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 Post subject: Re: NPFL 2019 Season
PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2019 1:05 am 
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TonyTheTigerKiller wrote:
ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ukwala,

How are you? What do people think about the appointment of Benedict "Suru-gede" Ugwu as Rangers coach? What is his coaching background? Is he up to snuff? Also what is the general take on the club's recruitment of players. It will be a shame if both Enyimba and Rangers fail to go far considering the early exit of Pillars, especially. For Tornadoes, I really never expected much from them to begin with.

EII, I am fine thanks. Trust you are too. Thanks for reviving this thread, though after this reply, we may need to start a fresh thread for the 2019/2020 season.

I don't think any fan is sold on Surugede as Rangers coach, and it would appear neither is the club Management as he is but a caretaker coach. He has been Youth coach in Rangers for a couple of seasons but nothing spectacular and we are still waiting for the substantive coach.
MFM's former coach, Fidelis Ilechukwu, who may not have won anything yet but did very well to keep MFM among the top teams (much like Pochetino at Spurs) was touted at some point but he ended up in Heartland.
The Brazilian, Rafael Everton, who has been at Ifeanyi Ubah and Akwa United was also touted but so far nothing yet. He is still free, having just left Akwa United and so may yet end up with us and though I am not a big fan, I won't be too displeased to see him at Rangers (afterall he won the Confed cup - FA cup - with FCIU). I still remember with Nostalgia, the exploits of his compatriot, Roberto Diaz in the early 80's.

A number of new players have been recruited - Kehinde Adedipe (Rivers United), Obinna Eleje (unattached), Agu Kenechukwu (Lamryl United), Uche John (Enyimba), Ibrahim Olawoyin (Abia Warriors) and the most notable of them Ikechukwu Ibenegbu (alias mosquito, the veteran attacking midfielder who has been all over the place and lately with Enyimba). A couple were promoted from the youth team (Surugede boys??).
On the downside, we lost two of our best players of last season; our captain Godwin Aguda who left for a 2nd division team in Saudi Arabia, and Bright Silas (much loved goalscoring wide midfielder) who moved to a club in Egypt. We also lost Bobby Clement who was injured for much of last season and has returned to Kuwait for a second spell there.

Not knowing the current form of the team with all the changes in players and coaches, we can only hope and pray that they do well both at home and on the continent when the season starts soon. Our pre-season preparation however seems to be going well; we defeated Heartland (Ilechukwu et al) in Okigwe (Heartland's home) on Wednesday and will play Warri Wolves tomorrow Sunday in Warri. We also won the inuagural edition of the Enugu FA super cup (???).


Ukwala,

Thanks for the update. I sensed that this Suru-gede stuff isn't going to cut it but I was not sure. The loss of Amapakabo and then Ogunbote were big, in my opinion. I did not know what Suru-gede has done previously as coach. It seemed to me his claim is simply being a former Rangers' player.

Ilechukwu had shown ability to mold unknown names at MFM to become a respectable team year after year and I believe he will do well at Heartland. At MFM, he lost players annually to better financed clubs but kept the club at the top with unknown guys every year.

It really will be disappointing if Rangers join Pillars and Tornadoes as eliminated teams in the continent. I am not at all enthused by the recruitment. To contest for the continental trophies, our clubs must recruited the best players around the continent. We cannot compete against clubs from North Africa, South Africa, and Congo DR that recruit across the continent. We blame our continental woes on coaching in Nigeria but I believe it is a lazy cop-out. There are numerous reasons for non-performance and that includes poor recruitment. I read a recent interview of Esperance managers and they pointed out the importance of recruiting continent-wide if you hope to win in Africa. I have always believed this. Enyimba's victory in Africa was a major recruitment of the best Nigerian talent spearheaded by then NFF Sec-Gen Ogunjobi. Although it was not continent-wide but Enyimba was virtually home-based SE in those two years. Depending on regular recruitment of local talent as Rangers appear to have done instead of seeking Africa-wide talent is not going to cut it. It is a huge gap. Of course, there are other issues.

EII,

Surugede hasn’t done it anywhere as a coach and if he is given the job on a permanent basis, it would be a massive gamble.

