Cybereagles

The Undisputed Number One Home for All Super Eagles Fans
It is currently Thu Aug 13, 2020 5:38 pm

All times are UTC + 1 hour




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 94 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 1:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 2:39 am
Posts: 18222
Location: Super Eagles Homeland
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!



That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?


Dammy,

Without doubt I campaign for homebred simply because it makes no sense to invite a Division III player and then claim (1) there are no good GKs at top of Nigeria's local football, and *2) you offer grooming opportunities for a division III players. If that is the case, the GKs at home playing week in and week out should be offered the same opportunities. There is certainly no doubt that there are issues in this players invitation. Keshi was fired for exactly this behavior that the NFF and Rohr have undertaken with Maduka.

Now, Maduka has used that invitation to get a better contract. The very point Rohr was recently quoted as insinuating in stating when he later noted that he is now being reticent in addressing pressure from players of dual nationality players who are angling to be called up to the NT. A bit late, if you ask me.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 6:28 pm 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:12 pm
Posts: 10328
Location: loughborough.
Enugu II wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!



That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?


Dammy,

Without doubt I campaign for homebred simply because it makes no sense to invite a Division III player and then claim (1) there are no good GKs at top of Nigeria's local football, and *2) you offer grooming opportunities for a division III players. If that is the case, the GKs at home playing week in and week out should be offered the same opportunities. There is certainly no doubt that there are issues in this players invitation. Keshi was fired for exactly this behavior that the NFF and Rohr have undertaken with Maduka.

Now, Maduka has used that invitation to get a better contract. The very point Rohr was recently quoted as insinuating in stating when he later noted that he is now being reticent in addressing pressure from players of dual nationality players who are angling to be called up to the NT. A bit late, if you ask me.

Enugu II, Dammy know you are saying the truth and stating facts!

_________________
By the grace of God I am a Christian, by my deeds a great sinner.....The Way of a Pilgrim


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 7:25 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 9:33 pm
Posts: 10005
fabio wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!



That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?


Dammy,

Without doubt I campaign for homebred simply because it makes no sense to invite a Division III player and then claim (1) there are no good GKs at top of Nigeria's local football, and *2) you offer grooming opportunities for a division III players. If that is the case, the GKs at home playing week in and week out should be offered the same opportunities. There is certainly no doubt that there are issues in this players invitation. Keshi was fired for exactly this behavior that the NFF and Rohr have undertaken with Maduka.

Now, Maduka has used that invitation to get a better contract. The very point Rohr was recently quoted as insinuating in stating when he later noted that he is now being reticent in addressing pressure from players of dual nationality players who are angling to be called up to the NT. A bit late, if you ask me.

Enugu II, Dammy know you are saying the truth and stating facts!

What facts? Maduka's talent got him a contract with Sparta Rotterdam. How come SE invites did not get the likes of Uzoenyi, Egwueke, Agbim, Babatunde, Odunlami etc contracts in decent European leagues.?
Rohr recognised a talent and moved in quickly to grab the talent for Nigeria, just like Onigbinde in 2002 when he took Enyeama, who was not Enyimba's number one goalkeeper to the WC.
Maduka fully deserved his invitation and has since justified the invitation. We have a goalkeeper that can keep for us for the next 15 years!

_________________
I am happy


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 7:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 9:33 pm
Posts: 10005
Gotti wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!

That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?

Did you all think the people who called up an unknown and untested player in semi-pro Div 4 didn’t know that? :lol:

So why didn't that Swiss 2nd division midfielder get a move to a decent league? Not even the Swiss first division?
It's not about SE invitations, it's about TALENT!!!
Stephen Ukoh's appearance for the SE against CIV succeeded in getting him a move to the 5th tier of German football, where he currently plys his trade.

_________________
I am happy


Last edited by Dammy on Tue Jul 14, 2020 7:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 7:41 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 6:41 am
Posts: 39682
Location: Land of the Terrapins
Dammy wrote:
fabio wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!



That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?


Dammy,

Without doubt I campaign for homebred simply because it makes no sense to invite a Division III player and then claim (1) there are no good GKs at top of Nigeria's local football, and *2) you offer grooming opportunities for a division III players. If that is the case, the GKs at home playing week in and week out should be offered the same opportunities. There is certainly no doubt that there are issues in this players invitation. Keshi was fired for exactly this behavior that the NFF and Rohr have undertaken with Maduka.

