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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:59 pm 
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Oga Oloye, I respect your opinion and I know it's not fashionable to have a contrary opinion on CE but I'm gonna state mine and damn the fockers.
Imagine you have to make a crucial decision on your career and someone says "we need a yes or no now?" Why do we think because it's football people cannot genuinely take thier time to decide and weigh their options?
Yes, Tammy might also see Nigeria as second choice. I know some of you have first choice to fourth choice when you were picking your educational institutions. It's ok for you but not others?
We should also know that for people who have not lived in Nigeria or have any regular contact with Nigeria are more likely to see Nigeria as last resort. Heck athletes who were brought up in Nigeria are even deserting Nigeria.
Maybe Tammy played Nigeria but that is like saying he knew he would hit a rich vein of form and the threat of Nigeria seeking his services will then force what's his name to pick him for England. That's a very long play.






oloye wrote:
Even before the two my position has always been clear, tell us yes or no when we come to you, don't use us to bargain. When Tammy was looking clueless and like a fish out of River Thames he started singing awilo songs and suddenly started dancing to Sunny Ade music, but as soon as he started scoring, he started loing Rule Brittania and God save our noble Queen.

If that is not being played, biko help me out.

There is nothing emotional about my position, may God keep us all alive, time is always the one that tells the story of what went on behind the scene. But biko I know when am being played, this sounds like double dealing.
We were played like felele blown blown, we may not agree but I stand on my position gidigba like Zuma rock.
Damunk wrote:
oloye wrote:
I told ya all these guys are playing us like whot card, throw the rubbish card on deck and hope to play their joker as we cluelessly gobble up the rubbish they spew in our direction.

I have no problem if they choose their country of birth over us, but I have every problem being used as a pawn and a second option if the first fails.

You don't have to be rich or complete to have dignity, I have poor and disable people with dignity that will shame all.

Shame on all who allow us to be pissed upon, who lowered our self pride only to be scorned and treated like a cheap unkempt ayilara prostitute. We deserve better!
Oloye, for one who is known to be 'cool, calm ad collected' (as we used to say back in the day), I believe on this matter you have joined the 'emotional brigade' in their interpretation of events and their response to Tammy's final decision.

Being 'played' is a subjective opinion and a very negative spin on what you see and read in the public domain.
You have no idea what was going on in Tammy's head (or heart) to conclude that he was being dubious, cunning, dishonest or any other negative perception of what went on. This kind of thing is what leads to hate mail, physical and verbal threats etc etc against players who at the end of the day might be nothing like what they are portrayed to be.

In as much as you say you respect Tammy's decision, you also happen to be in the company of those who do not and are quite happy to smear his name and personality permanently. You give credence to their emotionality simply by virtue of your position as an ex-international. If anything, I woulda thought you can relate. Two clubs want your services. Its a big story and the press are on your case, quoting, misquoting and fabricating your comments. You have to make a choice and you choose one. Next thing you are "a traitor", "overrated", "two-faced" and "greedy". And the rejected party says you are "arrogant", "disrespectful" of their club and its great heritage and even "dishonest".
But we all know it is just emotion. Those that know the real story will not be heard. Remember Odemwingie's QPR fiasco? Na so.

For all you know, it was a battle for Tammy. The England call came first. They always had the edge. The Nigeria call has not even come. At best there have been tentative enquiries.

It is only those that know Tammy personally that can realistically comment on whether he was 'playing' Nigeria and 'pissing all over us' or not. I'm sure players like Iwobi got their own undeserved abuse when he decided to play for Nigeria, probably smearing his character too.

This one is an extreme response and I could have sworn someone stole your handle.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:45 pm 
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As I said I don't have any wahala with Tammy or Tomori, I have not attacked their decisions instead I have questioned the way we put ourselves about. The fact of the matter is that we were played and I have explained it again and again why, now if you cannot see it no wahala. When they were not courted by England they wanted to play for us, but as soon as a couple of goals came in they suddenly realised England was always their preferred choice.

They always knew what they wanted it England first, it always England first. Like someone said in another forum, we are not asking them to leave Chelsea and come to play for Kano Pillars. It was a case of choosing nationality and they opted to be English, that is what I see when it comes to playing for your national team, it is not career. When I see the likes of Mikhitaryan come out proudly to represent their countries, the likes of Dzeko also, it was never about career, it was first and last about nationality.

That is the difference. I would have preferred they say from the onset sorry I sink or swim with england. Ireland has been in this position long before us, I have seen Irish players in this position, there were those who simply told Ireland listen we have Irish names and grand parents but sorry we simply do not want to play as that is not is not enough. Ireland courted Mark Noble, the guy stuck to his gun that it was either England of nothing else.

There were many others like Noble who simply said listen we would go British all the way.

The fact still remains when we put our offer on the table we must be proud enough to say take it or leave it, we won't hang around and play us like your joker.

Like I said we stand a better chance of offering them the ticket to the world Cup than anyone else it is our selling point. If it is not enough then let us stop wasting our time with these kids, let us stop demeaning ourselves. The hl mark of Nigerians is our pride and dignity even in the face of the nonsense we are going through, we are still able to stand tall.

These days I see people with no sense of dignity running us around, the other day it was the President rushing down to SA to come and hug Ramphosa or whatever his name is, less than a month after his citizens were butchered like rams on the streets of SA.

My national team should remain a place of dignity and honor, fit only for those who want to play for us because they identify with the nationality not chances and one chancers!

Of course we can disagree, but this is how I see life. It is not about career choice selecting England, it does not have to come to that, those English boys playing for St George Wear the nationality with pride, yes it offers financial renumeration but to them first and foremost it was about national pride.

