zidane had no choice but to take him off.

Although Isco was not much of a factor when Salah came off cos Liverpool took him out of the game, Salah going off suddenly gave RM the attacking width and impetus they missed when Salah was on the pitch. Watching it, I saw familiar patterns of RM play. E.g. Modric and Kroos dropping into temporary FB positions allowing Cavanja and Marcelo push up. Or Modric and Kroos creating a temporary back 4, allowing FBs to push high up stretching the pitch.

This is what Zidane's RM are all about, their FBs being a major part of their attacking play. They push them high up, there front 3, going in narrow, creating an instant 5 man attack with mainly Kroos supporting from deep. Kroos and Modric have to provide defensive cover in transition. Their quality of individuals and play forces the opposition to defend in the 3rd block.

Salah going off gave them the chance to do this consistently. The first 20 minutes of the game saw RM be g unable to consistently play their game with any control. Liverpool controlled the contest with Salah on the pitch and edged it when he left cos Isco could not get into the game.

It must be said, the outstanding player on the day was Modric, He was pivotal in RM's resistance and drive to attack. Modric's touch, movement on and off the ball on and between the lines, his bravery when faced with 2 or 3 pressing, not to panic, but hold it till the very nano second then slip in the right pass was supreme play. He was genius on the day. He dragged RM into this game as Liverpool's energy levels dropped. He also exploited the outlet that was Bale the most. The stats show he made the most completed passes to Bale from midfield.

This is in part why it was such a tough loss to take. But we move on...

When the last 8 was decided, I always said 'pool matched up well tactically to everyone except Roma. Never factored Di Francesco would make such a tactical blunder as he did at Anfield...

But one has to express the huge respect to ZZ. I've not seen anyone bridge the tactical and human mgt side as he has done at RM.

Yes, the foundation is the money they have to acquire a deep and rich diversity of talent, but somebody has to put it together and make it work. I mean a top and experienced manager as Benitez was never able to elicit half the work rate they have shown under Zidane...

But in spite of the pain, I'm quite optimistic about the future for LFC...Looking forward to seeing Naby in this setup...

[ohsee]

Lawd Have Mercy mo gbe ohhh

Fat Mamanikulapo
We won yesterday, and you are still yabbing me. When are you going to come to Toronto so we can celebrate? I promise not to bring my camera.

[green4life]

@Tx, Chief Oga at that, a bit of discourse on the abuse down the right (Real's left) and the ineffectual introduction of Adam Lallana.

Marcello only became a factor in the game after Salah left...

Marcelo was already enjoying himself in the first 10minutes he was playing just outside the Liverpool 18 area and even had a scuffed shot at goal. Liverpool were outclassed for the majority of the game

Read my exchanges with Waffi so you can learn the game.

Long English my brother. The fact is even when Sallah was on the pitch, Liverpool created absolutely nothing. All the possession and high press means nothing if the opposition isn't troubled. And it means even less when the opponent has a lot more quality options than Liverpool because they were always going to bite back in more ways than one. So it was only a matter of time. The Sallah injury is a convenient distraction to justify a moral victory.

[Coach]

@Chief Oga Tx, the introduction of Lallana was very puzzling, one can only imagine he was the most match fit of the substitutes. In effect, not only was he a yard off the pace, but he equally lacked the pace to execute the press. Much worse however, his introduction had a corset-like effect on the width of the pitch. Naturally inclined to move infield, Lallana freed up the left hand-side, congested the midfield and forced Milner to make more lateral runs to double up with Robertson. One would’ve thought Moreno, assuming he still has use of this legs, would’ve been a better option, especially given Real were weakened at right back.

...The game was not only defined by the patheticness of a goalkeeper who has no business playing as a number one outside of Wengerism, but also by the exploitation of enforced vulnerabilities. Liverpoool lost Salah, Real ran roughshod down the left. Real lost Carvajal, Liverpool cut inside and asked no questions of his replacement.

[danfo driver]

For those who are still wondering whether "taking out your opponent is a strategy

Funny how you completely forgot to mention the push in the back by the Liverpool #4 Van Dijk on Ramos leading to the collision.
I suppose that doesnt match your one-sided narrative

oh! Sorry. Let me also apologise for not mentioning that Van Dijk put out Ramos' elbow and held it firmly.

[ohsee]

For those who are still wondering whether "taking out your opponent is a strategy

Funny how you completely forgot to mention the push in the back by the Liverpool #4 Van Dijk on Ramos leading to the collision.
I suppose that doesnt match your one-sided narrative

Did he also push his elbow?
It is what it is. Ramos is a true warrior....Moving on...

No silly, He was pushed in the back (or are you going to deny that).
He also was not looking at the keeper when his elbow struck the keepers face.
I can understand the keepers complaint though,..he was looking at the ball too when he got hit (clearly didnt see the push leading to the contact).

This was a case for a penalty against Liverpool by the letter of the law,..but given the contact that typically takes place during crosses, set plays, etc, its perfectly fine to carry on.

You all need to stop whinning. Its truly pathetic. Football is a contact sport (You EPL junkies should know).
These kind of things happen every single day and it is just part of the game.

Its not about whining; I already moved on.

2ndly, no way it was PK; that's not in any discussion except to someone totally ignorant about the game.