Now, Maduka has used that invitation to get a better contract. The very point Rohr was recently quoted as insinuating in stating when he later noted that he is now being reticent in addressing pressure from players of dual nationality players who are angling to be called up to the NT. A bit late, if you ask me.

Enugu II, Dammy know you are saying the truth and stating facts!

What facts? Maduka's talent got him a contract with Sparta Rotterdam. How come SE invites did not get the likes of Uzoenyi, Egwueke, Agbim, Babatunde, Odunlami etc contracts in decent European leagues.?
Rohr recognised a talent and moved in quickly to grab the talent for Nigeria, just like Onigbinde in 2002 when he took Enyeama, who was not Enyimba's number one goalkeeper to the WC.
Maduka fully deserved his invitation and has since justified the invitation. We have a goalkeeper that can keep for us for the next 15 years!


Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?

_________________
Super Eagus 4 Life!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 8:00 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 9:33 pm
Posts: 10005
maceo4 wrote:
Dammy wrote:
fabio wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!



That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?


Dammy,

Without doubt I campaign for homebred simply because it makes no sense to invite a Division III player and then claim (1) there are no good GKs at top of Nigeria's local football, and *2) you offer grooming opportunities for a division III players. If that is the case, the GKs at home playing week in and week out should be offered the same opportunities. There is certainly no doubt that there are issues in this players invitation. Keshi was fired for exactly this behavior that the NFF and Rohr have undertaken with Maduka.

Now, Maduka has used that invitation to get a better contract. The very point Rohr was recently quoted as insinuating in stating when he later noted that he is now being reticent in addressing pressure from players of dual nationality players who are angling to be called up to the NT. A bit late, if you ask me.

Enugu II, Dammy know you are saying the truth and stating facts!

What facts? Maduka's talent got him a contract with Sparta Rotterdam. How come SE invites did not get the likes of Uzoenyi, Egwueke, Agbim, Babatunde, Odunlami etc contracts in decent European leagues.?
Rohr recognised a talent and moved in quickly to grab the talent for Nigeria, just like Onigbinde in 2002 when he took Enyeama, who was not Enyimba's number one goalkeeper to the WC.
Maduka fully deserved his invitation and has since justified the invitation. We have a goalkeeper that can keep for us for the next 15 years!


Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?

Abeg don't mind them, their arguments are always full of gaping holes.

_________________
I am happy


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 3:38 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 2:39 am
Posts: 18222
Location: Super Eagles Homeland
maceo4 wrote:
Dammy wrote:
fabio wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!



That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?


Dammy,

Without doubt I campaign for homebred simply because it makes no sense to invite a Division III player and then claim (1) there are no good GKs at top of Nigeria's local football, and *2) you offer grooming opportunities for a division III players. If that is the case, the GKs at home playing week in and week out should be offered the same opportunities. There is certainly no doubt that there are issues in this players invitation. Keshi was fired for exactly this behavior that the NFF and Rohr have undertaken with Maduka.

Now, Maduka has used that invitation to get a better contract. The very point Rohr was recently quoted as insinuating in stating when he later noted that he is now being reticent in addressing pressure from players of dual nationality players who are angling to be called up to the NT. A bit late, if you ask me.

Enugu II, Dammy know you are saying the truth and stating facts!

What facts? Maduka's talent got him a contract with Sparta Rotterdam. How come SE invites did not get the likes of Uzoenyi, Egwueke, Agbim, Babatunde, Odunlami etc contracts in decent European leagues.?
Rohr recognised a talent and moved in quickly to grab the talent for Nigeria, just like Onigbinde in 2002 when he took Enyeama, who was not Enyimba's number one goalkeeper to the WC.
Maduka fully deserved his invitation and has since justified the invitation. We have a goalkeeper that can keep for us for the next 15 years!


Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


Maceo4,

You should know how those signings work. First, no European club team will sign a GK from Africa to sit on the bench. You should know that. Ezenwa will only be signed to start or have a good chance of starting. Most GKs that sit on the bench signed from Africa are most likely young with the hope of being a future starter. This is simply a financial calculation. In most cases, a GK signed from Africa is preferably from the academy or young enough with a near-future opportunity to become a starter. That should be common knowlege by now, I would hope.

