Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
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Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Watching this World Cup I hope it has to be apparent to all that the crap and claim that all the best players are in the BIG 5 league is absolute crap. Yes, the Big 5 has most of the best players. Bold that word best because it has a different meaning from all. Any given day, a good team can take on a team full of best players on paper. Morocco and others have shown it. The fact, however, is that Morocco has done nothing shocking. These things have been done in the past and will be done in the future. That is why football results are not determined by merely number counting how many players you have in some "Big 5" crap or the other.
Last edited by Enugu II on Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Did you check where the Moroccan players play before making this post?Enugu II wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:23 pm Watching this World Cup I hope it has to be apparent to all that the crap and claim that all the best players are in the BIG 5 league is absolute crap. Yes, the Big 5 has most of the best players. Bold that word best because it has a different meaning from all. Any given day, a good team can take on a team full of best players on paper. Morocco and others have shown it. The fact, however, is that Morocco has done nothing shocking. These things have been done in the past and will be done in the future. That is why football results are not determined by merely number counting how many players you have in some "Big 5" crap or the other.
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Bros...a lot of the Moroccans play in top leagues na
- Bigpokey24
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
the big 5 leagues are good oo, we can use them to develop our players , so when we meet them in the WC, we are used to them... playing in top leagues do matter.. we need our goalies and defenders in the big 5 leagues oooo
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My post are with no warranties and confers zero rights. Get out your feelings
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Yes, I did. I wouldn't be writing this if they had more players in the Big 5 than the teams that they have overcome. Let's stop the bean counting.... that is the point and focus on what actually is produced on the field.Scipio Africanus wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:26 pmDid you check where the Moroccan players play before making this post?Enugu II wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:23 pm Watching this World Cup I hope it has to be apparent to all that the crap and claim that all the best players are in the BIG 5 league is absolute crap. Yes, the Big 5 has most of the best players. Bold that word best because it has a different meaning from all. Any given day, a good team can take on a team full of best players on paper. Morocco and others have shown it. The fact, however, is that Morocco has done nothing shocking. These things have been done in the past and will be done in the future. That is why football results are not determined by merely number counting how many players you have in some "Big 5" crap or the other.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
This is an important discussion that would take many pages to flesh out.
My quick thoughts:
1) Yes, big European club football sometimes doesn't offer the environment for some players to succeed, a lot of it cultural.
2) That said, yes, having a presence on big European usually indicates individual player quality...but not having this doesn't mean you don't have the said quality.
I apologize in advance for bringing up Croatia, but I follow them through this prism. We have a lot of players in Europe. But for those who can't cut it for whatever reason, they play for Dinamo or Hajduk or Rijeka...Petkovic, Livaja, Orsic all scored or assisted in big games this WC...and our goalie who stopped Japan and Brazil plays for Dinamo.
It is a good blend. I don't think Croatia would do so well if we didn't have to big club guys. But also if we didn't have the domestic league non-glamorous players give depth...and we dream big that maybe our clubs in time will be even stronger.
Morocco has a lot of players in Europe. Some indeed play on big clubs. And there are some domestic players, although I know NOTHING about this, just scraping it from google.
My conclusion: at least for Croatia, our consistent success is tied to having enough big role players at big leagues as well as a domestic pool.
My quick thoughts:
1) Yes, big European club football sometimes doesn't offer the environment for some players to succeed, a lot of it cultural.
2) That said, yes, having a presence on big European usually indicates individual player quality...but not having this doesn't mean you don't have the said quality.
I apologize in advance for bringing up Croatia, but I follow them through this prism. We have a lot of players in Europe. But for those who can't cut it for whatever reason, they play for Dinamo or Hajduk or Rijeka...Petkovic, Livaja, Orsic all scored or assisted in big games this WC...and our goalie who stopped Japan and Brazil plays for Dinamo.
It is a good blend. I don't think Croatia would do so well if we didn't have to big club guys. But also if we didn't have the domestic league non-glamorous players give depth...and we dream big that maybe our clubs in time will be even stronger.
Morocco has a lot of players in Europe. Some indeed play on big clubs. And there are some domestic players, although I know NOTHING about this, just scraping it from google.
My conclusion: at least for Croatia, our consistent success is tied to having enough big role players at big leagues as well as a domestic pool.
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
BTW: England for me illustrates this. Concentrated in 1 major league, not well distributed across the others. That is why I think they are not tier 1, don't have enough of that continental flair culture.
But, the margins are thin, so I might end up eating my words in 3 hours...although I doubt it.
But, the margins are thin, so I might end up eating my words in 3 hours...although I doubt it.
Pax Americana...Wither Now?
