Antonio Concecao - any takers?

[highbury]

In 2345, the slave coast also known as Nigeria will be looking for a foreign coach. Nigeria was called a slave coast for a reason. The people and their leaders think like slaves

Yup! It’s slave mentality when we hire foreigners but discrimination when they don’t hire our players or coaches. If we did things the right way we wouldn’t have to reference slavery in 2024. Doing so is SLAVE mentality. Perpetual victim hood.

No. It's deemed discrimination when one is not hired even though one meets the criteria needed to be given the job. It is more slavish when this occurs in ones own country. Nigerians don't like to hear the truth. I know it doesn't sound nice but it is the harsh reality. Nigeria is still a slave coast.

[Enugu II]

Its best practice NOT because it is done in Europe. I never cited Europe; YOU DID!

It is best practice because it is done ALL OVER THE WORLD.

When the Packers fired McCarthy, they did not put out a notice for coaches to apply. They did not take applications from coaches.

They simply SHORTLISTED coaches who fit the criteria they identified internally and then went out and interviewed those of them on the list who declared themselves available.

The same thing has happened with other NFL teams: Atlanta Falcons, Chargers, Panthers, Patriots..

My team Liverpool is currently doing a search for a coach to replace Jurgen Klopp.
- They haven't put out a notice for applications.
- They have not asked coaches to apply.
- They have identified their criteria
- They have reportedly shortlisted a couple of candidates.
- They are reportedly waiting to speak with their top choice Alonso.

It is best practice because it is done ALL OVER THE WORLD.

Okay, it has shifted to being done all over the WORLD. That, still, does not make it best. If it did, why do you think it is bein g changed in some places that I have pointed at? The key is looking at the practice itself and not the place. Take the case of Packers, for instance, as I noted in the old days they will simply talk to those they identify. Today, they are forced to talk to at least a minority, following the Rooney Rule. Why is that? Have you asked why that is required? However, because clubs began to interview a minority as a token simply to meet the requirement, the NFL had to act recently. Why? Have you asked? Now, they have added a requirement i.e. if you hire a minority and that minority is lost you get a third round pick. Why do you think all those repair mechanisms are being introduced? I await your answer.

No it has not shifted; it is your MO in debates. Shift the argument and accuse me of doing it! You are the one who said it was best practice in Europe. I never said it...

2ndly, the Rooney Rule does not support your argument. It merely supports who is in your shortlist- that a minority must be in your shortlist.

Nowhere in the NFLY are coaches hired by asking for applications. That is the issue here. DO NOT CHANGE THE ARGUMENT!

The Packers hired Matt Lafleur not by asking for applications. They hired him from A SHORTLIST that they prepared, based on the criteria that they established internally.

That shortlist included a minority coach based on the requirements of the Rooney Rule.

It appears from above that you are confusing the requirements in the Rooney rule with your idea of asking for applications from coaches in the hiring process. Your problem is again that you do not fully understand these issues...

Txj,

I will not go back and forth with you and headed no where. I will simply place an article below for everyone to read and understand that the rule was put there to break the old boys network that dictated hiring of coaches in the NFL and pervades today in soccer in Europe. The Rooney rule has been improved over the years and remains imperfect and will require additional tweaking, However, it reminds us that the old boy network isd piss poor an d leads to racialized hiring and that is what pervades hiring of managers in socccer today. In any case, read below about the Rooney rule and ignore the noise and obfuscation in the discourse prior:

What is the NFL's Rooney Rule?
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/sports/ ... d/5055519/
The NFL instituted the policy with the intention of creating a more equitable interview process for prominent positions
By Charlotte Edmonds • Published January 19, 2024 • Updated on January 19, 2024 at 10:56 am


Coming up on its 20th year in the league, here’s everything you need to know about the Rooney Rule.

The NFL playoffs are underway, and the coaching carousel has been spinning in high gear. Some established coaches will get a second -- or even third -- chance to lead an NFL sideline, while other positions will be filled by little-known up-and-comers.

With that comes a look back at the NFL hiring practices over the years, starting with the Rooney Rule. The two-decade-old policy is considered one of the league’s most notable and notorious hiring policies and has earned mixed reviews from fans and front offices alike.

Here’s a look at the Rooney Rule:

What is the Rooney Rule?
The original Rooney Rule, coming up on its 21st year in the league, dictated that all NFL teams must interview at least one minority candidate for head coaching openings. It has since been expanded to include other positions and more provisions.

What is the origin of the Rooney Rule?
The policy was first implemented ahead of the 2003 regular season in response to the firing of head coaches Tony Dungy and Dennis Green.