Ilechukwu should do well at Heartland. He was unveiled by the Governor (I assume that means he is interested!) and Papillo, his Special Adviser on Sports, should be able to lend his considerable weight to his former club.

Nigerian clubs are plagued by the general societal issues; inadequate funding, weak league (poor management and a paucity of facilities), no motivation (constant breach of contracts), etc. etc. Some, like Rangers, do have players from other African countries but they are understandably not the best of the bunch.

Clubs that do well on the continent are well funded, well managed (mostly private owned) and well supported. As for me, I will just try and enjoy the games and hope for the best. I can’t say I am optimistic because there is no basis for optimism.

If Rangers conquer the local league again this year to tie Enyimba on 8 apiece, I will be more than happy.


It is so inappropriate to make such sweeping judgements about Surugede considering that not even one coach ever got his first job with any experience in coaching. I would just wish him the best and hope he succeeds :!:


Cheers.



TTTK,

Na waoooo! What is inappropriate in Ukwala's take?

Yes, a coach who gets his first job has no experience. However, how many inexperienced coaches get their first opportunity with a big club? That is the point Ukwala is making and I certainly agree with that. A club like Rangers FC is expected to hire an experienced coach. That is, perhaps, why Surugede is considered a caretaker at this time at Rangers. Let's see what he makes of the opportunity but his hiring is surely unexpected at a club like Rangers.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


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 Post subject: Re: NPFL 2019 Season
PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2019 2:53 pm 
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Posts: 2472
Location: Nigeria
Enugu II wrote:
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote:
ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ukwala,

How are you? What do people think about the appointment of Benedict "Suru-gede" Ugwu as Rangers coach? What is his coaching background? Is he up to snuff? Also what is the general take on the club's recruitment of players. It will be a shame if both Enyimba and Rangers fail to go far considering the early exit of Pillars, especially. For Tornadoes, I really never expected much from them to begin with.

EII, I am fine thanks. Trust you are too. Thanks for reviving this thread, though after this reply, we may need to start a fresh thread for the 2019/2020 season.

I don't think any fan is sold on Surugede as Rangers coach, and it would appear neither is the club Management as he is but a caretaker coach. He has been Youth coach in Rangers for a couple of seasons but nothing spectacular and we are still waiting for the substantive coach.
MFM's former coach, Fidelis Ilechukwu, who may not have won anything yet but did very well to keep MFM among the top teams (much like Pochetino at Spurs) was touted at some point but he ended up in Heartland.
The Brazilian, Rafael Everton, who has been at Ifeanyi Ubah and Akwa United was also touted but so far nothing yet. He is still free, having just left Akwa United and so may yet end up with us and though I am not a big fan, I won't be too displeased to see him at Rangers (afterall he won the Confed cup - FA cup - with FCIU). I still remember with Nostalgia, the exploits of his compatriot, Roberto Diaz in the early 80's.

A number of new players have been recruited - Kehinde Adedipe (Rivers United), Obinna Eleje (unattached), Agu Kenechukwu (Lamryl United), Uche John (Enyimba), Ibrahim Olawoyin (Abia Warriors) and the most notable of them Ikechukwu Ibenegbu (alias mosquito, the veteran attacking midfielder who has been all over the place and lately with Enyimba). A couple were promoted from the youth team (Surugede boys??).
On the downside, we lost two of our best players of last season; our captain Godwin Aguda who left for a 2nd division team in Saudi Arabia, and Bright Silas (much loved goalscoring wide midfielder) who moved to a club in Egypt. We also lost Bobby Clement who was injured for much of last season and has returned to Kuwait for a second spell there.

Not knowing the current form of the team with all the changes in players and coaches, we can only hope and pray that they do well both at home and on the continent when the season starts soon. Our pre-season preparation however seems to be going well; we defeated Heartland (Ilechukwu et al) in Okigwe (Heartland's home) on Wednesday and will play Warri Wolves tomorrow Sunday in Warri. We also won the inuagural edition of the Enugu FA super cup (???).


Ukwala,

Thanks for the update. I sensed that this Suru-gede stuff isn't going to cut it but I was not sure. The loss of Amapakabo and then Ogunbote were big, in my opinion. I did not know what Suru-gede has done previously as coach. It seemed to me his claim is simply being a former Rangers' player.