3rd, and most importantly, the elbow was thrown from flexing and jerking the arm. Its not a typical contact. I watch La Liga and Ramos far more than you do, and I know his tendencies.

A defender pushing an opposing player in the back in the 18 is not a foul/penalty offense???


Oya, come an tell me about my "ignorance of the game"

The only reason why that is not discussed by many of you yapping about fake "intentional elbows" is because it doesnt match your narrative of Ramos being a dirty player (which I will freely admit as a Madrid fan that he is in many cases,...but not this one).

Listen bruv,...if you really want to "move on" as you say,...just accept the loss like a Man (or Woman,...what ever you are) and stop complaining.

See how you are yabbing the CE Soccer Socrates. His knowledge of futbol is encyclopedic; it is multifarious; it is polymathic; it is even omniscient! Please take time o!

[Waffiman]

They did indeed create chances; all saved by Navas- two from Mane and one from Trent. Their shot pass routine to counter the press was well expected- hence the dominance of the short spaces between the lines. Which is why the biggest miss for LFC going into the game was Ox, because of the next phase where his breakaway pace is decisive.

For me, it was not so much the short pass routine, the decisive factor was the absence of key players which made the tactic ultimately effective. Afterall City are better in the build-up/ball control phase than RM, yet LFC overcame them decisively....

We had luck throughout the series; think we used it all up b/4 the final

On ZZ, his in-game mgt has always been underrated, as one who follows La Liga closely. No team in football has the wealth of talent as Madrid; but nobody has used such wealth of resources as well as ZZ..

The mix of short passing and the strategic long-ball is a thing of beauty. But defensively, LFC controlled much of that until things started going south...

Liverpool need to get into the market big time- not so much in numbers but complementary quality to what it already has...

My bad, I wanted to say they did not create a big chance, the type they do on a regular basis.

The loss of Salah was pivotal. It was effectively the difference for Liverpool. Some here are saying Marcelo got wide when Salah was on the pitch. He did once or twice but merely getting forward is not the point. Real Madrid started with a diamond 4-4-2, Isco just behind Benzema and Ronaldo. But Marcelo is encourage to go forward providing width and overloading the left side. It is usually from Marcelo's forward forays, RM drags the opposition out of shape and quickly look to exploit space with very quick use of the ball to Ronaldo especially.

But in that period Salah was on the pitch, RM just could not set any playing tempo. Marcelo could not go forward, cos he was marking Salah. What's worse Salah cutting in dragged Marcelo in towards the CDs creating plenty of space for Arnold to exploit. They really did not make much of it, but had Salah stayed on it was a matter of time.

Salah's presence had two effects. RM had no width to attack, cos Marcelo could not provide it with any consistency. Second was, by dragging Marcelo in, it was creating space and width for Arnold.

When you factor in Liverpool's aggressive pressing, they not only made RM defend in the 3rd block, they also prevented RM from playing with any consistency from the 3rd block. They took away RM wide attack and created one for themselves in the process.

But another key to Liverpool earlier control was how they took out Isco. This was done with the intelligence and aggression putting him in a cage and the use of zonal pressing to squeeze the lines. They have studied Isco, they took out all his passing lanes, consequently, Isco dropping deep or in advanced positions offered nothing in attack, midfield or defence. Zidane had no choice but to take him off.

Although Isco was not much of a factor when Salah came off cos Liverpool took him out of the game, Salah going off suddenly gave RM the attacking width and impetus they missed when Salah was on the pitch. Watching it, I saw familiar patterns of RM play. E.g. Modric and Kroos dropping into temporary FB positions allowing Cavanja and Marcelo push up. Or Modric and Kroos creating a temporary back 4, allowing FBs to push high up stretching the pitch.

This is what Zidane's RM are all about, their FBs being a major part of their attacking play. They push them high up, there front 3, going in narrow, creating an instant 5 man attack with mainly Kroos supporting from deep. Kroos and Modric have to provide defensive cover in transition. Their quality of individuals and play forces the opposition to defend in the 3rd block.

Salah going off gave them the chance to do this consistently. The first 20 minutes of the game saw RM be g unable to consistently play their game with any control. Liverpool controlled the contest with Salah on the pitch and edged it when he left cos Isco could not get into the game.

It must be said, the outstanding player on the day was Modric, He was pivotal in RM's resistance and drive to attack. Modric's touch, movement on and off the ball on and between the lines, his bravery when faced with 2 or 3 pressing, not to panic, but hold it till the very nano second then slip in the right pass was supreme play. He was genius on the day. He dragged RM into this game as Liverpool's energy levels dropped. He also exploited the outlet that was Bale the most. The stats show he made the most completed passes to Bale from midfield.

This is in part why it was such a tough loss to take. But we move on...

When the last 8 was decided, I always said 'pool matched up well tactically to everyone except Roma. Never factored Di Francesco would make such a tactical blunder as he did at Anfield...

But one has to express the huge respect to ZZ. I've not seen anyone bridge the tactical and human mgt side as he has done at RM.

Yes, the foundation is the money they have to acquire a deep and rich diversity of talent, but somebody has to put it together and make it work. I mean a top and experienced manager as Benitez was never able to elicit half the work rate they have shown under Zidane...

