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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:01 am 
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danfo driver wrote:
Coach wrote:
@Danfo, on the contrary, no one compared Pogba and Sissoko, rather the need for Pogba and what could be gotten from Sissoko.


Even if that was the gentleman's motive, then thats even just as laughable.

1. Can Sissoko control games?
2 Does Sissoko have suprior passing range?
3. Can Sissoko read the game in the manner necessary for deep lying playmaker?
4 Can Sissoko provide the most assist in a league?

On the club side:

1. Can Sissoko bring in the amount of money in image rights Pogba is going to pull in?
2. Can Sissoko lead a team to win a league title, rather than relegaton?


I am sorry, but Sissoko cannot give them what Pogba can give them.


Quote:
As for the ESPN article, bog standard white man's world responding to the threat of a black man daring to be the most expensive player in the world. Ask Bale to do a fraction of what Ronaldinho did, yet they keep insisting up his value for money.


:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:


They are even starting to say Pogba does not score 50 goals a season hence he doesn't deserve to cost 100 million.

Pogba's potential record breaking transfer won't sit well with many and they will be on his case all the time, he has to be prepared mentally


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:20 am 
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@Danfo, the point has been missed once more. United don't need Pogba to make a genuine attempt at the title. In Martial-Rooney-Mkhitarayan they have a very capable triumvirate. Zlatan, who knows what he'll bring, but even Memphis, with proper guidance, could flourish. Mata would walk into many lineups and adds further to their options. In defence, providing fitness, they're reasonably ok and certainly, in the base of midfield, are much the same. Pogba will be wonderful addition, but is not the difference between success and failure. Even Sissoko would add am injection of power, pace, certainly not the panache and overall technical capability that Pogba does have. In abundance...but is that what Mourinho wants here? United won't field Pogba is his roaming Juventus role, rather the energetic, advanced stopper ala Matic, presumably. There are others who could do that, not as good, but good enough, for a fraction of the price.

@Benteke, re: the article, t'is no more than the stereotypical athletic ape picture being portrayed. All that was amiss was a reference to musculature and dense negroid coating, with an ad lib from Big Ron Atkinson. One could omit Pogba from the article and substitute any failed black applicant, of footballing background, who auditioned for the England job. Harum scarum, lack of intelligence, all power, no panache...in other words, big, black and clumsy. Read any reference to black defenders in sports journalism, the blacker the berry the more consistent the report. When Stones was doing the David Luiz, twas the innocent ignorance of youth. When Mangala did the same, twas the pressure of the transfer fee, lack of concentration, ability to read the game, over reliance on physical prowess. In other words, Big, Black and Clumsy.

Pogba isn't worth 100 million, no footballer is, but such is the distorted metric scale of their industry. PB is about to begin the most expensive player in the world, a jet black man whom none can claim ownership of other than the obvious. Who will knock him off that perch? The white world shudders at the thought.


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:47 am 
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danfo driver wrote:

I read the repugnant article and I was ashamed that a black man like yourself will post such a demeaning article. It is a shame! The writer should spend more time watching Pogba and many other technically gifted and intelligent BLACK footballers, rather than spewing stereotypes. Sad sad shame that a black man, like yourself, has allowed himself to be used in promoting such nonsense. Sad sad sad!

I would have been ashamed of you if you were a black man. It appears you are black, it appears you are male, but you are certainly not a "man". This is b/c I doubt if you are over 18. I also know that no real man could be comfortable being another man's groupie like you are with Borinho.

Your groupie tendencies push you to all manner of tantrums in your defence of your hero. So rather than deal with the truth in the article that such a limited player is not worth £100m, you chose to play the race card, blissfully unaware of how such frivolous accusations of racism undermine the cause against racial discrimination b/c they are used by racists to dismiss genuine claims of racism.

Of course, I expect this point to be over your head. After all, your hero Borinho dismissed claims that black coaches were discriminated against by claiming anyone good enough would get a job (implying that black coaches were not good enough).

People like you are why Chris Rock claimed that black men don't read and if you wanted to hide something from them put it in a book. You didn't read the article or did but didn't understand it (which is even worse, but not surprising considering you are as dumb as a doorknob).

For starters, it is not clear the writer is white. All we have is a name. You may not be aware that black people are sportswriters. But let's go along with your assumption that he is white and look for traces of racism in the article.

The 1st para talked about the wealth of the EPL.

2nd para questions the quality of the English game. Is the writer "racist" against the English?

3rd para suggests the signing of Pogba reflects the questions about the quality of the English game b/c of his playing style - driving midfielder with power and pace. If you had even basic comprehension skills, you'd recognise this is more of a criticism of the English game than of Pogba. And it is 100% true.

