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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2020 4:40 pm 
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fabio wrote:
Damunk wrote:

Prof, with reference to the highlighted which are the key elements of your post....

IF what you say is indeed OFFICIAL POLICY (even if unstated publicly) then you are right in that it is MORALLY NOT RIGHT AND UNJUST.
Again, I reiterate IF it is official policy. :idea:


EnuguII has given facts, empirical evidence etc. The foundation of your reply is IF. Come on, chief!

This is what Pinnick said:

Quote:
Maduwuba, writing in Pulse in 2015, reiterated a speech given by Pinnick to parents of foreign-developed players in England. Maduwuba credited Pinnick with stating that he would rather these players that “have been exposed to the scientific methods of football in terms of coaching style, amenities and equipment as well as discipline in areas of fitness and nutrition” to build a new-look Super Eagles than the hungry local players still scratching the ground.
Come on FABIO!
These are established facts?
Where is the direct Pinnick quote?
Have you seen it?
I searched the net for it and even the 2015 Maduwuba article itself and couldn't find either. (Maduwuba has several articles he wrote for PULSE, including in 2015, but that particular one I couldn't find)

Maybe you'll have better luck but before you swallow the quote as established fact, surely you'd be expected to do a little more digging rather than accepting it simply because it fits your narrative.

As for facts, it would be very useful if the records of Nigeria's top five or even top three coaches could be compared.
I've posted Rohr's and Keshi's elsewhere.
Westerhoff's unfortunately aren't eadily available online and I can't male sense of the records shown here.
Amodu's too would be nice.

So maybe, as a lover of facts, you might oblige? :taunt:

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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2020 4:56 pm 
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Damunk wrote:

Come on FABIO!
These are established facts?
Where is the direct Pinnick quote?
Have you seen it?
I searched the net for it and even the 2015 Maduwuba article itself and couldn't find either. (Maduwuba has several articles he wrote for PULSE, including in 2015, but that particular one I couldn't find)

Maybe you'll have better luck but before you swallow the quote as established fact, surely you'd be expected to do a little more digging rather than accepting it simply because it fits your narrative.

As for facts, it would be very useful if the records of Nigeria's top five or even top three coaches could be compared.
I've posted Rohr's and Keshi's elsewhere.
Westerhoff's unfortunately isn't available anywhere online.
Amodu's too would be nice.

So maybe, as a lover of facts, you might oblige? :taunt:

Damunk, I am in the process of updating my special software for finding the facts you wrote.

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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2020 5:24 pm 
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Damunk wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Damunk wrote:
So again, Prof...the key question is who and where are these local players being sidetracked in pursuit of FB players?
The pursuit of FB players is a symptom of a serious problem, not the cause.

It is like complaining that we are not treating COVID19 with dogonyaro or agbo, but instead prefer antibiotics, pain killers, cough syrup, oxygen and ventilators.

None of these have any bearing on the CV itself but keep us alive, fit and (in this case) even stronger while we attempt to fix the causative agent of the disease.

We still have to compete on the world stage and Nigerian fans are no longer willing to wait for Nigeria to fix its myriad problems before we turn to football.

Damunk,

The point you miss here is that the current situation is a solution designed strategically by Pinnick to solve a "problem" that he has assumed exists. Pinnick came into this expressing pride in flying each weekend to watch EPL. For him EPL became the standard of football and drives what he does. Among his first move was to organize a training session of England-born Nigerian youths in London during a weekend that a Nigerian international did not take place. He informed the media immediately that his intent was to have those players form the Nigerian national team under his leadership. For him this was the way to improved the national team and perhaps win laurels. I hope you remember the above?

It is that very strategy that guides the selection of players to the Super Eagles today and has trickled down to age teams as we saw at the U17 level. This isn't happenstance. Tis is a STRATEGY. Make no mistake about it. The fact that home based players are ignored is a strategy not happenstance. This is why Adelakun's revelations (inspite of his failed attempt to call it back by wordsmithing, in my view, is HUGE. Adelakun admitted that ignoring local guys was because there was no data to access them and not necessarily that they are not good. This explains the call up of a third division goalkeeper ahead of tons of goalkeepers playing at the top level in Nigeria. Nigeria has admitted to investing in training this keeper who;e he is in the national team he way resources were spent training Uzoho at the national team level. Bear in mind that we are talking about the national team here. None of this extra training session was offered to the likes of Ezenwa by the way. This is not conjecture. It is happening right before all of us.

