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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 12:43 am 
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Zelex wrote:
He should declare himself available for selection if that time ever comes. To each his own though.

Zelex, your points are well taken but this sentimental use of terms like 'begging' and' pursuing' doesn't really portray the situation accurately in my opinion.
The approach from the football authorities to these guys is probably no different from the rest, with phone calls and probably a follow-up visit.
How do players indicate their desire to play for Nigeria anyway?

Such an action whatever it is can easily be seen as being presumptuous:
"Who even told you Nigeria wants you anyway?"
"Who told you you are good enough for Nigeria sef?"


So they might not 'indicate' their availability in any obvious way as we are assuming.
The established norm is to be approached, not to go soliciting for an invitation.

When Tammy Abraham put the Naija flag on his IG page, it might be the best 'indicator' anyone can hope to get if that is what he was signaling. Going on the pages of newspapers or online to say "I am ready to play for Nigeria" is a risk and even though we might see it as no big deal in Nigeria, some cultures do not operate that way and it is not the norm.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 1:20 am 
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Damunk wrote:
Zelex wrote:
He should declare himself available for selection if that time ever comes. To each his own though.

Zelex, your points are well taken but this sentimental use of terms like 'begging' and' pursuing' doesn't really portray the situation accurately in my opinion.
The approach from the football authorities to these guys is probably no different from the rest, with phone calls and probably a follow-up visit.
How do players indicate their desire to play for Nigeria anyway?

Such an action whatever it is can easily be seen as being presumptuous:
"Who even told you Nigeria wants you anyway?"
"Who told you you are good enough for Nigeria sef?"


So they might not 'indicate' their availability in any obvious way as we are assuming.
The established norm is to be approached, not to go soliciting for an invitation.

When Tammy Abraham put the Naija flag on his IG page, it might be the best 'indicator' anyone can hope to get if that is what he was signaling. Going on the pages of newspapers or online to say "I am ready to play for Nigeria" is a risk and even though we might see it as no big deal in Nigeria, some cultures do not operate that way and it is not the norm.


Interesting perspective. Point taken, I can't really disagree with what you've typed.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 5:48 am 
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felarey wrote:
deanotito wrote:
Damunk wrote:
deanotito wrote:
I really wish Nigeria would leave guys like these alone. They should be given a simple choice...when someone commits to you and then decommits and joins the German U21 side, that should be it. He shouldn't be considered ever again.

Going back to them after something like this weakens you psychologically, and makes your team feel inferior. Is Felix Agu really going to change life in the eagles? Probably not...so why?
Maybe for you the fan, but for their professional teammates, it don't mean shytt.
Its part f the game. Soldier come, soldier go. It is central to professional football life.
You accept wholeheartedly what's yours; you let go of he who goes elsewhere.
They fully understand that.
You and I don't quite get it. We are driven by ego.
Footballer na ashawo, no disrespect to them.


I disagree. Completely and Totally. You can’t fill your team with German rejects and expect to have a psychological edge over Germany/like countries.

I wonder what psychological edge Liverpool have over Chelsea with Salah. You guys make shocking statements sometimes. This is football where players can be late bloomers. Imagine if Austria had thrown Alaba away when he was still travelling to camp in Nigeria. It is outright discriminatory to decide to banish a Nigerian from representing his national team. That won't even hold in a human right court. Such misplaced ego is what makes this world a worse place and leads to wars. It is how people become disenfranchised by smartys in power thinking they're doing the right thing. Have you had any thought that you may be denying a nigerian his right?


You really think National Team football is the same as club football? I ask.. why does a player give his all for his national team? Surely it is not for the bonus they pay...compared to his club, its nothing. He plays, in a large part, for pride. And when it comes to that, his psyche is extremely important. You cannot fill your team with German rejects and expect that it won't have a negative psychological impact on the rejects and even on the other players. Can the impact be overcome? Yes....but of what use is it to hobble yourself? And please...Salah is an exception...not a rule. When high profile players crash, they generally never come back to that level.

If Mr. Agu is a savior, he will make the German squad. If he cannot even earn a competitive shirt for Germany (which is the only way he would be eligible to play for Nigeria), odds are he is far from a savior. So for what reason would we debase ourselves for him again? What improvement against other options could he offer that makes him so worth it?