4th para continues about the nature of Pogba's game - it lacks "subtlety" that you would expect from a £100m player. He is still young but has not shown the "game intelligence" of the likes of Messi, Ronaldo or Suarez, and critically, this would not hinder his advancement in England (another big criticism of the English game!). These points about Pogba are spot on and have nothing to do with his race. To claim it is about race is to ignore the fact that the writer is saying the English game is played without "game intelligence". Black players are just about 30% in England. So the writer is claiming that more whites than blacks (70%) play without "game intelligence" in England. Do you see how stupid you are? I doubt it, you lack the intelligence to see it.

5th para continues on this theme - the emphasis in England is on physicality, no time to think, if you can run 90mph you'd do well. Pogba with his explosive bursts should fit in. It goes on to suggest "flaws in technique" would matter more in Madrid/Barcelona than at OT. Once again, 100% true and more criticism of the EPL than Pogba. Someone like Fabregas was an absolute star in England, but "flaws in his technique" made him less of a star at Barca and he was regularly booed by his own fans. I also think that Pogba's technique is very questionable and I suspect this was why neither Barca nor Real were willing to step in for him. And they usually have first refusal on the genuine world stars.

6th para - more of the same, slamming the EPL.

7th para - backs up the argument with the claims of Rafa about no tactics. Del Bosque talked about "tactical anarchy" at OT.

8th and 9th para - bashes Big Sam (is he black?) and suggests he played a big role in determining the "direction" of the English game. Coincidentally, someone once described Borinho as "a rich man's Allardyce" and he is the one shelling out £100m for Pogba. The real story is that Pogba is not worth that amount and Borinho is willing to authorise the pymt b/c £20m would go to Pogba's agent and Borinho would get a slice of that pie.

10th para talks about the English in Europe and how Liverpool used a high tempo game to beat Dortmund and Villareal, but were undone by a more thinking Sevilla. Where is the racism here? No blacks at Sevilla and Liverpool all black???

11th para contrasts Bayern, Barca, Madrid and Atleti with English clubs. "Racist" against the English??

12th para claims Pogba should be at home in England b/c of the way he plays. He doesn't control the rhythm of the game. True or false?

13th para says Pogba would add to the "excitement" in the EPL but would not make Manure CL contenders. The only things "black and white" here are the colours of Juve.

He concludes with another dig at the EPL - expensive players but not the best football. Anyone that has watched the EPL and Pogba wouldn't disagree.

There was nothing racial about the article unless you have the demented view that an assumed white journalist has no right to be critical of a black player. Racism is a pattern of behaviour. There is no pattern here when the discussion was just about one black guy. The only pattern here is in the writer's criticism of the English game.

There was an article yesterday questioning why Juve paid £70m for Higuain. I said I wouldn't pay 1m naira for him. By your demented "logic", we may be "racist" towards Argies.

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 11:49 am 
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@CIC, when Bale, one of the great exponents of pace and power, rose to prominence on the back of such virtues, was he afforded the same ink for critique? Journalists and analysts has every right to appraise the performer, but parity should be exercised and prejudice, uninvited. Was Bale technically sound, effortlessly intelligent, or were his stellar moments clad in lillywhite made of blistering pace and thunderbolt power in the strike? Was Maicon done by Messi-esque trickery or the "can run for days" quality packed into his Welsh wellies? There is a stereotype that resonates throughout football that black players are athletes as opposed to intellects. Go back a few years and hear the arguments of would be black captains who never were. There is an undertone that resonates in the above piece, whether intentional or merely regurgitation of consensus amongst sporting commentators, it cannot be denied.

Pace. Power. Lack of intelligence. A young man, who, at a very early age took steps that would shape his career at a time when others bowed in subservience to the messianic Ferguson. Unintelligent. A young man who has flourished in what is, stereotypically, the most difficult, defensively minded, tactically astute league, according to many, unintelligent. A young man who has excelled as a defensive, box to box and attacking midfielder, effortless transitioning between the three. Unintelligent. Who is of Einsteinian cerebral fortitude? Jack Wilshere, Cesc Fabregas, Mesut Ozil and yet when asked to occupy positions outside of their niche, all have proven dullards. Mesut wide right, Fabregas at the bade of midfield, Wilshere deep-lying playmakers. All failed experiments and yet, by the jury of the tabloid, theirs is in-game intelligence.

There is without doubt an undertone in the article, would one go as far as racist or rather a reflection of the wider societies view on the black sportsman. It will pain the establishment to see Pogba on the throne and for that reason alone, one hopes he is crowned.