Now, should Nigeria ignore these foreign-based talents? Not at all. They are Nigerians and should be called up except, of course, the discriminate decision on the goalkeeping position. What I rail about is the obvious discriminotary act against Nigerians simply because they are based in Nigeria. That is not acceptable and should never be acceptable.

Damunk, if you look you will notice the gradual change in the composition of Nigeria's national teams. Pinnick has staked on this. The test is whether his goal can be achieved by this obvious strategic decision. That goal is to consistently dominate Africa and do much better than we have ever done at the World Cup. If he achieves it then power to him. Although, his strategic design has not become fully implemented the results on the field, this far, have not borne out his optimism.

You do not have to wait for an express statement by Pinnick to know what is happening. Several years ago I blew the lid on the listing of five players that the NFA had blacklisted for the World Cup under Onigbinde. I did not wait for an official NFF statement to make that call but the signs were there and if you can put 2+2 together it would be obvious. Later, that revelation became clear when Taribo West had to apologize before he became one of the first five to be recalled. I am now blowing the lid on a design that is quite clear only if you are willing to look and put 2+2 together. The question is whether such a policy is right, moral, and just.
Prof, with reference to the highlighted which are the key elements of your post....

IF what you say is indeed OFFICIAL POLICY (even if unstated publicly) then you are right in that it is MORALLY NOT RIGHT AND UNJUST.
Again, I reiterate IF it is official policy. :idea:

I am not convinced however that it is the case.
I still believe the policy is for the best man to get the role, regardless of where he was born or plies his trade. Unfortunately, I believe our league is weak at the moment and it is not producing the quality of players that can displace other Nigerians from the world's top leagues.

Its a chicken and egg situation:
Is it the poor league that is driving the NFF to seek better players abroad or is it players abroad that are driving the NFF to ignore the locals?

The NFF has the absolute responsibility of developing our leagues and the huge problems we as a country face aren't helping matters. I listened to Shehu Dikko the other day speaking extensively on the NFF plans for sourcing and injecting funds and know-how into developing our league the right way, and unless you are saying Pinnick runs a one-man dictatorship, it is wrong to assume that the rest of those responsible for developing and running our football are docile and clueless. Pinnick alone cannot dictate policy and Shehu for one isn't on the same page with him if that is indeed OFFICIAL policy as you suggest.

I implore you to listen to the Shehu Dikko interview here. The issue of Arsenal and ManU fans within the NFF even came up at one point, but i won't reveal Shehu's response because I want you and several others to watch it. :D

The GK position is a pretty unique one and cannot be held up as representative.
Ezenwa and Akpeyi have been loyally stuck by, even to the consternation of Nigerians. One might argue that there are 'other' 'keepers somewhere in the league but who are they and where are they> Afikolahi didn't impress and I believe Femi Thomas has also had a shot. Moreover, our CHAN and WAFU 'keepers have not been able to displace Ezenwa even with our local coaches.
Uzoho and Okoye are the future - according to Rohr - and like you said, if he turns out to be right, it'd be pure genius. If not, he (or they) will 'fall on their sword' and die by their decision.

I, like many fans (I'd argue the majority of Nigerian fans), need a lot more convincing before we follow your line of argument. It does not make us right and you wrong, but the inherent weakness in your argument is that you have repeatedly failed to show evidence that the wrong choice of players is being made due to "discrimination".

What we can all agree on, is that the NPFL needs a whole new injection of funds and management.
Maybe then it will start to produce SE-ready players. But like they say, "Antelope meat is sweet, by while it is cooking, what shall we eat?"

For now, we are harvesting a large amount of foreign-born Nigerians.
We hope the Nigerian-bred antelope meat is cooked and ready soon.


Damunk,

I do think that was we are seeing is not based on simply the focus on best available players but it is based on a clearly designed plan. In my view there are numerous signs that point to why this is a clear plan. I have only mentioned just a few.