Ilechukwu had shown ability to mold unknown names at MFM to become a respectable team year after year and I believe he will do well at Heartland. At MFM, he lost players annually to better financed clubs but kept the club at the top with unknown guys every year.

It really will be disappointing if Rangers join Pillars and Tornadoes as eliminated teams in the continent. I am not at all enthused by the recruitment. To contest for the continental trophies, our clubs must recruited the best players around the continent. We cannot compete against clubs from North Africa, South Africa, and Congo DR that recruit across the continent. We blame our continental woes on coaching in Nigeria but I believe it is a lazy cop-out. There are numerous reasons for non-performance and that includes poor recruitment. I read a recent interview of Esperance managers and they pointed out the importance of recruiting continent-wide if you hope to win in Africa. I have always believed this. Enyimba's victory in Africa was a major recruitment of the best Nigerian talent spearheaded by then NFF Sec-Gen Ogunjobi. Although it was not continent-wide but Enyimba was virtually home-based SE in those two years. Depending on regular recruitment of local talent as Rangers appear to have done instead of seeking Africa-wide talent is not going to cut it. It is a huge gap. Of course, there are other issues.

EII,

Surugede hasn’t done it anywhere as a coach and if he is given the job on a permanent basis, it would be a massive gamble.

Ilechukwu should do well at Heartland. He was unveiled by the Governor (I assume that means he is interested!) and Papillo, his Special Adviser on Sports, should be able to lend his considerable weight to his former club.

Nigerian clubs are plagued by the general societal issues; inadequate funding, weak league (poor management and a paucity of facilities), no motivation (constant breach of contracts), etc. etc. Some, like Rangers, do have players from other African countries but they are understandably not the best of the bunch.

Clubs that do well on the continent are well funded, well managed (mostly private owned) and well supported. As for me, I will just try and enjoy the games and hope for the best. I can’t say I am optimistic because there is no basis for optimism.

If Rangers conquer the local league again this year to tie Enyimba on 8 apiece, I will be more than happy.


It is so inappropriate to make such sweeping judgements about Surugede considering that not even one coach ever got his first job with any experience in coaching. I would just wish him the best and hope he succeeds :!:


Cheers.



TTTK,

Na waoooo! What is inappropriate in Ukwala's take?

Yes, a coach who gets his first job has no experience. However, how many inexperienced coaches get their first opportunity with a big club? That is the point Ukwala is making and I certainly agree with that. A club like Rangers FC is expected to hire an experienced coach. That is, perhaps, why Surugede is considered a caretaker at this time at Rangers. Let's see what he makes of the opportunity but his hiring is surely unexpected at a club like Rangers.

Kpom. Surugede has not even been main assistant coach at any club and Rangers Management made it clear when they hired him that he was just a caretaker coach pending the appointment of a substantive coach. If they end up giving him the job, it would be a big gamble. That is not to say that gambles don't pay off; Zidane's did at Real Madrid. Whatever happens, I wish him nothing but the best.


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 Post subject: Re: NPFL 2019 Season
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 5:15 pm 
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How did Ogunjobi assist Enyimba's recruitment? This sounds interesting. Would you mind sharing more details?

Enugu II wrote:

It really will be disappointing if Rangers join Pillars and Tornadoes as eliminated teams in the continent. I am not at all enthused by the recruitment. To contest for the continental trophies, our clubs must recruited the best players around the continent. We cannot compete against clubs from North Africa, South Africa, and Congo DR that recruit across the continent. We blame our continental woes on coaching in Nigeria but I believe it is a lazy cop-out. There are numerous reasons for non-performance and that includes poor recruitment. I read a recent interview of Esperance managers and they pointed out the importance of recruiting continent-wide if you hope to win in Africa. I have always believed this. Enyimba's victory in Africa was a major recruitment of the best Nigerian talent spearheaded by then NFF Sec-Gen Ogunjobi. Although it was not continent-wide but Enyimba was virtually home-based SE in those two years. Depending on regular recruitment of local talent as Rangers appear to have done instead of seeking Africa-wide talent is not going to cut it. It is a huge gap. Of course, there are other issues.