Dungy built a 54-42 record over six seasons with the Buccaneers before being fired in early 2002. Jon Gruden went on to lead Tampa Bay to the franchise’s first Super Bowl championship, but Dungy is still widely credited for having developed the stellar defensive unit that allowed just over 12 points per game that season. Meanwhile, Green had made the playoffs eight of his nine seasons with the Minnesota Vikings but was fired midway through the 2001 season after going 5-10.

Green and Dungy were only the third and fifth Black or African-American coaches hired to lead NFL teams at the time, respectively. Their firings prompted scrutiny and an investigation by civil rights attorneys who determined that when “compared statistically, Black head coaches have a higher winning percentage than their white NFL counterparts, but were still more likely to be fired.”

With this information made public, agents, coaches, front office personnel and players came together to pressure the NFL to institute a more equitable interview process. The resulting policy was named after Dan Rooney, then-owner of the Pittsburgh Steelers and chairman of the league’s diversity committee.

What are the changes to the Rooney Rule?
Just in the past few years, the Rooney Rule has undergone a series of changes geared toward providing more specific parameters.

In 2020, team owners approved a system intended to reward teams for developing minority talent into potential head coach or general manager candidates. If a team loses a minority executive or coach to another team, they would receive a third-round compensatory pick for two years. In the event that they lose both a coach and a personnel member, that compensatory pick would be extended for a third year.

Other changes to the rule include requiring interviewing at least two external minority candidates for head coaching vacancies and one external minority candidate for coordinator positions. The Rooney Rule is also applicable to senior level front office positions and vacancies for the quarterbacks coach, a common pipeline for future head coaches.

How effective is the Rooney Rule?
The initial results from the Rooney Rule were promising -- with the percentage of African-American or Black head coaches in the NFL rising from 6% to 22% within three seasons.

As times goes by -- and stories of Rooney Rule violations emerged -- the picture gets a little more complicated. By the end of the 2021 regular season, only one Black coach -- Mike Tomlin -- remained employed. The Washington Commanders’ Ron Rivera, who is Latino, and New York Jets’ Robert Saleh, who is of Lebanese descent, were the only other coaches who qualified as candidates within the Rooney Rule.

That same season, David Culley and Brian Flores were both fired from their head coaching posts. Flores’ termination came as a surprise to many considering he was coming off back-to-back winning seasons with the Miami Dolphins – a franchise first since 2001. However, the question of discriminatory hiring practices reached a fever pitch in the months following.

In early February 2022, Flores filed a lawsuit against the NFL, the Dolphins, the Denver Broncos and the New York Giants alleging discrimination in his interview process.

Flores’ primary evidence for the allegations? A text message from New England Patriots head coach Bill Belichick congratulating him on being named the next head coach for the Giants … sent the day before Flores was set to interview for the position.

Turns out the message was intended for a different former assistant of Belichick’s also named Brian, Brian Daboll, who was later named head coach for the Giants.


While the league continues to add more provisions to its hiring practices, the Flores’ lawsuit is potentially a reminder of the many shortcomings of the Rooney Rule.
In 2023, there were six minority head coaches, or 18.8% of the league. Comparatively, players of color made up 75% of the league, per USA TODAY.
What is the penalty for violating the Rooney Rule?
When the Rooney Rule was originally implemented, it was said to come with penalties ranging from fines to a loss of draft picks. In the two decades since, the Detroit Lions are the only team to receive any sort of penalty -- a $200,000 fine in 2003 and no loss of draft picks.

I know about the Rooney Rule. I'm quite familiar with how it works and the updates to it.

I'm also very familiar with your typical style of diverting attention from the substance of a debate and then attributing it to someone else

The Rooney rule is not applicable to the issue here which is how coaches are NOT hired by asking for applications from all and sundry...

It sure does not appear that you are familiar with it or the rationale for it. If you are familiar as you claim, you should then understand that the current process for hiring managers in the EPL is not - a beacon of example for hiring coaches. That is the point. The EPL system is exactly the reason why the Rooney Rule was introduced in the NFL which previously used that system. The Rooney Rule, as you claim you understand its rationale, was introduced to breakdown the old boys network infesting the way managers are hired. Or what is the reason that you suppose led to the introduction of the Rooney Rule?

Its actually a DISHONEST way to debate to repeatedly misread and obfuscate.

I spoke about BEST PRACTICES. I didn't speak about Europe or EPL or US.

But even wrt the Rooney Rule, no team in the US hires coaches by ASKING FOR APPLICATIONS , which is the SUBJECT of our discussion.

In the NFL they all abide by the Rooney Rule but not one of them do so by asking coaches to apply!

If you know one please post it here.

But why was an application needed? ANSWER -- because it gives opportunity for everyone via an independent firm. It is suggested because that is what modern organizations default to. They don't do it just for rote but there is actually a REASON for it -- equal access and opportunity. Precisely, what an old boy network hiring used by the EPL does not offer. I hope you now understand why it was brought up. How if you feel the UK system assures equal access and opportunity, then advise me.