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 12:12 pm 
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Coach wrote:
@CIC, when Bale, one of the great exponents of pace and power, rose to prominence on the back of such virtues, was he afforded the same ink for critique? Journalists and analysts has every right to appraise the performer, but parity should be exercised and prejudice, uninvited. Was Bale technically sound, effortlessly intelligent, or were his stellar moments clad in lillywhite made of blistering pace and thunderbolt power in the strike? Was Maicon done by Messi-esque trickery or the "can run for days" quality packed into his Welsh wellies? There is a stereotype that resonates throughout football that black players are athletes as opposed to intellects. Go back a few years and hear the arguments of would be black captains who never were. There is an undertone that resonates in the above piece, whether intentional or merely regurgitation of consensus amongst sporting commentators, it cannot be denied.

Pace. Power. Lack of intelligence. A young man, who, at a very early age took steps that would shape his career at a time when others bowed in subservience to the messianic Ferguson. Unintelligent. A young man who has flourished in what is, stereotypically, the most difficult, defensively minded, tactically astute league, according to many, unintelligent. A young man who has excelled as a defensive, box to box and attacking midfielder, effortless transitioning between the three. Unintelligent. Who is of Einsteinian cerebral fortitude? Jack Wilshere, Cesc Fabregas, Mesut Ozil and yet when asked to occupy positions outside of their niche, all have proven dullards. Mesut wide right, Fabregas at the bade of midfield, Wilshere deep-lying playmakers. All failed experiments and yet, by the jury of the tabloid, theirs is in-game intelligence.

There is without doubt an undertone in the article, would one go as far as racist or rather a reflection of the wider societies view on the black sportsman. It will pain the establishment to see Pogba on the throne and for that reason alone, one hopes he is crowned.


:agree:
Thank you coach again.


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 12:14 pm 
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Coach wrote:
@CIC, when Bale, one of the great exponents of pace and power, rose to prominence on the back of such virtues, was he afforded the same ink for critique? Journalists and analysts has every right to appraise the performer, but parity should be exercised and prejudice, uninvited. Was Bale technically sound, effortlessly intelligent, or were his stellar moments clad in lillywhite made of blistering pace and thunderbolt power in the strike? Was Maicon done by Messi-esque trickery or the "can run for days" quality packed into his Welsh wellies? There is a stereotype that resonates throughout football that black players are athletes as opposed to intellects. Go back a few years and hear the arguments of would be black captains who never were. There is an undertone that resonates in the above piece, whether intentional or merely regurgitation of consensus amongst sporting commentators, it cannot be denied.

Pace. Power. Lack of intelligence. A young man, who, at a very early age took steps that would shape his career at a time when others bowed in subservience to the messianic Ferguson. Unintelligent. A young man who has flourished in what is, stereotypically, the most difficult, defensively minded, tactically astute league, according to many, unintelligent. A young man who has excelled as a defensive, box to box and attacking midfielder, effortless transitioning between the three. Unintelligent. Who is of Einsteinian cerebral fortitude? Jack Wilshere, Cesc Fabregas, Mesut Ozil and yet when asked to occupy positions outside of their niche, all have proven dullards. Mesut wide right, Fabregas at the bade of midfield, Wilshere deep-lying playmakers. All failed experiments and yet, by the jury of the tabloid, theirs is in-game intelligence.

There is without doubt an undertone in the article, would one go as far as racist or rather a reflection of the wider societies view on the black sportsman. It will pain the establishment to see Pogba on the throne and for that reason alone, one hopes he is crowned.

Did you read the article?

The article said Pogba has shown few signs of "game intelligence". I agree. It also says that "thinkers" don't thrive in England. So how is this a racist stereotype?

Bale's transfer tag was questioned by many. This article talks about him being just about pace and strength. That's being "racist".
https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/pitch ... 44732.html

Zizou says the price tag is "incomprehensible" and it was carried by the "racist" Daily Mail.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... h-86m.html

Players like Fabregas, Ibra, and others also questioned the amount shelled out. Fabregas' tactical intelligence was questioned big time at Barca. Please leave Wilshere out of this discussion!

Where is the "undertone" in the article. Or do you have to close your eyes in order to see it?

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 12:26 pm 
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Fabregas' tactical intelligence questioned by "racists"

Quote:
From the outset the then-24-year-old appeared lost in Pep Guardiola’s quick-passing, highly-disciplined setup, and, while his goals and assists combined for an impressive stat sheet, the statistics hid what was, from the very beginning, a very uncomfortable reunion.

By his second season at Camp Nou, Fabregas was a regular target of the Barcelona boo-boys. And ahead of a Champions League quarterfinal against Paris Saint-Germain, Pique shed some light on why that was.