In any case, that nuance should inform the difference between Maduka and Ezenwa. Nevertheless, be aware that Rohr was not the guy that gave Ezenwa an NT shirt. Ezenwa was already an NT player prior to Rohr's arrival. Rohr has basically used Ezenwa as a token, so to speak, as a wedge against undiscerning watchers who use that to say "you see, he has a locally-based player on the team." :rotf:

Do not think for a moment that Rohr does not know what he is doing. Read his interviews, if you are unaware of this. Read the Phillip Billig case and how Billig used Nigeria's interest to get a Danish national team call up. https://www.thisdaylive.com/index.php/2020/06/06/philip-billing-using-nigeria-as-bait-for-denmark-call-up/It is quite possible some of the dual citizens in England are currently using that ploy to attract England's interest. So, perhaps, never understate the effect of a Nigerian call up on any player's career.

I am surprised that this is even a debate issue.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 3:55 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 6:41 am
Posts: 39682
Location: Land of the Terrapins
Enugu II wrote:
Maceo4,

You should know how those signings work. First, no European club team will sign a GK from Africa to sit on the bench. You should know that. Ezenwa will only be signed to start or have a good chance of starting. Most GKs that sit on the bench signed from Africa are most likely young with the hope of being a future starter. This is simply a financial calculation. In most cases, a GK signed from Africa is preferably from the academy or young enough with a near-future opportunity to become a starter. That should be common knowlege by now, I would hope.

In any case, that nuance should inform the difference between Maduka and Ezenwa. Nevertheless, be aware that Rohr was not the guy that gave Ezenwa an NT shirt. Ezenwa was already an NT player prior to Rohr's arrival. Rohr has basically used Ezenwa as a token, so to speak, as a wedge against undiscerning watchers who use that to say "you see, he has a locally-based player on the team." :rotf:

Do not think for a moment that Rohr does not know what he is doing. Read his interviews, if you are unaware of this. Read the Phillip Billig case and how Billig used Nigeria's interest to get a Danish national team call up. https://www.thisdaylive.com/index.php/2020/06/06/philip-billing-using-nigeria-as-bait-for-denmark-call-up/It is quite possible some of the dual citizens in England are currently using that ploy to attract England's interest. So, perhaps, never understate the effect of a Nigerian call up on any player's career.

I am surprised that this is even a debate issue.


Prof, of course it helps not disputing that, but I don't think there is a direct correlation especially in Okoye's case. It might more so be because he's German and came up in their structured program and performed well in their lower leagues rose to be the backup goalie in the A team, and probably has a good agent. Things that probably would have landed him where he is now regardless of an SE callup. Maybe I shouldn't have used Ezenwa, but Uzoho's case might be more comparable, and being a starter at a world cup hasn't necessarily helped his career so far, even though he was already in Europe at a young age, he's not getting this type of opportunity and has to settle for Omonia. So I think we are over estimating what playing for the SE does for a lot of these players, outside of those that need it to get work permits.

_________________
Super Eagus 4 Life!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2020 11:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:20 am
Posts: 30214
Dammy wrote:
So why didn't that Swiss 2nd division midfielder get a move to a decent league? Not even the Swiss first division?
It's not about SE invitations, it's about TALENT!!!
Stephen Ukoh's appearance for the SE against CIV succeeded in getting him a move to the 5th tier of German football, where he currently plys his trade.

Likely the same reason the dude from Bulgaria did not...

_________________
#BRINGBACKALLOURGIRLS#


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 6:13 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 9:33 pm
Posts: 10005
Gotti wrote:
Dammy wrote:
So why didn't that Swiss 2nd division midfielder get a move to a decent league? Not even the Swiss first division?
It's not about SE invitations, it's about TALENT!!!
Stephen Ukoh's appearance for the SE against CIV succeeded in getting him a move to the 5th tier of German football, where he currently plys his trade.

Likely the same reason the dude from Bulgaria did not...

Please remind me which match the dude from Bulgaria played for the SE?

_________________
I am happy


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 1:31 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:35 pm
Posts: 39565
Location: Somewhere
what about Arthur Okonkwo?

_________________
AFCON 2019 sweet o
Barren for 37 yrs no good o

New member and Titled Chief, Distant Gunners Consortium.
"This is an island surrounded by water, big water, ocean water."