Last edited by wiseone on Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: NPFL 2019 Season
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:56 pm 
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wiseone,

At the time, Ogunjobi was NFA Sec-Gen and Nigeria was not achieving much in the continent and he (Ogunjobi) made statements that the NFA will get involved in helping the Nigeria rep (Enyimba) recruit the best players in the country by working on negotiations with other Nigerian clubs. The NFA did this but it also led to problems.

If you recall, one of the best players at that time was Ahmed Garba at Pillars. Pillars had a strange agreement with Enyimba (with likely NFA approval). The agreement allowed Garba to play locally in the league for Pillars, while simultaneously playing continental games for Enyimba. This was an obvious violation. Well, after Enyimba won the continental cup, their North African opponents filed a protest with a video showing Garba playing locally for Pillars. Well, CAF ruled in favor of Enyimba after NFA claimed that it could not vouch for the date of the video and its authenticity.

Hopefully, the above gives you an idea on how the NFA, under Ogunjobi's secretaryship, worked with Enyimba to win those continental titles.

wiseone wrote:
How did Ogunjobi assist Enyimba's recruitment. This sounds interesting. Would you mind sharing more details?

Enugu II wrote:

It really will be disappointing if Rangers join Pillars and Tornadoes as eliminated teams in the continent. I am not at all enthused by the recruitment. To contest for the continental trophies, our clubs must recruited the best players around the continent. We cannot compete against clubs from North Africa, South Africa, and Congo DR that recruit across the continent. We blame our continental woes on coaching in Nigeria but I believe it is a lazy cop-out. There are numerous reasons for non-performance and that includes poor recruitment. I read a recent interview of Esperance managers and they pointed out the importance of recruiting continent-wide if you hope to win in Africa. I have always believed this. Enyimba's victory in Africa was a major recruitment of the best Nigerian talent spearheaded by then NFF Sec-Gen Ogunjobi. Although it was not continent-wide but Enyimba was virtually home-based SE in those two years. Depending on regular recruitment of local talent as Rangers appear to have done instead of seeking Africa-wide talent is not going to cut it. It is a huge gap. Of course, there are other issues.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:21 pm 
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Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:48 am 
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wiseone wrote:
Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.


The two above could have been involved, particularly Anyansi but there is little doubt that Ogunjobi undertook it as a project at that time.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:17 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
wiseone wrote:
Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.

The two above could have been involved, particularly Anyansi but there is little doubt that Ogunjobi undertook it as a project at that time.

It was all down to Orji Uzor Kalu...
He masterminded the turnaround of Enyimba from a substantively “feeder” club to a juggernaut.

Kalu unsuccessfully tried to buy the club for most of the 90s, and when he became Gov provided unlimited funds to it. While Anyansi was his point man, he was very involved in the affairs of the club. Any role Ogunjobi played was secondary and wouldn’t have been anything more than as an enabler.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:02 pm 
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I recall that when Kalu was governor, he said he would float Enyimba on the Nigerian Stock Exchange. What happened to that plan for Enyimba to become financially independent?

Gotti wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
wiseone wrote:
Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.

The two above could have been involved, particularly Anyansi but there is little doubt that Ogunjobi undertook it as a project at that time.

It was all down to Orji Uzor Kalu...
He masterminded the turnaround of Enyimba from a substantively “feeder” club to a juggernaut.

Kalu unsuccessfully tried to buy the club for most of the 90s, and when he became Gov provided unlimited funds to it. While Anyansi was his point man, he was very involved in the affairs of the club. Any role Ogunjobi played was secondary and wouldn’t have been anything more than as an enabler.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:46 am 
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wiseone wrote:
I recall that when Kalu was governor, he said he would float Enyimba on the Nigerian Stock Exchange. What happened to that plan for Enyimba to become financially independent?

Gotti wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
wiseone wrote:
Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.

The two above could have been involved, particularly Anyansi but there is little doubt that Ogunjobi undertook it as a project at that time.

It was all down to Orji Uzor Kalu...
He masterminded the turnaround of Enyimba from a substantively “feeder” club to a juggernaut.

Kalu unsuccessfully tried to buy the club for most of the 90s, and when he became Gov provided unlimited funds to it. While Anyansi was his point man, he was very involved in the affairs of the club. Any role Ogunjobi played was secondary and wouldn’t have been anything more than as an enabler.