The minute these ones start singing between two lines waiting to use one against the other, integrity goes out of the window.

pajimoh wrote:
Oga Oloye, I respect your opinion and I know it's not fashionable to have a contrary opinion on CE but I'm gonna state mine and damn the fockers.
Imagine you have to make a crucial decision on your career and someone says "we need a yes or no now?" Why do we think because it's football people cannot genuinely take thier time to decide and weigh their options?
Yes, Tammy might also see Nigeria as second choice. I know some of you have first choice to fourth choice when you were picking your educational institutions. It's ok for you but not others?
We should also know that for people who have not lived in Nigeria or have any regular contact with Nigeria are more likely to see Nigeria as last resort. Heck athletes who were brought up in Nigeria are even deserting Nigeria.
Maybe Tammy played Nigeria but that is like saying he knew he would hit a rich vein of form and the threat of Nigeria seeking his services will then force what's his name to pick him for England. That's a very long play.






oloye wrote:
Even before the two my position has always been clear, tell us yes or no when we come to you, don't use us to bargain. When Tammy was looking clueless and like a fish out of River Thames he started singing awilo songs and suddenly started dancing to Sunny Ade music, but as soon as he started scoring, he started loing Rule Brittania and God save our noble Queen.

If that is not being played, biko help me out.

There is nothing emotional about my position, may God keep us all alive, time is always the one that tells the story of what went on behind the scene. But biko I know when am being played, this sounds like double dealing.
We were played like felele blown blown, we may not agree but I stand on my position gidigba like Zuma rock.
Damunk wrote:
oloye wrote:
I told ya all these guys are playing us like whot card, throw the rubbish card on deck and hope to play their joker as we cluelessly gobble up the rubbish they spew in our direction.

I have no problem if they choose their country of birth over us, but I have every problem being used as a pawn and a second option if the first fails.

You don't have to be rich or complete to have dignity, I have poor and disable people with dignity that will shame all.

Shame on all who allow us to be pissed upon, who lowered our self pride only to be scorned and treated like a cheap unkempt ayilara prostitute. We deserve better!
Oloye, for one who is known to be 'cool, calm ad collected' (as we used to say back in the day), I believe on this matter you have joined the 'emotional brigade' in their interpretation of events and their response to Tammy's final decision.

Being 'played' is a subjective opinion and a very negative spin on what you see and read in the public domain.
You have no idea what was going on in Tammy's head (or heart) to conclude that he was being dubious, cunning, dishonest or any other negative perception of what went on. This kind of thing is what leads to hate mail, physical and verbal threats etc etc against players who at the end of the day might be nothing like what they are portrayed to be.

In as much as you say you respect Tammy's decision, you also happen to be in the company of those who do not and are quite happy to smear his name and personality permanently. You give credence to their emotionality simply by virtue of your position as an ex-international. If anything, I woulda thought you can relate. Two clubs want your services. Its a big story and the press are on your case, quoting, misquoting and fabricating your comments. You have to make a choice and you choose one. Next thing you are "a traitor", "overrated", "two-faced" and "greedy". And the rejected party says you are "arrogant", "disrespectful" of their club and its great heritage and even "dishonest".
But we all know it is just emotion. Those that know the real story will not be heard. Remember Odemwingie's QPR fiasco? Na so.

For all you know, it was a battle for Tammy. The England call came first. They always had the edge. The Nigeria call has not even come. At best there have been tentative enquiries.

It is only those that know Tammy personally that can realistically comment on whether he was 'playing' Nigeria and 'pissing all over us' or not. I'm sure players like Iwobi got their own undeserved abuse when he decided to play for Nigeria, probably smearing his character too.

This one is an extreme response and I could have sworn someone stole your handle.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 11:26 pm 
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He could not choose Nigeria without changing allegiance because he accepted the friendly invitation and played.

He can play for England without having to change allegiance; no administrative bottlenecks.

The minute he accepted the call up for that friendly, he had made his decision!


Damunk wrote:
MYMIND wrote:
DAMUNK

This is not difficult to discern; he used Nigeria's interest to propel himself into the England national team discussion.

The minute he decided to honor the friendly call up a sometime early last year after the picture of Pinnick with his Dad and Tammy, he had made up his mind to play for England. The discussion continued as to where his international football future lies till date because it was a friendly and he disappointed and was never called again.

Southgate wrote him off until his Chelsea performances this season; Southgate knew that if he does not call up Tammy for this international window, he will likely switch allegiance in protest.
Even your response is prejudging him.
So if he had honoured a Nigeria call-up it would only have been "in protest"?

You don judge am be dat nah.
Everything he has ever said regarding Nigeria is a con, if we are to go by your summation.

Conversely it means players like Iwobi feel nothing for England and anyone that accuses them of being "ungrateful" or disrespectful has a point and is justified? Human feelings and behaviour are never so black and white, but people will always have their own extreme spin on events depending on which side of the coin they lie.

Do you know what Iwobi went through in the run up to his stepping on the field for Nigeria for the first time?
The same emotional rants - but from the other side in his case.
No difference.

Abeg, lets not give him a bad name in order to hang him cos if you don't hang him, others will. :idea:


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:20 am 
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MYMIND wrote:
He could not choose Nigeria without changing allegiance because he accepted the friendly invitation and played.

He can play for England without having to change allegiance; no administrative bottlenecks.

The minute he accepted the call up for that friendly, he had made his decision!


Damunk wrote:
MYMIND wrote:
DAMUNK

This is not difficult to discern; he used Nigeria's interest to propel himself into the England national team discussion.

The minute he decided to honor the friendly call up a sometime early last year after the picture of Pinnick with his Dad and Tammy, he had made up his mind to play for England. The discussion continued as to where his international football future lies till date because it was a friendly and he disappointed and was never called again.

Southgate wrote him off until his Chelsea performances this season; Southgate knew that if he does not call up Tammy for this international window, he will likely switch allegiance in protest.
Even your response is prejudging him.
So if he had honoured a Nigeria call-up it would only have been "in protest"?

You don judge am be dat nah.
Everything he has ever said regarding Nigeria is a con, if we are to go by your summation.

Conversely it means players like Iwobi feel nothing for England and anyone that accuses them of being "ungrateful" or disrespectful has a point and is justified? Human feelings and behaviour are never so black and white, but people will always have their own extreme spin on events depending on which side of the coin they lie.

Do you know what Iwobi went through in the run up to his stepping on the field for Nigeria for the first time?
The same emotional rants - but from the other side in his case.
No difference.

Abeg, lets not give him a bad name in order to hang him cos if you don't hang him, others will. :idea:


Thank you, he has been gone since then, the only way we could get him is if England never called him again for a long time, basically if he never played well enough again a la Ameobi. But they have first right of refusal...