No where did one claim the system is used in the USA or UK? Why would I use those places for example when I have actually castigated their system? Where is the logic? Bros, follow the debate.

To reiterate, my point is actually that what is used in most of those places (UK/USA) is a decadent system. So why should I use that as an example. The only reason we began to discuss USA is because you claimed that the process of identification of coaches in such places is superior. I then argued that it was not. If is why then was Rooney Rule introduced? I then pointed the Rooney Rule as a specific example demonstrating why the old boy decadent system was being replaced in the USA. The same UK/USA system that you hold up as SUPERIOR! That very system is currently under scrutiny and change, You have acknowledged that, I hope? I say you have tactfully done so by noting that you are aware of the rule but have been silent about why it was introduced and what you think of it compared to the old way of hiring. Now, I ask i: DO you believe the Rooney Rule and its modification is better than the Old boys network system that you toured earlier?

Please answer. Do not tactfully try to divert the argument or suddenly go silent on this question. I am being direct here because I want to be sure that you believe that repair of the hiring rule in the USA is for good or you believe it is not.

[EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA]

In 2345, the slave coast also known as Nigeria will be looking for a foreign coach. Nigeria was called a slave coast for a reason. The people and their leaders think like slaves

Yup! It’s slave mentality when we hire foreigners but discrimination when they don’t hire our players or coaches. If we did things the right way we wouldn’t have to reference slavery in 2024. Doing so is SLAVE mentality. Perpetual victim hood.

No. It's deemed discrimination when one is not hired even though one meets the criteria needed to be given the job. It is more slavish when this occurs in ones own country. Nigerians don't like to hear the truth. I know it doesn't sound nice but it is the harsh reality. Nigeria is still a slave coast.

Nigeria has won Afcon with a local coach and a FC. Is it not a Slave mentality to believe that we do not know the difference between a good coach and a mediocre coach? The issue seems to be that you have such low expectations of Nigerians that you do not believe we can make the right decision local or foreign.
That is what George Bush jr called the soft bigotry of low expectations.

[highbury]

In 2345, the slave coast also known as Nigeria will be looking for a foreign coach. Nigeria was called a slave coast for a reason. The people and their leaders think like slaves

Yup! It’s slave mentality when we hire foreigners but discrimination when they don’t hire our players or coaches. If we did things the right way we wouldn’t have to reference slavery in 2024. Doing so is SLAVE mentality. Perpetual victim hood.

No. It's deemed discrimination when one is not hired even though one meets the criteria needed to be given the job. It is more slavish when this occurs in ones own country. Nigerians don't like to hear the truth. I know it doesn't sound nice but it is the harsh reality. Nigeria is still a slave coast.

Nigeria has won Afcon with a local coach and a FC. Is it not a Slave mentality to believe that we do not know the difference between a good coach and a mediocre coach? The issue seems to be that you have such low expectations of Nigerians that you do not believe we can make the right decision local or foreign.
That is what George Bush jr called the soft bigotry of low expectations.

Really? Is that you're imagination or did I make that claim? Please shed some light. My issue is that we shouldnt mortgage our future to a foreign coach? Is it wrong to sink or swim with a Nigerian?
lol with your quote of George Bush

[EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA]

In 2345, the slave coast also known as Nigeria will be looking for a foreign coach. Nigeria was called a slave coast for a reason. The people and their leaders think like slaves

Yup! It’s slave mentality when we hire foreigners but discrimination when they don’t hire our players or coaches. If we did things the right way we wouldn’t have to reference slavery in 2024. Doing so is SLAVE mentality. Perpetual victim hood.

No. It's deemed discrimination when one is not hired even though one meets the criteria needed to be given the job. It is more slavish when this occurs in ones own country. Nigerians don't like to hear the truth. I know it doesn't sound nice but it is the harsh reality. Nigeria is still a slave coast.

Nigeria has won Afcon with a local coach and a FC. Is it not a Slave mentality to believe that we do not know the difference between a good coach and a mediocre coach? The issue seems to be that you have such low expectations of Nigerians that you do not believe we can make the right decision local or foreign.
That is what George Bush jr called the soft bigotry of low expectations.

Really? Is that you're imagination or did I make that claim? Please shed some light. My issue is that we shouldnt mortgage our future to a foreign coach? Is it wrong to sink or swim with a Nigerian?
lol with your quote of George Bush

Nigeria’s talent level is way ahead of our administrators and local coaching. We have top 20 talent and still parading coaches whose claim to fame was in 1994 who really have had a real job. Imho, there’re only 3 Nigerians we should be looking at, Nsien, Egbo and Olofinjana. If they’re not ready we’ll need to get the best coach we can afford. Amunike, oliseh, Eguaveon and the rest of the 94 crew are no longer relevant. I’ll even settle for shoelace Yobo ahead of the 94 crew.

