World's best (Spain) team called 'boring'

[tfco]

I rest my case here.

Those who were absent when Chelsea won the CL have finally found a voice,,ad are desperate to equate 3 Lions to EPL
(cic, yujam, mi5)

Don't worry lads I also don't like England, strange as it may be.

did you notice that as well? Yujam is all over the forum he finally decided to comment after england lost on PKs

this thread you open dey pain dem well well, see how man wan use stats show say my woman fine pass your own

[cic old boy]

I rest my case here.

Those who were absent when Chelsea won the CL have finally found a voice,,ad are desperate to equate 3 Lions to EPL
(cic, yujam, mi5)

Don't worry lads I also don't like England, strange as it may be.

But you find England games "entertaining", even when your basis for entertainment is chances created! Now, that's what I would call strange.

[YUJAM]

. Thankfully the stats at fourfourtwo start to rubbish your sideways passing claim

You are trying too hard to cover your backside. You gave Pirlo a thumbs up for doing exactly what the Spanish midfield do – retain possession. Go and watch Pirlo again and you will see the times he lost possession were mainly when trying to create a goal-scoring opportunity. The rest of the pass completion stats are made up of playing simple balls to keep possession. That’s exactly what even Busquets does. But you call it “boring”. This isn’t the first time your double standards have been exposed. I remember how you used to sing Messi’s praises until Barca beat Manure silly. You attitude towards Spain is rooted in the hurt Barca has caused you. .

you are trying too hard. I gave Pirlo a thumbs up and suddenly you are going on and on about Spain's midfield.
Pass pass pass sideways with no intent to score is boring. See the flak JMO has been taking on CE for doing that, although in his defence he is JUST one guy. Pirlo is also ONE guy

The entire team passing the ball (oops, possession as you say) is excitement for you. Arsenal and Swansea do it in the EPL with no end product. Do not compare Barca to Spain, the former does it with an end product.

I cannot begin to go on about your double standard from when you announced United's decline a year before we won the CL. I like how you "conveniently" avoid game threads, but you also go missing when your team does not do well. Didn't see your post-game comments in the aftermath of DD bundling out your teams (Barca/BAyern pick your poison). Thought you were with Killa.

[tfco]

I rest my case here.

Those who were absent when Chelsea won the CL have finally found a voice,,ad are desperate to equate 3 Lions to EPL
(cic, yujam, mi5)

Don't worry lads I also don't like England, strange as it may be.

But you find England games "entertaining", even when your basis for entertainment is chances created! Now, that's what I would call strange.

Again you are reaching

Eng v Gha was the last Eng game I found entertaining. Action all over.

lol don't worry, Spa v Ger in the Final will be VERY exciting.

[cic old boy]

Actually, the real problem with this Spain team is that they don’t retain the ball as well as Barca. This is mainly down to poor decision making by the likes of David Silva, Xabi Alonso’s passing can be a bit sloppy at times, woeful distribution from Arbeloa and to some extent Xavi not being 100% fit.

[cic old boy]

Again you are reaching

Eng v Gha was the last Eng game I found entertaining. Action all over.

lol don't worry, Spa v Ger in the Final will be VERY exciting.

You have gone from talking rubbish in game threads instead of watching the game to talking rubbish about games that have not even taken place!

[tfco]

Again you are reaching

Eng v Gha was the last Eng game I found entertaining. Action all over.

lol don't worry, Spa v Ger in the Final will be VERY exciting.

You have gone from talking rubbish in game threads instead of watching the game to talking rubbish about games that have not even taken place!

As I said, your input is required in this thread.

But we know you Mr ATF, you will comment after Portugal gets KO. Should the inevitable happen, you will do a Killa.

[cic old boy]

As I said, your input is required in this thread.

But we know you Mr ATF, you will comment after Portugal gets KO. Should the inevitable happen, you will do a Killa.

You seem to forget that there were something like 3 threads about Fake Ron in a week. I can't comment on all them like you. I said all I need to say here and it doesn't change whether he scored against Holland or scores against Spain. Unlike you and many others "watching" match threads for score updates, I watch the games and know what Fake Ron's all-round game is about.

Fake Ron is very fast, has a powerful shot and is very strong, but his overall game is seriously lacking. When he is on a hot streak, the goals go in and people overlook the fact that he is easily dispossessed, makes a lot of wrong decisions, etc. Over the last 2 games he has demonstrated why he is not the real deal. Some clowns who think he is the same as Messi b/c both have not delivered for their countries don't know anything about the game. While Messi has not set the world on fire for the Argies, he at least plays very well for them. I can't say the same for Fake Ron.

