Cybereagles

platinum wrote:

Cellular wrote:

platinum wrote:
They missed Thiago Silva for that big time. When you have knuckleheads like david luiz and marcelo who have no discipline, you need someone to rein them in, they didnt have it.

Momentum is a mother!

I dey happy about this. They were taught a lesson in football, the movement of schweini, ozil, kroos, muller, klose.....germany were playing a different sport and brazil were found out.

Meanwhile, they were booing fred like it was his fault they just conceded 7.

Guy you talk thrash. First off take Ozil off that list and secondly what exactly has Fred done all tournament?

Mr. Piffington wrote:

Alert!!!..the just concluded match on tv Germany vs. Brazil is a PlayStation version....stay tune for the real match in 30 mins!!!

kolinzo wrote:

Vincent. wrote:

kolinzo wrote:

Vincent. wrote:

kolinzo wrote:Let's give it up for total football!!

Scolari taking responsibility for this loss. Now that's a coach!!

You mean tiki-taka is no longer dead?

Nothing tiki taka about what the Germans did. They were direct and on point. No need for 90% possession like the team we know. Tiki taka is dead.

So, you think tiki-taka means 90% possession? Maybe you should go and watch Barca from 2008/2009 or even Barca in the CL final against your Man U and see the possession stats. The possession stats started mounting after teams began playing 10 defenders in from of their penalty boxes.

In this match, Brazil simply had no defense, talk less of parking 10 defenders. Hence, there was no need huge amounts of passes to try to open up the defense.

You are trying too hard Vincent. Tiki Taka is dead just like Samba!

Wrong again: football styles don't die, they evolve. When someone says one style is dead, you immediately know that he does not understand what he is talking about.
Brazil is no longer playing Samba because they no longer produce the necessary types of players. You cannot expect Ramirez or Paulinho to play Samba football.

soma wrote:got to love everything about the Germans and Germany as a country. Don't dabble in other peoples political issues, have the power to influence a lot on world stage side by side the Americans but choose not to. Britain and France make so much noise in Europe you'd think Germany was in Asia.

Country run well, health service, roads trains etc are top notch. Less inmoral than most western countries. The list goes on and on.

I have always known that you are daft.

how did Ozil play?

zee wrote:

soma wrote:got to love everything about the Germans and Germany as a country. Don't dabble in other peoples political issues, have the power to influence a lot on world stage side by side the Americans but choose not to. Britain and France make so much noise in Europe you'd think Germany was in Asia.

Country run well, health service, roads trains etc are top notch. Less inmoral than most western countries. The list goes on and on.

I have always known that you are daft.

did I type that? Mods I've been hacked by platinum..

anikulapo wrote:how did Ozil play?

His best game of the WC so far and that's because Brazil were rubbish. Had enough room to roam as was afforded him by Brazils full backs.

This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

asabatex wrote:Brazilian Goalie Julio Ceasar is completely useless. He is the main reason why Brazil.

...how is he useless when you have target shooters right in front of you shooting away. Even the great USA Tim Howard may not be able to stop all that onslaught.

soma wrote:

zee wrote:

soma wrote:got to love everything about the Germans and Germany as a country. Don't dabble in other peoples political issues, have the power to influence a lot on world stage side by side the Americans but choose not to. Britain and France make so much noise in Europe you'd think Germany was in Asia.

Country run well, health service, roads trains etc are top notch. Less inmoral than most western countries. The list goes on and on.

I have always known that you are daft.

did I type that? Mods I've been hacked by platinum..

Gotta admit that was funny. Small pikin dey worry you.

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

You are right. I the EPL we have the top 3 honing French players rather than English players. Money has been the bane of the EPL and the premier league refusing to work with the FA in this regard.

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

Theoretically sounds good how do you explain Brazil coached by big phil in 02 as you mentioned? How do you explain france in 98? Brazil made a systemic commitment to getting bigger and stronger to match the Europeans.
The types of players cherished by teams in brazil has gone away from what used to be cherished. The sad bit is there are no young really exceptional talents coming up right now, the few raw young guys are really raw and more kerlon than ronaldo. We'll see how they react.