Pinnick visited Washington DC in his early days as NFF Chair when Oliseh had been appointed. I was one of the few that was at that meeting with him. I believe Cellular may have been there but I am not exactly sure. At that meeting he raved about his plans including having a foreign coach. He clearly believed that only such a coach would move Nigerian football forward. He noted that he had be convinced by the NFF First VP to consider Oliseh. Oliseh clearly was not Pinnick' choice. I have talked to someone clto Pinnick. Pinnick is a man who furnished his home by importing furniture from overseas because of his mindset that only things from overseas are good. This is his view about football, his support for Arsenal, and much more. This current move is not by happenstance. It is by design. You indicate how come he has such powers. While others resist they have to do so clandestinely. The fact is he can railroad any person who openly resists.You talk about Shehu Dikko. Have you forgotten what happened to Dikko in the election that brought Pinnick to the NFF Presidency.

While I do not want to extend the focus of this debate please be aware that the change in CAF trajectory to accommodate UEFA is not by happenstance either. It is a move engineer by the pro-Euro group that came to power after the defeat of Hayatou. One of the leaders of that group is Pinnick. The fact that the group has splintered over other minor matters since then notwithstanding.

The bottomline is that there is more than meets the eye, my brother.

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The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2020 6:14 pm 
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fabio wrote:
Damunk wrote:

Come on FABIO!
These are established facts?
Where is the direct Pinnick quote?
Have you seen it?
I searched the net for it and even the 2015 Maduwuba article itself and couldn't find either. (Maduwuba has several articles he wrote for PULSE, including in 2015, but that particular one I couldn't find)

Maybe you'll have better luck but before you swallow the quote as established fact, surely you'd be expected to do a little more digging rather than accepting it simply because it fits your narrative.

As for facts, it would be very useful if the records of Nigeria's top five or even top three coaches could be compared.
I've posted Rohr's and Keshi's elsewhere.
Westerhoff's unfortunately isn't available anywhere online.
Amodu's too would be nice.

So maybe, as a lover of facts, you might oblige? :taunt:

Damunk, I am in the process of updating my special software for finding the facts you wrote.
Update well o, because as I dey see am so, you will not find anything to support your case. :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2020 6:15 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:

Damunk,

I do think that was we are seeing is not based on simply the focus on best available players but it is based on a clearly designed plan. In my view there are numerous signs that point to why this is a clear plan. I have only mentioned just a few.

Pinnick visited Washington DC in his early days as NFF Chair when Oliseh had been appointed. I was one of the few that was at that meeting with him. I believe Cellular may have been there but I am not exactly sure. At that meeting he raved about his plans including having a foreign coach. He clearly believed that only such a coach would move Nigerian football forward. He noted that he had be convinced by the NFF First VP to consider Oliseh. Oliseh clearly was not Pinnick' choice. I have talked to someone clto Pinnick. Pinnick is a man who furnished his home by importing furniture from overseas because of his mindset that only things from overseas are good. This is his view about football, his support for Arsenal, and much more. This current move is not by happenstance. It is by design. You indicate how come he has such powers. While others resist they have to do so clandestinely. The fact is he can railroad any person who openly resists.You talk about Shehu Dikko. Have you forgotten what happened to Dikko in the election that brought Pinnick to the NFF Presidency.

While I do not want to extend the focus of this debate please be aware that the change in CAF trajectory to accommodate UEFA is not by happenstance either. It is a move engineer by the pro-Euro group that came to power after the defeat of Hayatou. One of the leaders of that group is Pinnick. The fact that the group has splintered over other minor matters since then notwithstanding.

The bottomline is that there is more than meets the eye, my brother.


Uncle Damunk, you know sey i be don tell you since long time Imo River sey in Lord Pinnick of Arsenal world, every good and perfect thing comes from abroad.

Do you still need more evidence. My guy chop rice, let stone!

What is the proverb that we elders say :taunt: the thing fabio can see sitting down, Damunk can´t see standing at the top of the tallest iroko tree :D :D

Just to add pepper to the story, Lord Pinnick of Arsenal na season ticket holder for Arsenal. Not sure, if him still dey do his fortnightly trip to watch his darling Arsenal. Do you remember this:

Quote:
The Nigeria Football Federation (NFF) president Amaju Pinnick has hit back at critics who attacked him for choosing to travel to England to watch the Community Shield game between Arsenal and Chelsea even when various national teams were involved in crucial Rio 2016 Olympic qualifiers.

Pinnick, who has not hidden his love for London club Arsenal, has been hugely criticised by football fans that he abandoned the country’s teams to watch Arsenal battle Chelsea.

