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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 8:21 pm 
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omotori wrote:
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theYemster, the question we should all ask is if say for example 9 players instead of 3 had been involved, would they have been sent packing effectively reducing our squad to 13, let's even say 6 players, do you think they would have taken the same decision...I still say it was knee jerk and a better punishment should have been proferred..

agreed.

at least these guys did their patriotic duty & showed up. now they are disgraced like crimminals when some other punishment would have been better for everybody.

what of Obafemi who did not even honor his invitation. where is his punishment.


wut unprofessional thing did obafemi do .. even if he had come he would have been behind kanu , aghahowa and some others ... i dont like the about turn he did but i can vouch for his professionality.

i agree with the suspension. the only shocking thing na Aiyegbeni .. he has a wife now. some peeps will never learn.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 8:26 pm 
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i agree with the suspension. the only shocking thing na Aiyegbeni .. he has a wife now. some peeps will never learn.


wife for green card ? at least he did not do a Kobe :D


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 9:15 pm 
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This is the first time in a long time that the NFA has done something sensible. These players deswerve to be sent home. If big name players like them cannot lead by example then they have no place being in the team. They have disgraced themselves, their nation and most importantly their fans.

I hope though that this is not a one off and will mark a new era in the NFA's running of the national team. Hopefully this sort of treatment will not be reserved for only players. I am sure other non playing staff have to obey simlar rules and if they break them they should be similarly dealt with.

For those who are crying that we are now short of players ... well it is a risk we have to take. That is why there is a squad of 22. Other players will be given a chance and hopefully will rise to the occassion. With these players in the squad we wouldnt have won the cup anyway so all we need now really is a creditable performance in the remaining games we play.

To the NFA ... I say well done and keep it up.
To the arrant players ... ASTALAVISTA BABY!!!


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 9:36 pm 
Waffiman wrote:
You guys are so funny. This has nothing to do with discipline, it has everything to do with victimisation, hence the protest and mutiny by the players. CCC will back down and he will look a joke. Mark my words.

Do you guys really believe it is just these guys that broke camp rules? If the NFA wants to punish players for breaking camp rules, we will have no player left in camp. :P :P :P CCC has victimised these players because they have been outspoken and asked for changes, they have told him to his face what they taught of him, it should be noted that CCC did not invite Baba and Agali. None of the players respect him as a coach, a lot of them do not respect him as a person. So the end result is this kind of disaster, when you master have undermine you publicly, you lose respect but they did not count on how desperate CCC is now. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

CCC is just desperate to cover his incompetence so he is looking for scapegoats to show the world these guys are the reason why I failed. His action justs shows how out of touch he is. What a prat!

Guys, we have just the quickest plane back from Tunis. :x :x :x :x :x

There will be more to come from this story. No worries.

Oga Chief. Abeg ansa my PM.


Waffi, much as it pains me to do this(based on our fall out of Arsenal and Madrid and a certain Veira) :wink: , I agree very much with you. CCC and Co are trying to sweep dirt under the carpet instead of parking it.But some of us are aware that CCC is the joke.
And I am already hearing some reports in some quaters that the action has been called off(much like Nigerian Strikes :P ) so you can guess who the joke is on.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 9:38 pm 
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omotori wrote:
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i agree with the suspension. the only shocking thing na Aiyegbeni .. he has a wife now. some peeps will never learn.


wife for green card ? at least he did not do a Kobe :D


how do u know?

waffiman i think you're putting a nasty spin on all this. What are ur sources in camp feeding you this ? Mutiny? come on man.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:05 pm 
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Just to clarify matters. From what I gather , the players were actually PLEADING, as opposed top DEMANDING that their colleagues be reinstated. But the response has been simply "No going back"

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:09 pm 
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KickOff Chief wrote:
Just to clarify matters. From what I gather , the players were actually PLEADING, as opposed top DEMANDING that their colleagues be reinstated. But the response has been simply "No going back"


Please KOC clarify something once and for all. Have this players been asked to leave or have they been reinstated?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:14 pm 
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knowing Nigeria, its 100% guranteed that a compromise will be worked out.

thats the best win-win for both sides. They will not be expelled.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:16 pm 
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omotori wrote:
knowing Nigeria, its 100% guranteed that a compromise will be worked out.

thats the best win-win for both sides. They will not be expelled.


