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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:47 pm 
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Imagine if we had always had this VAR system, a lot of past matches would've likely ended differently. These come to mind. I'm sure they're more.

1988 AFCON final, coulda beaten Cameroon if Henry Nwosu's goal stood and Roger Miller's dive not rewarded as a PK.

2000 AFCON final, coulda beaten Cameroon if Ikpeba's PK was allowed.

I'm gonna say the penalty awarded to Tunisia against Nigeria in the 2004 AFCON semi final.

France v Nigeria 2014 WCR16, France could've had Matuidi and Giroud sent off. And Emenike's goal could've been allowed.

Nigeria v Italy, USA 94, Maldini could've been sent off for killing Yekini down; but then again Zola worksheet not been sent off either so equation balanced.

Mexico 86 Quarter final. Maradona's hand of God goal would've been erased and maybe he doesn't score that best ever world cup goal.

England 66 World Cup final, perhaps Geoff Hurst's goal might've been disallowed and maybe England loses.

Spurs v Manure, the goal that never was game.

Finally, all the millions of dodgy penalty calls given to home teams in the Nigerian domestic league lol.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:58 pm 
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var should be outlawed

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:02 pm 
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The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:06 pm 
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theYemster wrote:
Imagine if we had always had this VAR system, a lot of past matches would've likely ended differently. These come to mind. I'm sure they're more.

1988 AFCON final, coulda beaten Cameroon if Henry Nwosu's goal stood and Roger Miller's dive not rewarded as a PK.

2000 AFCON final, coulda beaten Cameroon if Ikpeba's PK was allowed.

I'm gonna say the penalty awarded to Tunisia against Nigeria in the 2004 AFCON semi final.

France v Nigeria 2014 WCR16, France could've had Matuidi and Giroud sent off. And Emenike's goal could've been allowed.

Nigeria v Italy, USA 94, Maldini could've been sent off for killing Yekini down; but then again Zola worksheet not been sent off either so equation balanced.

Mexico 86 Quarter final. Maradona's hand of God goal would've been erased and maybe he doesn't score that best ever world cup goal.

England 66 World Cup final, perhaps Geoff Hurst's goal might've been disallowed and maybe England loses.

Spurs v Manure, the goal that never was game.

Finally, all the millions of dodgy penalty calls given to home teams in the Nigerian domestic league lol.


Point of correction. Ikpeba's goal would have level the scores with Cameroon. There is no guarantee we would have won, eventually..

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:07 pm 
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How could one miss the very incident that led to VAR by the conservative IFAB?

Lampard's missed goal in SA 2010.

VAR is supposedly limited to goal scoring and red card incidents.
This is better than what we saw during the Confederations Cup.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:28 am 
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Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

My understanding is that the officials in the booth determine if/when a review is necessary not the teams.

About the discretionary powers, I think the objective of the VAR system is to help the referee reconsider his decision, not used to overrule it.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:29 am 
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1naija wrote:
theYemster wrote:
Imagine if we had always had this VAR system, a lot of past matches would've likely ended differently. These come to mind. I'm sure they're more.

1988 AFCON final, coulda beaten Cameroon if Henry Nwosu's goal stood and Roger Miller's dive not rewarded as a PK.

2000 AFCON final, coulda beaten Cameroon if Ikpeba's PK was allowed.

I'm gonna say the penalty awarded to Tunisia against Nigeria in the 2004 AFCON semi final.

France v Nigeria 2014 WCR16, France could've had Matuidi and Giroud sent off. And Emenike's goal could've been allowed.

Nigeria v Italy, USA 94, Maldini could've been sent off for killing Yekini down; but then again Zola worksheet not been sent off either so equation balanced.

Mexico 86 Quarter final. Maradona's hand of God goal would've been erased and maybe he doesn't score that best ever world cup goal.

England 66 World Cup final, perhaps Geoff Hurst's goal might've been disallowed and maybe England loses.

Spurs v Manure, the goal that never was game.

Finally, all the millions of dodgy penalty calls given to home teams in the Nigerian domestic league lol.


Point of correction. Ikpeba's goal would have level the scores with Cameroon. There is no guarantee we would have won, eventually..

Oh ok thanks.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:31 am 
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Kabalega wrote:
How could one miss the very incident that led to VAR by the conservative IFAB?

Lampard's missed goal in SA 2010.

VAR is supposedly limited to goal scoring and red card incidents.
This is better than what we saw during the Confederations Cup.

Yes just for potentially game altering decisions, and I think it should remain that way. Can't have it for every ticky tacky call else the game will last five hours.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:33 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

Oga, football might either take the Rugby union or cricket approach to VAR. The rugby union approach I think is better.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:19 pm 
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Man, take a look at the Iran goal against Spain, that was overruled by the VAR. Pure hypocrisy in the media.

For example, this one decides to show the wrong picture. The show him "offside" when the ball lands, not when the free kick was played! :rotf:

Image

Same here...