We will have our pickings with players of Nigerian heritage that weren't born in Nigeria...We're just too populous not to. There will always be the Iwobis, Ainas and Ebuehis of this world who choose us while still young and inexperienced. We will also lose out on some Agus....but if we create a safe space for the likes of Agu to try and fail with Germany while still knowing Nigeria is an option, then we will also (eventually) lose out on the Ainas and Ebuehis.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 12:17 pm 
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deanotito wrote:
felarey wrote:
deanotito wrote:
Damunk wrote:
deanotito wrote:
I really wish Nigeria would leave guys like these alone. They should be given a simple choice...when someone commits to you and then decommits and joins the German U21 side, that should be it. He shouldn't be considered ever again.

Going back to them after something like this weakens you psychologically, and makes your team feel inferior. Is Felix Agu really going to change life in the eagles? Probably not...so why?
Maybe for you the fan, but for their professional teammates, it don't mean shytt.
Its part f the game. Soldier come, soldier go. It is central to professional football life.
You accept wholeheartedly what's yours; you let go of he who goes elsewhere.
They fully understand that.
You and I don't quite get it. We are driven by ego.
Footballer na ashawo, no disrespect to them.


I disagree. Completely and Totally. You can’t fill your team with German rejects and expect to have a psychological edge over Germany/like countries.

I wonder what psychological edge Liverpool have over Chelsea with Salah. You guys make shocking statements sometimes. This is football where players can be late bloomers. Imagine if Austria had thrown Alaba away when he was still travelling to camp in Nigeria. It is outright discriminatory to decide to banish a Nigerian from representing his national team. That won't even hold in a human right court. Such misplaced ego is what makes this world a worse place and leads to wars. It is how people become disenfranchised by smartys in power thinking they're doing the right thing. Have you had any thought that you may be denying a nigerian his right?


You really think National Team football is the same as club football? I ask.. why does a player give his all for his national team? Surely it is not for the bonus they pay...compared to his club, its nothing. He plays, in a large part, for pride. And when it comes to that, his psyche is extremely important. You cannot fill your team with German rejects and expect that it won't have a negative psychological impact on the rejects and even on the other players. Can the impact be overcome? Yes....but of what use is it to hobble yourself? And please...Salah is an exception...not a rule. When high profile players crash, they generally never come back to that level.

If Mr. Agu is a savior, he will make the German squad. If he cannot even earn a competitive shirt for Germany (which is the only way he would be eligible to play for Nigeria), odds are he is far from a savior. So for what reason would we debase ourselves for him again? What improvement against other options could he offer that makes him so worth it?

We will have our pickings with players of Nigerian heritage that weren't born in Nigeria...We're just too populous not to. There will always be the Iwobis, Ainas and Ebuehis of this world who choose us while still young and inexperienced. We will also lose out on some Agus....but if we create a safe space for the likes of Agu to try and fail with Germany while still knowing Nigeria is an option, then we will also (eventually) lose out on the Ainas and Ebuehis.

Deanitito

You claim Iwobi etc choose Nigeria. That is not entirely correct. Check out the process of those guys deciding to play for Nigeria. Consider first playing for another country and/or choosing Nigeria when that country is not breaking down doors to get them to play at the senior level. The difference with Tammy is that England has shown interest at the senior level. There is a difference. Let's not forget that.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2019 11:35 pm 
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felarey wrote:
Very funny, dunno why this topic has to be discussed over and over again. Those having issues with the player fail to realize playing for Nigeria is his birthright and the SE by design should choose the best players available to represent the country. Being rejected by Germany is not a curse as most of our players can't start for Germany. Who are the 'We' that decide whether or not we're 2nd choice?? Do those 'We' include nigerians of which these players are amongst them. If you want to implement a discriminatory policy of overlooking nigerians for the SE because they tried to play for Germany, go ahead and cut off your nose to spite your face with your misplaced ego. We are not dealing with a German here but a Nigerian, that's why we approached him in the first place. The best Nigerian footballers have a birthright and human right to play for the SE and it will ever remain that way. It's not like these players ever invite themselves or can force themselves on the team.


so whats your point again

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2019 6:03 pm 
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Even many of the dual nationals currently in the SE play for them only because they cannot get into the squads of their other nation. Do we honestly think Balogun, Ekong, and Ebuehi would be playing for Nigeria if Germany and Holland wanted them?

pajimoh wrote:
We need to get used to SE being "second choice" for most foreign born players. They've probably struggled for acceptance in their country.
To now dump their country and be called a "Nigerian international" without their country first deciding there's no need of them might result in some unwarranted attention from fans and the public alike.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 8:02 am 
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deanotito wrote:
I really wish Nigeria would leave guys like these alone. They should be given a simple choice...when someone commits to you and then decommits and joins the German U21 side, that should be it. He shouldn't be considered ever again.