[ohenhen1]

It is discrimination when the NFF boss tell the press they will not even consider a local coach then turn around and hire a foreign coach that has losing track record. Cant even get a job outside Africa That is discrimination, colo mentality. Anyways still have hope a local coach will be appointed. Even if that local coach fails. That should not disqualify a local coach from ever been considered.


The only foreign coach that has had success after leaving Nigeria is Lars Lagerback and he was a short term barely 3 months coach. He then went on to do well with Iceland. There is a proven track record of bad foreign coaches getting the Nigerian head coach role.

[highbury]

It is discrimination when the NFF boss tell the press they will not even consider a local coach then turn around and hire a foreign coach that has losing track record. Cant even get a job outside Africa That is discrimination, colo mentality. Anyways still have hope a local coach will be appointed. Even if that local coach fails. That should not disqualify a local coach from ever been considered.


The only foreign coach that has had success after leaving Nigeria is Lars Lagerback and he was a short term barely 3 months coach. He then went on to do well with Iceland. There is a proven track record of bad foreign coaches getting the Nigerian head coach role.

Nigeria should get to a point that the failure of a local coach doesn't necessitate the hiring of a foreign coach. We should sink or swim with our own. My goodness, it's 2024. Nigeria as still stands is still a slave coast. A big portion of our people are slaves. I hate to say this, but it is the sad truth.

[ohenhen1]

It is discrimination when the NFF boss tell the press they will not even consider a local coach then turn around and hire a foreign coach that has losing track record. Cant even get a job outside Africa That is discrimination, colo mentality. Anyways still have hope a local coach will be appointed. Even if that local coach fails. That should not disqualify a local coach from ever been considered.


The only foreign coach that has had success after leaving Nigeria is Lars Lagerback and he was a short term barely 3 months coach. He then went on to do well with Iceland. There is a proven track record of bad foreign coaches getting the Nigerian head coach role.

Nigeria should get to a point that the failure of a local coach doesn't necessitate the hiring of a foreign coach. We should sink or swim with our own. My goodness, it's 2024. Nigeria as still stands is still a slave coast. A big portion of our people are slaves. I hate to say this, but it is the sad truth.

I actually disagree a little bit. If there is a foreign coach that is good, He should be hired, But the problem is they keep picking bad foreign coaches while discriminating against local coaches. To make things worse, they come up with excuses to keep them, Remember how they attacked Amodu(RIP) for finishing third. The same people said Rohr met his contract requirement, they should keep him.

Florence Omagbemi won Afcon. Randy Waldrum finished 4th at Afcon. The WOWO crowd fought for him like he was a savior. The guy went to the World cup, played a complete defense style. Lost to a 10 man England in the knockout stage, playing defensive football. He comes back to Nigeria. That tournament style football is now struggling to beat Cameroon and will face South Africa next. What does the Wowo crowd say, Waldrum is excellent.

[highbury]

It is discrimination when the NFF boss tell the press they will not even consider a local coach then turn around and hire a foreign coach that has losing track record. Cant even get a job outside Africa That is discrimination, colo mentality. Anyways still have hope a local coach will be appointed. Even if that local coach fails. That should not disqualify a local coach from ever been considered.


The only foreign coach that has had success after leaving Nigeria is Lars Lagerback and he was a short term barely 3 months coach. He then went on to do well with Iceland. There is a proven track record of bad foreign coaches getting the Nigerian head coach role.

Nigeria should get to a point that the failure of a local coach doesn't necessitate the hiring of a foreign coach. We should sink or swim with our own. My goodness, it's 2024. Nigeria as still stands is still a slave coast. A big portion of our people are slaves. I hate to say this, but it is the sad truth.

I actually disagree a little bit. If there is a foreign coach that is good, He should be hired, But the problem is they keep picking bad foreign coaches while discriminating against local coaches. To make things worse, they come up with excuses to keep them, Remember how they attacked Amodu(RIP) for finishing third. The same people said Rohr met his contract requirement, they should keep him.

Respectfully, I reject the notion of hiring any foreign coach to coach Nigeria. They can be consultants , not be at the helm of leadership. End of story . I am telling you that Nigeria is still under foreign control. Hence, the name slave coast

[Orion]

In 2345, the slave coast also known as Nigeria will be looking for a foreign coach. Nigeria was called a slave coast for a reason. The people and their leaders think like slaves

Yup! It’s slave mentality when we hire foreigners but discrimination when they don’t hire our players or coaches. If we did things the right way we wouldn’t have to reference slavery in 2024. Doing so is SLAVE mentality. Perpetual victim hood.

