Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De Vrij

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wiseone
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Re: Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De

Post by wiseone »

Van Gaal and Holland were tactically brilliant today. I do not think it was a case of Spain "bottling" it. Rather, Holland's tactics were spot on:

1) They played a counter-attacking game and used the wings. Spain's full backs (especially Alba) love to attack more than defend. Holland simply allowed Spain's full backs to roam forward, then as soon as Holland recovered position, immediately attacked in the wide defensive spaces vacated by Spain's full backs.

2) Crossfield diagonal passes. A very simple but effective tactic. Daley Blind's lofted passes across the field were the perfect way to get the ball forward quickly and catch Spain's full backs upfield. Danny Blind's kid looks a terrific prospect.

Strangely enough these were the same tactics that Manchester United TRIED to use against Barcelona in the 2011 Champions League final. It failed in 2011 but worked against many of the same Spanish players today because Holland had Robben, Van Persie, and Blind executing the same plan. Manchester United had Park, Hernandez, and Valencia executing theirs...
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Re: Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De

Post by Coach »

@Mate, having seen Atletico demolish the cuteness of La Liga with an aggressive press, audacious switches and raking longballs, twas of absolutely no surprise that Van Gaal chose to go for war rather than play chess. Granted his tactical masterpiece bordered on genius, but the manner in which Holland decimated the lilly livered, yellow bellied, metrosexuals was more haymaker than box clever. Once they'd broken through the guard, the hooks were as hard as Ken Norton. Daley Blind high up on the left, Robben scurrying infield dragging the left-centre with him, left Chelsea's rookie unguarded. He was ravaged and seen pressing tissue to his back passage at full-time.

...Then theres the substitutions, removing Alonso, conceded everything, the goal, the game, pride and shame. Tis too easy to claim it a convenient collapse by all things Spanish. Re-e-wind, when the crowd says Bo Selecta...Chile's use of a 3/5 man defence exposed Spain's attacking strategy a few years back, Italy had them puffy-eyed and red nosed like a rhinophymic reindeer with their "Ngr nil - Spain 3, Keshi inspired" 3-4-2-1, five at the back in the defensive phase. What Candreva done to Alba, that which none of the all inspiring Eagles did, Robben done to both fullbacks yesterday. How often did the same Alba coranated and crowned Igwe vs Nigeria, overlap yesterday? Both Robins/-bens peeled wide, pressed high, Jordi was shutdown and made to look like Efe Ambrose at left back after a backstreet meeting with a topcoat, turned up collar and dark shades sporting, Ejide.

Chile will be a classic, certainly a red card and fisticuffs. Tis all or nothing for Spain, back to Fabregas upfront perhaps? Should thry fail, they'll have a perfect excuse.
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Re: Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De

Post by wale1974 »

mate wrote:This came out of nowhere. I still think Spain is too talented and deep for a 1st round elimination. Heck, I even think they can beat Brazil next round.

Spain played too complacently. They didn't put enough grit in when it counted. I also think they deviated from their game plan a bit. Once up 1 - 0, they usually work possession, forcing the other team to press, whereupon they effectively counter. They pressed a bit more than usual today. They played higher up in defense rather than in depth. That beautiful Robben 1st goal was the result of a breakdown originating from playing too high up.

t's early. Let's see if this is really a negative inflection point. Given the confed cup thrashing by Brazil, it's tempting to think so. But I'm not yet convinced this is the case.

The burden of proof is on Chile here. They might smell blood. Let's see 2nite what they have against Australia.

One thing is for sure: Holland looks like a potential winner. That squad out there had everything. Power. Pace. Unity. Spirit. Tactical discipline. Gritty defense. A few magicians.

Holland is the one team I feel that Brazil should be most wary of. For some reason, the Dutch always seem to give Brazil a tough game. And this time...Holland looks like they have many more guns.

Cheers, Mate
It so amazing how they always turn average players into true grits. On paper they look weak but on the field they are something else. This team is going to be around for a while, just look at that back four.
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Re: Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De

Post by slyk »

wale1974 wrote:
mate wrote:This came out of nowhere. I still think Spain is too talented and deep for a 1st round elimination. Heck, I even think they can beat Brazil next round.