Going back to them after something like this weakens you psychologically, and makes your team feel inferior. Is Felix Agu really going to change life in the eagles? Probably not...so why?



OR BETTER YET...


...Nigeria should craft and implement an effective youth development program within Nigeria. I don't see why this is made to look so complicated. With that in place, Nigeria can still welcome foreign-born players but they would have to be special to make the team. It should be rare for a player who cannot make the team of his foreign nation of birth to then revert to Nigeria as his second choice. Another way of putting is that if such a player would be in limbo because he won't be able to make either squad. I'm not as worried about any psychological problems as the fact that if Nigeria has ambitions of winning (yes, winning) the WC it's squad cannot be dominated by players that have been rejected by others. Simply not logical.
Bell

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 8:50 am 
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Bell wrote:
OR BETTER YET...


...Nigeria should craft and implement an effective youth development program within Nigeria. I don't see why this is made to look so complicated. With that in place, Nigeria can still welcome foreign-born players but they would have to be special to make the team. It should be rare for a player who cannot make the team of his foreign nation of birth to then revert to Nigeria as his second choice. Another way of putting is that if such a player would be in limbo because he won't be able to make either squad. I'm not as worried about any psychological problems as the fact that if Nigeria has ambitions of winning (yes, winning) the WC it's squad cannot be dominated by players that have been rejected by others. Simply not logical.
Bell


Better still....

.... Let´s say the truth. Pinnick has little or no interest in youth football development in Nigeria. All he wants is, recruiting dual national regardless of the league they are playing in, into the SE. Face facts, not theory, abeg.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:52 pm 
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Bell wrote:
deanotito wrote:
I really wish Nigeria would leave guys like these alone. They should be given a simple choice...when someone commits to you and then decommits and joins the German U21 side, that should be it. He shouldn't be considered ever again.

Going back to them after something like this weakens you psychologically, and makes your team feel inferior. Is Felix Agu really going to change life in the eagles? Probably not...so why?



OR BETTER YET...


...Nigeria should craft and implement an effective youth development program within Nigeria. I don't see why this is made to look so complicated. With that in place, Nigeria can still welcome foreign-born players but they would have to be special to make the team. It should be rare for a player who cannot make the team of his foreign nation of birth to then revert to Nigeria as his second choice. Another way of putting is that if such a player would be in limbo because he won't be able to make either squad. I'm not as worried about any psychological problems as the fact that if Nigeria has ambitions of winning (yes, winning) the WC it's squad cannot be dominated by players that have been rejected by others. Simply not logical.
Bell
This is why I keep on saying ego is getting in the way of reason and John 12 (who I disagree with on many issues) continues to say Nigerians are "delusional".

WE ARE RANKED 33 IN THE WORLD RANKINGS and even if the rankings are "crap'', "unfair', "racist" or whatever we choose to call them, we still wouldn't realistically be in the world's top 20.
Agreed?


So where do we get this notion that any player that can't make the full national squad of some of the world's elite footballing nations cannot be better than what we currently have available in our local leagues? And that is considering that our league is ranked even worse (72) than our national team, according to this.

Nigerians are paying lip service to meaningful development because, as I keep reiterating, NIGERIANS DON'T HAVE THE LIVER to sit out ten years of unreliable results while we go through a reorganization of our local leagues and youth development programs.
THEY WILL NOT TOLERATE THE INEVITABLE BAD RESULTS THAT GO WITH IT.

We can't even handle a defeat in a meaningless African Nations Cup tournament.
We can't handle coming third in AFCON.
We can't handle a first-round exit at the WC in a group featuring Croatia and Argenttina!
Even worse, they will rain serious abuse on 17-year-old kids that fail to 'deliver' top-level performances every single game.
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Yet people are campaigning for a bar on Nigeria-eligible players trying to hedge their bets on whether to play for Germany/England/Holland vs playing for Nigeria. It's not as if we are still inviting 'hey yous'. There are probably hundreds of eligible Nigerians playing in England alone who will never get a mention because they're just not up to even the minimum standard.

