OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

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ANC
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by ANC »

But on a serious note; if Nigeria appropriately defines her objective with age-grade tournament ( unearthing of talents), it would be very easy to stamp out age cheating. Just promote and monitor players during secondary school tournaments. Select only players with proven school records and only make exceptions in extraordinary rare cases.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by joao »

txj wrote:
joao wrote:
txj wrote:
Cristao II wrote:
txj wrote:The really sad thing is that many of us will privately acknowledge and deep down know that we are cheating. But will keep quiet here and hide behind the moniker of 'evidence '.
Txj, why should anyone be judged guilty of a crime without evidence?
Because Txj feels so. :lol: :lol: :lol:
It’s not the job of any itinerant internet poster to ‘find evidence ‘. That is frankly a basic misunderstanding of how things work in real life.

But what he/she can do is shine a light on suspicious patterns or observations.
Quite interesting reasoning indeed.
Now, this summed up Txj's perspective on things 'in real life'.
Talk about self indictment. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
You’ve neither said nor contributed anything. Except the self congratulations...
...And what you've insisted on makes sense, only to you.
After all these years of your riding the high horse, you have yet to make any sense besides accusations and insinuations.
A true crime buster, with regards the issue, would have presented clear evidence besides guessing on a person's age based
on pictures. Furthermore, please speak for yourself, and stop the generalizing. What's with
We are still cheating. We always cheat. Cheating is in our DNA...
I guess you are seeking company, but please stick with facts, and know your kind.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by osita »

ANC wrote:But on a serious note; if Nigeria appropriately defines her objective with age-grade tournament ( unearthing of talents), it would be very easy to stamp out age cheating. Just promote and monitor players during secondary school tournaments. Select only players with proven school records and only make exceptions in extraordinary rare cases.
We have lots of talent, this particular coach we have in the u20s is corrupt and lazy. The MFM club in the Nigerian league has fantastic young players. We just have a corrupt coach. The players we have currently in the u20 are not good enough, it’s all not picking players because u have no money interest
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by ohenhen1 »

The NFF need to do more to stop age cheating. We need to keep better records. Why are we so successful at youth level, then struggle at senior level?
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by theYemster »

ANC wrote:But on a serious note; if Nigeria appropriately defines her objective with age-grade tournament ( unearthing of talents), it would be very easy to stamp out age cheating. Just promote and monitor players during secondary school tournaments. Select only players with proven school records and only make exceptions in extraordinary rare cases.
I agree. Sigh, sadly many of the players I saw in that team don't pass the eye test.

If were in charge, I won't select any player in any professional team, I'll also not select any player without proper birth records, by proper I mean one that's been documented at the time of birth and during childhood. By now the FA should've started a nationwide awareness program and drive to inform the public and potential future parents on the importance of registering any birth. Make it mandatory, such that there's a penalty to parents if their kids are found not to have proper birth records. Work with govt to make it as seamless as possible. Let them know that if they don't properly register them, they will encounter problems in future. They should even record DNA, blood type, blood group, genotype etc.

It'll make forging ages much more difficult if all those info are documented at birth.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Cristao II »

JACKAL wrote:
Cristao II wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:
Cristao II wrote:
txj wrote:The really sad thing is that many of us will privately acknowledge and deep down know that we are cheating. But will keep quiet here and hide behind the moniker of 'evidence '.
Txj, why should anyone be judged guilty of a crime without evidence?
Because the system is corrupt. Look at the MRI failure rate for the U17 team.
So your evidence if these players decide to take you to court is that because of the MRI failure rate for the U17 team, they are overaged?

By your logic, every Nigerian on this board is a ***** agent because some Nigerians are crooks.
Another age Denier :boo:
Just to be clear which may be a waste of time. I do not stand with calling someone an age cheat just because someone feels they look old.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by YemiBrazil »

Cristao II wrote:
JACKAL wrote:
Cristao II wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:
Cristao II wrote:
txj wrote:The really sad thing is that many of us will privately acknowledge and deep down know that we are cheating. But will keep quiet here and hide behind the moniker of 'evidence '.
Txj, why should anyone be judged guilty of a crime without evidence?
Because the system is corrupt. Look at the MRI failure rate for the U17 team.
So your evidence if these players decide to take you to court is that because of the MRI failure rate for the U17 team, they are overaged?

By your logic, every Nigerian on this board is a ***** agent because some Nigerians are crooks.
Another age Denier :boo:
Just to be clear which may be a waste of time. I do not stand with calling someone an age cheat just because someone feels they look old.
Simple!
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by YemiBrazil »

JACKAL wrote:
YemiBrazil wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:I look at overall body features not just the face. Jerome Akor Adam's is mature for his age.


Olawale
ALIU
Rabiu
Utin
Jamil
Tijani
Offia
Maxwell

are mature for their age



I think Kingsley, Ozoronwafor, Bashiru, Nnamdi, Makanjoula, andZaccalla are U20. Zaccalla look like he is 14.
All from photo and television? These ageologist clowns no go kill person for hia :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
You nothing but an Age Denier !! :boo:
Not sure what you mean? Have you ever come up with the specific age of any of our players with proof (or even without proof) and I denied it? :mrgreen:
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by JACKAL »

YemiBrazil wrote:
JACKAL wrote:
YemiBrazil wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:I look at overall body features not just the face. Jerome Akor Adam's is mature for his age.