The NFF president was spotted at the Wembley for the Community Shield on a day two of Nigeria’s teams were in action.

https://africanfootball.com/news/556212 ... ng-Arsenal

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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2020 6:26 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
Damunk,

I do think that was we are seeing is not based on simply the focus on best available players but it is based on a clearly designed plan. In my view there are numerous signs that point to why this is a clear plan. I have only mentioned just a few.

Pinnick visited Washington DC in his early days as NFF Chair when Oliseh had been appointed. I was one of the few that was at that meeting with him. I believe Cellular may have been there but I am not exactly sure. At that meeting he raved about his plans including having a foreign coach. He clearly believed that only such a coach would move Nigerian football forward. He noted that he had be convinced by the NFF First VP to consider Oliseh. Oliseh clearly was not Pinnick' choice. I have talked to someone clto Pinnick. Pinnick is a man who furnished his home by importing furniture from overseas because of his mindset that only things from overseas are good. This is his view about football, his support for Arsenal, and much more. This current move is not by happenstance. It is by design. You indicate how come he has such powers. While others resist they have to do so clandestinely. The fact is he can railroad any person who openly resists.You talk about Shehu Dikko. Have you forgotten what happened to Dikko in the election that brought Pinnick to the NFF Presidency.

While I do not want to extend the focus of this debate please be aware that the change in CAF trajectory to accommodate UEFA is not by happenstance either. It is a move engineer by the pro-Euro group that came to power after the defeat of Hayatou. One of the leaders of that group is Pinnick. The fact that the group has splintered over other minor matters since then notwithstanding.

The bottomline is that there is more than meets the eye, my brother.
Okay Prof, I will keep an open mind. Bottom line for me is performance. I have put my faith in local players in the past only to be let down: Egwueke, Chikatara, Oboabona, Odunlami, Success and youth players like Chidera Ezeh , Musa Yahaya and Alampasu. Even now I am hoping for Ozonwafor to excel and claim a place in our defence.
So it is not as if I have a preference for FB.

But if there is more to all this than meets the eye as you say, I am ready to siddon look for now.

May the best player win is all I and millions of Nigerians want. :thumb:

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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2020 6:37 pm 
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Damunk,

We are possibly with the same view. For me, I have little doubt that a larger number of very good Nigerian players, at the senior level, are based outside the country. However, I believe that as long as as form changes and births are given, there will be a talent or two still coming up in Nigeria. I do jot want this group ignored because of a selective and essentially discriminatory policy enthroned by an NFF official or two. That is what I rail against.

I went back and reviewed statements made by Pinnick and other officials, including the recent one made by Adelakun and putting these things together it is becoming quite vivid that what is now occurring is not by happenstance but an actual plan. I ask is it a crime to be a Nigerian and living in your own country? That is what riles me.

Damunk wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Damunk,

I do think that was we are seeing is not based on simply the focus on best available players but it is based on a clearly designed plan. In my view there are numerous signs that point to why this is a clear plan. I have only mentioned just a few.

Pinnick visited Washington DC in his early days as NFF Chair when Oliseh had been appointed. I was one of the few that was at that meeting with him. I believe Cellular may have been there but I am not exactly sure. At that meeting he raved about his plans including having a foreign coach. He clearly believed that only such a coach would move Nigerian football forward. He noted that he had be convinced by the NFF First VP to consider Oliseh. Oliseh clearly was not Pinnick' choice. I have talked to someone clto Pinnick. Pinnick is a man who furnished his home by importing furniture from overseas because of his mindset that only things from overseas are good. This is his view about football, his support for Arsenal, and much more. This current move is not by happenstance. It is by design. You indicate how come he has such powers. While others resist they have to do so clandestinely. The fact is he can railroad any person who openly resists.You talk about Shehu Dikko. Have you forgotten what happened to Dikko in the election that brought Pinnick to the NFF Presidency.

While I do not want to extend the focus of this debate please be aware that the change in CAF trajectory to accommodate UEFA is not by happenstance either. It is a move engineer by the pro-Euro group that came to power after the defeat of Hayatou. One of the leaders of that group is Pinnick. The fact that the group has splintered over other minor matters since then notwithstanding.

The bottomline is that there is more than meets the eye, my brother.
Okay Prof, I will keep an open mind. Bottom line for me is performance. I have put my faith in local players in the past only to be let down: Egwueke, Chikatara, Oboabona, Odunlami, Success and youth players like Chidera Ezeh , Musa Yahaya and Alampasu. Even now I am hoping for Ozonwafor to excel and claim a place in our defence.
So it is not as if I have a preference for FB.