And please, it has little to do with Portugal being a poor team. Nani plays very well for them. The trouble with Fake Ron is that his all round game is not up to the superstar level he craves. He has never been the go-to guy that great players usually are. Figo and Rui Costa used to do it for Portugal. When the going got tough, they took over the game. Yesterday Fake Ron disappeared when the Danes stepped up and he kept giving the ball away. I may be wrong, but it seemed he never even bothered to join his team-mates celebrate the winner. I didn't see him and if that was the case, he has no business being their captain.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=221301&start=23

And more commentary on Fake Ron:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=221348

[AreaDaddy]

From Steve Gerrard hoping one day England can play tiki-taka (at least the possession aspect)

He did not duck anything and when he was asked on Monday why a group of apparently accomplished England players found it so hard to pass a football to each other during matches, he did not duck that either.

“It’s one of the biggest points of this tournament that the management and coaching staff will have to look into,” said Gerrard.

“We have to analyse why we aren’t keeping the ball better, especially at this level, because it’s fundamental. It’s the key if you want to beat the big teams in these tournaments.

"You have to keep the ball.

“Otherwise, you work so hard without it, they end up running you into the ground and creating chances.

Code: Select all

Attack vs defence: Gerrard and England only had 32% of possession against Italy
Alex Livesey

“I don’t look at stats too much - unless it’s clear time and time again that something’s sticking out very obviously.

“And in this tournament, the obvious thing is that we have come up short as far as possession is concerned.”

[cic old boy]

Carragher said similar things as Gerrard in a Telegraph article. They wanna be like Spain, while their groupies on CE are calling Spain "boring".

Spain has always produced playmakers like Xavi, and the Dutch and Portuguese flying wingers such as Arjen Robben or Cristiano Ronaldo. Our stars have been more tough, powerful midfielders or defenders who win the ball. Unfortunately, we do not breed enough players who keep it.

Spain are the example in terms of ball retention, the extraordinary ideal we aspire to. There needs to be some realism, though.

Can we really expect to do what they do even better? The English system has never produced a Xavi or an Andrés Iniesta.

We should watch and learn from them, but recognise what is genuinely attainable. It feels like we are always wishing we had been doing what others have done years after they have done it, so we are always playing catch-up.

[Mr. Piffington]

That's nice and cool but Spain are still boring to watch in 2012.

[airwolex]

The fact of the matter is that they are boring regardless. They are not like the swashbuckling Brazilian teams of years past, or the flowing Dutch teams of the 70's. They are a pragmatic team that hides behind meaningless possession. One Spain is enough; if every team starts playing like them people will die of stupor. I wonder what you guys would say if modern football hadn't implemented all this possession stats, attempts on goal stats etc. This is all you throw in our faces to prove Spain's ability to induce excitement....back in the day we didn't have any of these stats and I'm starting to think it's annoying.

As for the attempts on goals yada yada; you guys call Mourinho a bore no matter how many hundreds of goals his team scores so what's the big deal
about calling Spain boring? They don't score that many goals and are not even intereseted; their attempts on goals relative to their possession is still poor. Apart from Iniesta which of their star players would you really pay money to watch? Xavi, Silva, Busquets, Alonso? Which of them can produce excitement like Ronaldo De Lima, Robinho, Ronaldinho, Zidane or even Messi?

It's not jealousy, it's not hatred it's just that watching meaningless passing in the middle of the park is only interesting for 10 to 15 minutes.

[Mr. Piffington]

The fact of the matter is that they are boring regardless. They are not like the swashbuckling Brazilian teams of years past, or the flowing Dutch teams of the 70's. They are a pragmatic team that hides behind meaningless possession. One Spain is enough; if every team starts playing like them people will die of stupor.

As for the attempts on goals yada yada; you guys call Mourinho a bore no matter how many hundreds of goals his team scores so what's the big deal
about calling Spain boring?

It's not jealousy, it's not hatred watching meaningless passing in the middle of the park is only interesting for 10 to 15 minutes.

It's just funny watching grown men get all emotional about other people's opinions.

[kofi86]

You know what's funny?
The nickname of the Spanish team in the biggest german tabloid is Snooze Spaniards.
What do the Italians say about the spanish football at the Euro 2012? Boring!
Former Barca presidential candidate Josep Maria Minguella: Boring!

And there is a poll and debate on Marcawhether Spain plays boring or not. ~7,300 people have voted so far and 58% of the voters think that Spain has been boring so far.

[tfco]

The fact of the matter is that they are boring regardless. They are not like the swashbuckling Brazilian teams of years past, or the flowing Dutch teams of the 70's. They are a pragmatic team that hides behind meaningless possession. One Spain is enough; if every team starts playing like them people will die of stupor.

As for the attempts on goals yada yada; you guys call Mourinho a bore no matter how many hundreds of goals his team scores so what's the big deal
about calling Spain boring?

It's not jealousy, it's not hatred watching meaningless passing in the middle of the park is only interesting for 10 to 15 minutes.

It's just funny watching grown men get all emotional about other people's opinions.