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Last edited by maceo4 on Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:23 am 
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:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

oloye wrote:
As I said I don't have any wahala with Tammy or Tomori, I have not attacked their decisions instead I have questioned the way we put ourselves about. The fact of the matter is that we were played and I have explained it again and again why, now if you cannot see it no wahala. When they were not courted by England they wanted to play for us, but as soon as a couple of goals came in they suddenly realised England was always their preferred choice.

They always knew what they wanted it England first, it always England first. Like someone said in another forum, we are not asking them to leave Chelsea and come to play for Kano Pillars. It was a case of choosing nationality and they opted to be English, that is what I see when it comes to playing for your national team, it is not career. When I see the likes of Mikhitaryan come out proudly to represent their countries, the likes of Dzeko also, it was never about career, it was first and last about nationality.

That is the difference. I would have preferred they say from the onset sorry I sink or swim with england. Ireland has been in this position long before us, I have seen Irish players in this position, there were those who simply told Ireland listen we have Irish names and grand parents but sorry we simply do not want to play as that is not is not enough. Ireland courted Mark Noble, the guy stuck to his gun that it was either England of nothing else.

There were many others like Noble who simply said listen we would go British all the way.

The fact still remains when we put our offer on the table we must be proud enough to say take it or leave it, we won't hang around and play us like your joker.

Like I said we stand a better chance of offering them the ticket to the world Cup than anyone else it is our selling point. If it is not enough then let us stop wasting our time with these kids, let us stop demeaning ourselves. The hl mark of Nigerians is our pride and dignity even in the face of the nonsense we are going through, we are still able to stand tall.

These days I see people with no sense of dignity running us around, the other day it was the President rushing down to SA to come and hug Ramphosa or whatever his name is, less than a month after his citizens were butchered like rams on the streets of SA.

My national team should remain a place of dignity and honor, fit only for those who want to play for us because they identify with the nationality not chances and one chancers!

Of course we can disagree, but this is how I see life. It is not about career choice selecting England, it does not have to come to that, those English boys playing for St George Wear the nationality with pride, yes it offers financial renumeration but to them first and foremost it was about national pride.

The minute these ones start singing between two lines waiting to use one against the other, integrity goes out of the window.

pajimoh wrote:
Oga Oloye, I respect your opinion and I know it's not fashionable to have a contrary opinion on CE but I'm gonna state mine and damn the fockers.
Imagine you have to make a crucial decision on your career and someone says "we need a yes or no now?" Why do we think because it's football people cannot genuinely take thier time to decide and weigh their options?
Yes, Tammy might also see Nigeria as second choice. I know some of you have first choice to fourth choice when you were picking your educational institutions. It's ok for you but not others?
We should also know that for people who have not lived in Nigeria or have any regular contact with Nigeria are more likely to see Nigeria as last resort. Heck athletes who were brought up in Nigeria are even deserting Nigeria.
Maybe Tammy played Nigeria but that is like saying he knew he would hit a rich vein of form and the threat of Nigeria seeking his services will then force what's his name to pick him for England. That's a very long play.






oloye wrote:
Even before the two my position has always been clear, tell us yes or no when we come to you, don't use us to bargain. When Tammy was looking clueless and like a fish out of River Thames he started singing awilo songs and suddenly started dancing to Sunny Ade music, but as soon as he started scoring, he started loing Rule Brittania and God save our noble Queen.

If that is not being played, biko help me out.

There is nothing emotional about my position, may God keep us all alive, time is always the one that tells the story of what went on behind the scene. But biko I know when am being played, this sounds like double dealing.
We were played like felele blown blown, we may not agree but I stand on my position gidigba like Zuma rock.
Damunk wrote:
oloye wrote:
I told ya all these guys are playing us like whot card, throw the rubbish card on deck and hope to play their joker as we cluelessly gobble up the rubbish they spew in our direction.

I have no problem if they choose their country of birth over us, but I have every problem being used as a pawn and a second option if the first fails.

You don't have to be rich or complete to have dignity, I have poor and disable people with dignity that will shame all.

Shame on all who allow us to be pissed upon, who lowered our self pride only to be scorned and treated like a cheap unkempt ayilara prostitute. We deserve better!
Oloye, for one who is known to be 'cool, calm ad collected' (as we used to say back in the day), I believe on this matter you have joined the 'emotional brigade' in their interpretation of events and their response to Tammy's final decision.

Being 'played' is a subjective opinion and a very negative spin on what you see and read in the public domain.
You have no idea what was going on in Tammy's head (or heart) to conclude that he was being dubious, cunning, dishonest or any other negative perception of what went on. This kind of thing is what leads to hate mail, physical and verbal threats etc etc against players who at the end of the day might be nothing like what they are portrayed to be.

In as much as you say you respect Tammy's decision, you also happen to be in the company of those who do not and are quite happy to smear his name and personality permanently. You give credence to their emotionality simply by virtue of your position as an ex-international. If anything, I woulda thought you can relate. Two clubs want your services. Its a big story and the press are on your case, quoting, misquoting and fabricating your comments. You have to make a choice and you choose one. Next thing you are "a traitor", "overrated", "two-faced" and "greedy". And the rejected party says you are "arrogant", "disrespectful" of their club and its great heritage and even "dishonest".
But we all know it is just emotion. Those that know the real story will not be heard. Remember Odemwingie's QPR fiasco? Na so.

For all you know, it was a battle for Tammy. The England call came first. They always had the edge. The Nigeria call has not even come. At best there have been tentative enquiries.

It is only those that know Tammy personally that can realistically comment on whether he was 'playing' Nigeria and 'pissing all over us' or not. I'm sure players like Iwobi got their own undeserved abuse when he decided to play for Nigeria, probably smearing his character too.

This one is an extreme response and I could have sworn someone stole your handle.