Its all really emotional, ego-driven rants.
People putting pressure on young men in their teens and twenties which they themselves could not resist when they decided to move abroad and work for oyibo rather than stay and 'rep' in Nigeria.

I've got far more respect for those that live in Nigeria making the case than those making all the noise from the comfort of their cushy jobs in the west.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 7:45 pm 
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Damunk wrote:
Bell wrote:
deanotito wrote:
I really wish Nigeria would leave guys like these alone. They should be given a simple choice...when someone commits to you and then decommits and joins the German U21 side, that should be it. He shouldn't be considered ever again.

Going back to them after something like this weakens you psychologically, and makes your team feel inferior. Is Felix Agu really going to change life in the eagles? Probably not...so why?



OR BETTER YET...


...Nigeria should craft and implement an effective youth development program within Nigeria. I don't see why this is made to look so complicated. With that in place, Nigeria can still welcome foreign-born players but they would have to be special to make the team. It should be rare for a player who cannot make the team of his foreign nation of birth to then revert to Nigeria as his second choice. Another way of putting is that if such a player would be in limbo because he won't be able to make either squad. I'm not as worried about any psychological problems as the fact that if Nigeria has ambitions of winning (yes, winning) the WC it's squad cannot be dominated by players that have been rejected by others. Simply not logical.
Bell
This is why I keep on saying ego is getting in the way of reason and John 12 (who I disagree with on many issues) continues to say Nigerians are "delusional".

WE ARE RANKED 33 IN THE WORLD RANKINGS and even if the rankings are "crap'', "unfair', "racist" or whatever we choose to call them, we still wouldn't realistically be in the world's top 20.
Agreed?


So where do we get this notion that any player that can't make the full national squad of some of the world's elite footballing nations cannot be better than what we currently have available in our local leagues? And that is considering that our league is ranked even worse (72) than our national team, according to this.

Nigerians are paying lip service to meaningful development because, as I keep reiterating, NIGERIANS DON'T HAVE THE LIVER to sit out ten years of unreliable results while we go through a reorganization of our local leagues and youth development programs.
THEY WILL NOT TOLERATE THE INEVITABLE BAD RESULTS THAT GO WITH IT.

We can't even handle a defeat in a meaningless African Nations Cup tournament.
We can't handle coming third in AFCON.
We can't handle a first-round exit at the WC in a group featuring Croatia and Argenttina!
Even worse, they will rain serious abuse on 17-year-old kids that fail to 'deliver' top-level performances every single game.
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Yet people are campaigning for a bar on Nigeria-eligible players trying to hedge their bets on whether to play for Germany/England/Holland vs playing for Nigeria. It's not as if we are still inviting 'hey yous'. There are probably hundreds of eligible Nigerians playing in England alone who will never get a mention because they're just not up to even the minimum standard.

Its all really emotional, ego-driven rants.
People putting pressure on young men in their teens and twenties which they themselves could not resist when they decided to move abroad and work for oyibo rather than stay and 'rep' in Nigeria.

I've got far more respect for those that live in Nigeria making the case than those making all the noise from the comfort of their cushy jobs in the west.



IT'S QUITE POSSIBLE THAT...


...you hurriedly read my post and failed to get the point I was making:

1) No where did I say foreign-born players are unwelcome. I've been on record to say they are quite welcome. All I'm saying is that if Nigeria institutes a well-planned youth development program, it SHOULD be hard (not that they should be barred) for these foreign-born players who could not make their first choice foreign team to then turn their attention to Nigeria.

2) Nigeria may be ranked wherever but the premise of my position is that Nigeria is planning to win the WC. if that's the case, and it should, then settling for players who couldn't make their first choice team will only ensure that Nigeria can never win the WC. Basic logic.

3) I proposed instituting a youth development plan and you responded by saying this is not possible because Nigerians cannot stand a ten-year period of unreliable results. What in my post led to your conclusion that instituting a youth development program would lead to years of uncertain results?