But in spite of the pain, I'm quite optimistic about the future for LFC...Looking forward to seeing Naby in this setup...

Liverpool fans have a lot to be optimistic about especially when you consider the imminent arrival of Keita.

But on the squad, I don't think you are giving enough credit to RM.

Liverpool have spent more than Real Madrid in the last 5 years both on gross and net spend. You can check this out easily on via Google.

Another thing I have observed is so much was made of Barca and their Youth development when it was not really the case when you consider the numbers of players in the first team from the Barca Academy. Correct me if I am wrong, but I have counted 3 Liverpool academy players in the squad to Real Madrid's 9.

With Bale not starting, Liverpool's starting 1I will be more expensive than RM's. However, I see cannot dispute your point on RM's sheer quality. This is reflected in the fact that the most important factor of wage bill puts RM way ahead of Liverpool.

What really scares me, is the Youth talent they have and we also hear they are after Hazard and possibly Neymar. There is something menacing about RM which is really scary for the future.

[anikulapo]

Lawd Have Mercy mo gbe ohhh

Fat Mamanikulapo
We won yesterday, and you are still yabbing me. When are you going to come to Toronto so we can celebrate? I promise not to bring my camera.

Er which one be “we”? Abeg no come bring ya bad luck come my team ohhh ... take ya time ... and I was in ya area code last week but it seems bill collectors don make you change ya number

[txj]

They did indeed create chances; all saved by Navas- two from Mane and one from Trent. Their shot pass routine to counter the press was well expected- hence the dominance of the short spaces between the lines. Which is why the biggest miss for LFC going into the game was Ox, because of the next phase where his breakaway pace is decisive.

For me, it was not so much the short pass routine, the decisive factor was the absence of key players which made the tactic ultimately effective. Afterall City are better in the build-up/ball control phase than RM, yet LFC overcame them decisively....

We had luck throughout the series; think we used it all up b/4 the final

On ZZ, his in-game mgt has always been underrated, as one who follows La Liga closely. No team in football has the wealth of talent as Madrid; but nobody has used such wealth of resources as well as ZZ..

The mix of short passing and the strategic long-ball is a thing of beauty. But defensively, LFC controlled much of that until things started going south...

Liverpool need to get into the market big time- not so much in numbers but complementary quality to what it already has...

My bad, I wanted to say they did not create a big chance, the type they do on a regular basis.

The loss of Salah was pivotal. It was effectively the difference for Liverpool. Some here are saying Marcelo got wide when Salah was on the pitch. He did once or twice but merely getting forward is not the point. Real Madrid started with a diamond 4-4-2, Isco just behind Benzema and Ronaldo. But Marcelo is encourage to go forward providing width and overloading the left side. It is usually from Marcelo's forward forays, RM drags the opposition out of shape and quickly look to exploit space with very quick use of the ball to Ronaldo especially.

But in that period Salah was on the pitch, RM just could not set any playing tempo. Marcelo could not go forward, cos he was marking Salah. What's worse Salah cutting in dragged Marcelo in towards the CDs creating plenty of space for Arnold to exploit. They really did not make much of it, but had Salah stayed on it was a matter of time.

Salah's presence had two effects. RM had no width to attack, cos Marcelo could not provide it with any consistency. Second was, by dragging Marcelo in, it was creating space and width for Arnold.

When you factor in Liverpool's aggressive pressing, they not only made RM defend in the 3rd block, they also prevented RM from playing with any consistency from the 3rd block. They took away RM wide attack and created one for themselves in the process.

But another key to Liverpool earlier control was how they took out Isco. This was done with the intelligence and aggression putting him in a cage and the use of zonal pressing to squeeze the lines. They have studied Isco, they took out all his passing lanes, consequently, Isco dropping deep or in advanced positions offered nothing in attack, midfield or defence. Zidane had no choice but to take him off.

Although Isco was not much of a factor when Salah came off cos Liverpool took him out of the game, Salah going off suddenly gave RM the attacking width and impetus they missed when Salah was on the pitch. Watching it, I saw familiar patterns of RM play. E.g. Modric and Kroos dropping into temporary FB positions allowing Cavanja and Marcelo push up. Or Modric and Kroos creating a temporary back 4, allowing FBs to push high up stretching the pitch.

This is what Zidane's RM are all about, their FBs being a major part of their attacking play. They push them high up, there front 3, going in narrow, creating an instant 5 man attack with mainly Kroos supporting from deep. Kroos and Modric have to provide defensive cover in transition. Their quality of individuals and play forces the opposition to defend in the 3rd block.

Salah going off gave them the chance to do this consistently. The first 20 minutes of the game saw RM be g unable to consistently play their game with any control. Liverpool controlled the contest with Salah on the pitch and edged it when he left cos Isco could not get into the game.

It must be said, the outstanding player on the day was Modric, He was pivotal in RM's resistance and drive to attack. Modric's touch, movement on and off the ball on and between the lines, his bravery when faced with 2 or 3 pressing, not to panic, but hold it till the very nano second then slip in the right pass was supreme play. He was genius on the day. He dragged RM into this game as Liverpool's energy levels dropped. He also exploited the outlet that was Bale the most. The stats show he made the most completed passes to Bale from midfield.