“Here in Spain it’s always about passing the ball from one side to the other. But it’s not just passing—you have to be in the right place to receive it, and you have to develop a quick mind to see the pass, to know what you are going to do next,” he told the Telegraph.

I can see how Cesc,” he added, “would like to have more freedom, as he used to have at Arsenal. But you have to play according to where you are, of course.”

It was a not-so-veiled critique of his teammate’s lack of tactical discipline.


Quote:
From the get-go the ex-Arsenal skipper was a peripheral figure, and perhaps his failure to properly bed into the system came down, at least in part, to the fact that he was never going to displace one of three—particularly Xavi and Iniesta, both of whom were, and are, once-in-a-generation players.

That, combined with a perceived loss of Barcelona ideals while in the Premier League, turned what was supposed to be a happy reunion into heartbreak for the player and disappointment for the club.


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2077 ... -go-wrong#

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 12:26 pm 
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Oga cic old boy and oga Coach both of you take a bow.You guys have put down some solid points.


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:33 pm 
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@CIC, you have missed the point entirely. Where is the substantiation the claim of unintelligence? Is it in the topping of assist charts for Juventus? Was in finishing third for completed passes at the Euros?

How does quoting Pep Guardiola offer comparison? The charge against Pogba is a lack of intelligence, how is that justified? Perhaps discourse should be directed here. One's own assertion is this charge stems from the same seed that sees Mangala as clumsy and Stones as, young, expressive, when making the same mistake.

Kindly provide quotes of a lack of intelligence relating to Fabregas.


Last edited by Coach on Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:33 pm 
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The Frenchman lacks some of the subtlety that a £100 million-plus fee should bring. He is still young, but he shows few signs of game intelligence of the likes of Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo or Luis Suarez. That would not be a drawback in England.

There is too much emphasis on physicality in the Premier League. Doers, not thinkers, thrive. If you're young and can run and run, you'll fit in nicely. Pogba, with his bursts of explosiveness, would be an instant star. The flaws in his technique would matter less at Old Trafford than they would at the Bernabeu or the Camp Nou.
Pogba has the technique and intelligence to play anywhere. He is better in the Prem though or perhaps Real Madrid...if he goes to Barca they might do to him what they did to Toure, Keita, Masharano and Song, sacrifice his offensive talents to accommodate one of theirs. It is preposterous to insinuate that he somehow lacks the subtlety and intelligence to play in the La Liga.

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Last edited by airwolex on Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:34 pm 
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Benedict Iroha wrote:
Why man utd pay that much for the guy I won't understand


He wouldn't be overrated if Chelsea got him. Though I gotta agree, 120m is crazy money for one player. But if that helps Man U get better and go back to winning doubles and trebles again, it may be money well spent.

Besides Man U is planning to clear out some dead woods.

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:39 pm 
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@Air, f*ck them! It pains them that a jet black dullard is soon to be crowned King, with no heir in sight.


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 2:38 pm 
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Coach wrote:
@CIC, you have missed the point entirely. Where is the substantiation the claim of unintelligence? Is it in the topping of assist charts for Juventus? Was in finishing third for completed passes at the Euros?

How does quoting Pep Guardiola offer comparison? The charge against Pogba is a lack of intelligence, how is that justified? Perhaps discourse should be directed here. One's own assertion is this charge stems from the same seed that sees Mangala as clumsy and Stones as, young, expressive, when making the same mistake.

Kindly provide quotes of a lack of intelligence relating to Fabregas.

The "unintelligence" is not coming from Pogba! I have asked you to read the article.

This is what the man said:
Quote:
The Frenchman lacks some of the subtlety that a £100 million-plus fee should bring. He is still young, but he shows few signs of game intelligence of the likes of Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo or Luis Suarez. That would not be a drawback in England.

There is too much emphasis on physicality in the Premier League. Doers, not thinkers, thrive. If you're young and can run and run, you'll fit in nicely. Pogba, with his bursts of explosiveness, would be an instant star. The flaws in his technique would matter less at Old Trafford than they would at the Bernabeu or the Camp Nou.

Rather than read the article, you have relied on editorialising by Okokoborinko who was trying to twist this as a comment stereotyping black people as lacking intelligence.

For starters, the issue is not general intelligence, but "game intelligence". Another phrase for it is "tactical intelligence". The writer didn't say Pogba lacked it, but that he has shown "few signs of the likes" of Messi, Ronaldo and Suarez "game intelligence". He then emphasises that this missing tool should not be a drawback in England b/c the game there is not for the thinking player. So the writer's real beef is about the English game and not Pogba. That's why several of "WE" are getting worked up!