But if there is more to all this than meets the eye as you say, I am ready to siddon look for now.

May the best player win is all I and millions of Nigerians want. :thumb:

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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 12:45 am 
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...if only Nigerian federal government will do as the Nigeria FA, recruit foreign born and foreign trained Nigerians to run the country, may be Nigeria will be at a better trajectory in growth and development.


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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 9:41 am 
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mcal wrote:
...if only Nigerian federal government will do as the Nigeria FA, recruit foreign born and foreign trained Nigerians to run the country, may be Nigeria will be at a better trajectory in growth and development.

I agree with you totally!

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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 7:53 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
Damunk wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Damunk wrote:
So again, Prof...the key question is who and where are these local players being sidetracked in pursuit of FB players?
The pursuit of FB players is a symptom of a serious problem, not the cause.

It is like complaining that we are not treating COVID19 with dogonyaro or agbo, but instead prefer antibiotics, pain killers, cough syrup, oxygen and ventilators.

None of these have any bearing on the CV itself but keep us alive, fit and (in this case) even stronger while we attempt to fix the causative agent of the disease.

We still have to compete on the world stage and Nigerian fans are no longer willing to wait for Nigeria to fix its myriad problems before we turn to football.

Damunk,

The point you miss here is that the current situation is a solution designed strategically by Pinnick to solve a "problem" that he has assumed exists. Pinnick came into this expressing pride in flying each weekend to watch EPL. For him EPL became the standard of football and drives what he does. Among his first move was to organize a training session of England-born Nigerian youths in London during a weekend that a Nigerian international did not take place. He informed the media immediately that his intent was to have those players form the Nigerian national team under his leadership. For him this was the way to improved the national team and perhaps win laurels. I hope you remember the above?

It is that very strategy that guides the selection of players to the Super Eagles today and has trickled down to age teams as we saw at the U17 level. This isn't happenstance. Tis is a STRATEGY. Make no mistake about it. The fact that home based players are ignored is a strategy not happenstance. This is why Adelakun's revelations (inspite of his failed attempt to call it back by wordsmithing, in my view, is HUGE. Adelakun admitted that ignoring local guys was because there was no data to access them and not necessarily that they are not good. This explains the call up of a third division goalkeeper ahead of tons of goalkeepers playing at the top level in Nigeria. Nigeria has admitted to investing in training this keeper who;e he is in the national team he way resources were spent training Uzoho at the national team level. Bear in mind that we are talking about the national team here. None of this extra training session was offered to the likes of Ezenwa by the way. This is not conjecture. It is happening right before all of us.

Now, should Nigeria ignore these foreign-based talents? Not at all. They are Nigerians and should be called up except, of course, the discriminate decision on the goalkeeping position. What I rail about is the obvious discriminotary act against Nigerians simply because they are based in Nigeria. That is not acceptable and should never be acceptable.

Damunk, if you look you will notice the gradual change in the composition of Nigeria's national teams. Pinnick has staked on this. The test is whether his goal can be achieved by this obvious strategic decision. That goal is to consistently dominate Africa and do much better than we have ever done at the World Cup. If he achieves it then power to him. Although, his strategic design has not become fully implemented the results on the field, this far, have not borne out his optimism.

You do not have to wait for an express statement by Pinnick to know what is happening. Several years ago I blew the lid on the listing of five players that the NFA had blacklisted for the World Cup under Onigbinde. I did not wait for an official NFF statement to make that call but the signs were there and if you can put 2+2 together it would be obvious. Later, that revelation became clear when Taribo West had to apologize before he became one of the first five to be recalled. I am now blowing the lid on a design that is quite clear only if you are willing to look and put 2+2 together. The question is whether such a policy is right, moral, and just.
Prof, with reference to the highlighted which are the key elements of your post....

IF what you say is indeed OFFICIAL POLICY (even if unstated publicly) then you are right in that it is MORALLY NOT RIGHT AND UNJUST.
Again, I reiterate IF it is official policy. :idea:

I am not convinced however that it is the case.
I still believe the policy is for the best man to get the role, regardless of where he was born or plies his trade. Unfortunately, I believe our league is weak at the moment and it is not producing the quality of players that can displace other Nigerians from the world's top leagues.

Its a chicken and egg situation:
Is it the poor league that is driving the NFF to seek better players abroad or is it players abroad that are driving the NFF to ignore the locals?