This is in part why it was such a tough loss to take. But we move on...

When the last 8 was decided, I always said 'pool matched up well tactically to everyone except Roma. Never factored Di Francesco would make such a tactical blunder as he did at Anfield...

But one has to express the huge respect to ZZ. I've not seen anyone bridge the tactical and human mgt side as he has done at RM.

Yes, the foundation is the money they have to acquire a deep and rich diversity of talent, but somebody has to put it together and make it work. I mean a top and experienced manager as Benitez was never able to elicit half the work rate they have shown under Zidane...

But in spite of the pain, I'm quite optimistic about the future for LFC...Looking forward to seeing Naby in this setup...

Liverpool fans have a lot to be optimistic about especially when you consider the imminent arrival of Keita.

But on the squad, I don't think you are giving enough credit to RM.

Liverpool have spent more than Real Madrid in the last 5 years both on gross and net spend. You can check this out easily on via Google.

Another thing I have observed is so much was made of Barca and their Youth development when it was not really the case when you consider the numbers of players in the first team from the Barca Academy. Correct me if I am wrong, but I have counted 3 Liverpool academy players in the squad to Real Madrid's 9.

With Bale not starting, Liverpool's starting 1I will be more expensive than RM's. However, I see cannot dispute your point on RM's sheer quality. This is reflected in the fact that the most important factor of wage bill puts RM way ahead of Liverpool.

What really scares me, is the Youth talent they have and we also hear they are after Hazard and possibly Neymar. There is something menacing about RM which is really scary for the future.

To assess squads you have to calculate the real value of money. The current value of the Madrid squad is reflected in the existing contract of the players.

To use transfer fees, you have to bring each txfer expenditure to its present value. Otherwise it makes zero sense. You'll effect be saying, LFC spent more on a left back than Madrid. That is not even good enough to be called voodoo economics!

The notion that LFC has spent more than RM in last few years, turns financial logic on its head. This RM team wasn't built in last few years. It's a championship winning team that has been routinely added on.

Also, I'm not sure where you get those academy numbers from. Carvajal was the only academy product who started; then Nacho who replaced him.

But I have to tell you, I'm not one of those who is focussed on money; I'm more focussed on how well you spend...

[Heliopolis]

Questions have to be asked of Klopp, what his plan was to neutralize any of Real's main threats.

Ronaldo had 1 good chance all game.

Bale's 1st goal was unstoppable.

Benzema was a non-factor.

Karius gifted them 2 goals.

Questions have to be asked as to whether you actually bothered to watch the game.

He once supported Arsenal. But now supports Liverpool cos of Salah.

How can you say a man who scored a goal and ran almost as tirelessly as the Liverpool players did, was a non factor?

Liverpool were very unlucky but have the grace to give credit to Real Madrid.

Real Madrid got to the final by beat the champions of France, Italy and Germany. They also played a good game in what was a highly contested and competitive game. I just wish Liverpool made more of it when they were dominant, maybe we will be talking about them being 6 times winners.

Yes the game was lost on 2 goalkeeping errors but many more will remember the game for Bale's goal.

I hope Salah is fit for the WC.

I guess all the times that Wenger clubbed you over the head with his genitalia has really taken a toll on your brain. Reading comprehension clearly is not a strength of yours.

[anikulapo]

Questions have to be asked of Klopp, what his plan was to neutralize any of Real's main threats.

Ronaldo had 1 good chance all game.

Bale's 1st goal was unstoppable.

Benzema was a non-factor.

Karius gifted them 2 goals.

Questions have to be asked as to whether you actually bothered to watch the game.

He once supported Arsenal. But now supports Liverpool cos of Salah.

How can you say a man who scored a goal and ran almost as tirelessly as the Liverpool players did, was a non factor?

Liverpool were very unlucky but have the grace to give credit to Real Madrid.

Real Madrid got to the final by beat the champions of France, Italy and Germany. They also played a good game in what was a highly contested and competitive game. I just wish Liverpool made more of it when they were dominant, maybe we will be talking about them being 6 times winners.

Yes the game was lost on 2 goalkeeping errors but many more will remember the game for Bale's goal.

I hope Salah is fit for the WC.

I guess all the times that Wenger clubbed you over the head with his genitalia has really taken a toll on your brain. Reading comprehension clearly is not a strength of yours.

Oh dear

[ohsee]

Lawd Have Mercy mo gbe ohhh

Fat Mamanikulapo
We won yesterday, and you are still yabbing me. When are you going to come to Toronto so we can celebrate? I promise not to bring my camera.

Er which one be “we”? Abeg no come bring ya bad luck come my team ohhh ... take ya time ... and I was in ya area code last week but it seems bill collectors don make you change ya number

Look at this man. Me wey dey support Real Madrid via newspapers from di time when I was a small bomboy of two back in Enugu well bifor telebishon reash dia. Look at newbie like you who only started supporting Real when they won their first of this trifecta of tremendous triumphs In fact, I hear that, like the typical Americana, you dey call my Royal boys "real" instead of "Ree-ahl" like we Spanish-speaking ama-alas dey call dem.