If you understand the concept of "game intelligence" you would not come up with stuff about assists and completed passes. "Game intelligence" is a whole lot more than that. It is about controlling the game, dictating the tempo, the use of space, knowing when to make runs, when to release the ball, spotting dangers b/4 they happen, being a few plays ahead of the opposition, etc. Abeg, assists could come from mishit shots, deflections off your backsides, etc and completed passes include sideways passes of two yards. You should see Mikelele's stats for completed passes! :lol: As per leading in assists in Serie A, you should know that Serie A today is a poor imitation of the Serie A in the 80s/90s.

Who quoted Guardiola? The article quoted Rafa:
Quote:
Rafa Benitez once said that tactics barely matter in England. "Compete for the first ball, win the second ball," was the Spaniard's dismissive view of English strategy. He might have exaggerated for effect, but there is a germ of truth in the assertion.


Fabregas' limited tactical intelligence is legendary. I've already quoted Pique on this. Even Carra slammed Fab on this score. "He lacks tactical intelligence, especially defensively. That's one of the reasons Barcelona let Chelsea take him."
http://www.eurosport.co.uk/football/pre ... tory.shtml

Even Fab admitted how things were different when he went back to Spain.

Quote:
The first distinction he notes is on the tactical side of the game. At Arsenal, Fabregas had something akin to a free role. It was one in which he could use his judgement, roam the field, and look to create scoring chances from any number of spots.

So much of Barcelona’s success is built on the club’s unique system and style of play. Players are taught to play the “Barca Way” from a young age, and Fabregas has added a tactical discipline to his game that was not required in English soccer.

“Here, it’s completely different,” he said. “Everyone has their own place and it’s important you stick to your position. It took a while to remember stuff I’d learnt as a kid at Barcelona. But the memory is coming back and I’m improving game by game.”

“In Spain, it’s tactically much stronger than the Premier League,”
he adds. “But in England there is this passion. You are always trying to attack because the fans don’t want you to keep possession for long … A very different kind of football is played in Spain and England.”

“We train more, here, definitely. It was different at Arsenal. Sometimes after games we’d stay inside the gym but here we’re always outside, with the ball, practising, working tactically. Even if we play almost every three days we hardly have a day off. We train a lot –- nearly every day.”

Read more at: http://nesn.com/2012/03/cesc-fabregas-s ... hree-ways/

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:26 pm 
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cic old boy wrote:
Coach wrote:
@CIC, you have missed the point entirely. Where is the substantiation the claim of unintelligence? Is it in the topping of assist charts for Juventus? Was in finishing third for completed passes at the Euros?

How does quoting Pep Guardiola offer comparison? The charge against Pogba is a lack of intelligence, how is that justified? Perhaps discourse should be directed here. One's own assertion is this charge stems from the same seed that sees Mangala as clumsy and Stones as, young, expressive, when making the same mistake.

Kindly provide quotes of a lack of intelligence relating to Fabregas.

The "unintelligence" is not coming from Pogba! I have asked you to read the article.

This is what the man said:
Quote:
The Frenchman lacks some of the subtlety that a £100 million-plus fee should bring. He is still young, but he shows few signs of game intelligence of the likes of Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo or Luis Suarez. That would not be a drawback in England.

There is too much emphasis on physicality in the Premier League. Doers, not thinkers, thrive. If you're young and can run and run, you'll fit in nicely. Pogba, with his bursts of explosiveness, would be an instant star. The flaws in his technique would matter less at Old Trafford than they would at the Bernabeu or the Camp Nou.

Rather than read the article, you have relied on editorialising by Okokoborinko who was trying to twist this as a comment stereotyping black people as lacking intelligence.

For starters, the issue is not general intelligence, but "game intelligence". Another phrase for it is "tactical intelligence". The writer didn't say Pogba lacked it, but that he has shown "few signs of the likes" of Messi, Ronaldo and Suarez "game intelligence". He then emphasises that this missing tool should not be a drawback in England b/c the game there is not for the thinking player. So the writer's real beef is about the English game and not Pogba. That's why several of "WE" are getting worked up!

If you understand the concept of "game intelligence" you would not come up with stuff about assists and completed passes. "Game intelligence" is a whole lot more than that. It is about controlling the game, dictating the tempo, the use of space, knowing when to make runs, when to release the ball, spotting dangers b/4 they happen, being a few plays ahead of the opposition, etc. Abeg, assists could come from mishit shots, deflections off your backsides, etc and completed passes include sideways passes of two yards. You should see Mikelele's stats for completed passes! :lol: As per leading in assists in Serie A, you should know that Serie A today is a poor imitation of the Serie A in the 80s/90s.

Who quoted Guardiola? The article quoted Rafa:
Quote:
Rafa Benitez once said that tactics barely matter in England. "Compete for the first ball, win the second ball," was the Spaniard's dismissive view of English strategy. He might have exaggerated for effect, but there is a germ of truth in the assertion.