Image

It is disgraceful. Here is the video. You can see at 1:15 that it is a completely differently picture, nowhere near the 6 yard line. (And you can see at 1:02 that nobody gets a touch before the ball drops.)

The linesman does not flag it.

The linesman flagged 9 seconds later, at 1:24 after Iran scored.

This was described in the Sun as: "But their joy was cut short by an eagle-eyed linesman who had spotted Ezatolahi straying offside in the build-up."

:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Hypocrisy makes a mockery of everything. Technology doesn't always prevent it. The media is spinning it left and right.

It is touch and go whether the mid-fielder was offside when the kick was actually taken. The fact that the media dare not show the correct picture, but feel the need to spin it, tells the whole story.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:50 pm 
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sinequanon wrote:
It is disgraceful. Here is the video. You can see at 1:15 that it is a completely differently picture, nowhere near the 6 yard line. (And you can see at 1:02 that nobody gets a touch before the ball drops.
...It is touch and go whether the mid-fielder was offside when the kick was actually taken.

Oga, it was a correct decision
The Iranian that scored the goal, #6, was NOT offside when the kick was taken.
However, he was offside when his player (#20) headed the ball to him
It is very clear from the video

VAR worked very well

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:09 pm 
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Rawlings wrote:
sinequanon wrote:
It is disgraceful. Here is the video. You can see at 1:15 that it is a completely differently picture, nowhere near the 6 yard line. (And you can see at 1:02 that nobody gets a touch before the ball drops.
...It is touch and go whether the mid-fielder was offside when the kick was actually taken.

Oga, it was a correct decision
The Iranian that scored the goal, #6, was NOT offside when the kick was taken.
However, he was offside when his player (#20) headed the ball to him
It is very clear from the video

VAR worked very well


OK, that would partly explain the pictures that were used.

I think he headed at the ball and missed. The ball seemed to go in front of the player in front of him (who may have got a touch).

What I find suspicious is when people use the word "clear", when it isn't clear.

If the issue was about who got a touch before the midfielder scored, then that would be mentioned ABSOLUTELY everywhere. DID no. 20 get a touch, would be the question?

All I can find are vague, evasive references to the guy being offside in the "build-up" to the goal.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:30 pm 
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People are just making it up as they go along, and the media has fudged it, because there is nothing clear in the dodgy decision.

https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/8sl5n4/ezatolahi_iran_goal_disallowed_after_var/

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Belgium
Gordondel
7 points
·
20 hours ago
Can you explain the decision to me though? The ball comes off a Spanish player, I thought that couldn’t be offside, what am I misunderstanding?

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Real Madrid
HumongousChipmunk
26 points
·
20 hours ago
I think that the ball came off the head of #20 of Iran and then to Ezatolahi, who was already offside by then.

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Tottenham Hotspur
JeannotVD
8 points
·
19 hours ago
Handball too, which was the original complaint by many Spanish players.

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PremiumJapaneseGreen
0 points
·
18 hours ago
which was the original complaint by many Spanish

It doesn't seem like you can make it out from this angle that the player came off #20s head.


Everyone seems to be saying this is a clear cut offside, but I don't think that viewing angle allows us to see if it does. Granted, I'm sure the refs got to see a different angle and make their decision based on that, I just wish they would show us that angle.

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NEC
helemaalnicks
16 points
·
20 hours ago
First of all, both the 6 and the 19 were offside on the initial free kick, and they both touched it.

Also, I think the ball came off an Iran player, and 6 was waaaay offside at that point.

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England
cake_flattener1
8 points
·
19 hours ago
I think they were just onside on the initial free kick, but it doesn't matter because as you say, the no. 6 was way offside for the knock-on.

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United States
bduddy
2 points
·
20 hours ago
It hits Iran's #19 first.

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Houston Dynamo
pipsdontsqueak
4 points
·
20 hours ago
Iranian player was offside when the ball was kicked by the man taking the free kick.

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Belgium
Gordondel
6 points
·
20 hours ago
But that wasn’t the last touch though, how many touches are we supposed to take into account?

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Borussia Dortmund
lawrencecgn
8 points
·
20 hours ago
The touch in between was also by an Iranian player and was still offside. Also, it has to be a new game situation for passive active no longer becoming active once the ball is received i.e. with a controlled pass

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Eidolones
8 points
·
20 hours ago
It counts from the last "intentional" touch, which in this case was the down header by the Iranian player, and he was offside when that header was made. Deflections do not count even if it's off a Spanish player. If a Spanish player intentionally back pass though, you're allowed to intercept that even if you're on an offside position.

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Belgium
Gordondel
2 points
·
20 hours ago
Thank you! Got it.

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Arsenal
SomeOtherWilliam
1 point
·
20 hours ago
Does he interfere with play? I genuinely couldn't see it live or on reply

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Houston Dynamo
pipsdontsqueak
1 point
·
20 hours ago
Unclear, but it seems like he ran just beyond the Spanish defender as the ball was kicked.