Anyway, whenever you are in TO, PM me and I will give you my number. Make you no dey fear, everybody already knows you are a fatty-fatty, so if I take your picture post am for CE, everybody will just be bored with your flabulous fatness.

[metalalloy]

They did indeed create chances; all saved by Navas- two from Mane and one from Trent. Their shot pass routine to counter the press was well expected- hence the dominance of the short spaces between the lines. Which is why the biggest miss for LFC going into the game was Ox, because of the next phase where his breakaway pace is decisive.

For me, it was not so much the short pass routine, the decisive factor was the absence of key players which made the tactic ultimately effective. Afterall City are better in the build-up/ball control phase than RM, yet LFC overcame them decisively....

We had luck throughout the series; think we used it all up b/4 the final

On ZZ, his in-game mgt has always been underrated, as one who follows La Liga closely. No team in football has the wealth of talent as Madrid; but nobody has used such wealth of resources as well as ZZ..

The mix of short passing and the strategic long-ball is a thing of beauty. But defensively, LFC controlled much of that until things started going south...

Liverpool need to get into the market big time- not so much in numbers but complementary quality to what it already has...

My bad, I wanted to say they did not create a big chance, the type they do on a regular basis.

The loss of Salah was pivotal. It was effectively the difference for Liverpool. Some here are saying Marcelo got wide when Salah was on the pitch. He did once or twice but merely getting forward is not the point. Real Madrid started with a diamond 4-4-2, Isco just behind Benzema and Ronaldo. But Marcelo is encourage to go forward providing width and overloading the left side. It is usually from Marcelo's forward forays, RM drags the opposition out of shape and quickly look to exploit space with very quick use of the ball to Ronaldo especially.

But in that period Salah was on the pitch, RM just could not set any playing tempo. Marcelo could not go forward, cos he was marking Salah. What's worse Salah cutting in dragged Marcelo in towards the CDs creating plenty of space for Arnold to exploit. They really did not make much of it, but had Salah stayed on it was a matter of time.

Salah's presence had two effects. RM had no width to attack, cos Marcelo could not provide it with any consistency. Second was, by dragging Marcelo in, it was creating space and width for Arnold.

When you factor in Liverpool's aggressive pressing, they not only made RM defend in the 3rd block, they also prevented RM from playing with any consistency from the 3rd block. They took away RM wide attack and created one for themselves in the process.

But another key to Liverpool earlier control was how they took out Isco. This was done with the intelligence and aggression putting him in a cage and the use of zonal pressing to squeeze the lines. They have studied Isco, they took out all his passing lanes, consequently, Isco dropping deep or in advanced positions offered nothing in attack, midfield or defence. Zidane had no choice but to take him off.

Although Isco was not much of a factor when Salah came off cos Liverpool took him out of the game, Salah going off suddenly gave RM the attacking width and impetus they missed when Salah was on the pitch. Watching it, I saw familiar patterns of RM play. E.g. Modric and Kroos dropping into temporary FB positions allowing Cavanja and Marcelo push up. Or Modric and Kroos creating a temporary back 4, allowing FBs to push high up stretching the pitch.

This is what Zidane's RM are all about, their FBs being a major part of their attacking play. They push them high up, there front 3, going in narrow, creating an instant 5 man attack with mainly Kroos supporting from deep. Kroos and Modric have to provide defensive cover in transition. Their quality of individuals and play forces the opposition to defend in the 3rd block.

Salah going off gave them the chance to do this consistently. The first 20 minutes of the game saw RM be g unable to consistently play their game with any control. Liverpool controlled the contest with Salah on the pitch and edged it when he left cos Isco could not get into the game.

It must be said, the outstanding player on the day was Modric, He was pivotal in RM's resistance and drive to attack. Modric's touch, movement on and off the ball on and between the lines, his bravery when faced with 2 or 3 pressing, not to panic, but hold it till the very nano second then slip in the right pass was supreme play. He was genius on the day. He dragged RM into this game as Liverpool's energy levels dropped. He also exploited the outlet that was Bale the most. The stats show he made the most completed passes to Bale from midfield.

This is in part why it was such a tough loss to take. But we move on...

When the last 8 was decided, I always said 'pool matched up well tactically to everyone except Roma. Never factored Di Francesco would make such a tactical blunder as he did at Anfield...

But one has to express the huge respect to ZZ. I've not seen anyone bridge the tactical and human mgt side as he has done at RM.

Yes, the foundation is the money they have to acquire a deep and rich diversity of talent, but somebody has to put it together and make it work. I mean a top and experienced manager as Benitez was never able to elicit half the work rate they have shown under Zidane...

But in spite of the pain, I'm quite optimistic about the future for LFC...Looking forward to seeing Naby in this setup...

Liverpool fans have a lot to be optimistic about especially when you consider the imminent arrival of Keita.

But on the squad, I don't think you are giving enough credit to RM.

Liverpool have spent more than Real Madrid in the last 5 years both on gross and net spend. You can check this out easily on via Google.

Another thing I have observed is so much was made of Barca and their Youth development when it was not really the case when you consider the numbers of players in the first team from the Barca Academy. Correct me if I am wrong, but I have counted 3 Liverpool academy players in the squad to Real Madrid's 9.