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soma wrote:

anikulapo wrote:how did Ozil play?

His best game of the WC so far and that's because Brazil were rubbish. Had enough room to roam as was afforded him by Brazils full backs.

...as rubbish as they were today, SE could have beaten them too

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

Brazil won the 2002 WC with their best players all based in Europe.

Heliopolis wrote:

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

Brazil won the 2002 WC with their best players all based in Europe.

When you have the 'real' Ronaldo, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho,you will win any WC...............coach or no coach!!!!!!!!!!!!!

onwuatuegwu wrote:How much do they pay Scolari again?

...Nigerian FA can't pay that

Heliopolis wrote:

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

Brazil won the 2002 WC with their best players all based in Europe.

and most of them were in Europe in 1994 as well. I dunno what this "mate" of a man is talking about!

zee wrote:

Heliopolis wrote:

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

Brazil won the 2002 WC with their best players all based in Europe.

When you have the 'real' Ronaldo, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho,you will win any WC...............coach or no coach!!!!!!!!!!!!!

...note, those players were not as baby and sissy-like emotional as these ones today. men crying on the field for a pk shootout

Heliopolis wrote:

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

Brazil won the 2002 WC with their best players all based in Europe.

It's since 2002 especially that Europe has started to really leverage the gains of top leagues and CL competition.

I don't know for sure, but I bet over time that more South Americans move to Europe earlier than used to be the case. My guess is that this is what is disrupting their former development. I know for sure that this has hurt Croatia...as we used to keep players into their early 20s before they went abroad...developing and finishing their football style together, playing amidst Croatians.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for truly exceptional players playing on the strongest teams. Even from a young age. Messi went to Barcelona academy when he was 13 or so.

But if most of your players do this, you'll lose to the host countries, whom reap the most benefits. Would you agree that Messi on Barcelona helped Xavi, Puyol, Iniesta, Busquets, and co and Spain more than Argentina? It seems this has evolved in the past 15 years or so.

Lastly...look at the 2002 Brazil team...Ronaldo, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho, Carlos, Lucio, etc...compared to the current crop. Something accounts for the difference, not only individually, but how they play as a team. My guess is that it is rooted in what I said: namely, the center of gravity of football being in Europe.

We need multiple centers of gravity. South America. And, yes, Africa. Russia. Asia.

Again, this is just my 2 cents.

Cheers, Mate

Heliopolis wrote:

mate wrote:This for me is a consequence of having players concentrated in clubs augmented by the world's best players in top league and intra continental competition. Throw on top of this cutting edge academies, sports science, and program management. It makes a difference in a game where the margins are so small. Even amongst tier 1 teams, never mind nations not there yet.

Think of Spain with Barcelona and Real. And you better believe that Spain will be back, with a decent pipeline of players. Germany has Bayern and Dortmund. Italy too has this going on with several clubs.

Don't you think if Boca Jrs, River Plate, Flamengo, Club America, Cruz Azul, Seattle Sounders and so...retaining top players in top leagues, playing in a top Americas CL...giving European teams top competition for world club cups...wouldn't this make a difference for respective NT programs? What if South America had top leagues, the marketing, and the branding? These are all competitive multipliers.

Again, I see this as a key margin of difference. It ultimately allows European countries to hone and cement their style. I believe this is why Argentina and Brazil haven't played to their lofty standards, both in results and style.

Nobody is saying Brazil has to be 1982 jogo bonito. But Brazil surely can still be skilled and occasionally artistic while being strong, ruthless, and versatile. Sorry, but Brazil today was a throwback to some cynical Italian or even German teams of the past.

But that's just my observation, maybe just an opinion? I don't know. But I miss Brazil...not 1982, which isn't realistic...but 1994 and 2002 Brazil. It can be done, where they show their heritage and continue to evolve.

Cheers, Mate

Brazil won the 2002 WC with their best players all based in Europe.

But if you take a close look, most came to Europe at a slightly older age and thereby retaining most of their samba education. Now they come at a very young age.