No. It's deemed discrimination when one is not hired even though one meets the criteria needed to be given the job. It is more slavish when this occurs in ones own country. Nigerians don't like to hear the truth. I know it doesn't sound nice but it is the harsh reality. Nigeria is still a slave coast.

Nigeria has won Afcon with a local coach and a FC. Is it not a Slave mentality to believe that we do not know the difference between a good coach and a mediocre coach? The issue seems to be that you have such low expectations of Nigerians that you do not believe we can make the right decision local or foreign.
That is what George Bush jr called the soft bigotry of low expectations.

IMO, these people are plagued with a severe form of inferiority complex. They have this idea in their head that they are inferior to whites. Hence, hiring a foreign (white) coach reinforces that inferiority complex for them, and they don't want that reinforced.

Some of us don't see a difference. We want the most experienced person we can afford for the job. Unfortunately, our local league does not provide that experience because of player drain! The standard of the league is now very low. At least, the likes of Amodu coached clubs that had to deal with very talented opposition.

[Tobi17]

Angolan coach (now former ), also applied for the SE coaching job and is also in the running.

[txj]

Okay, it has shifted to being done all over the WORLD. That, still, does not make it best. If it did, why do you think it is bein g changed in some places that I have pointed at? The key is looking at the practice itself and not the place. Take the case of Packers, for instance, as I noted in the old days they will simply talk to those they identify. Today, they are forced to talk to at least a minority, following the Rooney Rule. Why is that? Have you asked why that is required? However, because clubs began to interview a minority as a token simply to meet the requirement, the NFL had to act recently. Why? Have you asked? Now, they have added a requirement i.e. if you hire a minority and that minority is lost you get a third round pick. Why do you think all those repair mechanisms are being introduced? I await your answer.

No it has not shifted; it is your MO in debates. Shift the argument and accuse me of doing it! You are the one who said it was best practice in Europe. I never said it...

2ndly, the Rooney Rule does not support your argument. It merely supports who is in your shortlist- that a minority must be in your shortlist.

Nowhere in the NFLY are coaches hired by asking for applications. That is the issue here. DO NOT CHANGE THE ARGUMENT!

The Packers hired Matt Lafleur not by asking for applications. They hired him from A SHORTLIST that they prepared, based on the criteria that they established internally.

That shortlist included a minority coach based on the requirements of the Rooney Rule.

It appears from above that you are confusing the requirements in the Rooney rule with your idea of asking for applications from coaches in the hiring process. Your problem is again that you do not fully understand these issues...

Txj,

I will not go back and forth with you and headed no where. I will simply place an article below for everyone to read and understand that the rule was put there to break the old boys network that dictated hiring of coaches in the NFL and pervades today in soccer in Europe. The Rooney rule has been improved over the years and remains imperfect and will require additional tweaking, However, it reminds us that the old boy network isd piss poor an d leads to racialized hiring and that is what pervades hiring of managers in socccer today. In any case, read below about the Rooney rule and ignore the noise and obfuscation in the discourse prior:

What is the NFL's Rooney Rule?
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/sports/ ... d/5055519/
The NFL instituted the policy with the intention of creating a more equitable interview process for prominent positions
By Charlotte Edmonds • Published January 19, 2024 • Updated on January 19, 2024 at 10:56 am


Coming up on its 20th year in the league, here’s everything you need to know about the Rooney Rule.

The NFL playoffs are underway, and the coaching carousel has been spinning in high gear. Some established coaches will get a second -- or even third -- chance to lead an NFL sideline, while other positions will be filled by little-known up-and-comers.

With that comes a look back at the NFL hiring practices over the years, starting with the Rooney Rule. The two-decade-old policy is considered one of the league’s most notable and notorious hiring policies and has earned mixed reviews from fans and front offices alike.

Here’s a look at the Rooney Rule:

What is the Rooney Rule?
The original Rooney Rule, coming up on its 21st year in the league, dictated that all NFL teams must interview at least one minority candidate for head coaching openings. It has since been expanded to include other positions and more provisions.

What is the origin of the Rooney Rule?
The policy was first implemented ahead of the 2003 regular season in response to the firing of head coaches Tony Dungy and Dennis Green.

Dungy built a 54-42 record over six seasons with the Buccaneers before being fired in early 2002. Jon Gruden went on to lead Tampa Bay to the franchise’s first Super Bowl championship, but Dungy is still widely credited for having developed the stellar defensive unit that allowed just over 12 points per game that season. Meanwhile, Green had made the playoffs eight of his nine seasons with the Minnesota Vikings but was fired midway through the 2001 season after going 5-10.