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 11:04 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:40 pm
Posts: 231
maceo4 wrote:
Dammy wrote:
fabio wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
gochino wrote:
Great news! Watched an interview were he said he started getting lots of offers after playing in that Brazil game, this shows what national team football can do to your CV!



That was never in doubt. Simply being called up by the national without playing a game will attract offers from smart clubs looking into the future.

Is that a reason why you campaign for home based players?


Dammy,

Without doubt I campaign for homebred simply because it makes no sense to invite a Division III player and then claim (1) there are no good GKs at top of Nigeria's local football, and *2) you offer grooming opportunities for a division III players. If that is the case, the GKs at home playing week in and week out should be offered the same opportunities. There is certainly no doubt that there are issues in this players invitation. Keshi was fired for exactly this behavior that the NFF and Rohr have undertaken with Maduka.

Now, Maduka has used that invitation to get a better contract. The very point Rohr was recently quoted as insinuating in stating when he later noted that he is now being reticent in addressing pressure from players of dual nationality players who are angling to be called up to the NT. A bit late, if you ask me.

Enugu II, Dammy know you are saying the truth and stating facts!

What facts? Maduka's talent got him a contract with Sparta Rotterdam. How come SE invites did not get the likes of Uzoenyi, Egwueke, Agbim, Babatunde, Odunlami etc contracts in decent European leagues.?
Rohr recognised a talent and moved in quickly to grab the talent for Nigeria, just like Onigbinde in 2002 when he took Enyeama, who was not Enyimba's number one goalkeeper to the WC.
Maduka fully deserved his invitation and has since justified the invitation. We have a goalkeeper that can keep for us for the next 15 years!


Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


Kpom! This is where this argument died. I would end thread here, no need to deliberate further.

_________________
"Everyone, and particularly every true beliver, should decide which is more important to them. But as for me, I choose eternity over lifetime".


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 10:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:20 am
Posts: 30214
Dammy wrote:
Gotti wrote:
Dammy wrote:
So why didn't that Swiss 2nd division midfielder get a move to a decent league? Not even the Swiss first division?
It's not about SE invitations, it's about TALENT!!!
Stephen Ukoh's appearance for the SE against CIV succeeded in getting him a move to the 5th tier of German football, where he currently plys his trade.

Likely the same reason the dude from Bulgaria did not...

Please remind me which match the dude from Bulgaria played for the SE?

Was he seriously invited to play or simply be marketed? Or is it the software “scout” didn’t a good job (either way)? :lol:

_________________
#BRINGBACKALLOURGIRLS#


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 10:40 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 9:33 pm
Posts: 10005
Gotti wrote:
Dammy wrote:
Gotti wrote:
Dammy wrote:
So why didn't that Swiss 2nd division midfielder get a move to a decent league? Not even the Swiss first division?
It's not about SE invitations, it's about TALENT!!!
Stephen Ukoh's appearance for the SE against CIV succeeded in getting him a move to the 5th tier of German football, where he currently plys his trade.

Likely the same reason the dude from Bulgaria did not...

Please remind me which match the dude from Bulgaria played for the SE?

Was he seriously invited to play or simply be marketed? Or is it the software “scout” didn’t a good job (either way)? :lol:

The question should be directed at those who gave a cap to a Swiss 2nd division player, who was marketed by that cap to the 5th tier of German football.

_________________
I am happy


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 11:01 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:20 am
Posts: 30214
Dammy wrote:
The question should be directed at those who gave a cap to a Swiss 2nd division player, who was marketed by that cap to the 5th tier of German football.

Ukoh stayed in the same Swiss top division for 4 years (up until 2019) after his LAST SE appearance...
That’s substantively no different from Musa Muhammed stuck in Croatia 4 years after playing for Rohr’s SE.

Meanwhile, the dude in Bulgaria purportedly “scouted” by special (marketing?) software...
Not only couldn’t “get a move to a decent league” but his contract was reportedly CANCELED last month! :lol: :lol: :lol:

_________________
#BRINGBACKALLOURGIRLS#


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 1:52 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 5:59 pm
Posts: 49127
Location: Nembe Creek...Oil Exploration. If you call am bunkering na you sabi.
maceo4 wrote:
Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


There's no doubt being invited to the National team enhances a player's profile.

Folks like comparing apples and udara. It ends at them being fruits.