The NFF has the absolute responsibility of developing our leagues and the huge problems we as a country face aren't helping matters. I listened to Shehu Dikko the other day speaking extensively on the NFF plans for sourcing and injecting funds and know-how into developing our league the right way, and unless you are saying Pinnick runs a one-man dictatorship, it is wrong to assume that the rest of those responsible for developing and running our football are docile and clueless. Pinnick alone cannot dictate policy and Shehu for one isn't on the same page with him if that is indeed OFFICIAL policy as you suggest.

I implore you to listen to the Shehu Dikko interview here. The issue of Arsenal and ManU fans within the NFF even came up at one point, but i won't reveal Shehu's response because I want you and several others to watch it. :D

The GK position is a pretty unique one and cannot be held up as representative.
Ezenwa and Akpeyi have been loyally stuck by, even to the consternation of Nigerians. One might argue that there are 'other' 'keepers somewhere in the league but who are they and where are they> Afikolahi didn't impress and I believe Femi Thomas has also had a shot. Moreover, our CHAN and WAFU 'keepers have not been able to displace Ezenwa even with our local coaches.
Uzoho and Okoye are the future - according to Rohr - and like you said, if he turns out to be right, it'd be pure genius. If not, he (or they) will 'fall on their sword' and die by their decision.

I, like many fans (I'd argue the majority of Nigerian fans), need a lot more convincing before we follow your line of argument. It does not make us right and you wrong, but the inherent weakness in your argument is that you have repeatedly failed to show evidence that the wrong choice of players is being made due to "discrimination".

What we can all agree on, is that the NPFL needs a whole new injection of funds and management.
Maybe then it will start to produce SE-ready players. But like they say, "Antelope meat is sweet, by while it is cooking, what shall we eat?"

For now, we are harvesting a large amount of foreign-born Nigerians.
We hope the Nigerian-bred antelope meat is cooked and ready soon.


Damunk,

I do think that was we are seeing is not based on simply the focus on best available players but it is based on a clearly designed plan. In my view there are numerous signs that point to why this is a clear plan. I have only mentioned just a few.

Pinnick visited Washington DC in his early days as NFF Chair when Oliseh had been appointed. I was one of the few that was at that meeting with him. I believe Cellular may have been there but I am not exactly sure. At that meeting he raved about his plans including having a foreign coach. He clearly believed that only such a coach would move Nigerian football forward. He noted that he had be convinced by the NFF First VP to consider Oliseh. Oliseh clearly was not Pinnick' choice. I have talked to someone clto Pinnick. Pinnick is a man who furnished his home by importing furniture from overseas because of his mindset that only things from overseas are good. This is his view about football, his support for Arsenal, and much more. This current move is not by happenstance. It is by design. You indicate how come he has such powers. While others resist they have to do so clandestinely. The fact is he can railroad any person who openly resists.You talk about Shehu Dikko. Have you forgotten what happened to Dikko in the election that brought Pinnick to the NFF Presidency.

While I do not want to extend the focus of this debate please be aware that the change in CAF trajectory to accommodate UEFA is not by happenstance either. It is a move engineer by the pro-Euro group that came to power after the defeat of Hayatou. One of the leaders of that group is Pinnick. The fact that the group has splintered over other minor matters since then notwithstanding.

The bottomline is that there is more than meets the eye, my brother.


Yes Prof, I was there. Also had a private audience with him.
Pinnick is extremely pro-foreign. We had an extensive conversation regarding Oliseh and he was basically that if/when Oliseh fails that will be it for him with trying local coaches. To his credit, he gave Siasia a chance in the interim and Siasia messed it up by doing the exact thing Pinnick was afraid local coaches do... coach and choose squads based on sentiments. The thing I appreciate with Pinnick was that when I was telling him and arguing he was like, "bros, come home first and see for yourself".

He is not a fan of local players because he knows all too well that the system and environment are corrupt... he doesn't want investing time and resources in depreciating assets. And I am talking about the "Age Controversy". The separation of the roles of NFF and the LMC kind of absolves him of doing anything to help market the league and the players from the league. The league is so corrupt that they won't even promote their best players but would promote players they want to market. I think he doesn't want to be dragged into it so he takes the easier approach of going foreign.

So, he does have his reasons.

Do I agree with them? No!

But it is his neck on the line.