With Bale not starting, Liverpool's starting 1I will be more expensive than RM's. However, I see cannot dispute your point on RM's sheer quality. This is reflected in the fact that the most important factor of wage bill puts RM way ahead of Liverpool.

What really scares me, is the Youth talent they have and we also hear they are after Hazard and possibly Neymar. There is something menacing about RM which is really scary for the future.

While that may be factually true, without putting the recent/current transfer climate into context, that's not a fair conclusion to draw.

[Waffiman]

Questions have to be asked of Klopp, what his plan was to neutralize any of Real's main threats.

Ronaldo had 1 good chance all game.

Bale's 1st goal was unstoppable.

Benzema was a non-factor.

Karius gifted them 2 goals.

Questions have to be asked as to whether you actually bothered to watch the game.

He once supported Arsenal. But now supports Liverpool cos of Salah.

How can you say a man who scored a goal and ran almost as tirelessly as the Liverpool players did, was a non factor?

Liverpool were very unlucky but have the grace to give credit to Real Madrid.

Real Madrid got to the final by beat the champions of France, Italy and Germany. They also played a good game in what was a highly contested and competitive game. I just wish Liverpool made more of it when they were dominant, maybe we will be talking about them being 6 times winners.

Yes the game was lost on 2 goalkeeping errors but many more will remember the game for Bale's goal.

I hope Salah is fit for the WC.

I guess all the times that Wenger clubbed you over the head with his genitalia has really taken a toll on your brain. Reading comprehension clearly is not a strength of yours.

Oh dear

I'll ignore that cry baby Egyptian for now. However, his posts do make you wonder. He has an unhealthy fascination for genitallia. Like we Gooners say, "Up the ar*e".

[Waffiman]

They did indeed create chances; all saved by Navas- two from Mane and one from Trent. Their shot pass routine to counter the press was well expected- hence the dominance of the short spaces between the lines. Which is why the biggest miss for LFC going into the game was Ox, because of the next phase where his breakaway pace is decisive.

For me, it was not so much the short pass routine, the decisive factor was the absence of key players which made the tactic ultimately effective. Afterall City are better in the build-up/ball control phase than RM, yet LFC overcame them decisively....

We had luck throughout the series; think we used it all up b/4 the final

On ZZ, his in-game mgt has always been underrated, as one who follows La Liga closely. No team in football has the wealth of talent as Madrid; but nobody has used such wealth of resources as well as ZZ..

The mix of short passing and the strategic long-ball is a thing of beauty. But defensively, LFC controlled much of that until things started going south...

Liverpool need to get into the market big time- not so much in numbers but complementary quality to what it already has...

My bad, I wanted to say they did not create a big chance, the type they do on a regular basis.

The loss of Salah was pivotal. It was effectively the difference for Liverpool. Some here are saying Marcelo got wide when Salah was on the pitch. He did once or twice but merely getting forward is not the point. Real Madrid started with a diamond 4-4-2, Isco just behind Benzema and Ronaldo. But Marcelo is encourage to go forward providing width and overloading the left side. It is usually from Marcelo's forward forays, RM drags the opposition out of shape and quickly look to exploit space with very quick use of the ball to Ronaldo especially.

But in that period Salah was on the pitch, RM just could not set any playing tempo. Marcelo could not go forward, cos he was marking Salah. What's worse Salah cutting in dragged Marcelo in towards the CDs creating plenty of space for Arnold to exploit. They really did not make much of it, but had Salah stayed on it was a matter of time.

Salah's presence had two effects. RM had no width to attack, cos Marcelo could not provide it with any consistency. Second was, by dragging Marcelo in, it was creating space and width for Arnold.

When you factor in Liverpool's aggressive pressing, they not only made RM defend in the 3rd block, they also prevented RM from playing with any consistency from the 3rd block. They took away RM wide attack and created one for themselves in the process.

But another key to Liverpool earlier control was how they took out Isco. This was done with the intelligence and aggression putting him in a cage and the use of zonal pressing to squeeze the lines. They have studied Isco, they took out all his passing lanes, consequently, Isco dropping deep or in advanced positions offered nothing in attack, midfield or defence. Zidane had no choice but to take him off.

Although Isco was not much of a factor when Salah came off cos Liverpool took him out of the game, Salah going off suddenly gave RM the attacking width and impetus they missed when Salah was on the pitch. Watching it, I saw familiar patterns of RM play. E.g. Modric and Kroos dropping into temporary FB positions allowing Cavanja and Marcelo push up. Or Modric and Kroos creating a temporary back 4, allowing FBs to push high up stretching the pitch.

This is what Zidane's RM are all about, their FBs being a major part of their attacking play. They push them high up, there front 3, going in narrow, creating an instant 5 man attack with mainly Kroos supporting from deep. Kroos and Modric have to provide defensive cover in transition. Their quality of individuals and play forces the opposition to defend in the 3rd block.

Salah going off gave them the chance to do this consistently. The first 20 minutes of the game saw RM be g unable to consistently play their game with any control. Liverpool controlled the contest with Salah on the pitch and edged it when he left cos Isco could not get into the game.