Maduka had no business being invited to the National Team. His invitation helped raise his profile and with proper representation, was able to cash in.

For those wondering how and why it didn't help other players? They should look at the Vince's own journey.

_________________
THERE WAS A COUNTRY...

...can't cry more than the bereaved!

Well done is better than well said!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 2:50 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 6:41 am
Posts: 39682
Location: Land of the Terrapins
Cellular wrote:
maceo4 wrote:
Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


There's no doubt being invited to the National team enhances a player's profile.

Folks like comparing apples and udara. It ends at them being fruits.

Maduka had no business being invited to the National Team. His invitation helped raise his profile and with proper representation, was able to cash in.

For those wondering how and why it didn't help other players? They should look at the Vince's own journey.


But if you remember Vince did get trails at Bolton and the like it just didn’t work out probably due to his Vampirism at the time, which furthers the argument that it’s more so about talent, once he worked out a lot of the kinks in his game he ended up having a very respectable career at Lille. Madukas time in the lower divisions of Germany are equivalent to the time Vince had to spend in Israel building his resume and film in order to make the step up.

No one is saying he had any business making the NT at the time he did, but there’s no substantive proof that his current move had so much to do with the Nigerian NT, and there are a lot of udaras to show otherwise. He’s not just gonna get a deal at a top European club simply because he’s played 30 something minutes for a below average NT struggling for players in his position. It’s more than likely gonna be because of hours and hours of film of the guy coming through the ranks in the German lower leagues. Same reason he made progress in his club moving through the ranks as he was following a process which ended up with him making the jump from the B team to being a backup on the A team. It’s constant progress and improvement in a structured environment with lots of film to back it up. You guys are being way too simplistic in your argument it’s not even funny. Being German and coming through their structured program has way way way more to do with his progress than anything else.

_________________
Super Eagus 4 Life!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 3:43 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 2:39 am
Posts: 18222
Location: Super Eagles Homeland
Cellular wrote:
maceo4 wrote:
Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


There's no doubt being invited to the National team enhances a player's profile.

Folks like comparing apples and udara. It ends at them being fruits.

Maduka had no business being invited to the National Team. His invitation helped raise his profile and with proper representation, was able to cash in.

For those wondering how and why it didn't help other players? They should look at the Vince's own journey.



Cell,

This is the point that many do not understand. For instance, some will assume that the coaches were the greatest if Maduka turns out to be a good goalkeeper for Nigeria. They forget that the very fact that Maduka had an opportunity to train with Nigeria's best players (not everyone will have same opportunity) and his use of that opportunity to get a great club elevated him to that point (many will not have that). The issue is not that he cannot be good or cannot eventually make the best team. Rather the issue is that he did not merited the opportunity in the first place ahead of several others.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 4:10 pm 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 5:57 pm
Posts: 42585
Location: UK
maceo4 wrote:
Cellular wrote:
maceo4 wrote:
Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


There's no doubt being invited to the National team enhances a player's profile.

Folks like comparing apples and udara. It ends at them being fruits.

Maduka had no business being invited to the National Team. His invitation helped raise his profile and with proper representation, was able to cash in.

For those wondering how and why it didn't help other players? They should look at the Vince's own journey.


But if you remember Vince did get trails at Bolton and the like it just didn’t work out probably due to his Vampirism at the time, which furthers the argument that it’s more so about talent, once he worked out a lot of the kinks in his game he ended up having a very respectable career at Lille.

No one is saying he had any business making the NT at the time he did, but there’s no substantive proof that it had so much to do with the Nigerian NT, and there are a lot of udaras to show otherwise. He’s not just gonna get a deal at a top European club simply because he’s played 30 something minutes for a below average NT struggling for players in his position. It’s more than likely gonna be because of hours and hours of film of the guy coming through the ranks in the German lower leagues. Same reason he made progress in his club moving through the ranks as he was following a process which ended up with him making the jump from the B team to being a backup on the A team. It’s constant progress and improvement in a structured environment with lots of film to back it up. You guys are being way too simplistic in your argument it’s not even funny.
You are making perfect sense.
For most, this argument is a 'political' one, primarily dictated by feelings towards Rohr with Maduka as the whipping boy.
He was obviously in the lower divisions as part of a planned grooming process, having been identified by his club as a talent long before Rohr ever invited him. With all due respect to both Akpeyi and Ezenwa, if Fortuna Dusseldorf had them as their only other GK options, would Maduka have been sent to the "fourth division" for game time? As you say, when the opportunity came, he quickly jumped into the A team's backup GK position. Was it his 30 mins SE cameo that influenced that too? :rotf:

It is perfectly within a coach's remit to identify exceptional young talent and set them on a fast track. That is why he is the coach and why you pay him. It is his given prerogative. If it turns out to be a wrong decision, he takes responsibility for it. Simple.