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Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 8:34 am 
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Again, I understand your frustration and this boils down to lack of strategy from the NFF.
You approach someone to play for you or possibly change nationality from the country they represented in their youth.
To some of this guys, the first time they'll be having contact with NFF is to request their services.
They've never had a call to say "Hello, we are the NFF. We know you're a Nigerian and we are wishing and praying for you. We'll keep in touch to see how you're doing....". Probably not one contact, ever.
Then compare it with the interactions they've had with their current country of abode. They've been approached before to play for the junior teams. They've gone to their practice based. They've had the mementos of their call-up sent to them with caps and all, proudly hanging on their mantle piece.
Then you expect the NFF to waltz in and say "we want you to play for us, this is our offer. Take it or leave it".
This approach is not a request but an ultimatum. You are not putting yourself in their shoes.
I admit Nigeria need to approach things a little better and some of us have been saying, this thing should not be played out in the media. If the player takes it to the media then you know he's playing you. Some players have joined the SE without some of us knowing they are even on the radar.
The NFF can also wait for players to approach them. At least we know those are likely to be ready. But most here would also argue if they are chasing us then they are no good.
There just has to be some guidelines from the NFF without the ultimatum or the "shame" of feeling being played.


oloye wrote:
As I said I don't have any wahala with Tammy or Tomori, I have not attacked their decisions instead I have questioned the way we put ourselves about. The fact of the matter is that we were played and I have explained it again and again why, now if you cannot see it no wahala. When they were not courted by England they wanted to play for us, but as soon as a couple of goals came in they suddenly realised England was always their preferred choice.

They always knew what they wanted it England first, it always England first. Like someone said in another forum, we are not asking them to leave Chelsea and come to play for Kano Pillars. It was a case of choosing nationality and they opted to be English, that is what I see when it comes to playing for your national team, it is not career. When I see the likes of Mikhitaryan come out proudly to represent their countries, the likes of Dzeko also, it was never about career, it was first and last about nationality.

That is the difference. I would have preferred they say from the onset sorry I sink or swim with england. Ireland has been in this position long before us, I have seen Irish players in this position, there were those who simply told Ireland listen we have Irish names and grand parents but sorry we simply do not want to play as that is not is not enough. Ireland courted Mark Noble, the guy stuck to his gun that it was either England of nothing else.

There were many others like Noble who simply said listen we would go British all the way.

The fact still remains when we put our offer on the table we must be proud enough to say take it or leave it, we won't hang around and play us like your joker.

Like I said we stand a better chance of offering them the ticket to the world Cup than anyone else it is our selling point. If it is not enough then let us stop wasting our time with these kids, let us stop demeaning ourselves. The hl mark of Nigerians is our pride and dignity even in the face of the nonsense we are going through, we are still able to stand tall.

These days I see people with no sense of dignity running us around, the other day it was the President rushing down to SA to come and hug Ramphosa or whatever his name is, less than a month after his citizens were butchered like rams on the streets of SA.

My national team should remain a place of dignity and honor, fit only for those who want to play for us because they identify with the nationality not chances and one chancers!

Of course we can disagree, but this is how I see life. It is not about career choice selecting England, it does not have to come to that, those English boys playing for St George Wear the nationality with pride, yes it offers financial renumeration but to them first and foremost it was about national pride.

The minute these ones start singing between two lines waiting to use one against the other, integrity goes out of the window.

pajimoh wrote:
Oga Oloye, I respect your opinion and I know it's not fashionable to have a contrary opinion on CE but I'm gonna state mine and damn the fockers.
Imagine you have to make a crucial decision on your career and someone says "we need a yes or no now?" Why do we think because it's football people cannot genuinely take thier time to decide and weigh their options?
Yes, Tammy might also see Nigeria as second choice. I know some of you have first choice to fourth choice when you were picking your educational institutions. It's ok for you but not others?
We should also know that for people who have not lived in Nigeria or have any regular contact with Nigeria are more likely to see Nigeria as last resort. Heck athletes who were brought up in Nigeria are even deserting Nigeria.
Maybe Tammy played Nigeria but that is like saying he knew he would hit a rich vein of form and the threat of Nigeria seeking his services will then force what's his name to pick him for England. That's a very long play.






oloye wrote:
Even before the two my position has always been clear, tell us yes or no when we come to you, don't use us to bargain. When Tammy was looking clueless and like a fish out of River Thames he started singing awilo songs and suddenly started dancing to Sunny Ade music, but as soon as he started scoring, he started loing Rule Brittania and God save our noble Queen.

If that is not being played, biko help me out.

There is nothing emotional about my position, may God keep us all alive, time is always the one that tells the story of what went on behind the scene. But biko I know when am being played, this sounds like double dealing.
We were played like felele blown blown, we may not agree but I stand on my position gidigba like Zuma rock.
Damunk wrote:
oloye wrote:
I told ya all these guys are playing us like whot card, throw the rubbish card on deck and hope to play their joker as we cluelessly gobble up the rubbish they spew in our direction.

I have no problem if they choose their country of birth over us, but I have every problem being used as a pawn and a second option if the first fails.

You don't have to be rich or complete to have dignity, I have poor and disable people with dignity that will shame all.

Shame on all who allow us to be pissed upon, who lowered our self pride only to be scorned and treated like a cheap unkempt ayilara prostitute. We deserve better!
Oloye, for one who is known to be 'cool, calm ad collected' (as we used to say back in the day), I believe on this matter you have joined the 'emotional brigade' in their interpretation of events and their response to Tammy's final decision.

Being 'played' is a subjective opinion and a very negative spin on what you see and read in the public domain.
You have no idea what was going on in Tammy's head (or heart) to conclude that he was being dubious, cunning, dishonest or any other negative perception of what went on. This kind of thing is what leads to hate mail, physical and verbal threats etc etc against players who at the end of the day might be nothing like what they are portrayed to be.

In as much as you say you respect Tammy's decision, you also happen to be in the company of those who do not and are quite happy to smear his name and personality permanently. You give credence to their emotionality simply by virtue of your position as an ex-international. If anything, I woulda thought you can relate. Two clubs want your services. Its a big story and the press are on your case, quoting, misquoting and fabricating your comments. You have to make a choice and you choose one. Next thing you are "a traitor", "overrated", "two-faced" and "greedy". And the rejected party says you are "arrogant", "disrespectful" of their club and its great heritage and even "dishonest".
But we all know it is just emotion. Those that know the real story will not be heard. Remember Odemwingie's QPR fiasco? Na so.