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
No one said all their starting 11 has to be in the Big 5. That Morrocan team have players playing in top clubs. Don’t forget they fired their Foreign Coach because he refused to bring back Ziyech.Enugu II wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:31 pmYes, I did. I wouldn't be writing this if they had more players in the Big 5 than the teams that they have overcome. Let's stop the bean counting.... that is the point and focus on what actually is produced on the field.Scipio Africanus wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:26 pmDid you check where the Moroccan players play before making this post?Enugu II wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:23 pm Watching this World Cup I hope it has to be apparent to all that the crap and claim that all the best players are in the BIG 5 league is absolute crap. Yes, the Big 5 has most of the best players. Bold that word best because it has a different meaning from all. Any given day, a good team can take on a team full of best players on paper. Morocco and others have shown it. The fact, however, is that Morocco has done nothing shocking. These things have been done in the past and will be done in the future. That is why football results are not determined by merely number counting how many players you have in some "Big 5" crap or the other.
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Their goalie alone na Sevilla's stopper.
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
BTW, I have not even located those who are starters in those teams. Bottom line this is about TEAM and not about individual players and their clubs.
Morocco World Cup 2022 squad: The final 26-man team
GK: Yassine Bounou (Sevilla)
GK: Munir El Kajoui (Al Wehda)
GK: Ahmed Reda Tagnaouti (Wydad Casablanca)
DF: Nayef Aguerd (West Ham United)
DF: Yahia Attiat Allah (Wydad Casablanca)
DF: Badr Benoun (Qatar SC)
DF: Achraf Dari (Stade Brest)
DF: Jawad El Yamiq (Real Valladolid)
DF: Achraf Hakimi (Paris Saint-Germain)
DF: Noussair Mazraoui (Bayern Munich)
DF: Romain Saiss (Besiktas)
MF: Sofyan Amrabat (Fiorentina)
MF: Selim Amallah (Standard Liege)
MF: Bilal El Khannouss (Racing Genk)
MF: Yahya Jabrane (Wydad Casablanca)
MF: Azzedine Ounahi (Angers)
MF: Abdelhamid Sabiri (Sampdoria)
FW: Zakaria Aboukhlal (Toulouse)
FW: Soufiane Boufal (Angers)
FW: Ilias Chair (Queens Park Rangers)
FW: Walid Cheddira (Bari)
FW: Youssef En-Nesyri (Sevilla)
FW: Abde Ezzalzouli (Osasuna)
FW: Abderrazak Hamdallah (Al Ittihad)
FW: Amine Harit (Olympique Marseille)
FW: Hakim Ziyech (Chelsea)
Last edited by Enugu II on Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Conversely, countries without a functioning league are nowhere near the WC. Even Costa Rica has a well organized league.
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:42 pm Conversely, countries without a functioning league are nowhere near the WC. Even Costa Rica has a well organized league.
Thank you for pointing that out.
Half education is very dangerous!
That is what this garbage thread exemplifies...
We have aleague that is dysfunctional in almost every aspect.
Player welfare
training
nutrition
pitches
referee
attendance
record keeping
marketing
And someone wants to compare the clubs in it to Wydad Casablanca...
Its not only ignorant but downright disrespectful to those countries that actually are working hard
Form is temporary; Class is Permanent!
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
having big players and having a team are 2 different things! Greece won the Euros in 2004 with a disciplined defensive team
So angry Nigeria got kicked out of the world cup once again, i nearly told my wife that i caught my girlfriend with another man today!
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
I keep thinking about this comparison.
Greece couldn't sustain it. They actually did get fortunate in that Euro win. Not taking anything away, but Greece have since been terrible.
We will see where Morocco goes from here. I get the sense they can build upon this WC if they cement the success: maintain the NT program with continued blending of foreign and domestic players...and upgrade the leagues and academies.
Pax Americana...Wither Now?
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
the difference being, Morocco have skilful footballers, natural talent is in abundance! it will inspire more teenagers to pursue a career in football, they should continue recruiting foreign based players and mix them with the home based, their players will be in huge demand now, thats what success doesmate wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:26 pm
I keep thinking about this comparison.
Greece couldn't sustain it. They actually did get fortunate in that Euro win. Not taking anything away, but Greece have since been terrible.
We will see where Morocco goes from here. I get the sense they can build upon this WC if they cement the success: maintain the NT program with continued blending of foreign and domestic players...and upgrade the leagues and academies.
So angry Nigeria got kicked out of the world cup once again, i nearly told my wife that i caught my girlfriend with another man today!
Marko
Marko
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Useless man, do you have to insult your elders and betters to make your point?txj wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:18 pmEMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:42 pm Conversely, countries without a functioning league are nowhere near the WC. Even Costa Rica has a well organized league.
Thank you for pointing that out.
Half education is very dangerous!
That is what this garbage thread exemplifies...
We have aleague that is dysfunctional in almost every aspect.
Player welfare
training
nutrition
pitches
referee
attendance
record keeping
marketing
And someone wants to compare the clubs in it to Wydad Casablanca...