Fabregas' limited tactical intelligence is legendary. I've already quoted Pique on this. Even Carra slammed Fab on this score. "He lacks tactical intelligence, especially defensively. That's one of the reasons Barcelona let Chelsea take him."
http://www.eurosport.co.uk/football/pre ... tory.shtml

Even Fab admitted how things were different when he went back to Spain.

Quote:
The first distinction he notes is on the tactical side of the game. At Arsenal, Fabregas had something akin to a free role. It was one in which he could use his judgement, roam the field, and look to create scoring chances from any number of spots.

So much of Barcelona’s success is built on the club’s unique system and style of play. Players are taught to play the “Barca Way” from a young age, and Fabregas has added a tactical discipline to his game that was not required in English soccer.

“Here, it’s completely different,” he said. “Everyone has their own place and it’s important you stick to your position. It took a while to remember stuff I’d learnt as a kid at Barcelona. But the memory is coming back and I’m improving game by game.”

“In Spain, it’s tactically much stronger than the Premier League,”
he adds. “But in England there is this passion. You are always trying to attack because the fans don’t want you to keep possession for long … A very different kind of football is played in Spain and England.”

“We train more, here, definitely. It was different at Arsenal. Sometimes after games we’d stay inside the gym but here we’re always outside, with the ball, practising, working tactically. Even if we play almost every three days we hardly have a day off. We train a lot –- nearly every day.”

Read more at: http://nesn.com/2012/03/cesc-fabregas-s ... hree-ways/


CIC..You are wasting your time trying to reason with folks that will find racism in a pitch black room arguing with an aborigine...

Once a white man writes something they disagree with,then its racism or there is a racial undertone...

Viera,Eto'o,Desailly,Weah,Henri..all black men that have been lauded for being with the very best tactically and physically in the game...But no..when anyone dares critique a black man, they must unleash all the forces of Hades on the writer...

Pogba will be a failure at United,mark my words. He doesn't even have that much pace he's being credited for and he certainly wont have all the time that he has on the ball in Italy


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:33 pm 
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airwolex wrote:
Quote:
The Frenchman lacks some of the subtlety that a £100 million-plus fee should bring. He is still young, but he shows few signs of game intelligence of the likes of Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo or Luis Suarez. That would not be a drawback in England.

There is too much emphasis on physicality in the Premier League. Doers, not thinkers, thrive. If you're young and can run and run, you'll fit in nicely. Pogba, with his bursts of explosiveness, would be an instant star. The flaws in his technique would matter less at Old Trafford than they would at the Bernabeu or the Camp Nou.
Pogba has the technique and intelligence to play anywhere. He is better in the Prem though or perhaps Real Madrid...if he goes to Barca they might do to him what they did to Toure, Keita, Masharano and Song, sacrifice his offensive talents to accommodate one of theirs. It is preposterous to insinuate that he somehow lacks the subtlety and intelligence to play in the La Liga.



No The reason he wont cut it at Barca is because he is not good enough. When will you guys accept that Pogba is Conman. He is at best a poor man's version of Viera. We all watched the Euros at his own backyard and he was MIA. But then again he will do ok in the EPL because like Pogba, the EPL is overrated and loaded with overrated overprized overhyped players like *drum roll* Pogba :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:24 pm 
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The other issue here is that we have the usual anti EPL aka La Liga fans seem to be upset that Pogba is going to EPL worse still to Man Utd, instead of La Liga :taunt: :biggrin:

If it was Madrid that was buying Pogba for 100million i think there'd be lots of gushing on here right now about how much guile he has and how he will be a success, i notice Yujam is no longer defending the boy from anti EPL jackals on CE, i remember Yujam as a strong admirer of Pogba when he was a Juventus :laugh: :laugh:


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:58 pm 
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bret- hart wrote:
airwolex wrote:
Quote:
The Frenchman lacks some of the subtlety that a £100 million-plus fee should bring. He is still young, but he shows few signs of game intelligence of the likes of Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo or Luis Suarez. That would not be a drawback in England.

There is too much emphasis on physicality in the Premier League. Doers, not thinkers, thrive. If you're young and can run and run, you'll fit in nicely. Pogba, with his bursts of explosiveness, would be an instant star. The flaws in his technique would matter less at Old Trafford than they would at the Bernabeu or the Camp Nou.
Pogba has the technique and intelligence to play anywhere. He is better in the Prem though or perhaps Real Madrid...if he goes to Barca they might do to him what they did to Toure, Keita, Masharano and Song, sacrifice his offensive talents to accommodate one of theirs. It is preposterous to insinuate that he somehow lacks the subtlety and intelligence to play in the La Liga.