No club can be financially independent in present day Nigeria. Nigerians love football, yes, but it is a luxury most cannot afford.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2019 2:44 am 
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ukwala,

I believe that clubs can be financially independent in Nigeria. However, the league has to make that amenable in several ways including scheduling and regulations. There are certainly opportunities as well as significant strengths in the Nigerian environment to make it possible but there are major restructuring that would be necessary, in my opinion.

But the idea of floating a Nigerian club in the Stock Exchange as is will simply fail. Why would anyone buy such a stock when the club is losing money and the industry regulation is adverse? Makes little sense. Things have to change ... that is where it starts.

ukwala wrote:
wiseone wrote:
I recall that when Kalu was governor, he said he would float Enyimba on the Nigerian Stock Exchange. What happened to that plan for Enyimba to become financially independent?

Gotti wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
wiseone wrote:
Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.

The two above could have been involved, particularly Anyansi but there is little doubt that Ogunjobi undertook it as a project at that time.

It was all down to Orji Uzor Kalu...
He masterminded the turnaround of Enyimba from a substantively “feeder” club to a juggernaut.

Kalu unsuccessfully tried to buy the club for most of the 90s, and when he became Gov provided unlimited funds to it. While Anyansi was his point man, he was very involved in the affairs of the club. Any role Ogunjobi played was secondary and wouldn’t have been anything more than as an enabler.

No club can be financially independent in present day Nigeria. Nigerians love football, yes, but it is a luxury most cannot afford.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2019 5:55 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
ukwala,

I believe that clubs can be financially independent in Nigeria. However, the league has to make that amenable in several ways including scheduling and regulations. There are certainly opportunities as well as significant strengths in the Nigerian environment to make it possible but there are major restructuring that would be necessary, in my opinion.

But the idea of floating a Nigerian club in the Stock Exchange as is will simply fail. Why would anyone buy such a stock when the club is losing money and the industry regulation is adverse? Makes little sense. Things have to change ... that is where it starts.

ukwala wrote:
wiseone wrote:
I recall that when Kalu was governor, he said he would float Enyimba on the Nigerian Stock Exchange. What happened to that plan for Enyimba to become financially independent?

Gotti wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
wiseone wrote:
Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.

The two above could have been involved, particularly Anyansi but there is little doubt that Ogunjobi undertook it as a project at that time.

It was all down to Orji Uzor Kalu...
He masterminded the turnaround of Enyimba from a substantively “feeder” club to a juggernaut.

Kalu unsuccessfully tried to buy the club for most of the 90s, and when he became Gov provided unlimited funds to it. While Anyansi was his point man, he was very involved in the affairs of the club. Any role Ogunjobi played was secondary and wouldn’t have been anything more than as an enabler.

No club can be financially independent in present day Nigeria. Nigerians love football, yes, but it is a luxury most cannot afford.

EII,

I hear you. You've basically said our clubs, and league, can function profitably if we get our act together!! Fine, but when do you think we can get our act together, pray when do you think the "major restructuring that would be necessary" will happen?? "The league has to make that amenable in several ways including scheduling and regulations" - when do you think this can be realised? The same league that has not been able to start the 2019/2020 season, setting dates and changing at will? I can tell you for free that these things aren't happening any time soon.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2019 8:57 pm 
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Ukwala,

What I am stating is about is HOPE. Doing those things aren't difficult but they require selflessness and commitment. I know that it is difficult to find these days but surely there are still people who can offer that. If not, we just have to close shop and give up. That option is not what I believe in.

ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ukwala,

I believe that clubs can be financially independent in Nigeria. However, the league has to make that amenable in several ways including scheduling and regulations. There are certainly opportunities as well as significant strengths in the Nigerian environment to make it possible but there are major restructuring that would be necessary, in my opinion.

But the idea of floating a Nigerian club in the Stock Exchange as is will simply fail. Why would anyone buy such a stock when the club is losing money and the industry regulation is adverse? Makes little sense. Things have to change ... that is where it starts.

ukwala wrote:
wiseone wrote:
I recall that when Kalu was governor, he said he would float Enyimba on the Nigerian Stock Exchange. What happened to that plan for Enyimba to become financially independent?