People forget that Maduka was invited twice by Imama to the U23 team months before he got Rohr's SE invite. Unfortunately postponements and club commitments prevented his U23 debut.

As I said, the debate is less about the expediency of the decision and more about misplaced sentiment. That Maduka is being used as the fulcrum of such an unrelenting attack on Rohr is unfortunate. Hopefully it doesn't reflect the wider opinion amongst millions of SE fans.
This place can often make you believe that our opinion here is a mirror Nigerian society.
Not really. It's just a small part of a whole.

_________________
"Ole kuku ni gbogbo wọn "


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 4:47 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 9:33 pm
Posts: 10005
Damunk wrote:
maceo4 wrote:
Cellular wrote:
maceo4 wrote:
Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


There's no doubt being invited to the National team enhances a player's profile.

Folks like comparing apples and udara. It ends at them being fruits.

Maduka had no business being invited to the National Team. His invitation helped raise his profile and with proper representation, was able to cash in.

For those wondering how and why it didn't help other players? They should look at the Vince's own journey.


But if you remember Vince did get trails at Bolton and the like it just didn’t work out probably due to his Vampirism at the time, which furthers the argument that it’s more so about talent, once he worked out a lot of the kinks in his game he ended up having a very respectable career at Lille.

No one is saying he had any business making the NT at the time he did, but there’s no substantive proof that it had so much to do with the Nigerian NT, and there are a lot of udaras to show otherwise. He’s not just gonna get a deal at a top European club simply because he’s played 30 something minutes for a below average NT struggling for players in his position. It’s more than likely gonna be because of hours and hours of film of the guy coming through the ranks in the German lower leagues. Same reason he made progress in his club moving through the ranks as he was following a process which ended up with him making the jump from the B team to being a backup on the A team. It’s constant progress and improvement in a structured environment with lots of film to back it up. You guys are being way too simplistic in your argument it’s not even funny.
You are making perfect sense.
For most, this argument is a 'political' one, primarily dictated by feelings towards Rohr with Maduka as the whipping boy.
He was obviously in the lower divisions as part of a planned grooming process, having been identified by his club as a talent long before Rohr ever invited him. With all due respect to both Akpeyi and Ezenwa, if Fortuna Dusseldorf had them as their only other GK options, would Maduka have been sent to the "fourth division" for game time? As you say, when the opportunity came, he quickly jumped into the A team's backup GK position. Was it his 30 mins SE cameo that influenced that too? :rotf:

It is perfectly within a coach's remit to identify exceptional young talent and set them on a fast track. That is why he is the coach and why you pay him. It is his given prerogative. If it turns out to be a wrong decision, he takes responsibility for it. Simple.

People forget that Maduka was invited twice by Imama to the U23 team months before he got Rohr's SE invite. Unfortunately postponements and club commitments prevented his U23 debut.

As I said, the debate is less about the expediency of the decision and more about misplaced sentiment. That Maduka is being used as the fulcrum of such an unrelenting attack on Rohr is unfortunate. Hopefully it doesn't reflect the wider opinion amongst millions of SE fans.
This place can often make you believe that our opinion here is a mirror Nigerian society.
Not really. It's just a small part of a whole.

Don't mind them, it's the same crew that celebrated when South Africa beat the SE in Uyo and when Ebuehi initially turned down Rohr's invitation. No matter, how they sugarcoat it, we know their target is Rohr and they will always latch on to the lowest hanging fruitm

_________________
I am happy


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 4:50 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 9:33 pm
Posts: 10005
Gotti wrote:
Dammy wrote:
The question should be directed at those who gave a cap to a Swiss 2nd division player, who was marketed by that cap to the 5th tier of German football.

Ukoh stayed in the same Swiss top division for 4 years (up until 2019) after his LAST SE appearance...
That’s substantively no different from Musa Muhammed stuck in Croatia 4 years after playing for Rohr’s SE.