They need to be expelled, and the expulsion needs to stick otherwise we have lost all credibility as a nation.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:23 pm 
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If you say they won't be expelled then you don't know who CCC is.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:43 pm 
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whomever CCC is, he is not a fool. And he must know that tampering with team morale at this late hour would be crazy. He must also know that his job probably depends on this next game.

if the guys are sent home, Nigeria may chop 3-0 tommorrow.

CCC is not that crazy.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:48 pm 
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If he has the backing of the sports minister his job is probably safe.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 10:55 pm 
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guys, it's not the dismissal of the players i'm unhappy with, it's the bloody timing(forgive my french). The time to lay down the law was during the Faro camp when these guys stayed very late at their clubs .
Even now ,sending these guys home barely a day before we have to win a crucial match against s.africa will seriously dent morale. As we can see the players were quite unhapppy with the decision and came late to training. With this kind of situation, the players may not give their all tomorrow.
A better thing would have been to suspend them for tomorrows game, let them train with the team, then decide what punishment to take AFTER the game with the players' captain kept in the loop during the deliberations


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 11:00 pm 
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omonoba wrote:
guys, it's not the dismissal of the players i'm unhappy with, it's the bloody timing(forgive my french). The time to lay down the law was during the Faro camp when these guys stayed very late at their clubs .
Even now ,sending these guys home barely a day before we have to win a crucial match against s.africa will seriously dent morale. As we can see the players were quite unhapppy with the decision and came late to training. With this kind of situation, the players may not give their all tomorrow.
A better thing would have been to suspend them for tomorrows game, let them train with the team, then decide what punishment to take AFTER the game with the players' captain kept in the loop during the deliberations


I totally disagree, the suspension is justified and should stand. No one man is greater than Nigeria and Nigerians. They should learn that.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 11:28 pm 
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The NFA had no other choice given the circumstances. If true, the players violated strict camp rules and had to be punished.

Never-the-less, if you trade so-called discipline for the humiliation of being dumped out of an international competition, then your fundamental discipline structure is clearly ailing. This happened in the last WC and though I hope we don't witness a reoccurence, a strong stench of "deja vu" fills the air.

Discipline isn't derived from thin air. Rather, it is borne out of respect, credibility and organisation. The NFA has NONE of these key ingredients.

In desperation, NFA continues to drag Nigeria in the mud because it cannot control a bunch of young men. The buck stops with you Mr. Galadima and you are FAILING HOPELESSLY

Suggestions:
1. Stop Stealing
2. Get your house in order and introduce a professional culture
3. Employ a capable and respectable coach
4. Support the coach with a structured discipline system
5. If all else fails, leverage the power vested upon you by FIFA

I can only pray you read this and take action. I doubt you will.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 12:12 am 
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Waffiman wrote:
You guys are so funny. This has nothing to do with discipline, it has everything to do with victimisation, hence the protest and mutiny by the players. CCC will back down and he will look a joke. Mark my words.

Do you guys really believe it is just these guys that broke camp rules? If the NFA wants to punish players for breaking camp rules, we will have no player left in camp. :P :P :P CCC has victimised these players because they have been outspoken and asked for changes, they have told him to his face what they taught of him, it should be noted that CCC did not invite Baba and Agali. None of the players respect him as a coach, a lot of them do not respect him as a person. So the end result is this kind of disaster, when you master have undermine you publicly, you lose respect but they did not count on how desperate CCC is now. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

CCC is just desperate to cover his incompetence so he is looking for scapegoats to show the world these guys are the reason why I failed. His action justs shows how out of touch he is. What a prat!