Green and Dungy were only the third and fifth Black or African-American coaches hired to lead NFL teams at the time, respectively. Their firings prompted scrutiny and an investigation by civil rights attorneys who determined that when “compared statistically, Black head coaches have a higher winning percentage than their white NFL counterparts, but were still more likely to be fired.”

With this information made public, agents, coaches, front office personnel and players came together to pressure the NFL to institute a more equitable interview process. The resulting policy was named after Dan Rooney, then-owner of the Pittsburgh Steelers and chairman of the league’s diversity committee.

What are the changes to the Rooney Rule?
Just in the past few years, the Rooney Rule has undergone a series of changes geared toward providing more specific parameters.

In 2020, team owners approved a system intended to reward teams for developing minority talent into potential head coach or general manager candidates. If a team loses a minority executive or coach to another team, they would receive a third-round compensatory pick for two years. In the event that they lose both a coach and a personnel member, that compensatory pick would be extended for a third year.

Other changes to the rule include requiring interviewing at least two external minority candidates for head coaching vacancies and one external minority candidate for coordinator positions. The Rooney Rule is also applicable to senior level front office positions and vacancies for the quarterbacks coach, a common pipeline for future head coaches.

How effective is the Rooney Rule?
The initial results from the Rooney Rule were promising -- with the percentage of African-American or Black head coaches in the NFL rising from 6% to 22% within three seasons.

As times goes by -- and stories of Rooney Rule violations emerged -- the picture gets a little more complicated. By the end of the 2021 regular season, only one Black coach -- Mike Tomlin -- remained employed. The Washington Commanders’ Ron Rivera, who is Latino, and New York Jets’ Robert Saleh, who is of Lebanese descent, were the only other coaches who qualified as candidates within the Rooney Rule.

That same season, David Culley and Brian Flores were both fired from their head coaching posts. Flores’ termination came as a surprise to many considering he was coming off back-to-back winning seasons with the Miami Dolphins – a franchise first since 2001. However, the question of discriminatory hiring practices reached a fever pitch in the months following.

In early February 2022, Flores filed a lawsuit against the NFL, the Dolphins, the Denver Broncos and the New York Giants alleging discrimination in his interview process.

Flores’ primary evidence for the allegations? A text message from New England Patriots head coach Bill Belichick congratulating him on being named the next head coach for the Giants … sent the day before Flores was set to interview for the position.

Turns out the message was intended for a different former assistant of Belichick’s also named Brian, Brian Daboll, who was later named head coach for the Giants.


While the league continues to add more provisions to its hiring practices, the Flores’ lawsuit is potentially a reminder of the many shortcomings of the Rooney Rule.
In 2023, there were six minority head coaches, or 18.8% of the league. Comparatively, players of color made up 75% of the league, per USA TODAY.
What is the penalty for violating the Rooney Rule?
When the Rooney Rule was originally implemented, it was said to come with penalties ranging from fines to a loss of draft picks. In the two decades since, the Detroit Lions are the only team to receive any sort of penalty -- a $200,000 fine in 2003 and no loss of draft picks.

I know about the Rooney Rule. I'm quite familiar with how it works and the updates to it.

I'm also very familiar with your typical style of diverting attention from the substance of a debate and then attributing it to someone else

The Rooney rule is not applicable to the issue here which is how coaches are NOT hired by asking for applications from all and sundry...

It sure does not appear that you are familiar with it or the rationale for it. If you are familiar as you claim, you should then understand that the current process for hiring managers in the EPL is not - a beacon of example for hiring coaches. That is the point. The EPL system is exactly the reason why the Rooney Rule was introduced in the NFL which previously used that system. The Rooney Rule, as you claim you understand its rationale, was introduced to breakdown the old boys network infesting the way managers are hired. Or what is the reason that you suppose led to the introduction of the Rooney Rule?

Its actually a DISHONEST way to debate to repeatedly misread and obfuscate.

I spoke about BEST PRACTICES. I didn't speak about Europe or EPL or US.

But even wrt the Rooney Rule, no team in the US hires coaches by ASKING FOR APPLICATIONS , which is the SUBJECT of our discussion.

In the NFL they all abide by the Rooney Rule but not one of them do so by asking coaches to apply!

If you know one please post it here.

But why was an application needed? ANSWER -- because it gives opportunity for everyone via an independent firm. It is suggested because that is what modern organizations default to. They don't do it just for rote but there is actually a REASON for it -- equal access and opportunity. Precisely, what an old boy network hiring used by the EPL does not offer. I hope you now understand why it was brought up. How if you feel the UK system assures equal access and opportunity, then advise me.

No where did one claim the system is used in the USA or UK? Why would I use those places for example when I have actually castigated their system? Where is the logic? Bros, follow the debate.