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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 9:42 pm 
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Cellular wrote:
Yes Prof, I was there. Also had a private audience with him.
Pinnick is extremely pro-foreign. We had an extensive conversation regarding Oliseh and he was basically that if/when Oliseh fails that will be it for him with trying local coaches. To his credit, he gave Siasia a chance in the interim and Siasia messed it up by doing the exact thing Pinnick was afraid local coaches do... coach and choose squads based on sentiments. The thing I appreciate with Pinnick was that when I was telling him and arguing he was like, "bros, come home first and see for yourself".

He is not a fan of local players because he knows all too well that the system and environment are corrupt... he doesn't want investing time and resources in depreciating assets. And I am talking about the "Age Controversy". The separation of the roles of NFF and the LMC kind of absolves him of doing anything to help market the league and the players from the league. The league is so corrupt that they won't even promote their best players but would promote players they want to market. I think he doesn't want to be dragged into it so he takes the easier approach of going foreign.

So, he does have his reasons.

Do I agree with them? No!

But it is his neck on the line.
Thanks for this Cellular.
It at least sheds some light on his thinking.

His personal flaws and bad optics aside, your account easily suggests he is a man on a mission who is operating on the belief that 'the end justifies the means', as long as it is legal.
In itself not a bad thing, but not everybody's cup of tea.
He knows Nigerians. If he is successful, all this grammar we dey talk will quickly fade away.

Keshi went thru similar, not just from the NFF but from fans themselves, even here on CE

When he won AFCON, nothing else mattered.

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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 11:03 pm 
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I mean, what the F are we calling Billing for? what does he have to do with the Nigeria? Disgusting


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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 11:30 pm 
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chief nfachairman wrote:
I mean, what the F are we calling Billing for? what does he have to do with the Nigeria? Disgusting

The SE is now a world brand, like the title the starter of the thread used, the SE is now of England, Germany, Holland, Belgium, Russia and lately Denmark!

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 12:28 am 
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Damunk wrote:
Cellular wrote:
Yes Prof, I was there. Also had a private audience with him.
Pinnick is extremely pro-foreign. We had an extensive conversation regarding Oliseh and he was basically that if/when Oliseh fails that will be it for him with trying local coaches. To his credit, he gave Siasia a chance in the interim and Siasia messed it up by doing the exact thing Pinnick was afraid local coaches do... coach and choose squads based on sentiments. The thing I appreciate with Pinnick was that when I was telling him and arguing he was like, "bros, come home first and see for yourself".

He is not a fan of local players because he knows all too well that the system and environment are corrupt... he doesn't want investing time and resources in depreciating assets. And I am talking about the "Age Controversy". The separation of the roles of NFF and the LMC kind of absolves him of doing anything to help market the league and the players from the league. The league is so corrupt that they won't even promote their best players but would promote players they want to market. I think he doesn't want to be dragged into it so he takes the easier approach of going foreign.

So, he does have his reasons.

Do I agree with them? No!

But it is his neck on the line.
Thanks for this Cellular.
It at least sheds some light on his thinking.

His personal flaws and bad optics aside, your account easily suggests he is a man on a mission who is operating on the belief that 'the end justifies the means', as long as it is legal.
In itself not a bad thing, but not everybody's cup of tea.
He knows Nigerians. If he is successful, all this grammar we dey talk will quickly fade away.

Keshi went thru similar, not just from the NFF but from fans themselves, even here on CE

When he won AFCON, nothing else mattered.


That is his sentiment. At least that was what I gathered.
He believes that if folks want to improve themselves they should find their way overseas and make themselves become in high demand.

Unfortunately, his idea on how to make Naijaria Super Eagles a winning team and a top world team lies with foreign-born players. His colleagues at the LMC are not helping either.

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 12:57 am 
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Cellular wrote:
Damunk wrote:
Cellular wrote:
Yes Prof, I was there. Also had a private audience with him.
Pinnick is extremely pro-foreign. We had an extensive conversation regarding Oliseh and he was basically that if/when Oliseh fails that will be it for him with trying local coaches. To his credit, he gave Siasia a chance in the interim and Siasia messed it up by doing the exact thing Pinnick was afraid local coaches do... coach and choose squads based on sentiments. The thing I appreciate with Pinnick was that when I was telling him and arguing he was like, "bros, come home first and see for yourself".