"but how can they be BORING when they have the most shots on target"

[airwolex]

You know what's funny?
The nickname of the Spanish team in the biggest german tabloid is Snooze Spaniards.
What do the Italians say about the spanish football at the Euro 2012? Boring!
Former Barca presidential candidate Josep Maria Minguella: Boring!

And there is a poll and debate on Marcawhether Spain plays boring or not. ~7,300 people have voted so far and 58% of the voters think that Spain has been boring so far.

The Spanish press has been ultra critical of Del Bosque and his pragmatic style, particularly playing two dm's. I don't know why it's only on CE that it's a sin to call a spade a spade. Not everybody likes tika taka especially this version.....it's simple.

[tfco]

You know what's funny?
The nickname of the Spanish team in the biggest german tabloid is Snooze Spaniards.
What do the Italians say about the spanish football at the Euro 2012? Boring!
Former Barca presidential candidate Josep Maria Minguella: Boring!

And there is a poll and debate on Marcawhether Spain plays boring or not. ~7,300 people have voted so far and 58% of the voters think that Spain has been boring so far.

"why tf are you bringing other countries/languages into this.
We only care what the English press report"

[jus2nang]

Lol. One has to simply laugh at some of the analysis today. Fwiw Spain had more attempts on goal than any side during the 1st round. So where does thos idea that their passing is without end product come from?

Correct. from UEFA.

http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro/season=201 ... index.html

20 of those attempts were against Ireland! Against France they only had 5 attempts on target.

Spain do play the right way as it is the most effective and does require fantastic technique. But Germany are much, much more exciting to watch. Spain are so good that most teams will park the bus against them, so it is the opponent that adds the first ingredient to a boring match. Spain adds the second ingredient - not creating enough chances, holding onto the ball, but doing very very little with it. They wait for the perfect opportunity before attempting a final ball. There's absolutely nothing wrong with this, in fact it's very sensible as of course giving the ball away in the wrong place would leave the team vulnerable to the counter attack.

However this doesn't mean that the game isn't boring to watch. It is. Safe, risk-free, boring football. Germany play with more flair, more variety, more attempt at penetration, more risk and thus are infinitely more entertaining. They're not as efficient as Spain and of course international football is all about winning, so Spain shouldn't change the way they play. But it's still boring. No action - and that's the bottom line, there's not enough action, goals, great saves, narrow misses etc. You don't get enough of that in Spain matches (unless they're playing a really poor side or really open side). I mean they start some games without a striker for goodness sake!

They are the best, yes. But that doesn't mean that they're not boring, they are and they will be until they decide to start taking some risks in order to entertain the crowd (they won't though, because of course more risk is less efficient).

[cic old boy]

Spain are so good that most teams will park the bus against them, so it is the opponent that adds the first ingredient to a boring match. Spain adds the second ingredient - not creating enough chances, holding onto the ball, but doing very very little with it. They wait for the perfect opportunity before attempting a final ball. There's absolutely nothing wrong with this, in fact it's very sensible as of course giving the ball away in the wrong place would leave the team vulnerable to the counter attack.

Once the opposition parks the bus, you have to hold on to the ball to drag them out of position. And it is not essentially your fault for not creating enough chances since the essence of parking the bus is to limit the opposition's chances. This is like blaming a boxer for not landing head shots if the other guy has covered up his head and is not throwing any punches.

[jus2nang]

Spain are so good that most teams will park the bus against them, so it is the opponent that adds the first ingredient to a boring match. Spain adds the second ingredient - not creating enough chances, holding onto the ball, but doing very very little with it. They wait for the perfect opportunity before attempting a final ball. There's absolutely nothing wrong with this, in fact it's very sensible as of course giving the ball away in the wrong place would leave the team vulnerable to the counter attack.

Once the opposition parks the bus, you have to hold on to the ball to drag them out of position. And it is not essentially your fault for not creating enough chances since the essence of parking the bus is to limit the opposition's chances. This is like blaming a boxer for not landing head shots if the other guy has covered up his head and is not throwing any punches.

Nothing wrong with it. Still doesn't mean that it's not boring though.

[jus2nang]

In fact they should throw in some tricks/skills (like Neymar/Ronaldinho/Okocha etc) as they hold onto the ball, that would make them more entertaining to watch.

[cic old boy]

Nothing wrong with it. Still doesn't mean that it's not boring though.

Just pointing out that the side that makes it "boring" is the side that sets out its stall to park the bus. Simple cause and effect.

[Heliopolis]

Stats do not prove that a team is fun to watch. This debate is entirely subjective to begin with so I introducing objective information is an exercise in futility. It'd be like someone saying "Seinfeld is boring to watch" (a subjective statement based on personal preference) and then some next person says "How can it be boring when it is the highest rated sitcome of all time!".

Spain is a great team and they play the game the right way but retaining possession 70% of the time while averaging 1 goal per match is not exciting football. This is a team that scored pretty much 1 goal per match en route to their 2010 WC win and has scored 1 goal from live play in each of 3 of their 4 matches so far.