Gotti wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
wiseone wrote:
Thanks EnuguII. I had thought all along that the drivers in that nationwide player recruitment were Abia State's governor Orji Kalu and Enyimba's S-G Anyansi.

The two above could have been involved, particularly Anyansi but there is little doubt that Ogunjobi undertook it as a project at that time.

It was all down to Orji Uzor Kalu...
He masterminded the turnaround of Enyimba from a substantively “feeder” club to a juggernaut.

Kalu unsuccessfully tried to buy the club for most of the 90s, and when he became Gov provided unlimited funds to it. While Anyansi was his point man, he was very involved in the affairs of the club. Any role Ogunjobi played was secondary and wouldn’t have been anything more than as an enabler.

No club can be financially independent in present day Nigeria. Nigerians love football, yes, but it is a luxury most cannot afford.

EII,

I hear you. You've basically said our clubs, and league, can function profitably if we get our act together!! Fine, but when do you think we can get our act together, pray when do you think the "major restructuring that would be necessary" will happen?? "The league has to make that amenable in several ways including scheduling and regulations" - when do you think this can be realised? The same league that has not been able to start the 2019/2020 season, setting dates and changing at will? I can tell you for free that these things aren't happening any time soon.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 3:00 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
Ukwala,

What I am stating is about is HOPE. Doing those things aren't difficult but they require selflessness and commitment. I know that it is difficult to find these days but surely there are still people who can offer that. If not, we just have to close shop and give up. That option is not what I believe in.

ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ukwala,

I believe that clubs can be financially independent in Nigeria. However, the league has to make that amenable in several ways including scheduling and regulations. There are certainly opportunities as well as significant strengths in the Nigerian environment to make it possible but there are major restructuring that would be necessary, in my opinion.

But the idea of floating a Nigerian club in the Stock Exchange as is will simply fail. Why would anyone buy such a stock when the club is losing money and the industry regulation is adverse? Makes little sense. Things have to change ... that is where it starts.

No club can be financially independent in present day Nigeria. Nigerians love football, yes, but it is a luxury most cannot afford.

EII,

Again, I hear you. Selflessness and commitment?? Ok oo, no comments :huh: To be frank, I am not even sure there is enough money in football to make a club financially independent.

For example, the recent CAF Confed cup by Rangers in Enugu had gate fees of N100, N200, and N1,000.


So, with such low fees, the stadium will be full? No


Most times when the stadium is full, know that the gates were flung open at some point to let in fans free-of-charge.

Notwithstanding my misgivings, I join you in hoping for nothing but the best for our football.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 3:23 pm 
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Ukwala,

I actually think that while gates may still matter for Nigerian football, the real money is beyond the gates and via several schemes that will take time cultivating. Deep down, we (Nigerians) love football and that is a very important factor and it is a matter of finding creative ways to take advantage of that factor but it requires regulatory interventions as well in my opinion.

I am not sure that it is just the lack of funds preventing spectators from getting to the stadium. In 2016 when Rangers won the league, the club filled the stadium repeatedly with fans and it was not about opening up the gates. Fans were attracted/pulled to the stadium and the games were not just promoted but they were scheduled to avoid the odious(I use it deliberately) English Premier League games.
ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
Ukwala,

What I am stating is about is HOPE. Doing those things aren't difficult but they require selflessness and commitment. I know that it is difficult to find these days but surely there are still people who can offer that. If not, we just have to close shop and give up. That option is not what I believe in.

ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ukwala,

I believe that clubs can be financially independent in Nigeria. However, the league has to make that amenable in several ways including scheduling and regulations. There are certainly opportunities as well as significant strengths in the Nigerian environment to make it possible but there are major restructuring that would be necessary, in my opinion.

But the idea of floating a Nigerian club in the Stock Exchange as is will simply fail. Why would anyone buy such a stock when the club is losing money and the industry regulation is adverse? Makes little sense. Things have to change ... that is where it starts.

No club can be financially independent in present day Nigeria. Nigerians love football, yes, but it is a luxury most cannot afford.

EII,

Again, I hear you. Selflessness and commitment?? Ok oo, no comments :huh: To be frank, I am not even sure there is enough money in football to make a club financially independent.

For example, the recent CAF Confed cup by Rangers in Enugu had gate fees of N100, N200, and N1,000.