Spain played too complacently. They didn't put enough grit in when it counted. I also think they deviated from their game plan a bit. Once up 1 - 0, they usually work possession, forcing the other team to press, whereupon they effectively counter. They pressed a bit more than usual today. They played higher up in defense rather than in depth. That beautiful Robben 1st goal was the result of a breakdown originating from playing too high up.

t's early. Let's see if this is really a negative inflection point. Given the confed cup thrashing by Brazil, it's tempting to think so. But I'm not yet convinced this is the case.

The burden of proof is on Chile here. They might smell blood. Let's see 2nite what they have against Australia.

One thing is for sure: Holland looks like a potential winner. That squad out there had everything. Power. Pace. Unity. Spirit. Tactical discipline. Gritty defense. A few magicians.

Holland is the one team I feel that Brazil should be most wary of. For some reason, the Dutch always seem to give Brazil a tough game. And this time...Holland looks like they have many more guns.

Cheers, Mate
It so amazing how they always turn average players into true grits. On paper they look weak but on the field they are something else. This team is going to be around for a while, just look at that back four.
I think all this praise for the Dutch team is quite premature. In the first half they were very ordinary even poor and were enabled by some shambolic individual Spanish displays in the second half. I am not saying that they will not turn out to be quite exceptional but let's see them in three more games.
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Re: Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De

Post by tolahs »

Great match but how much better can the Dutch get? & how much worse can Spain get? we wait in anticipation - Tiki-taka w/o pressure on the ball when not in possession is destined to fail. Neither Barca or Spain have had standout CDs or great defensive FBs whilst they've dominated world footie.
Does Spain still have the legs to press like they used to? Can they pass a quicker ball?!!!
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Re: Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De

Post by kalani JR »

tolahs wrote:Great match but how much better can the Dutch get? & how much worse can Spain get? we wait in anticipation - Tiki-taka w/o pressure on the ball when not in possession is destined to fail. Neither Barca or Spain have had standout CDs or great defensive FBs whilst they've dominated world footie.
Does Spain still have the legs to press like they used to? Can they pass a quicker ball?!!!
Puyol, Ramos, Pique, Arbeloa?
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Re: Spain 1 - 5 Holland: 2H Alonso (p); RVPx2, Robbenx2, De

Post by Vincent. »

kolinzo wrote:
Vincent. wrote:1. Complete and utter humiliation for Spain.

2. The hungrier team won. The Spaniards were just strolling around the pitch as if it was their birthright for Holland to just lie down and let them win.

3. They shot themselves in the foot by arrogantly nicking Diego Costa from Brazil and taking him to a World Cup that is hosted by Brazil: this means that the fans will make every match hell for them

4. For those inevitably chanting the latest fashionable slogan "Tiki-taka is dead," there was no tiki-taka on display. What I saw were long balls to Diego Costa and a bunch of pompous players strolling around as if they own the place.
You didn't watch this match if you think Spain was just strolling.

You didn't watch this match if you think tiki taka was not on display.

Truth, Holland shut them down. It wasn't due to any arrogance from Spain. It is not arrogance when you are beaten 5-1. It is called a beatdown!
If you think that was the normal tiki-taka that achieved so much success, then you are mistaken about what tiki-taka means (at least in the form that has served Barca/Spain very well in recent years). If tiki-taka means just passing, passing, and passing the ball, then every team in the world plays tiki-taka. Even Holland are masters of tiki-taka (Johan Cruyff brought it from Hollad to Barca decades ago).

The style of tiki-taka that has brought Barca/Spain huge successes in the past six years involves quick, one-touch passing triangles, and quick movement combined with extreme pressing to recover the ball when it is lost. That speed of passing and pressing to quickly recover the ball allows Barca/Spain to play a high defensive line. However, when the speed of passing and movement are slow (which I meant by strolling around) and the pressing is not intense enough, Barca/Spain do not control the midfield and the opposition is able to to win the ball and launch counter-attack into acres of space behind the high defensive line, which is what Robben and Van Persie exploited brilliantly in the second half.

Spain played something close to their normal tiki-taka in the first half in addition to using long balls to Diego Costa, and they did create some chances. However, even most of their passing in the first half involved Pique and Ramost stroking the ball between themselves. In the second half, they were simply too slow in midfield and Del Bosque did not make adjustments to protect the center backs or move the defense closer to goal, so Robben was able to run at the CDs at will.
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