No The reason he wont cut it at Barca is because he is not good enough. When will you guys accept that Pogba is Conman. He is at best a poor man's version of Viera. We all watched the Euros at his own backyard and he was MIA. But then again he will do ok in the EPL because like Pogba, the EPL is overrated and loaded with overrated overprized overhyped players like *drum roll* Pogba :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:08 pm 
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bret- hart wrote:
airwolex wrote:
Quote:
The Frenchman lacks some of the subtlety that a £100 million-plus fee should bring. He is still young, but he shows few signs of game intelligence of the likes of Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo or Luis Suarez. That would not be a drawback in England.

There is too much emphasis on physicality in the Premier League. Doers, not thinkers, thrive. If you're young and can run and run, you'll fit in nicely. Pogba, with his bursts of explosiveness, would be an instant star. The flaws in his technique would matter less at Old Trafford than they would at the Bernabeu or the Camp Nou.
Pogba has the technique and intelligence to play anywhere. He is better in the Prem though or perhaps Real Madrid...if he goes to Barca they might do to him what they did to Toure, Keita, Masharano and Song, sacrifice his offensive talents to accommodate one of theirs. It is preposterous to insinuate that he somehow lacks the subtlety and intelligence to play in the La Liga.



No The reason he wont cut it at Barca is because he is not good enough. When will you guys accept that Pogba is Conman. He is at best a poor man's version of Viera. We all watched the Euros at his own backyard and he was MIA. But then again he will do ok in the EPL because like Pogba, the EPL is overrated and loaded with overrated overprized overhyped players like *drum roll* Pogba :roll:
Pogba and Coman, are two great ballers...no need to talk, time will tell.

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 3:26 am 
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cic old boy wrote:
danfo driver wrote:

I read the repugnant article and I was ashamed that a black man like yourself will post such a demeaning article. It is a shame! The writer should spend more time watching Pogba and many other technically gifted and intelligent BLACK footballers, rather than spewing stereotypes. Sad sad shame that a black man, like yourself, has allowed himself to be used in promoting such nonsense. Sad sad sad!

I would have been ashamed of you if you were a black man. It appears you are black, it appears you are male, but you are certainly not a "man". This is b/c I doubt if you are over 18. I also know that no real man could be comfortable being another man's groupie like you are with Borinho.

Your groupie tendencies push you to all manner of tantrums in your defence of your hero. So rather than deal with the truth in the article that such a limited player is not worth £100m, you chose to play the race card, blissfully unaware of how such frivolous accusations of racism undermine the cause against racial discrimination b/c they are used by racists to dismiss genuine claims of racism.

Of course, I expect this point to be over your head. After all, your hero Borinho dismissed claims that black coaches were discriminated against by claiming anyone good enough would get a job (implying that black coaches were not good enough).

People like you are why Chris Rock claimed that black men don't read and if you wanted to hide something from them put it in a book. You didn't read the article or did but didn't understand it (which is even worse, but not surprising considering you are as dumb as a doorknob).

For starters, it is not clear the writer is white. All we have is a name. You may not be aware that black people are sportswriters. But let's go along with your assumption that he is white and look for traces of racism in the article.

The 1st para talked about the wealth of the EPL.

2nd para questions the quality of the English game. Is the writer "racist" against the English?

3rd para suggests the signing of Pogba reflects the questions about the quality of the English game b/c of his playing style - driving midfielder with power and pace. If you had even basic comprehension skills, you'd recognise this is more of a criticism of the English game than of Pogba. And it is 100% true.

4th para continues about the nature of Pogba's game - it lacks "subtlety" that you would expect from a £100m player. He is still young but has not shown the "game intelligence" of the likes of Messi, Ronaldo or Suarez, and critically, this would not hinder his advancement in England (another big criticism of the English game!). These points about Pogba are spot on and have nothing to do with his race. To claim it is about race is to ignore the fact that the writer is saying the English game is played without "game intelligence". Black players are just about 30% in England. So the writer is claiming that more whites than blacks (70%) play without "game intelligence" in England. Do you see how stupid you are? I doubt it, you lack the intelligence to see it.

5th para continues on this theme - the emphasis in England is on physicality, no time to think, if you can run 90mph you'd do well. Pogba with his explosive bursts should fit in. It goes on to suggest "flaws in technique" would matter more in Madrid/Barcelona than at OT. Once again, 100% true and more criticism of the EPL than Pogba. Someone like Fabregas was an absolute star in England, but "flaws in his technique" made him less of a star at Barca and he was regularly booed by his own fans. I also think that Pogba's technique is very questionable and I suspect this was why neither Barca nor Real were willing to step in for him. And they usually have first refusal on the genuine world stars.