It must be said, the outstanding player on the day was Modric, He was pivotal in RM's resistance and drive to attack. Modric's touch, movement on and off the ball on and between the lines, his bravery when faced with 2 or 3 pressing, not to panic, but hold it till the very nano second then slip in the right pass was supreme play. He was genius on the day. He dragged RM into this game as Liverpool's energy levels dropped. He also exploited the outlet that was Bale the most. The stats show he made the most completed passes to Bale from midfield.

This is in part why it was such a tough loss to take. But we move on...

When the last 8 was decided, I always said 'pool matched up well tactically to everyone except Roma. Never factored Di Francesco would make such a tactical blunder as he did at Anfield...

But one has to express the huge respect to ZZ. I've not seen anyone bridge the tactical and human mgt side as he has done at RM.

Yes, the foundation is the money they have to acquire a deep and rich diversity of talent, but somebody has to put it together and make it work. I mean a top and experienced manager as Benitez was never able to elicit half the work rate they have shown under Zidane...

But in spite of the pain, I'm quite optimistic about the future for LFC...Looking forward to seeing Naby in this setup...

Liverpool fans have a lot to be optimistic about especially when you consider the imminent arrival of Keita.

But on the squad, I don't think you are giving enough credit to RM.

Liverpool have spent more than Real Madrid in the last 5 years both on gross and net spend. You can check this out easily on via Google.

Another thing I have observed is so much was made of Barca and their Youth development when it was not really the case when you consider the numbers of players in the first team from the Barca Academy. Correct me if I am wrong, but I have counted 3 Liverpool academy players in the squad to Real Madrid's 9.

With Bale not starting, Liverpool's starting 1I will be more expensive than RM's. However, I see cannot dispute your point on RM's sheer quality. This is reflected in the fact that the most important factor of wage bill puts RM way ahead of Liverpool.

What really scares me, is the Youth talent they have and we also hear they are after Hazard and possibly Neymar. There is something menacing about RM which is really scary for the future.

To assess squads you have to calculate the real value of money. The current value of the Madrid squad is reflected in the existing contract of the players.

To use transfer fees, you have to bring each txfer expenditure to its present value. Otherwise it makes zero sense. You'll effect be saying, LFC spent more on a left back than Madrid. That is not even good enough to be called voodoo economics!

The notion that LFC has spent more than RM in last few years, turns financial logic on its head. This RM team wasn't built in last few years. It's a championship winning team that has been routinely added on.

Also, I'm not sure where you get those academy numbers from. Carvajal was the only academy product who started; then Nacho who replaced him.

But I have to tell you, I'm not one of those who is focussed on money; I'm more focussed on how well you spend...

The true value of a player is reflected in what the buying club wants to pay for the player. That is the only objective valuation that can be placed on players and it is the valuation used for the figures posted. This RM team has been added on over time, but the vast majority have been bought in the last few year, 5 to be exact.

Yes, you have a point about real value with regards to their contracts, but this value has almost never been the buying price of a player. Why? The value is the price has set by the club to which the player is contracted, but there is another party to player valuation, the buying club and the player himself. Consequently, real value as stated in your post is highly subjective and unrealistic. In Spain, they have buy out clauses, these too are subjective valuations for all srots of reasons to the clubs involved. Real value as stated by you, is merely a subjective guide to player value. The only onbective real value is what a buying club pays for the players.

It is of course in your interest being a Liverpool supporter to try to argue for real value, but that is not what the real cost of these players are to both clubs. The reals cost is what they have paid for those player and it is the only objective measurement. So it stands that on the basis of what both clubs have paid for their players, with Bale not starting, Liverpool's starting 1I was more expensive than RM's. On this factor, Liverpool were not RM's inferiors, however, on the most important factor of wage bill, RM pay far more than Liverpool, and this was reflected in the final itself. RM's substitution of Isco for Bale was a huge improvement because it contributed massivelly to them winning the game. Compare and contrast the effect of the loss of Salah and Lalana's coming in. This is what a wage bill brings to a club and it is why it is the dsefining factor in any sport. If you pay the highest salary, you tend to keep your best players.

My Academy numbers are from the full squad list of both team. RM, since Perez returned has focused on the Academy players. They have Academy players like, Dani Carvajal, Nacho Fernandez, Marco Asensio, Lucas Vazquez, Jesus Vallejo, Marcos Llorente, Achraf Hakimi, Kiko Casilla and Borja Mayoral.

[Waffiman]

They did indeed create chances; all saved by Navas- two from Mane and one from Trent. Their shot pass routine to counter the press was well expected- hence the dominance of the short spaces between the lines. Which is why the biggest miss for LFC going into the game was Ox, because of the next phase where his breakaway pace is decisive.

For me, it was not so much the short pass routine, the decisive factor was the absence of key players which made the tactic ultimately effective. Afterall City are better in the build-up/ball control phase than RM, yet LFC overcame them decisively....

We had luck throughout the series; think we used it all up b/4 the final

On ZZ, his in-game mgt has always been underrated, as one who follows La Liga closely. No team in football has the wealth of talent as Madrid; but nobody has used such wealth of resources as well as ZZ..

The mix of short passing and the strategic long-ball is a thing of beauty. But defensively, LFC controlled much of that until things started going south...

Liverpool need to get into the market big time- not so much in numbers but complementary quality to what it already has...