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Uruguay
TheBlackHandOfDog
2 points
·
20 hours ago
He was offside when the original ball was put through.

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iushciuweiush
1 point
·
18 hours ago
https://i.imgur.com/5XKpviI.jpg

Ball came off the head/hand of #20 at this point.

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Belgium
Gordondel
1 point
·
18 hours ago
Which isn't the last touch and that's why I was confused, I got my answer from someone else, letting me know that deflections don't count.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:20 am 
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Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

Hi, EII. Do you think the VAR protocol will eventually lead to all goals being reviewed as in Rugby? or a challenge system as in Cricket, Tennis?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 4:08 am 
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folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

Hi, EII. Do you think the VAR protocol will eventually lead to all goals being reviewed as in Rugby? or a challenge system as in Cricket, Tennis?


folem,

TBH, yes. I hope it goes that way. The most frustrating to me is the fact that the coaches are not allowed to call for a review which allows officials too much power. What is FIFA afraid of in allowing the teams a limited number of challenges to a refereeing call? Right now, the match officials continues to retain much of the power and can disregard the VAR or so it seems.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 4:24 am 
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Enugu II wrote:
folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

Hi, EII. Do you think the VAR protocol will eventually lead to all goals being reviewed as in Rugby? or a challenge system as in Cricket, Tennis?


folem,

TBH, yes. I hope it goes that way. The most frustrating to me is the fact that the coaches are not allowed to call for a review which allows officials too much power. What is FIFA afraid of in allowing the teams a limited number of challenges to a refereeing call? Right now, the match officials continues to retain much of the power and can disregard the VAR or so it seems.

If it goes all the way, who should have the power to challenge between the captain and the coach?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 4:31 am 
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Not sure why VAR was wasn’t used in the Morocco game when a blatant foul by Pepe in the Moroccan attacker’s wasn’t caked.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 6:13 am 
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YUJAM wrote:
Not sure why VAR was wasn’t used in the Morocco game when a blatant foul by Pepe in the Moroccan attacker’s wasn’t caked.


FIFA has clear rules/guidelines on WHEN VAR can be used

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 10:47 am 
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folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

Hi, EII. Do you think the VAR protocol will eventually lead to all goals being reviewed as in Rugby? or a challenge system as in Cricket, Tennis?


folem,

TBH, yes. I hope it goes that way. The most frustrating to me is the fact that the coaches are not allowed to call for a review which allows officials too much power. What is FIFA afraid of in allowing the teams a limited number of challenges to a refereeing call? Right now, the match officials continues to retain much of the power and can disregard the VAR or so it seems.

If it goes all the way, who should have the power to challenge between the captain and the coach?


For me it should be the coach in contact either VAR official. That to me will help have the system operate optimally.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:31 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

Hi, EII. Do you think the VAR protocol will eventually lead to all goals being reviewed as in Rugby? or a challenge system as in Cricket, Tennis?


folem,

TBH, yes. I hope it goes that way. The most frustrating to me is the fact that the coaches are not allowed to call for a review which allows officials too much power. What is FIFA afraid of in allowing the teams a limited number of challenges to a refereeing call? Right now, the match officials continues to retain much of the power and can disregard the VAR or so it seems.

If it goes all the way, who should have the power to challenge between the captain and the coach?


For me it should be the coach in contact either VAR official. That to me will help have the system operate optimally.
I think the captain can do it by contacting the referee who is in charge of the game to check with the VAR officials. What other sport uses the coach to initiate video challenges?


Last edited by folem on Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:40 pm 
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This VAR will make diving players obsolete.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:09 pm 
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:21 pm 
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folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
folem wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
The VAR is doing a good job. For me there are two areas of concern though: a) when to request a review, and b) balancing referee's discretionary power.

Hi, EII. Do you think the VAR protocol will eventually lead to all goals being reviewed as in Rugby? or a challenge system as in Cricket, Tennis?


folem,

TBH, yes. I hope it goes that way. The most frustrating to me is the fact that the coaches are not allowed to call for a review which allows officials too much power. What is FIFA afraid of in allowing the teams a limited number of challenges to a refereeing call? Right now, the match officials continues to retain much of the power and can disregard the VAR or so it seems.

If it goes all the way, who should have the power to challenge between the captain and the coach?


For me it should be the coach in contact either VAR official. That to me will help have the system operate optimally.
I think the captain can do it by contacting the referee who is in charge of the game to check with the VAR officials. What other sport uses the coach to initiate video challenges?

Hi EII, from what we have seen so far, it seems the players are all now influencing the referee to check VAR on all controversial decisions that the referee doesn't give in their favor and showing dissent in many cases. Isn't it obvious now, that the VAR protocol has to be amended to give only the captain the ability to challenge the referee and within a time limit for the incident and how many times it can be done per half and if successful with a challenge can as well have the option to retain one more challenge within the period.


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