So, with such low fees, the stadium will be full? No


Most times when the stadium is full, know that the gates were flung open at some point to let in fans free-of-charge.

Notwithstanding my misgivings, I join you in hoping for nothing but the best for our football.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:34 pm 
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Many, many years ago, I wrote a long paper, later published, about a blueprint for developing the league.

We need the NFF to help potential investors in our clubs to properly understand the minimum cost of running a club in a season. By that I mean the true cost; not inflated, not understated.

Then they need to set minimum admin standards/structures.

It's going to take time, but these things need to be structured and implemented progressively and in consultation with all stakeholders.

One way to do this is to create a "super league" structure, where such minimum standards are enforced. We do not need more than 10 truly professional clubs...

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:41 pm 
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txj wrote:
Many, many years ago, I wrote a long paper, later published, about a blueprint for developing the league.

We need the NFF to help potential investors in our clubs to properly understand the minimum cost of running a club in a season. By that I mean the true cost; not inflated, not understated.

Then they need to set minimum admin standards/structures.

It's going to take time, but these things need to be structured and implemented progressively and in consultation with all stakeholders.

One way to do this is to create a "super league" structure, where such minimum standards are enforced. We do not need more than 10 truly professional clubs...


I think on the same lines, the 20-club league is bloated TBH. Secondly, we do not need a nationwide league. We can have a regional league where winners of the conferences move to a final stage where they play each other at a designated venue. This arrangement will help cut traveling costs as well. Moreover the promotion/regulation can also be ditched if the league is made entirely private. This structure will assure investors of a viable outcome to their investment. The lower leagues can then have promotion/relegation and work as semi-pro leagues that then feed into the elite level.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:14 am 
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Enugu II wrote:
txj wrote:
Many, many years ago, I wrote a long paper, later published, about a blueprint for developing the league.

We need the NFF to help potential investors in our clubs to properly understand the minimum cost of running a club in a season. By that I mean the true cost; not inflated, not understated.

Then they need to set minimum admin standards/structures.

It's going to take time, but these things need to be structured and implemented progressively and in consultation with all stakeholders.

One way to do this is to create a "super league" structure, where such minimum standards are enforced. We do not need more than 10 truly professional clubs...


I think on the same lines, the 20-club league is bloated TBH. Secondly, we do not need a nationwide league. We can have a regional league where winners of the conferences move to a final stage where they play each other at a designated venue. This arrangement will help cut traveling costs as well. Moreover the promotion/regulation can also be ditched if the league is made entirely private. This structure will assure investors of a viable outcome to their investment. The lower leagues can then have promotion/relegation and work as semi-pro leagues that then feed into the elite level.

The lower leagues (where the blank sh**ting stars operate :taunt: ) are run on regional basis. The NPFL is still operating as a nationwide league because the state governments that own the clubs are able to absorb the huge losses. The NFF has to wean itself of government influence and be truly independent to be able to take these decisions.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:56 am 
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ukwala wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
txj wrote:
Many, many years ago, I wrote a long paper, later published, about a blueprint for developing the league.

We need the NFF to help potential investors in our clubs to properly understand the minimum cost of running a club in a season. By that I mean the true cost; not inflated, not understated.

Then they need to set minimum admin standards/structures.

It's going to take time, but these things need to be structured and implemented progressively and in consultation with all stakeholders.

One way to do this is to create a "super league" structure, where such minimum standards are enforced. We do not need more than 10 truly professional clubs...


I think on the same lines, the 20-club league is bloated TBH. Secondly, we do not need a nationwide league. We can have a regional league where winners of the conferences move to a final stage where they play each other at a designated venue. This arrangement will help cut traveling costs as well. Moreover the promotion/regulation can also be ditched if the league is made entirely private. This structure will assure investors of a viable outcome to their investment. The lower leagues can then have promotion/relegation and work as semi-pro leagues that then feed into the elite level.

The lower leagues (where the blank sh**ting stars operate :taunt: ) are run on regional basis. The NPFL is still operating as a nationwide league because the state governments that own the clubs are able to absorb the huge losses. The NFF has to wean itself of government influence and be truly independent to be able to take these decisions.