Olawale
ALIU
Rabiu
Utin
Jamil
Tijani
Offia
Maxwell

are mature for their age



I think Kingsley, Ozoronwafor, Bashiru, Nnamdi, Makanjoula, andZaccalla are U20. Zaccalla look like he is 14.
All from photo and television? These ageologist clowns no go kill person for hia :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
You nothing but an Age Denier !! :boo:
Not sure what you mean? Have you ever come up with the specific age of any of our players with proof (or even without proof) and I denied it? :mrgreen:
Definitions:
Ageologist: Those who fastidiously specialize in guestimating people age's with common sense analysis albeit anecdotally.
Age Denier : Kinda like the phrase"Holocaust Denier"... They see it, feel it, but refuse to believe it even with very strong and powerful anecdotal evidence.

PS. I am not saying or suggesting evidence of the Holocaust was anecdotal
Last edited by JACKAL on Tue May 28, 2019 11:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Damunk »

JACKAL wrote:
YemiBrazil wrote:
JACKAL wrote:
YemiBrazil wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:I look at overall body features not just the face. Jerome Akor Adam's is mature for his age.


Olawale
ALIU
Rabiu
Utin
Jamil
Tijani
Offia
Maxwell

are mature for their age



I think Kingsley, Ozoronwafor, Bashiru, Nnamdi, Makanjoula, andZaccalla are U20. Zaccalla look like he is 14.
All from photo and television? These ageologist clowns no go kill person for hia :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
You nothing but an Age Denier !! :boo:
Not sure what you mean? Have you ever come up with the specific age of any of our players with proof (or even without proof) and I denied it? :mrgreen:
Definitions:
Ageologist: Those who fastidiously specialize in guestimating people age's with common sense analysis albeit anecdotally.
Age Denier : Kinda like "Holocaust Denier"... They see it, feel it, but refuse to believe it even with very strong and powerful anecdotal evidence.
Evidence of the Holocaust is not anecdotal, for God's sake.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Damunk »

theYemster wrote:
ANC wrote:But on a serious note; if Nigeria appropriately defines her objective with age-grade tournament ( unearthing of talents), it would be very easy to stamp out age cheating. Just promote and monitor players during secondary school tournaments. Select only players with proven school records and only make exceptions in extraordinary rare cases.
I agree. Sigh, sadly many of the players I saw in that team don't pass the eye test.

If were in charge, I won't select any player in any professional team, I'll also not select any player without proper birth records, by proper I mean one that's been documented at the time of birth and during childhood. By now the FA should've started a nationwide awareness program and drive to inform the public and potential future parents on the importance of registering any birth. Make it mandatory, such that there's a penalty to parents if their kids are found not to have proper birth records. Work with govt to make it as seamless as possible. Let them know that if they don't properly register them, they will encounter problems in future. They should even record DNA, blood type, blood group, genotype etc.

It'll make forging ages much more difficult if all those info are documented at birth.
You are making HUGE assumptions here, all based on what you feel a 20yr old Nigerian should look like.

You've read the first-hand experience of Ugbowo, but refuse to factor it into your conclusions.
You've assumed the authorities are not doing at least some of what you say they should be doing and have no idea the number of players rejected for the very reasons you suggest. I guess until they send you a personal email detailing what has transpired, there's no way it coulda happened, right?

But most importantly you are not even calling for even one iota of evidence from anyone anywhere on the age cheating allegation. Its all based on TV camera images and photographs as if you do not have any life experience that tells you that images can be deceptive and meeting a person in real life can be a totally different story.

Is there something wrong with our people or maybe our culture that makes us value feelings over fact 9 times out of 10?

Maybe this is an emotional matter, but this is not the way TheYemster of RnR routinely analyses issues. :idea:
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Damunk »

osita wrote:
ANC wrote:But on a serious note; if Nigeria appropriately defines her objective with age-grade tournament ( unearthing of talents), it would be very easy to stamp out age cheating. Just promote and monitor players during secondary school tournaments. Select only players with proven school records and only make exceptions in extraordinary rare cases.
We have lots of talent, this particular coach we have in the u20s is corrupt and lazy. The MFM club in the Nigerian league has fantastic young players. We just have a corrupt coach. The players we have currently in the u20 are not good enough, it’s all not picking players because u have no money interest
I don't know anything about the "corrupt coach" and that is for you to prove from the safety of your anonymity. But have you considered even for one minute that all these nameless "fantastic young players" y'all keep reminding us exist everywhere might in fact not meet certain criteria...like clean school records, traceable birth certificates etc, or simply have dodgy and conflicting histories not worth taking the risk on?

All this hysteria is being made on wild assumptions which nobody has bothered to seek clarification on. We are reaching conclusions in a manner none of us would dare do for an 'O' level chemistry exam (Action ---> Observation ---> Conclusion) talk less at the university level or the workplace. :oops:
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Gotti »

txj wrote:The CE archives are an interesting repository of information sometimes.