For all you know, it was a battle for Tammy. The England call came first. They always had the edge. The Nigeria call has not even come. At best there have been tentative enquiries.

It is only those that know Tammy personally that can realistically comment on whether he was 'playing' Nigeria and 'pissing all over us' or not. I'm sure players like Iwobi got their own undeserved abuse when he decided to play for Nigeria, probably smearing his character too.

This one is an extreme response and I could have sworn someone stole your handle.

_________________
Super Eagles - Fly Above The Storm!!!


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:51 am 
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Your points are well documented, but most of the points you raised here is not my bone of contention. I appreciate the position they are in, one thing i am not as a person , is to be insensitive. Yeah there should be a guideline or modus operandi for approaching these boys, but no matter how we want to toss it part of this process must have dates and deadline. It is not being insensitive rather dates and deadline are the hallmarks of an organisation or association that have a program.

But the point here is you are not looking at the issues that got me angry, oh by the way i am not frustrated, i will never allow the shenanigans of my country to frustrate me, it will only if i am not a Nigerian, but i can be angry. The real point here is, if Tammy had not started scoring goals , if he was struggling like the season initially suggested, would England have invited him, would he have gone with England or continue to give us the impression he wants to play for us? That is the playing part, that is the part i have problem with. If he was still struggling with Chelsea and probably cast aside after being humiliated by the fans of the country he now says he is proud to play for, he would probably be on the plane heading to Singapore, and would be grabbing the NFF logo saying he loves Nigeria. Now let me push it further, if you can feel proud to play for a country that hurl sickening, racial insults at you because you missed goals or penalties, then such should be able to play for a country like Nigeria irrespective of our shortcomings.

When we approach any player we express a desire to have them play for us, we are not begging them nor are we forcing them, we are appealing to what binds us together, the bond of nationality. No nation must have to beg anyone to represent her , nor must they force any to do so unless well maybe military service. So if we come to you and tell you we think you are good enough to play for us and say would you consider representing the country of your descent, we also come to you showing you our plans and why we need your answer. Doing so not to coerce or corral you into a decision, no far from it, rather the dates and deadline we show to you is part of the program we have in place which we are now asking you to become part of. No matter how much companies covet your skill, they cannot keep the offer open forever, that skill or talent is required within a certain project window. That is what deadlines are for, they are not meant to intimidate people, those who have plans they are working with will appreciate deadlines.

Of course i agree some of these boys should have been approached earlier, but then i look at what Tomori did to Canada, and Declan Rice to Ireland, this approach does not carry any guarantee either. So yes we need to take on aggressive manner that says we need answers as soon as possible as we do not have the luxury. The truth is we do not! These folks will not choose us if they an the other option open , so we are left with either accepting that we are second best when it comes to their decision making or simply tell them to shove it we wont settle for second best. I will go with the second option, i believe in pampering players, i believe in respecting players, but i do not , i repeat i do not believe in begging a player to put on a jersey. You see as someone who has played this game, the player who gives you the best are the ones decided to do it from their own free will. They will die for you. The ones you beg, you must always find a way to keep begging or keeping them happy.

So when you approach these folks we must do so with confidence, with pride and with dignity. We know what we are , we know what we are offering and we know we have a stake in them that is almost spiritual and ancestral, when we show up at your doorstep we are asking you to become part of our national aspiration. If at the age of 22, you have never felt that inspiration, if you have never considered it or felt a connection , Jesus who are the fools who approached such a player?

On the issue of players approaching us, my answer is still a no, it is clubs or national teams that approach players. You dont need to approach us, if you plan to play for Nigeria, go ahead grab yourself a Nigerian passport and proudly let the whole world know you cherish your Nigerian roots, then go back to your club and play yourself into reckoning like every other player seeking to represent their countries and are awaiting an international call. Just because you are born abroad and play abroad does not give you automatic call, rather If we deem you good enough for us we will call you!


pajimoh wrote:
Again, I understand your frustration and this boils down to lack of strategy from the NFF.
You approach someone to play for you or possibly change nationality from the country they represented in their youth.
To some of this guys, the first time they'll be having contact with NFF is to request their services.
They've never had a call to say "Hello, we are the NFF. We know you're a Nigerian and we are wishing and praying for you. We'll keep in touch to see how you're doing....". Probably not one contact, ever.
Then compare it with the interactions they've had with their current country of abode. They've been approached before to play for the junior teams. They've gone to their practice based. They've had the mementos of their call-up sent to them with caps and all, proudly hanging on their mantle piece.
Then you expect the NFF to waltz in and say "we want you to play for us, this is our offer. Take it or leave it".
This approach is not a request but an ultimatum. You are not putting yourself in their shoes.

I admit Nigeria need to approach things a little better and some of us have been saying, this thing should not be played out in the media. If the player takes it to the media then you know he's playing you. Some players have joined the SE without some of us knowing they are even on the radar.
The NFF can also wait for players to approach them. At least we know those are likely to be ready. But most here would also argue if they are chasing us then they are no good.
There just has to be some guidelines from the NFF without the ultimatum or the "shame" of feeling being played.



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 2:11 pm 
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:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Excellently put! I for one have always been in support of recruiting the best Nigerians all across the globe. However, the recent encounters have left a bad taste in my mouth. There is a feeling (at least to me) that an invitation to SE has been devalued. What surprises me the amount of people satisfied with Nigeria being a 2nd choice. As I've mentioned earlier in a discussion with Felarey, there is no guarantee how ones career will turn out if they play for either Nigeria or e.g. England. Thus go with your instinct. If you've never felt inspired to put on the GWG jersey. Then fair enough, but this merry-go-around nonsense with Abraham was embarrassing. I blame the NFF more than the players however speaking as some who was born abroad who can somehow relate to the thinking of these boys. I must say, they are not as naive as some of you like to think.


oloye wrote:
Your points are well documented, but most of the points you raised here is not my bone of contention. I appreciate the position they are in, one thing i am not as a person , is to be insensitive. Yeah there should be a guideline or modus operandi for approaching these boys, but no matter how we want to toss it part of this process must have dates and deadline. It is not being insensitive rather dates and deadline are the hallmarks of an organisation or association that have a program.