Guys, we have just the quickest plane back from Tunis. :x :x :x :x :x

There will be more to come from this story. No worries.

Oga Chief. Abeg ansa my PM.


Waffiman, what are you whinning about? First, this players agreed to the rules of the team. There are clear rules, not rules that were fabricated this morning to punish "outspoken" players. I don't know what you are calling victimization if there is a rule saying that you would be faced with so, so and so punishment if you break so, so and so rule; and then this rule is applied to players found erring.

And let's remain objective, we can not debate about heresay. Which other player do we know of that has broken rules, that has been caught and has not been punished? Show me one example (confirmed) and then you have a case that the Coach is being subjective. (And don't start talking about Okocha and Kanu. They did not break any rules).

You talk about Chukwu victimizing the players. Really, that is irrelevant. It would be victimization if he lied that they went partying to punish them. If they adhered to rules that they accepted to adhere to, would Chukwu have had the opportunity to "victimize" them? All this talk about Chukwu not inviting them is irrelevant. They broke rules, so they ought to be punished.

Now, I am going to sound like I am contradicting myself. In circumstances such as these, a true leader is someone who can read the situation carefully, assess all the options and make a sound decision. Certainly, one of the cards he should consider would be leniency and probably a lesser punishment. Considering histories of precedence and knowing the potential long-term impact his decision can make I support the decision to expell those players from camp. Babayaro is one of the most indisciplined players ever to come out of Nigeria, he has been a recurring face in disciplinary issues. He certainly deserves no leniency whatsoever. Agali, from what I gather, has not always been a "good" boy but he is not as disobedient as Babayaro. It is Aiyegbeni that seems to be the most hurt, he is more or less a good boy just hanging out with the wrong crowd. Now, expelling Babayaro alone and suspending the others might be judged as a highly subjective punishment since they all committed the same offense. At the same time, so it would make sense that for the sake of the other two, Babayaro should be allowed to escape with lesser punishment. HOWEVER, if you look at Nigeria's past outings at ANC and other tournaments, discipline has always been the greatest problem. For this reason, a new precedent must be set for instilling discipline. It is only unfortunate that Yakubu and Agali are going to have to bear what might seem an overly harsh punishment for the sake of the future of the team.

Now, most arguing against this decision point to two things:

First, he has alterior motives for coming up with this decision. I am not in Chukwu's mind so I cannot not read it, neither can any other "normal" person in this forum. But really, this arguement is not about "what are the reasons for his making this decision" but about "is this the right action".

Second, many say if other players got away with it in the past, why shouldn't these do? Tricky, but who says the coach doesn't have the right to learn from his mistakes? And it is NEVER too late to do the right thing. That he did the wrong thing in the past is no excuse for him to do the wrong thing now.

Many also say that it would affect our Nations Cup campaign. Let's not be silly here. With what you saw in the first match, do you sincerely think that that team without drastic changes has a future? I don't think so. Unless by some chance a miracle comes up (and miracles to happen). That team is coming home sooner than later either ways, I think it is better we learn a lesson for a change than just get to the semi-finals again (we don't need more silver or bronze medals).

Now, what I think about CCC is a different story, and when it comes to aportioning blames at the end of the day, we should all know better than let the NFA or CCC give the excuse about discipline. They have erred. But again, I would say, this has nothing to do with whether the punishment was right or not. The talk about aportioning blames is an entirely different issue from whether a punishment for indiscipline is right or wrong.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:02 am 
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Not surprising! it the the super bufoons for ya :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Good news though!


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:42 am 
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omotori wrote:
Quote:
theYemster, the question we should all ask is if say for example 9 players instead of 3 had been involved, would they have been sent packing effectively reducing our squad to 13, let's even say 6 players, do you think they would have taken the same decision...I still say it was knee jerk and a better punishment should have been proferred..

agreed.

at least these guys did their patriotic duty & showed up. now they are disgraced like crimminals when some other punishment would have been better for everybody.

what of Obafemi who did not even honor his invitation. where is his punishment.


Atleast Martins was respectful enough not to come. What I mean is that he did not break any of the team's rules, he pulled out to give us the chance to have someone who would give us 100%. It's better not to show up that to come and break rules!


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:51 am 
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omotori wrote:
whomever CCC is, he is not a fool. And he must know that tampering with team morale at this late hour would be crazy. He must also know that his job probably depends on this next game.

if the guys are sent home, Nigeria may chop 3-0 tommorrow.

CCC is not that crazy.


Because of no Yak . babayaro left back replacement dey. Agali? he was a sub anyway. I beg no misyarn. Them don go


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:56 am 
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It looks like Garba Lawal is going to play Left full back against SA.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 2:13 am 
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Mboma wrote:
Not surprising! it the the super bufoons for ya :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Good news though!

no matter how gleeful you are in the wake of this news, the insult is uncalled for


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 2:23 am 
THIS AUGURS WELL FOR THE FUTURE OF NIGERIAN SOCCER, AND...

...those of you who love Nigerian soccer should be applauding this move. It's good for the future of IC's (who have been accused of being intimidated by the highly paid foreign legion) and FC's. C3 may well lose his job after Tunisia but he has struck a positive blow for the future. My only regret is that this didn't happen years ago. Nigeria would have been spared of this now. But better late than never.

I've said it before, I'd populate my squad with high school players if they are the only disciplined players left.

Those of you who are complaining should know you can't achieve anything worthy without cost. Yes, this may severely impact Nigeria's chances here but I look forward to more disciplined tournaments in the future. Like WC'06.

The players complain of shoddy preparations then make themselves part of the problem. How can you convince the players you mean business if you are not ready to take actions that could be costly?

Let's look at C3's tenure and leave the likes of Bora for now and see how undisciplined these players have been:
-Kanu left Arsenal but failed to connect with the rest of the players in Namibia in C3's first match.
-Aiyegbeni was in Benin but refused to participate in a qualifier thus jeopardizing the team's chances.
-Kanu again was supposed to be in camp but instead flew to Nigeria to do a commercial.

What's it with this trio? They live in glamorous cities and have all the time in the world to do night time socializing so why choose a tournament, especially one in which their progression has been so threatened, to do this. And arriving late to the hotel, chances are they would have looked for an excuse to stay away from practice the next day, further jeopardizing the team's chances.

A lot of you would be complaining if it were fringe players who are disciplined suggesting that the NFA wouldn't have the temerity to discipline the big boys. Now the NFA has called your bluff.

Some are saying these boys may now forever refuse to play for the country. Come on. It's not like future coaches would want to invite them anyway. And Nigeria can adequately find new players to replace them. This is not the tradition of indiscipline you want them to pass on to younger players.

Some say the NFA itself is undisciplined so why should they be inflicting punishment on undisciplined players. Simple: it's their role to dish out such.

And if the NFA flops, it's the role of the minister to draw the right amount of blood. And if the minsiter doesn't do his job, Obasanjo hopefully knows what to do. And Obasanjo has the people of Nigeria as boss and they know what to do if he doesn't meet expectations.

Folks, I'm sorry this has to happen but I think Nigerian football and its fans are the ultimate winners.

Bravo to those who have stoutly defended this action here: SHOWNOJA, OLOYE, PA JIMOH, BOMBASTIC, GOLDLEAF, JIGGERMAN21, AKAMOKE et al.

And please this does not necessarily mean Tunisia is over - we could see a new fighting spirit. Those who would be replacing these players are not exactly reporting straight from the playgrounds.
Bell


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2004 2:24 am 
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omonoba, let mboma gloat...wherever there is a valley, you're bound to find a peak and vise versa


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