To reiterate, my point is actually that what is used in most of those places (UK/USA) is a decadent system. So why should I use that as an example. The only reason we began to discuss USA is because you claimed that the process of identification of coaches in such places is superior. I then argued that it was not. If is why then was Rooney Rule introduced? I then pointed the Rooney Rule as a specific example demonstrating why the old boy decadent system was being replaced in the USA. The same UK/USA system that you hold up as SUPERIOR! That very system is currently under scrutiny and change, You have acknowledged that, I hope? I say you have tactfully done so by noting that you are aware of the rule but have been silent about why it was introduced and what you think of it compared to the old way of hiring. Now, I ask i: DO you believe the Rooney Rule and its modification is better than the Old boys network system that you toured earlier?

Please answer. Do not tactfully try to divert the argument or suddenly go silent on this question. I am being direct here because I want to be sure that you believe that repair of the hiring rule in the USA is for good or you believe it is not.

The issue is not the Rooney Rule. That is just your attempt to distract and obfuscate. And its increasingly clear that you do not even understand the application of the rule!

All the NFL teams implement the Rooney Rule in the hiring process. But not ONE has a process for open application by all and sundry.

What the Rooney Rule ensures is ACCESS- that a minority coach MUST be included in the SHORTLIST. That is different from asking for open applications from all and sundry..

I have asked you b/4 and I ask again, name ONE NFL team that has invited open applications for a coaching job while implementing the Rooney Rule. NAME ONE!!!

I started by speaking about BEST PRACTICE. Best practice means global application of best standards. Not UK, not US, but global. That is what best practice means.

Which team or country that is in the top tier of football anywhere invites open applications for coaches?

[greg]

Angolan coach (now former ), also applied for the SE coaching job and is also in the running.

i don't mind this dude either. Great with tactics and set pieces. Didn't see enough of game readership though. Two Peseiro boys now in the running.
I just refuse to be drawn in the foreign vs local/black vs white nonsense. Good coach or no good coach is all our focus should be on.

[greg]

It is discrimination when the NFF boss tell the press they will not even consider a local coach then turn around and hire a foreign coach that has losing track record. Cant even get a job outside Africa That is discrimination, colo mentality. Anyways still have hope a local coach will be appointed. Even if that local coach fails. That should not disqualify a local coach from ever been considered.


The only foreign coach that has had success after leaving Nigeria is Lars Lagerback and he was a short term barely 3 months coach. He then went on to do well with Iceland. There is a proven track record of bad foreign coaches getting the Nigerian head coach role.

Nigeria should get to a point that the failure of a local coach doesn't necessitate the hiring of a foreign coach. We should sink or swim with our own. My goodness, it's 2024. Nigeria as still stands is still a slave coast. A big portion of our people are slaves. I hate to say this, but it is the sad truth.

I actually disagree a little bit. If there is a foreign coach that is good, He should be hired, But the problem is they keep picking bad foreign coaches while discriminating against local coaches. To make things worse, they come up with excuses to keep them, Remember how they attacked Amodu(RIP) for finishing third. The same people said Rohr met his contract requirement, they should keep him.

Florence Omagbemi won Afcon. Randy Waldrum finished 4th at Afcon. The WOWO crowd fought for him like he was a savior. The guy went to the World cup, played a complete defense style. Lost to a 10 man England in the knockout stage, playing defensive football. He comes back to Nigeria. That tournament style football is now struggling to beat Cameroon and will face South Africa next. What does the Wowo crowd say, Waldrum is excellent.

In women's football, we are the Egypt of Africa. 8 titles with zero impact on the world stage. In fact the team with the most defeats and goals conceded at the WC. I will gladly trade an Afcon title for the sort of performance we saw at the last WC. Has nothing to do with the color of the coach. I loved Dedevbo, the coach of the Oshoala U-20 Falconets who almost won the WC, but we've been unlucky with the coaches of the Super Falcons. It's been a Russian Roulette of coaching appointments so all we can do is celebrate and savor the moments whenever we land a good one.

[naijaguy]

We need to snap out of this white/black mentality.
Hire a good coach irrespective of his colour.
The people clamouring for a Nigerian coach will be the first to scream that he's being bribed to field players.
As for those looking for a Pep Guardiola Type of Coach, continue dreaming. To cough out the $50k per month salary for Peserio was difficult, is it the ones earning $2m per month what we can afford?

Jose Peserio and the likes are the best we can afford for now.
The earlier we let this sink, the better for us all.

[ohenhen1]

It is discrimination when the NFF boss tell the press they will not even consider a local coach then turn around and hire a foreign coach that has losing track record. Cant even get a job outside Africa That is discrimination, colo mentality. Anyways still have hope a local coach will be appointed. Even if that local coach fails. That should not disqualify a local coach from ever been considered.