But the point here is you are not looking at the issues that got me angry, oh by the way i am not frustrated, i will never allow the shenanigans of my country to frustrate me, it will only if i am not a Nigerian, but i can be angry. The real point here is, if Tammy had not started scoring goals , if he was struggling like the season initially suggested, would England have invited him, would he have gone with England or continue to give us the impression he wants to play for us? That is the playing part, that is the part i have problem with. If he was still struggling with Chelsea and probably cast aside after being humiliated by the fans of the country he now says he is proud to play for, he would probably be on the plane heading to Singapore, and would be grabbing the NFF logo saying he loves Nigeria. Now let me push it further, if you can feel proud to play for a country that hurl sickening, racial insults at you because you missed goals or penalties, then such should be able to play for a country like Nigeria irrespective of our shortcomings.

When we approach any player we express a desire to have them play for us, we are not begging them nor are we forcing them, we are appealing to what binds us together, the bond of nationality. No nation must have to beg anyone to represent her , nor must they force any to do so unless well maybe military service. So if we come to you and tell you we think you are good enough to play for us and say would you consider representing the country of your descent, we also come to you showing you our plans and why we need your answer. Doing so not to coerce or corral you into a decision, no far from it, rather the dates and deadline we show to you is part of the program we have in place which we are now asking you to become part of. No matter how much companies covet your skill, they cannot keep the offer open forever, that skill or talent is required within a certain project window. That is what deadlines are for, they are not meant to intimidate people, those who have plans they are working with will appreciate deadlines.

Of course i agree some of these boys should have been approached earlier, but then i look at what Tomori did to Canada, and Declan Rice to Ireland, this approach does not carry any guarantee either. So yes we need to take on aggressive manner that says we need answers as soon as possible as we do not have the luxury. The truth is we do not! These folks will not choose us if they an the other option open , so we are left with either accepting that we are second best when it comes to their decision making or simply tell them to shove it we wont settle for second best. I will go with the second option, i believe in pampering players, i believe in respecting players, but i do not , i repeat i do not believe in begging a player to put on a jersey. You see as someone who has played this game, the player who gives you the best are the ones decided to do it from their own free will. They will die for you. The ones you beg, you must always find a way to keep begging or keeping them happy.

So when you approach these folks we must do so with confidence, with pride and with dignity. We know what we are , we know what we are offering and we know we have a stake in them that is almost spiritual and ancestral, when we show up at your doorstep we are asking you to become part of our national aspiration. If at the age of 22, you have never felt that inspiration, if you have never considered it or felt a connection , Jesus who are the fools who approached such a player?

On the issue of players approaching us, my answer is still a no, it is clubs or national teams that approach players. You dont need to approach us, if you plan to play for Nigeria, go ahead grab yourself a Nigerian passport and proudly let the whole world know you cherish your Nigerian roots, then go back to your club and play yourself into reckoning like every other player seeking to represent their countries and are awaiting an international call. Just because you are born abroad and play abroad does not give you automatic call, rather If we deem you good enough for us we will call you!


pajimoh wrote:
Again, I understand your frustration and this boils down to lack of strategy from the NFF.
You approach someone to play for you or possibly change nationality from the country they represented in their youth.
To some of this guys, the first time they'll be having contact with NFF is to request their services.
They've never had a call to say "Hello, we are the NFF. We know you're a Nigerian and we are wishing and praying for you. We'll keep in touch to see how you're doing....". Probably not one contact, ever.
Then compare it with the interactions they've had with their current country of abode. They've been approached before to play for the junior teams. They've gone to their practice based. They've had the mementos of their call-up sent to them with caps and all, proudly hanging on their mantle piece.
Then you expect the NFF to waltz in and say "we want you to play for us, this is our offer. Take it or leave it".
This approach is not a request but an ultimatum. You are not putting yourself in their shoes.

I admit Nigeria need to approach things a little better and some of us have been saying, this thing should not be played out in the media. If the player takes it to the media then you know he's playing you. Some players have joined the SE without some of us knowing they are even on the radar.
The NFF can also wait for players to approach them. At least we know those are likely to be ready. But most here would also argue if they are chasing us then they are no good.
There just has to be some guidelines from the NFF without the ultimatum or the "shame" of feeling being played.



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:18 pm 
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The Englishman's post is still on Eagles Nest, as some natives hope that the Englishman will have a late change of heart and grace them with his representation :lol: what a shame!

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Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:29 pm 
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danfo driver wrote:
The Englishman's post is still on Eagles Nest, as some natives hope that the Englishman will have a late change of heart and grace them with his representation :lol: what a shame!

:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:01 am 
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oloye wrote:
The real point here is, if Tammy had not started scoring goals , if he was struggling like the season initially suggested, would England have invited him, would he have gone with England or continue to give us the impression he wants to play for us? That is the playing part, that is the part i have problem with. If he was still struggling with Chelsea and probably cast aside after being humiliated by the fans of the country he now says he is proud to play for, he would probably be on the plane heading to Singapore, and would be grabbing the NFF logo saying he loves Nigeria. Now let me push it further, if you can feel proud to play for a country that hurl sickening, racial insults at you because you missed goals or penalties, then such should be able to play for a country like Nigeria irrespective of our shortcomings.



If Tammy was struggling in the Championship and did not have the family connection Pinnick would we have cared either?


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:35 am 
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More post about the English International :rotf: England plays Czech and Bulgaria..I will help una open game thread

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:35 am 
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Bigpokey24 wrote:
More post about the English International :rotf: England plays Czech and Bulgaria..I will help una open game thread


Abeg open game thread so we can follow the English game, abeg! Under the rules laid out by the commonwealth of nations, we must keep tabs on our colonial massas. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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metalalloy wrote:
Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:33 am 
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kalani JR wrote:
oloye wrote:
The real point here is, if Tammy had not started scoring goals , if he was struggling like the season initially suggested, would England have invited him, would he have gone with England or continue to give us the impression he wants to play for us? That is the playing part, that is the part i have problem with. If he was still struggling with Chelsea and probably cast aside after being humiliated by the fans of the country he now says he is proud to play for, he would probably be on the plane heading to Singapore, and would be grabbing the NFF logo saying he loves Nigeria. Now let me push it further, if you can feel proud to play for a country that hurl sickening, racial insults at you because you missed goals or penalties, then such should be able to play for a country like Nigeria irrespective of our shortcomings.



If Tammy was struggling in the Championship and did not have the family connection Pinnick would we have cared either?

Sometimes I think it is best not to comment than proceed to make silly comments. We were chasing Tammy regardless, he started looking in our direction when it appeared he was not going anywhere and everyone started singing praise the Lord. So I don't know where this analogy of yours is coming from. We were ready to cap anyone just because they were born abroad. And pray why would we want someone with no connection to play for us? What manner of shallow reasoning is this.. When he was struggling at Swansea we wanted him still.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:53 pm 
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oloye wrote:
kalani JR wrote:
If Tammy was struggling in the Championship and did not have the family connection Pinnick would we have cared either?

Sometimes I think it is best not to comment than proceed to make silly comments. We were chasing Tammy regardless, he started looking in our direction when it appeared he was not going anywhere and everyone started singing praise the Lord. So I don't know where this analogy of yours is coming from. We were ready to cap anyone just because they were born abroad. And pray why would we want someone with no connection to play for us? What manner of shallow reasoning is this.. When he was struggling at Swansea we wanted him still.


I actually agree with "kalani JR" who I believe was making a wider point about the right people have to choose what is best for themselves or the organisation they represent.

NFF is not chasing Adebayo Akinfeyinwa to cap him because they believe they have better options, Tammy Abrahams has decided England is a better option.

I laugh when I read people say Tammy used "us", England that have Harry Kane are scared of losing someone who would at best be a squad player. Please think about it a bit more.

We are not talking about Ronaldo or Messi here, this is not Catholic Mo Johnston posing in a Celtic shirt only to sign for Rangers. What is this bitterness all about and when is it going to stop?

Can I remind us all that Tammy came through the English system and England should have exclusive or first refusal rights to his services.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:59 pm 
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Aswani wrote:
oloye wrote:
kalani JR wrote:
If Tammy was struggling in the Championship and did not have the family connection Pinnick would we have cared either?

Sometimes I think it is best not to comment than proceed to make silly comments. We were chasing Tammy regardless, he started looking in our direction when it appeared he was not going anywhere and everyone started singing praise the Lord. So I don't know where this analogy of yours is coming from. We were ready to cap anyone just because they were born abroad. And pray why would we want someone with no connection to play for us? What manner of shallow reasoning is this.. When he was struggling at Swansea we wanted him still.


I actually agree with "kalani JR" who I believe was making a wider point about the right people have to choose what is best for themselves or the organisation they represent.

NFF is not chasing Adebayo Akinfeyinwa to cap him because they believe they have better options, Tammy Abrahams has decided England is a better option.

I laugh when I read people say Tammy used "us", England that have Harry Kane are scared of losing someone who would at best be a squad player. Please think about it a bit more.

We are not talking about Ronaldo or Messi here, this is not Catholic Mo Johnston posing in a Celtic shirt only to sign for Rangers. What is this bitterness all about and when is it going to stop?

Can I remind us all that Tammy came through the English system and England should have exclusive or first refusal rights to his services.

Another goose chase here, the NFF now was not there when Akinfenwa was much younger, we did not have the aggressive policy which Pinic has now. Now let me even indulge this non argument. We were chasing Tammy when he was doing it in the Nationwide and when he was still struggling with Swansea. As soon as we heard he belonged to Chelsea we were not bothered, we simply wanted him. England wanted him strictly on performance and after his stinct with Swansea did not go well they pushed him aside. If he had not started this season we'll, England would not have capped him, but we were working behind the scenes even without the goals to cap him.

As for Akinfenwa, I can assure that if he was younger and playing now, we probably would be chasing him,l. We capped Aina when he was in the championship before he went on laon and permanently to Italy, so I really don't understand what Kalani was yearning about.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:09 pm 
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:lol: :lol: this is so funny , people writing essays about the English international, bobo is currently with the likes of Kane, Sterling etc at the FA house getting ready for their midweek games, people here dey write essays , when our own SE dey play this weekend kai :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: look at the clueless JOhn Pajimoh Barnes writing essays

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:14 pm 
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oloye wrote:
Aswani wrote:
oloye wrote:
kalani JR wrote:
If Tammy was struggling in the Championship and did not have the family connection Pinnick would we have cared either?

Sometimes I think it is best not to comment than proceed to make silly comments. We were chasing Tammy regardless, he started looking in our direction when it appeared he was not going anywhere and everyone started singing praise the Lord. So I don't know where this analogy of yours is coming from. We were ready to cap anyone just because they were born abroad. And pray why would we want someone with no connection to play for us? What manner of shallow reasoning is this.. When he was struggling at Swansea we wanted him still.


I actually agree with "kalani JR" who I believe was making a wider point about the right people have to choose what is best for themselves or the organisation they represent.

NFF is not chasing Adebayo Akinfeyinwa to cap him because they believe they have better options, Tammy Abrahams has decided England is a better option.

I laugh when I read people say Tammy used "us", England that have Harry Kane are scared of losing someone who would at best be a squad player. Please think about it a bit more.

We are not talking about Ronaldo or Messi here, this is not Catholic Mo Johnston posing in a Celtic shirt only to sign for Rangers. What is this bitterness all about and when is it going to stop?

Can I remind us all that Tammy came through the English system and England should have exclusive or first refusal rights to his services.

Another goose chase here, the NFF now was not there when Akinfenwa was much younger, we did not have the aggressive policy which Pinic has now. Now let me even indulge this non argument. We were chasing Tammy when he was doing it in the Nationwide and when he was still struggling with Swansea. As soon as we heard he belonged to Chelsea we were not bothered, we simply wanted him. England wanted him strictly on performance and after his stinct with Swansea did not go well they pushed him aside. If he had not started this season we'll, England would not have capped him, but we were working behind the scenes even without the goals to cap him.

As for Akinfenwa, I can assure that if he was younger and playing now, we probably would be chasing him,l. We capped Aina when he was in the championship before he went on laon and permanently to Italy, so I really don't understand what Kalani was yearning about.


Everybody is capped on performance you're saying this like it's a bad thing. So what if England didn't want to call up an underperforming player in lieu of one that was in good form - this is ignoring that they capped him after his season at Bristol - that's what you do. We do the same, there are hundreds of Nigerians of mixed nationalities playing football right now, why haven't we invited them? Answer, because we haven't deemed them as good enough. We can cut the bullshit about our desire for Tammy to play for us is based on more altruistic intentions, it's not. It was largely based on Pinnick's ego and that he appeared to be a budding superstar.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:42 pm 
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oloye wrote:
kalani JR wrote:
oloye wrote:
The real point here is, if Tammy had not started scoring goals , if he was struggling like the season initially suggested, would England have invited him, would he have gone with England or continue to give us the impression he wants to play for us? That is the playing part, that is the part i have problem with. If he was still struggling with Chelsea and probably cast aside after being humiliated by the fans of the country he now says he is proud to play for, he would probably be on the plane heading to Singapore, and would be grabbing the NFF logo saying he loves Nigeria. Now let me push it further, if you can feel proud to play for a country that hurl sickening, racial insults at you because you missed goals or penalties, then such should be able to play for a country like Nigeria irrespective of our shortcomings.



If Tammy was struggling in the Championship and did not have the family connection Pinnick would we have cared either?

Sometimes I think it is best not to comment than proceed to make silly comments. We were chasing Tammy regardless, he started looking in our direction when it appeared he was not going anywhere and everyone started singing praise the Lord. So I don't know where this analogy of yours is coming from. We were ready to cap anyone just because they were born abroad. And pray why would we want someone with no connection to play for us? What manner of shallow reasoning is this.. When he was struggling at Swansea we wanted him still.

Oloye, this is not true. See this thread below where I was talking about Tomori. There is one degree of seperation between myself and his family and at that time, I can authoritatively confirm with firsthand info that no approach had been made by the NFF. Read this especially my exchanges with Wanajo and to a lesser extent Emir Kongi. This was in 2016. Bottom line is we are only after them now because of where they've reached. Lets stop pretending like we want them for anything other than to play football in the GWG.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=271775&hilit=tomori&start=23

We're the ones demeaning ourselves refusing to respect one another as Nigerians and speaking of these guys like they're aliens. If you have pride in being a Nigerian, you should be also prideful enough to respect the decisions of another Nigerian. Nobody played us, you guys are just bitter you weren't chosen. And it's a Nigerian thing, because we weren't bitter about the likes of Zidane, Patrick Vieira, Kluivert, Makalele etc. that did the same thing Tammy did.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:24 pm 
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kalani JR wrote:
oloye wrote:
Aswani wrote:
oloye wrote:
kalani JR wrote:
If Tammy was struggling in the Championship and did not have the family connection Pinnick would we have cared either?

Sometimes I think it is best not to comment than proceed to make silly comments. We were chasing Tammy regardless, he started looking in our direction when it appeared he was not going anywhere and everyone started singing praise the Lord. So I don't know where this analogy of yours is coming from. We were ready to cap anyone just because they were born abroad. And pray why would we want someone with no connection to play for us? What manner of shallow reasoning is this.. When he was struggling at Swansea we wanted him still.


I actually agree with "kalani JR" who I believe was making a wider point about the right people have to choose what is best for themselves or the organisation they represent.

NFF is not chasing Adebayo Akinfeyinwa to cap him because they believe they have better options, Tammy Abrahams has decided England is a better option.

I laugh when I read people say Tammy used "us", England that have Harry Kane are scared of losing someone who would at best be a squad player. Please think about it a bit more.

We are not talking about Ronaldo or Messi here, this is not Catholic Mo Johnston posing in a Celtic shirt only to sign for Rangers. What is this bitterness all about and when is it going to stop?

Can I remind us all that Tammy came through the English system and England should have exclusive or first refusal rights to his services.

Another goose chase here, the NFF now was not there when Akinfenwa was much younger, we did not have the aggressive policy which Pinic has now. Now let me even indulge this non argument. We were chasing Tammy when he was doing it in the Nationwide and when he was still struggling with Swansea. As soon as we heard he belonged to Chelsea we were not bothered, we simply wanted him. England wanted him strictly on performance and after his stinct with Swansea did not go well they pushed him aside. If he had not started this season we'll, England would not have capped him, but we were working behind the scenes even without the goals to cap him.

As for Akinfenwa, I can assure that if he was younger and playing now, we probably would be chasing him,l. We capped Aina when he was in the championship before he went on laon and permanently to Italy, so I really don't understand what Kalani was yearning about.


Everybody is capped on performance you're saying this like it's a bad thing. So what if England didn't want to call up an underperforming player in lieu of one that was in good form - this is ignoring that they capped him after his season at Bristol - that's what you do. We do the same, there are hundreds of Nigerians of mixed nationalities playing football right now, why haven't we invited them? Answer, because we haven't deemed them as good enough. We can cut the bullshit about our desire for Tammy to play for us is based on more altruistic intentions, it's not. It was largely based on Pinnick's ego and that he appeared to be a budding superstar.

Dude stay on one line of argument please I beg you. :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:00 pm 
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danfo driver wrote:
The Englishman's post is still on Eagles Nest, as some natives hope that the Englishman will have a late change of heart and grace them with his representation :lol: what a shame!


It is a post that has to do with allegiance to Nigeria. It is correctly on Eagles Nest.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:37 pm 
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I'm surprised that the mods have allowed the thread of an Englishman to remain on Eagles Nest. Guys, please do the needful and move this thread to World Football. Cheers.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:19 pm 
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green4life wrote:
I'm surprised that the mods have allowed the thread of an Englishman to remain on Eagles Nest. Guys, please do the needful and move this thread to World Football. Cheers.


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Discuss Nigerian related football (soccer) topics here.


Falls into this category, and the current stage of discussion is clearly Nigeria centric.


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