Its not only ignorant but downright disrespectful to those countries that actually are working hard
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Your argument is totally flawed, Prof.
Good teams are made up of good players. Good players play in the best leagues - that is the reality of modern day football.
Had Morocco not deployed its best players, they would have been back home in Rabat right now.
Good teams are made up of good players. Good players play in the best leagues - that is the reality of modern day football.
Had Morocco not deployed its best players, they would have been back home in Rabat right now.
Enugu II wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:23 pm Watching this World Cup I hope it has to be apparent to all that the crap and claim that all the best players are in the BIG 5 league is absolute crap. Yes, the Big 5 has most of the best players. Bold that word best because it has a different meaning from all. Any given day, a good team can take on a team full of best players on paper. Morocco and others have shown it. The fact, however, is that Morocco has done nothing shocking. These things have been done in the past and will be done in the future. That is why football results are not determined by merely number counting how many players you have in some "Big 5" crap or the other.
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Teams actually can win on huge doses of good fortune.
Essentially, the business end of the World Cup is a knockout competition, not a league.
We will always have the upsets - that’s the allure of the knockout competitions across the world.
Sustaining it is another matter.
Don’t talk about Greece or even about Denmark as if they’re typical cases.
Theirs were extreme examples. Good for them but it’s not happening again for them any time soon.
Morocco we are celebrating today would never be stupid enough to ignore quality players available to them for sentimental quota system rubbish. You earn your place on quality.
No substitute.
Essentially, the business end of the World Cup is a knockout competition, not a league.
We will always have the upsets - that’s the allure of the knockout competitions across the world.
Sustaining it is another matter.
Don’t talk about Greece or even about Denmark as if they’re typical cases.
Theirs were extreme examples. Good for them but it’s not happening again for them any time soon.
Morocco we are celebrating today would never be stupid enough to ignore quality players available to them for sentimental quota system rubbish. You earn your place on quality.
No substitute.
"Ole kuku ni gbogbo wọn "
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
That's the MO of the stupid c-word. My goodness what a gutter rat txj is. Now he'll be along to tell you how there is something very wrong with you . Projection.ohsee wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:31 pmUseless man, do you have to insult your elders and betters to make your point?txj wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:18 pmEMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:42 pm Conversely, countries without a functioning league are nowhere near the WC. Even Costa Rica has a well organized league.
Thank you for pointing that out.
Half education is very dangerous!
That is what this garbage thread exemplifies...
We have aleague that is dysfunctional in almost every aspect.
Player welfare
training
nutrition
pitches
referee
attendance
record keeping
marketing
And someone wants to compare the clubs in it to Wydad Casablanca...
Its not only ignorant but downright disrespectful to those countries that actually are working hard
Wha choo looking at?!
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Nigeria would probably have told Ziyeck to go to hell for turning down an invitation by the (former) coach.Otitokoro wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:39 pm Your argument is totally flawed, Prof.
Good teams are made up of good players. Good players play in the best leagues - that is the reality of modern day football.
Had Morocco not deployed its best players, they would have been back home in Rabat right now.Enugu II wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:23 pm Watching this World Cup I hope it has to be apparent to all that the crap and claim that all the best players are in the BIG 5 league is absolute crap. Yes, the Big 5 has most of the best players. Bold that word best because it has a different meaning from all. Any given day, a good team can take on a team full of best players on paper. Morocco and others have shown it. The fact, however, is that Morocco has done nothing shocking. These things have been done in the past and will be done in the future. That is why football results are not determined by merely number counting how many players you have in some "Big 5" crap or the other.
Now nobody remembers all that.
Nobody remembers the number of Moroccan players born and/or playing outside Morocco. Or whose mama is a foreigner.
They are Moroccans. Finish.
"Ole kuku ni gbogbo wọn "
Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
Well their starting LB plays for Wydad.
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Re: Big FIVE LEAGUE MY Foot!!!!!
ohsee wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:31 pmUseless man, do you have to insult your elders and betters to make your point?txj wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:18 pmEMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:42 pm Conversely, countries without a functioning league are nowhere near the WC. Even Costa Rica has a well organized league.
Thank you for pointing that out.
Half education is very dangerous!
That is what this garbage thread exemplifies...
We have aleague that is dysfunctional in almost every aspect.
Player welfare
training
nutrition
pitches
referee
attendance
record keeping
marketing
And someone wants to compare the clubs in it to Wydad Casablanca...
Its not only ignorant but downright disrespectful to those countries that actually are working hard
I would counter that the thread itself is an insult on our collective intelligence and therefore worse...
The point he makes though, which I agree with, is that its ultimately about the quality of the team you produce, not the profile of individual players. which is not saying anything new...
But there's little doubt that the threshold and the platform is the quality of the players. And that's what gives you the foundation to build quality teams...
Form is temporary; Class is Permanent!
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp