Time for the SE to go 3-5-2 ?????
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If you only see wingbacks then you are blind. 3-5-2 in this formation has NO wingbacks. It has 3 central Defenders instead of 2.3-5-2 is just porus as hell. The wing backs cannot cover the defense AND provide wing play. The talent rrely exists in the same person, so you end up with an inadequacy one way or another.
So here you have Kalu /Utaka. They aint no wing backs, they're basically wide strikers. Their instinct is not to stay home and protect - its to attack. So a suposed 3-5-2 ends up in reality being a 3-3-4. I don't need to tell you how that's gonna turn out. If you go with more defensive players there its really 5-3-2.
3 at the back and 2 DMs in the center forces the attack wide. Thats why you need to have your wingers cutting off the wings and tracking back like Amunike and Finidi did.
3-5-2 reinforces 2 areas of traditional weakness in nigerian defence: man marking and it plugs in the huge holes left behind Okocha in the center of the field.
Thats why Nigeria is suicidal in trying to play wing backs. Yobo and Udeze just do not get back fast enough. Sweden scored easily TWICE because of that failing.Its nothing about a deficiency in your player selection, its just the nature of that job-description: impossible to fill. I have only ever seen 4 players world ever who were legitimate 2-way wing backs: Cafu, Roberto Carlos, Candela and Lizarazu. In their prime they were all textbook definition of wing back. Other than that players who play that position are usually defenders masquerading as wingers or wingers who are defensive laibilities.
Yes you do. You don't play 3-5-2 as a wing back formation. you play 3 central defenders who stay within the box. Let the wingers close off the wings and the DM's support them also.We don't have the personelly for it. Not even Udeze. Babayaro is close maybe but frankly he's a defensive liability with that backpedalling nonsense. We just don't cant fill the jobs in 3-5-2.
Korea played 3-4-3, definitely not 3-5-2.
Turkey was basically playing 3-6-1, with Hakan Sukur definitely alone up front.
Germany is pathologically inclined to play 3-5-2. Plus they lack any kind of team speed to make 4-4-2 worth it for them. However they do have a surplus of guys that are like 6'3" and weigh a good 190. They can easily field a team of 11 such guys, full back included.. So they play a nominal 3-5-2 (but really more 5-3-2) and try to out-thug the opponent in a 90 min wrestling match which serves their superior size and strength, which is how they beat Korea. We on the other hand we work with medium size players wh have strength ALLIED with speed - its not 3-5-2 raw material.
Brazil mind you had Gilberto Silva PLUS Kleberson at DM. Gilberto Silva alone is 6'3" and has skill set of a CD. We don't even have a Kleberson, let alone a Gilberto.
Plus mos tof all, Brazil Cafu and Roberto Carlos. Those guys are the dictionary definition of "wing-back", even at age 30. They can play an entrire wing all by themeselves with almost no help. To tell you the truth, those guys are not human, they are physical freaks of nature.
You show just me one left footer and one right footer with Nigerian passposrts who can match those two guys for 90 minute stamina, offensive ability AND defensive commitment - let alone the subs that you need for a tournament.
With the personell we have - especially the obvious lack of two tigers at DM, we are just asking to be slaughtered if we play 3-5-2.
I'm sure people will mention Udeze/Yobo. Well, they would be a third rate copy of Cafu/Roberto carlos and as you saw at last ANC, even in 4-4-2 Udeze was not getting the defensive backup he deserved. Can you imagige the kind of gaps that would be behind thme in 3-5-2?
We can use 4-5-1 to do anything that you might want 3-5-2 for - ie to dominate midfield. And we have far more appropriate personell for that 4-5-1, especially if you've got Agali and YAK to play the front runner and can put the likes of JAG/Utaka to break forward in suport. And if needed, that system can switch to an effective 4-3-3 or 4-4-2 without even subbing anyone.
Turkey was basically playing 3-6-1, with Hakan Sukur definitely alone up front.
Germany is pathologically inclined to play 3-5-2. Plus they lack any kind of team speed to make 4-4-2 worth it for them. However they do have a surplus of guys that are like 6'3" and weigh a good 190. They can easily field a team of 11 such guys, full back included.. So they play a nominal 3-5-2 (but really more 5-3-2) and try to out-thug the opponent in a 90 min wrestling match which serves their superior size and strength, which is how they beat Korea. We on the other hand we work with medium size players wh have strength ALLIED with speed - its not 3-5-2 raw material.
Brazil mind you had Gilberto Silva PLUS Kleberson at DM. Gilberto Silva alone is 6'3" and has skill set of a CD. We don't even have a Kleberson, let alone a Gilberto.
Plus mos tof all, Brazil Cafu and Roberto Carlos. Those guys are the dictionary definition of "wing-back", even at age 30. They can play an entrire wing all by themeselves with almost no help. To tell you the truth, those guys are not human, they are physical freaks of nature.
You show just me one left footer and one right footer with Nigerian passposrts who can match those two guys for 90 minute stamina, offensive ability AND defensive commitment - let alone the subs that you need for a tournament.
With the personell we have - especially the obvious lack of two tigers at DM, we are just asking to be slaughtered if we play 3-5-2.
I'm sure people will mention Udeze/Yobo. Well, they would be a third rate copy of Cafu/Roberto carlos and as you saw at last ANC, even in 4-4-2 Udeze was not getting the defensive backup he deserved. Can you imagige the kind of gaps that would be behind thme in 3-5-2?
We can use 4-5-1 to do anything that you might want 3-5-2 for - ie to dominate midfield. And we have far more appropriate personell for that 4-5-1, especially if you've got Agali and YAK to play the front runner and can put the likes of JAG/Utaka to break forward in suport. And if needed, that system can switch to an effective 4-3-3 or 4-4-2 without even subbing anyone.
Ziontrain , I just don't see where you get your Roberto Carlos "getting back in time idea from". One of madrid weak points is when Puyol and Carlos joins the attack , they don't have the DM to plug the holes.
Brazil switched to 3-5-2 to compensate for thier fullbacks not gettin back on time.
BTW , the crux of the discuss is you can play a back 3 in a 3-5-3 or 3-4-3 and be successful , as was seen in Japkor. The koreans and Turks are not particularly physically imposing. 3-5-2 is not alien to the SE , Troussier qualified for France 98 with it. I most impress upon you, that was easiest quilification for any WC we ever had.
All been said , I have said it b4 and will continue to say it , the most successful SE coach will be the one that goes to 4-3-1-2 with 3 DMs. IMHO.
I believe the formation will shore up our weak spots and still have dedicated 3 offensive players . If we cannot get a goal or 2 with Okocha , JAG and whoever in Attack , after dominating the midfield , we have no buisness calling ourselves a African superpower in football.
Brazil switched to 3-5-2 to compensate for thier fullbacks not gettin back on time.
BTW , the crux of the discuss is you can play a back 3 in a 3-5-3 or 3-4-3 and be successful , as was seen in Japkor. The koreans and Turks are not particularly physically imposing. 3-5-2 is not alien to the SE , Troussier qualified for France 98 with it. I most impress upon you, that was easiest quilification for any WC we ever had.
All been said , I have said it b4 and will continue to say it , the most successful SE coach will be the one that goes to 4-3-1-2 with 3 DMs. IMHO.
I believe the formation will shore up our weak spots and still have dedicated 3 offensive players . If we cannot get a goal or 2 with Okocha , JAG and whoever in Attack , after dominating the midfield , we have no buisness calling ourselves a African superpower in football.
Mike Ditka quote :
"I didn't say it in those general terms but I said it like that".
"I didn't say it in those general terms but I said it like that".
Have u guys forgotten how Aghahowa was dealt with by Rio ferdinand and Sol at the World cup? Pls wake up guys! Jag is not effective as the arrowhead, but will be deadly playing from the wings.Watch the demolition of Senegal at the CAN 2000 for a demonstration of power play from the wings.
Aiyegbeni Should start upfront,supported by JAG and Kanu.Utaka can come in to replace either of the three in the latter stages of games.
Rotimi
Okoronkwo Ribo Yobo
Obodo Olofinjana
JAG Jay JAy Kalu/Ekwueme
KAnu
Aiyegbeni
My three kobo
La Reussi
Aiyegbeni Should start upfront,supported by JAG and Kanu.Utaka can come in to replace either of the three in the latter stages of games.
Rotimi
Okoronkwo Ribo Yobo
Obodo Olofinjana
JAG Jay JAy Kalu/Ekwueme
KAnu
Aiyegbeni
My three kobo
La Reussi
In all things and every situation, give thanks to God.
I have no problem with three at the back, especially if we play something like 3-3-3-1 or 3-4-3. I already said that ealier in the thread. But you need three worker DM's - and we cant find even ONE.
If somebody really thinks that Obodo-Olofinjana is sufficent to cover for BOTH Okocha AND the wing backs in a 3-5-2, you are really kidding yourself. Even both of those two guys combined is not half a Makelele or Viera on defensive presence.
3-5-2 witj those two guys at DM against a decent intl team and you will get ripped to shreds in manner that will make Nigeria vs Denmark (1998) seem like a pleasant memory.
If somebody really thinks that Obodo-Olofinjana is sufficent to cover for BOTH Okocha AND the wing backs in a 3-5-2, you are really kidding yourself. Even both of those two guys combined is not half a Makelele or Viera on defensive presence.
3-5-2 witj those two guys at DM against a decent intl team and you will get ripped to shreds in manner that will make Nigeria vs Denmark (1998) seem like a pleasant memory.
"Jose Mourinho favoured directness and used to throw Robert Huth or John Terry up front when Chelsea were chasing the game, a ploy associated with the industrial era of English football management."
- The Guardian UK, November 26, 2007
- The Guardian UK, November 26, 2007
This is all really a waste of time, or wishful thinking at best.
CCC is in charge, remember?! And with his outdated, slow, uneducated, clueless, rigid, ..., one-track mind, it's going to be 4-4-2 all the way!! Whether it follows common sense or not. For heaven's sake, 3-5-2 or any other formation hasn't even seriously occurred to him.
So perhaps it would be more productive to think of how best we could execute CCC's exalted (and only) 4-4-2 formation with the resources at our disposal.
And Ayo, I wouldn't be too hellbent on the Olofinjana-Obodo partnership if I were you, otherwise you will get a heartbreak. IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. Period.
CCC is in charge, remember?! And with his outdated, slow, uneducated, clueless, rigid, ..., one-track mind, it's going to be 4-4-2 all the way!! Whether it follows common sense or not. For heaven's sake, 3-5-2 or any other formation hasn't even seriously occurred to him.
So perhaps it would be more productive to think of how best we could execute CCC's exalted (and only) 4-4-2 formation with the resources at our disposal.
And Ayo, I wouldn't be too hellbent on the Olofinjana-Obodo partnership if I were you, otherwise you will get a heartbreak. IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. Period.
The SUPER EAGLES shall rise again!