4) I disagree strenuously with your statement that the call for a youth development program is mere lip service. Certainly not from me. And if as you imply, putting a youth development program in place is not realistic, you are therefore suggesting that the best Nigeria can do is maintain the current status, or maybe do a better job bringing in these foreign-born players. If that's your position, you're in effect saying Nigeria should not aspire to win the WC. You can't win it when better players in other countries are leaving you with their "rejects".

5) As others have pointed out, these kids have the absolute right to do what's their best interest. But so does Nigeria. I don't fault the likes of Dele Alli for choosing England, but, personally, after being rejected once like this Agu kid is doing, I would not give him a second chance. Let the kids diligently and carefully study the options available to them, make their decision and go with it. Nigeria should not be used as their safety net. I don't think the football fortunes of the country depends on these kids. Aspiring keeper Maduka seems to have thrown his lot with Nigeria and has every opportunity that native born Nigerians have. Some might say he did so because he's concluded that he has no chance with Germany. I say fine: that's what the rest of them should be doing. I say so even though, regrettably, I know the problems and mismanagement that are the norm in Nigerian football.
Bell
Bell

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:05 am 
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Bell wrote:
Damunk wrote:
Bell wrote:


OR BETTER YET...


...Nigeria should craft and implement an effective youth development program within Nigeria. I don't see why this is made to look so complicated. With that in place, Nigeria can still welcome foreign-born players but they would have to be special to make the team. It should be rare for a player who cannot make the team of his foreign nation of birth to then revert to Nigeria as his second choice. Another way of putting is that if such a player would be in limbo because he won't be able to make either squad. I'm not as worried about any psychological problems as the fact that if Nigeria has ambitions of winning (yes, winning) the WC it's squad cannot be dominated by players that have been rejected by others. Simply not logical.
Bell
This is why I keep on saying ego is getting in the way of reason and John 12 (who I disagree with on many issues) continues to say Nigerians are "delusional".

WE ARE RANKED 33 IN THE WORLD RANKINGS and even if the rankings are "crap'', "unfair', "racist" or whatever we choose to call them, we still wouldn't realistically be in the world's top 20.
Agreed?


So where do we get this notion that any player that can't make the full national squad of some of the world's elite footballing nations cannot be better than what we currently have available in our local leagues? And that is considering that our league is ranked even worse (72) than our national team, according to this.

Nigerians are paying lip service to meaningful development because, as I keep reiterating, NIGERIANS DON'T HAVE THE LIVER to sit out ten years of unreliable results while we go through a reorganization of our local leagues and youth development programs.
THEY WILL NOT TOLERATE THE INEVITABLE BAD RESULTS THAT GO WITH IT.

We can't even handle a defeat in a meaningless African Nations Cup tournament.
We can't handle coming third in AFCON.
We can't handle a first-round exit at the WC in a group featuring Croatia and Argenttina!
Even worse, they will rain serious abuse on 17-year-old kids that fail to 'deliver' top-level performances every single game.
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Yet people are campaigning for a bar on Nigeria-eligible players trying to hedge their bets on whether to play for Germany/England/Holland vs playing for Nigeria. It's not as if we are still inviting 'hey yous'. There are probably hundreds of eligible Nigerians playing in England alone who will never get a mention because they're just not up to even the minimum standard.

Its all really emotional, ego-driven rants.
People putting pressure on young men in their teens and twenties which they themselves could not resist when they decided to move abroad and work for oyibo rather than stay and 'rep' in Nigeria.

I've got far more respect for those that live in Nigeria making the case than those making all the noise from the comfort of their cushy jobs in the west.



IT'S QUITE POSSIBLE THAT...


...you hurriedly read my post and failed to get the point I was making:

1) No where did I say foreign-born players are unwelcome. I've been on record to say they are quite welcome. All I'm saying is that if Nigeria institutes a well-planned youth development program, it SHOULD be hard (not that they should be barred) for these foreign-born players who could not make their first choice foreign team to then turn their attention to Nigeria.

2) Nigeria may be ranked wherever but the premise of my position is that Nigeria is planning to win the WC. if that's the case, and it should, then settling for players who couldn't make their first choice team will only ensure that Nigeria can never win the WC. Basic logic.

3) I proposed instituting a youth development plan and you responded by saying this is not possible because Nigerians cannot stand a ten-year period of unreliable results. What in my post led to your conclusion that instituting a youth development program would lead to years of uncertain results?