Meanwhile, the dude in Bulgaria purportedly “scouted” by special (marketing?) software...
Not only couldn’t “get a move to a decent league” but his contract was reportedly CANCELED last month! :lol: :lol: :lol:

So Swiss 2nd division is now top division? Anything to suit your narrative. Shame the marketing strategy didn't work for Ukoh despite being capped.
I ask again, which match or matches did the player from Bulgaria's top club play for Nigeria to warrant the marketing insinuation?

_________________
I am happy


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 6:24 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 5:59 pm
Posts: 49127
Location: Nembe Creek...Oil Exploration. If you call am bunkering na you sabi.
maceo4 wrote:
Cellular wrote:
maceo4 wrote:
Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


There's no doubt being invited to the National team enhances a player's profile.

Folks like comparing apples and udara. It ends at them being fruits.

Maduka had no business being invited to the National Team. His invitation helped raise his profile and with proper representation, was able to cash in.

For those wondering how and why it didn't help other players? They should look at the Vince's own journey.


But if you remember Vince did get trails at Bolton and the like it just didn’t work out probably due to his Vampirism at the time, which furthers the argument that it’s more so about talent, once he worked out a lot of the kinks in his game he ended up having a very respectable career at Lille. Madukas time in the lower divisions of Germany are equivalent to the time Vince had to spend in Israel building his resume and film in order to make the step up.

No one is saying he had any business making the NT at the time he did, but there’s no substantive proof that his current move had so much to do with the Nigerian NT, and there are a lot of udaras to show otherwise. He’s not just gonna get a deal at a top European club simply because he’s played 30 something minutes for a below average NT struggling for players in his position. It’s more than likely gonna be because of hours and hours of film of the guy coming through the ranks in the German lower leagues. Same reason he made progress in his club moving through the ranks as he was following a process which ended up with him making the jump from the B team to being a backup on the A team. It’s constant progress and improvement in a structured environment with lots of film to back it up. You guys are being way too simplistic in your argument it’s not even funny. Being German and coming through their structured program has way way way more to do with his progress than anything else.


You again comparing two plants that the only similarity is that they are both fruits.

Vincent was the goalie of a 2 time African Champion. A multi Naijarian league winner. He went to Israel not to hone his craft but for economic reasons.

It is very difficult to justify the call up of Maduka.

Sorry.

The reason why the Maduka situation sticks out is because not only were we inviting a local goalie who wasn't in top form for his team or in the league we had to go into the low rungs of the foreign cadre to invite a goalie for the SENIOR MEN'S National Team.

I will love to know the criteria for the exemption or for that matter exception made for Maduka so others can aim for the same.

_________________
THERE WAS A COUNTRY...

...can't cry more than the bereaved!

Well done is better than well said!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2020 6:26 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 5:59 pm
Posts: 49127
Location: Nembe Creek...Oil Exploration. If you call am bunkering na you sabi.
Enugu II wrote:
Cellular wrote:
maceo4 wrote:
Abi, he's played a grand total of what 30something minutes for SE subbing in for Uzoho in the Brazil friendly, so what about Ezenwa and Akpeyi that have kept way more matches, they couldn't get a Rotterdam deal with their considerably more international exposure?


There's no doubt being invited to the National team enhances a player's profile.

Folks like comparing apples and udara. It ends at them being fruits.

Maduka had no business being invited to the National Team. His invitation helped raise his profile and with proper representation, was able to cash in.

For those wondering how and why it didn't help other players? They should look at the Vince's own journey.



Cell,

This is the point that many do not understand. For instance, some will assume that the coaches were the greatest if Maduka turns out to be a good goalkeeper for Nigeria. They forget that the very fact that Maduka had an opportunity to train with Nigeria's best players (not everyone will have same opportunity) and his use of that opportunity to get a great club elevated him to that point (many will not have that). The issue is not that he cannot be good or cannot eventually make the best team. Rather the issue is that he did not merited the opportunity in the first place ahead of several others.


There's absolutely NO justification for the invitation to the SENIOR MEN'S NATIONAL TEAM.

_________________
THERE WAS A COUNTRY...

...can't cry more than the bereaved!

Well done is better than well said!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 94 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 1naija, Bing [Bot], DIMKA76, Google [Bot] and 49 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group