The same slew of characters like Damunk, Gotti and EII can be found criticizing those who dared to question Yomi Tella’s team and asking for evidence.

We have since come to find out that the suspicious patterns that were highlighted by the whistleblowers was indeed well founded.

Just like it was for the 1989 team, the 2013, 2005, the Chukwudi team, etc.
Dude, it should be a succinct lesson that PROFESSIONALLY-ACCOMPLISHED persons are all aligned on this matter... :lol:
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Enugu II »

Image

I don't see how you can tell this kid's age just by his photo.

Or even this guy below:

Image
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Gotti »

txj wrote:The CE archives are an interesting repository of information sometimes.

The same slew of characters like Damunk, Gotti and EII can be found criticizing those who dared to question Yomi Tella’s team and asking for evidence.

We have since come to find out that the suspicious patterns that were highlighted by the whistleblowers was indeed well founded.

Just like it was for the 1989 team, the 2013, 2005, the Chukwudi team, etc.
Btw, what exactly is it that supposedly "was indeed well founded"? :blink:

Is it that the purportedly then "36-year-old" Dele Ajiboye is still active 12 years later and was even recently called up by Oyinbo coach Gernot Rohr to the main SE squad (after starring for the CHAN SEs)? Or is it that of the Spain U17 team in the same 2007 U17 WC tournament (that the Tella team only managed to beat via a PK shootout), only GK De Gea has gone on to be an establish senior international for Spain (with "stars" like Bojan being a bench player at second divsion Stoke City)? Or is it that several of the other U17 teams at the same 2007 U17 (including powerhouses like France and Argentina) have not even had a single player on their team become establish internationals at the senior level?
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Man Ataye »

wale1974 wrote:
Tobi17 wrote:I'll really love to see an "U20" picture of you :taunt:
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

That was funny. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by JACKAL »

Damunk wrote:
JACKAL wrote:
YemiBrazil wrote:
JACKAL wrote:
YemiBrazil wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:I look at overall body features not just the face. Jerome Akor Adam's is mature for his age.


Olawale
ALIU
Rabiu
Utin
Jamil
Tijani
Offia
Maxwell

are mature for their age



I think Kingsley, Ozoronwafor, Bashiru, Nnamdi, Makanjoula, andZaccalla are U20. Zaccalla look like he is 14.
All from photo and television? These ageologist clowns no go kill person for hia :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
You nothing but an Age Denier !! :boo:
Not sure what you mean? Have you ever come up with the specific age of any of our players with proof (or even without proof) and I denied it? :mrgreen:
Definitions:
Ageologist: Those who fastidiously specialize in guestimating people age's with common sense analysis albeit anecdotally.
Age Denier : Kinda like "Holocaust Denier"... They see it, feel it, but refuse to believe it even with very strong and powerful anecdotal evidence.
Evidence of the Holocaust is not anecdotal, for God's sake.
Of course its not, I was merely using that phrase to describe the Age denier phrase
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by joao »

The arguments some of these 'Ageologist' profer are so mind-boggling one has to wonder if they really comprehend
what they are saying. Their argument is akin to saying, '...and if I feel it, then then it true. Nothing to prove'.
The sad part to this type of reasoning, is when such is used to indict them or their loved ones. Then...
SMH :shock: :shock: :shock:
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Gotti »

Damunk wrote:Evidence of the Holocaust is not anecdotal, for God's sake.
Abegi tell him...
But sadly that's the sort of leap of logic that underlies Ageology! :oops:
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by ANC »

unless someone crawled out from under the rock, never went to church, never got sick, and was homeschooled, I see no reason why an organization cannot effectively verify someones age. Forget birth records etc; those should only be a part of it when available.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Waffiman »

More things change, the more they stay the same. Social media is cruel with even more direct and ruthless criticisms of the player's ages, than here on CE. This debate is as old as the hills. It is most unfortunate that we have to go through this at every junior tournament.

Image

Image

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It is too late for these criticisms now. Let's support our team. I know I am.
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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

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Re: OUR AGBAYA POLICY AT U20 LEVEL IS ALIVE AND WELL

Post by Lolly »

ANC wrote:unless someone crawled out from under the rock, never went to church, never got sick, and was homeschooled, I see no reason why an organization cannot effectively verify someones age. Forget birth records etc; those should only be a part of it when available.
How do you expect the authorities to verify when the player will provide fake school results provided by the school principal, fake WAEC result provided by WAEC officials, fake passport provided by the FG, fake affidavit of birth provided by the courts, and of course mummy and daddy to back up his fake date of birth while siblings and friends don't want to pour sand sand for him garri? Let's be honest for once. Nigerian players don't use their real ages. But it doesn't mean you can tell the exact age of a person from their looks.

And the government is trying but the people are bent of not playing by the rules. Let me give you an example. A former employee (driver) who also plays football and has been trying to travel abroad for football trials recently managed to change his date of birth on his passport at source. He paid somebody in the passport office in Abuja who updated his records in the database and they renewed his passport with the new date of birth. I was shocked. He has been on this DOB thing for almost 4 years. Meanwhile he is over 30 but new DOB puts him at 20.
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