4) I disagree strenuously with your statement that the call for a youth development program is mere lip service. Certainly not from me. And if as you imply, putting a youth development program in place is not realistic, you are therefore suggesting that the best Nigeria can do is maintain the current status, or maybe do a better job bringing in these foreign-born players. If that's your position, you're in effect saying Nigeria should not aspire to win the WC. You can't win it when better players in other countries are leaving you with their "rejects".

5) As others have pointed out, these kids have the absolute right to do what's their best interest. But so does Nigeria. I don't fault the likes of Dele Alli for choosing England, but, personally, after being rejected once like this Agu kid is doing, I would not give him a second chance. Let the kids diligently and carefully study the options available to them, make their decision and go with it. Nigeria should not be used as their safety net. I don't think the football fortunes of the country depends on these kids. Aspiring keeper Maduka seems to have thrown his lot with Nigeria and has every opportunity that native born Nigerians have. Some might say he did so because he's concluded that he has no chance with Germany. I say fine: that's what the rest of them should be doing. I say so even though, regrettably, I know the problems and mismanagement that are the norm in Nigerian football.
Bell
Bell
Bell....apologies.
It was not directed at you tbh.
I was speaking to those GDPs who just can't stand foreign-born Nigerians invited to the SE and hide behind the local league being neglected as if revamping it can happen in 6 months.

But there are a couple of things I still disagree with though:
4. The "lip service" thing is about those calling for local players from the local league (or possibly local players playing secretly under Eko bridge) arguing that they say are better than some players being called to camp. Forget those noisemakers. They can't handle the pain of transition and will derail any SE progress with their calls for sackings when the going gets tough.
I want the local league developed but am under no illusions that the trial and error of local players as a priority will be seriously painful.

5. I've made my point about young men struggling to make permanent choices on their career paths.They are young and still very impressionable. They have a right to make wrong choices at that age, like we all did. I'd never pressure anyone to do what I am unable to do myself. At 21, I really had no plan to travel abroad to work. I later changed my mind and despite govt (state and federal) having subsidized my medical training, never went back.

I'm sure most of us here have made vows and choices at that age and then reversed them.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 7:20 am 
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Damunk wrote:
Bell wrote:
Damunk wrote:
Bell wrote:


OR BETTER YET...


...Nigeria should craft and implement an effective youth development program within Nigeria. I don't see why this is made to look so complicated. With that in place, Nigeria can still welcome foreign-born players but they would have to be special to make the team. It should be rare for a player who cannot make the team of his foreign nation of birth to then revert to Nigeria as his second choice. Another way of putting is that if such a player would be in limbo because he won't be able to make either squad. I'm not as worried about any psychological problems as the fact that if Nigeria has ambitions of winning (yes, winning) the WC it's squad cannot be dominated by players that have been rejected by others. Simply not logical.
Bell
This is why I keep on saying ego is getting in the way of reason and John 12 (who I disagree with on many issues) continues to say Nigerians are "delusional".

WE ARE RANKED 33 IN THE WORLD RANKINGS and even if the rankings are "crap'', "unfair', "racist" or whatever we choose to call them, we still wouldn't realistically be in the world's top 20.
Agreed?


So where do we get this notion that any player that can't make the full national squad of some of the world's elite footballing nations cannot be better than what we currently have available in our local leagues? And that is considering that our league is ranked even worse (72) than our national team, according to this.

Nigerians are paying lip service to meaningful development because, as I keep reiterating, NIGERIANS DON'T HAVE THE LIVER to sit out ten years of unreliable results while we go through a reorganization of our local leagues and youth development programs.
THEY WILL NOT TOLERATE THE INEVITABLE BAD RESULTS THAT GO WITH IT.

We can't even handle a defeat in a meaningless African Nations Cup tournament.
We can't handle coming third in AFCON.
We can't handle a first-round exit at the WC in a group featuring Croatia and Argenttina!
Even worse, they will rain serious abuse on 17-year-old kids that fail to 'deliver' top-level performances every single game.
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Yet people are campaigning for a bar on Nigeria-eligible players trying to hedge their bets on whether to play for Germany/England/Holland vs playing for Nigeria. It's not as if we are still inviting 'hey yous'. There are probably hundreds of eligible Nigerians playing in England alone who will never get a mention because they're just not up to even the minimum standard.