My bad, I wanted to say they did not create a big chance, the type they do on a regular basis.

The loss of Salah was pivotal. It was effectively the difference for Liverpool. Some here are saying Marcelo got wide when Salah was on the pitch. He did once or twice but merely getting forward is not the point. Real Madrid started with a diamond 4-4-2, Isco just behind Benzema and Ronaldo. But Marcelo is encourage to go forward providing width and overloading the left side. It is usually from Marcelo's forward forays, RM drags the opposition out of shape and quickly look to exploit space with very quick use of the ball to Ronaldo especially.

But in that period Salah was on the pitch, RM just could not set any playing tempo. Marcelo could not go forward, cos he was marking Salah. What's worse Salah cutting in dragged Marcelo in towards the CDs creating plenty of space for Arnold to exploit. They really did not make much of it, but had Salah stayed on it was a matter of time.

Salah's presence had two effects. RM had no width to attack, cos Marcelo could not provide it with any consistency. Second was, by dragging Marcelo in, it was creating space and width for Arnold.

When you factor in Liverpool's aggressive pressing, they not only made RM defend in the 3rd block, they also prevented RM from playing with any consistency from the 3rd block. They took away RM wide attack and created one for themselves in the process.

But another key to Liverpool earlier control was how they took out Isco. This was done with the intelligence and aggression putting him in a cage and the use of zonal pressing to squeeze the lines. They have studied Isco, they took out all his passing lanes, consequently, Isco dropping deep or in advanced positions offered nothing in attack, midfield or defence. Zidane had no choice but to take him off.

Although Isco was not much of a factor when Salah came off cos Liverpool took him out of the game, Salah going off suddenly gave RM the attacking width and impetus they missed when Salah was on the pitch. Watching it, I saw familiar patterns of RM play. E.g. Modric and Kroos dropping into temporary FB positions allowing Cavanja and Marcelo push up. Or Modric and Kroos creating a temporary back 4, allowing FBs to push high up stretching the pitch.

This is what Zidane's RM are all about, their FBs being a major part of their attacking play. They push them high up, there front 3, going in narrow, creating an instant 5 man attack with mainly Kroos supporting from deep. Kroos and Modric have to provide defensive cover in transition. Their quality of individuals and play forces the opposition to defend in the 3rd block.

Salah going off gave them the chance to do this consistently. The first 20 minutes of the game saw RM be g unable to consistently play their game with any control. Liverpool controlled the contest with Salah on the pitch and edged it when he left cos Isco could not get into the game.

It must be said, the outstanding player on the day was Modric, He was pivotal in RM's resistance and drive to attack. Modric's touch, movement on and off the ball on and between the lines, his bravery when faced with 2 or 3 pressing, not to panic, but hold it till the very nano second then slip in the right pass was supreme play. He was genius on the day. He dragged RM into this game as Liverpool's energy levels dropped. He also exploited the outlet that was Bale the most. The stats show he made the most completed passes to Bale from midfield.

This is in part why it was such a tough loss to take. But we move on...

When the last 8 was decided, I always said 'pool matched up well tactically to everyone except Roma. Never factored Di Francesco would make such a tactical blunder as he did at Anfield...

But one has to express the huge respect to ZZ. I've not seen anyone bridge the tactical and human mgt side as he has done at RM.

Yes, the foundation is the money they have to acquire a deep and rich diversity of talent, but somebody has to put it together and make it work. I mean a top and experienced manager as Benitez was never able to elicit half the work rate they have shown under Zidane...

But in spite of the pain, I'm quite optimistic about the future for LFC...Looking forward to seeing Naby in this setup...

Liverpool fans have a lot to be optimistic about especially when you consider the imminent arrival of Keita.

But on the squad, I don't think you are giving enough credit to RM.

Liverpool have spent more than Real Madrid in the last 5 years both on gross and net spend. You can check this out easily on via Google.

Another thing I have observed is so much was made of Barca and their Youth development when it was not really the case when you consider the numbers of players in the first team from the Barca Academy. Correct me if I am wrong, but I have counted 3 Liverpool academy players in the squad to Real Madrid's 9.

With Bale not starting, Liverpool's starting 1I will be more expensive than RM's. However, I see cannot dispute your point on RM's sheer quality. This is reflected in the fact that the most important factor of wage bill puts RM way ahead of Liverpool.

What really scares me, is the Youth talent they have and we also hear they are after Hazard and possibly Neymar. There is something menacing about RM which is really scary for the future.

While that may be factually true, without putting the recent/current transfer climate into context, that's not a fair conclusion to draw.

I have stated an objective information. The figures come from what RM paid for the players. I have not in any way tried to argue on if it is a fair valuation especially in the context of how player valuation has gone ridiculous in resent windows. I was actually being very fair in the overall context of my post when I mention the far superior wage bil of RM as a for more important indicator. In any sport but most important in football, the most important factor is, wage bill, RM pay far more than Liverpool, and this was reflected in the final itself. RM's substitution of Isco for Bale was a huge improvement because it contributed massivelly to them winning the game. Compare and contrast the effect of the loss of Salah and Lalana's coming in. This is what a wage bill brings to a club and it is why it is the defining factor in any sport. If you pay the highest salary, you tend to keep your best players.