The only foreign coach that has had success after leaving Nigeria is Lars Lagerback and he was a short term barely 3 months coach. He then went on to do well with Iceland. There is a proven track record of bad foreign coaches getting the Nigerian head coach role.

Nigeria should get to a point that the failure of a local coach doesn't necessitate the hiring of a foreign coach. We should sink or swim with our own. My goodness, it's 2024. Nigeria as still stands is still a slave coast. A big portion of our people are slaves. I hate to say this, but it is the sad truth.

I actually disagree a little bit. If there is a foreign coach that is good, He should b

ne hired, But the problem is they keep picking bad foreign coaches while discriminating against local coaches. To make things worse, they come up with excuses to keep them, Remember how they attacked Amodu(RIP) for finishing third. The same people said Rohr met his contract requirement, they should keep him.

Florence Omagbemi won Afcon. Randy Waldrum finished 4th at Afcon. The WOWO crowd fought for him like he was a savior. The guy went to the World cup, played a complete defense style. Lost to a 10 man England in the knockout stage, playing defensive football. He comes back to Nigeria. That tournament style football is now struggling to beat Cameroon and will face South Africa next. What does the Wowo crowd say, Waldrum is excellent.

In women's football, we are the Egypt of Africa. 8 titles with zero impact on the world stage. In fact the team with the most defeats and goals conceded at the WC. I will gladly trade an Afcon title for the sort of performance we saw at the last WC. Has nothing to do with the color of the coach. I loved Dedevbo, the coach of the Oshoala U-20 Falconets who almost won the WC, but we've been unlucky with the coaches of the Super Falcons. It's been a Russian Roulette of coaching appointments so all we can do is celebrate and savor the moments whenever we land a good one.

Na I will have to disagree. I would rather win Afcon and play our style of football at the WC which is offensive football, How many goals did they score at the WC?

[ohenhen1]

Angolan coach (now former ), also applied for the SE coaching job and is also in the running.

His resume is okay. He is 48 and has been a part of the youth system and the national team in Angola. His resume is okay. Let's hear his vision for Nigeria,. I like his scout and youth football background. He is not a journey man coach.

[danfo driver]

Angolan coach (now former ), also applied for the SE coaching job and is also in the running.

His Angolan team was very well coached and the humiliated Peseiro that day.

[Damunk]

I actually disagree a little bit. If there is a foreign coach that is good, He should be hired, But the problem is they keep picking bad foreign coaches while discriminating against local coaches. To make things worse, they come up with excuses to keep them, Remember how they attacked Amodu(RIP) for finishing third. The same people said Rohr met his contract requirement, they should keep him.

This is why nobody really takes you serious in this place. You keep on confirming it with your love for wuru-wuruing-to-the-answer’.

FYI…the people that attacked Amodu and got him sacked for coming third are ‘the same people’ in all probability that got Rohr sacked for coming third. Amodu qualified us for the World Cup and was sacked just like Rohr qualified us for AFCON and got sacked before the tournament. Same mindset.
Meanwhile those that resisted the sacking of Rohr after he met his contractual obligations are in all likelihood ‘the same people’ that objected to the sacking of Amodu.
That’s why I say you are a dishonest person.
Rewriting history and trying to reinvent the definition of logic.

Florence Omagbemi won Afcon. Randy Waldrum finished 4th at Afcon. The WOWO crowd fought for him like he was a savior. The guy went to the World cup, played a complete defense style. Lost to a 10 man England in the knockout stage, playing defensive football. He comes back to Nigeria. That tournament style football is now struggling to beat Cameroon and will face South Africa next. What does the Wowo crowd say, Waldrum is excellent.

What a silly argument.
It’s not really worth reacting to.

But maybe I should:

[joao]

In 2345, the slave coast also known as Nigeria will be looking for a foreign coach. Nigeria was called a slave coast for a reason. The people and their leaders think like slaves

Looks like you are confused. Great to note you admit thinking like a slave.

[ohenhen1]

Wowo and Obidient movement is a major threat to Nigeria. It is even worse than Corruption in my opinion.

[bret- hart]

Wowo and Obidient movement is a major threat to Nigeria. It is even worse than Corruption in my opinion.

Yea because your drug baron president is doing a swell job at the moment

[ohenhen1]

Wowo and Obidient movement is a major threat to Nigeria. It is even worse than Corruption in my opinion.

Yea because your drug baron president is doing a swell job at the moment

if WOWO wasn't a problem there won't be a lot of Japa and foreign imports which is affecting the economy, You will have law makers buy Nigeria goods instead of buying expensive luxury cars. Nigerians won't be importing all of their fuel. They would fix the refineries. The Naira would be stronger. It is not all Tinubu fault.

Obidient movement is like the west cancel culture leftist crowd. highly intolerant people.