Its all really emotional, ego-driven rants.
People putting pressure on young men in their teens and twenties which they themselves could not resist when they decided to move abroad and work for oyibo rather than stay and 'rep' in Nigeria.

I've got far more respect for those that live in Nigeria making the case than those making all the noise from the comfort of their cushy jobs in the west.



IT'S QUITE POSSIBLE THAT...


...you hurriedly read my post and failed to get the point I was making:

1) No where did I say foreign-born players are unwelcome. I've been on record to say they are quite welcome. All I'm saying is that if Nigeria institutes a well-planned youth development program, it SHOULD be hard (not that they should be barred) for these foreign-born players who could not make their first choice foreign team to then turn their attention to Nigeria.

2) Nigeria may be ranked wherever but the premise of my position is that Nigeria is planning to win the WC. if that's the case, and it should, then settling for players who couldn't make their first choice team will only ensure that Nigeria can never win the WC. Basic logic.

3) I proposed instituting a youth development plan and you responded by saying this is not possible because Nigerians cannot stand a ten-year period of unreliable results. What in my post led to your conclusion that instituting a youth development program would lead to years of uncertain results?

4) I disagree strenuously with your statement that the call for a youth development program is mere lip service. Certainly not from me. And if as you imply, putting a youth development program in place is not realistic, you are therefore suggesting that the best Nigeria can do is maintain the current status, or maybe do a better job bringing in these foreign-born players. If that's your position, you're in effect saying Nigeria should not aspire to win the WC. You can't win it when better players in other countries are leaving you with their "rejects".

5) As others have pointed out, these kids have the absolute right to do what's their best interest. But so does Nigeria. I don't fault the likes of Dele Alli for choosing England, but, personally, after being rejected once like this Agu kid is doing, I would not give him a second chance. Let the kids diligently and carefully study the options available to them, make their decision and go with it. Nigeria should not be used as their safety net. I don't think the football fortunes of the country depends on these kids. Aspiring keeper Maduka seems to have thrown his lot with Nigeria and has every opportunity that native born Nigerians have. Some might say he did so because he's concluded that he has no chance with Germany. I say fine: that's what the rest of them should be doing. I say so even though, regrettably, I know the problems and mismanagement that are the norm in Nigerian football.
Bell
Bell
Bell....apologies.
It was not directed at you tbh.
I was speaking to those GDPs who just can't stand foreign-born Nigerians invited to the SE and hide behind the local league being neglected as if revamping it can happen in 6 months.

But there are a couple of things I still disagree with though:
4. The "lip service" thing is about those calling for local players from the local league (or possibly local players playing secretly under Eko bridge) arguing that they say are better than some players being called to camp. Forget those noisemakers. They can't handle the pain of transition and will derail any SE progress with their calls for sackings when the going gets tough.
I want the local league developed but am under no illusions that the trial and error of local players as a priority will be seriously painful.

5. I've made my point about young men struggling to make permanent choices on their career paths.They are young and still very impressionable. They have a right to make wrong choices at that age, like we all did. I'd never pressure anyone to do what I am unable to do myself. At 21, I really had no plan to travel abroad to work. I later changed my mind and despite govt (state and federal) having subsidized my medical training, never went back.

I'm sure most of us here have made vows and choices at that age and then reversed them.



damunk, NO APOLOGIES NEEDED, AFTERALL...


...different points of view, and vigorous disagreements, are allowed here. Nothing you said was out of line or personal. On my part, I hope I didn't sound angry.
Bell

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2019 9:21 am 
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Zelex wrote:
I have no qualms if a player decides to pledge their allegiance to another nation, fair enough. Whilst I don't agree that the chapter should be closed such players if they do decide to play for Nigeria in the future, in no way should Nigeria put themselves out there to try and "convince" these players again. They have to openly declare themselves available for selection. The idea of going back to convince someone who has rejected you previously is frankly embarrassing, particularly in the context of International football where it is a privilege to where the green jersey.


:clap: :clap:
of all the points made here this is the one that makes most sense.
No reason why We cannot actively court a player but once they decide not to take up the offer Nigeria should let them know the door is open in future but they need to make the effort to get back in the frame. This stance should be made public (put on the NFF website as a policy statement maybe) so there is no ambiguity.
Totally straightforward and fair in my opinion

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