Agreed. Deep changes need to happen.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:54 pm 
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NPFL is surviving because government is basically 100 percent subsidizing it. So no incentive to grow the league when the salary is guaranteed. Complete privatization is only way to see real change in the league.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 1:57 pm 
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ohenhen1 wrote:
NPFL is surviving because government is basically 100 percent subsidizing it. So no incentive to grow the league when the salary is guaranteed. Complete privatization is only way to see real change in the league.



Ohenhen1,

Where did you get this number? Are you talking about the clubs or the league? There is a difference? In none of those is there 100% government funding, bros.

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The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 2:06 pm 
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Enugu II wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:
NPFL is surviving because government is basically 100 percent subsidizing it. So no incentive to grow the league when the salary is guaranteed. Complete privatization is only way to see real change in the league.



Ohenhen1,

Where did you get this number? Are you talking about the clubs or the league? There is a difference? In none of those is there 100% government funding, bros.



Ok what is the percentage of subsidy and how many clubs are privately owned?


If we want change, we have to be serious. Private sector will not invest if they have to compete with Government. It will not be a level playing field. The only way forward is 100 percent private ownership of the Nigerian clubs. Ban government ownership. Maybe start out with the Green bay Packers ownership model. Which is community ownership of the teams. Government can help them out by offering free leasing of sports facilities and etc.

Nigeria private sector free of government interference can make the league a success. So much money can be made from merchandizing and etc. We have seen how successful other industries like Nollywood, telecom and etc are in Nigeria. I see no reason why football can't be another success story.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:22 pm 
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Ohenhen1,

I have no issues with your proposed solution. The point is that your 100% statement was inaccurate.


ohenhen1 wrote:
Enugu II wrote:
ohenhen1 wrote:
NPFL is surviving because government is basically 100 percent subsidizing it. So no incentive to grow the league when the salary is guaranteed. Complete privatization is only way to see real change in the league.



Ohenhen1,

Where did you get this number? Are you talking about the clubs or the league? There is a difference? In none of those is there 100% government funding, bros.



Ok what is the percentage of subsidy and how many clubs are privately owned?


If we want change, we have to be serious. Private sector will not invest if they have to compete with Government. It will not be a level playing field. The only way forward is 100 percent private ownership of the Nigerian clubs. Ban government ownership. Maybe start out with the Green bay Packers ownership model. Which is community ownership of the teams. Government can help them out by offering free leasing of sports facilities and etc.

Nigeria private sector free of government interference can make the league a success. So much money can be made from merchandizing and etc. We have seen how successful other industries like Nollywood, telecom and etc are in Nigeria. I see no reason why football can't be another success story.

_________________
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:44 am 
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I have advocated the regionalisation of the NPL many times before. In this post here, my exact words were:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=292306&hilit=zones+league#p5357140

"The NPL should be regionalised like the NFL. Perhaps have 4-6 local mini-leagues. Then the champions or top 2 teams of each mini-league would then advance to the play-off finals to determine the Nigerian champion. This would reduce travel costs for teams and improve safety. It would also give teams around the country something to play for and generate local football rivalries.

Travelling across the country to play El-Kanemi Warriors, Lobi Stars, Kano Pillars, Sharks, 3SC, MFM etc is hard in this era of Boko Haram, kidnappers, armed robbers, and AK47 wielding men lurking on the roads."



Enugu II wrote:
txj wrote:
Many, many years ago, I wrote a long paper, later published, about a blueprint for developing the league.

We need the NFF to help potential investors in our clubs to properly understand the minimum cost of running a club in a season. By that I mean the true cost; not inflated, not understated.

Then they need to set minimum admin standards/structures.

It's going to take time, but these things need to be structured and implemented progressively and in consultation with all stakeholders.

One way to do this is to create a "super league" structure, where such minimum standards are enforced. We do not need more than 10 truly professional clubs...


I think on the same lines, the 20-club league is bloated TBH. Secondly, we do not need a nationwide league. We can have a regional league where winners of the conferences move to a final stage where they play each other at a designated venue. This arrangement will help cut traveling costs as well. Moreover the promotion/regulation can also be ditched if the league is made entirely private. This structure will assure investors of a viable outcome to their investment. The lower leagues can then have promotion/relegation and work as semi-pro leagues that then feed into the elite level.


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