He is not a fan of local players because he knows all too well that the system and environment are corrupt... he doesn't want investing time and resources in depreciating assets. And I am talking about the "Age Controversy". The separation of the roles of NFF and the LMC kind of absolves him of doing anything to help market the league and the players from the league. The league is so corrupt that they won't even promote their best players but would promote players they want to market. I think he doesn't want to be dragged into it so he takes the easier approach of going foreign.

So, he does have his reasons.

Do I agree with them? No!

But it is his neck on the line.
Thanks for this Cellular.
It at least sheds some light on his thinking.

His personal flaws and bad optics aside, your account easily suggests he is a man on a mission who is operating on the belief that 'the end justifies the means', as long as it is legal.
In itself not a bad thing, but not everybody's cup of tea.
He knows Nigerians. If he is successful, all this grammar we dey talk will quickly fade away.

Keshi went thru similar, not just from the NFF but from fans themselves, even here on CE

When he won AFCON, nothing else mattered.


That is his sentiment. At least that was what I gathered.
He believes that if folks want to improve themselves they should find their way overseas and make themselves become in high demand.

Unfortunately, his idea on how to make Naijaria Super Eagles a winning team and a top world team lies with foreign-born players. His colleagues at the LMC are not helping either.

Thanks for the insight Cell, the man on the ground has first hand information of the situation. We have a league that the best local players bypass to come to Europe. There's a reason why that happens.
The main issue with the local league is not producing players for the SE but finding the right investment in players, coaches and equipment/facilities. When this is done, the issue can be revisited.
At least Pinnick has a plan and I hope it is sustainable.

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 1:40 am 
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Cellular wrote:
Unfortunately, his idea on how to make Naijaria Super Eagles a winning team and a top world team lies with foreign-born players.
Is this borne about by the facts on the ground? Is this "idea" of Pinnick's actually being put into practice to a great extent?

Or put simply, what's the average % of foreign-born players that comprise Nigeria squads?

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 1:41 am 
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Cellular wrote:
Damunk wrote:
Cellular wrote:
Yes Prof, I was there. Also had a private audience with him.
Pinnick is extremely pro-foreign. We had an extensive conversation regarding Oliseh and he was basically that if/when Oliseh fails that will be it for him with trying local coaches. To his credit, he gave Siasia a chance in the interim and Siasia messed it up by doing the exact thing Pinnick was afraid local coaches do... coach and choose squads based on sentiments. The thing I appreciate with Pinnick was that when I was telling him and arguing he was like, "bros, come home first and see for yourself".

He is not a fan of local players because he knows all too well that the system and environment are corrupt... he doesn't want investing time and resources in depreciating assets. And I am talking about the "Age Controversy". The separation of the roles of NFF and the LMC kind of absolves him of doing anything to help market the league and the players from the league. The league is so corrupt that they won't even promote their best players but would promote players they want to market. I think he doesn't want to be dragged into it so he takes the easier approach of going foreign.

So, he does have his reasons.

Do I agree with them? No!

But it is his neck on the line.
Thanks for this Cellular.
It at least sheds some light on his thinking.

His personal flaws and bad optics aside, your account easily suggests he is a man on a mission who is operating on the belief that 'the end justifies the means', as long as it is legal.
In itself not a bad thing, but not everybody's cup of tea.
He knows Nigerians. If he is successful, all this grammar we dey talk will quickly fade away.

Keshi went thru similar, not just from the NFF but from fans themselves, even here on CE

When he won AFCON, nothing else mattered.


That is his sentiment. At least that was what I gathered.
He believes that if folks want to improve themselves they should find their way overseas and make themselves become in high demand.

Unfortunately, his idea on how to make Naijaria Super Eagles a winning team and a top world team lies with foreign-born players. His colleagues at the LMC are not helping either.


If ya take a look @ the French team that won the World Cup you’d
find a whole bunch of em playing outside of France.
Same 4 Croatia, Holland, Argentina, Brazil, Belgium ... with few exceptions
like Germany, England and Spain with a vast majority of players playing in their local league.
Point is that the world has changed.
If you’re charged with succeeding in
a demanding environment then it becomes a similar matter
of the end justifying the means.
Can’t fault a man who is looking out 2 save
his neck while still giving the country the best
chance 2 win.


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 3:59 am 
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Pinnick’s track record with the Delta Athletics Federation was discussed here when he got the NFF viewtopic.php?f=1&t=255157&p=4363481

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