6th para - more of the same, slamming the EPL.

7th para - backs up the argument with the claims of Rafa about no tactics. Del Bosque talked about "tactical anarchy" at OT.

8th and 9th para - bashes Big Sam (is he black?) and suggests he played a big role in determining the "direction" of the English game. Coincidentally, someone once described Borinho as "a rich man's Allardyce" and he is the one shelling out £100m for Pogba. The real story is that Pogba is not worth that amount and Borinho is willing to authorise the pymt b/c £20m would go to Pogba's agent and Borinho would get a slice of that pie.

10th para talks about the English in Europe and how Liverpool used a high tempo game to beat Dortmund and Villareal, but were undone by a more thinking Sevilla. Where is the racism here? No blacks at Sevilla and Liverpool all black???

11th para contrasts Bayern, Barca, Madrid and Atleti with English clubs. "Racist" against the English??

12th para claims Pogba should be at home in England b/c of the way he plays. He doesn't control the rhythm of the game. True or false?

13th para says Pogba would add to the "excitement" in the EPL but would not make Manure CL contenders. The only things "black and white" here are the colours of Juve.

He concludes with another dig at the EPL - expensive players but not the best football. Anyone that has watched the EPL and Pogba wouldn't disagree.

There was nothing racial about the article unless you have the demented view that an assumed white journalist has no right to be critical of a black player. Racism is a pattern of behaviour. There is no pattern here when the discussion was just about one black guy. The only pattern here is in the writer's criticism of the English game.

There was an article yesterday questioning why Juve paid £70m for Higuain. I said I wouldn't pay 1m naira for him. By your demented "logic", we may be "racist" towards Argies.


Awww you wrote quite a lot, but i didnt even bother reading it :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 3:29 am 
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airwolex wrote:
bret- hart wrote:
airwolex wrote:
Quote:
The Frenchman lacks some of the subtlety that a £100 million-plus fee should bring. He is still young, but he shows few signs of game intelligence of the likes of Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo or Luis Suarez. That would not be a drawback in England.

There is too much emphasis on physicality in the Premier League. Doers, not thinkers, thrive. If you're young and can run and run, you'll fit in nicely. Pogba, with his bursts of explosiveness, would be an instant star. The flaws in his technique would matter less at Old Trafford than they would at the Bernabeu or the Camp Nou.
Pogba has the technique and intelligence to play anywhere. He is better in the Prem though or perhaps Real Madrid...if he goes to Barca they might do to him what they did to Toure, Keita, Masharano and Song, sacrifice his offensive talents to accommodate one of theirs. It is preposterous to insinuate that he somehow lacks the subtlety and intelligence to play in the La Liga.



No The reason he wont cut it at Barca is because he is not good enough. When will you guys accept that Pogba is Conman. He is at best a poor man's version of Viera. We all watched the Euros at his own backyard and he was MIA. But then again he will do ok in the EPL because like Pogba, the EPL is overrated and loaded with overrated overprized overhyped players like *drum roll* Pogba :roll:
Pogba and Coman, are two great ballers...no need to talk, time will tell.



Lol he compared Pogba to vieira because Pogba is tall, black and French. :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: good to se those who watch football on the pages of website. Lmaooo Pogba and vieira :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

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:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:36 am 
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danfo driver wrote:

Awww you wrote quite a lot, but i didnt even bother reading it :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Thanks for the confirmation.
Quote:
People like you are why Chris Rock claimed that black men don't read and if you wanted to hide something from them put it in a book. You didn't read the article or did but didn't understand it (which is even worse, but not surprising considering you are as dumb as a doorknob).

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:31 pm 
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cic old boy wrote:
danfo driver wrote:

Awww you wrote quite a lot, but i didnt even bother reading it :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Thanks for the confirmation.
Quote:
People like you are why Chris Rock claimed that black men don't read and if you wanted to hide something from them put it in a book. You didn't read the article or did but didn't understand it (which is even worse, but not surprising considering you are as dumb as a doorknob).


Awww Fidler, i see you wrote again, and i didnt read again :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

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 Post subject: Re: Pogba is overrated
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:24 pm 
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kajifu wrote:
Oga cic old boy and oga Coach both of you take a bow.You guys have put down some solid points.


I have gone through CiC's angle over again, my problem with him, he is so anti-EPL he can actually defend some sketchy stuff debatable articles just to bash EPL.

For me, Pogba is more overpriced than overrated.
But then again which player isn't overpriced in this current transfer market, especially when EPL clubs are the ones doing the buying amidst this imminent bumper tv deal.

To me Pogba would be just as overpriced as Bale or Higauin, but the overrated argument is a totally different story.


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