IS USA NOW A MORE SOCCER NATION THAN NIGERIA

[bret- hart]

Rubbish. They play in the CONCACRAP division with the likes of Jamaica and Honduras. If they merged with the South American division, the would not make another WC in our life time.

What holds Nigeria back in sports is poor administration. If we had that in check, garbage teams like USA would not touch us in football. Useless sports like Fake Football aka NFL OTOH....

Same old feeling based response. The USA has made it to the Q/finals of the world cup and Finals of the confederation cup involving teams outside the CONCACAF. Nigeria has outperformed the US when it comes to the youth level but when it comes to senior level, Nigeria is behind US.

Based on what exactly? 1 fluke qfinal appearance in 2002? I guess Senegal and Cameroon are ahead of Nigeria because like USA they stumbled into the Qfinals of the World Cup.

[GIN]

Rubbish. They play in the CONCACRAP division with the likes of Jamaica and Honduras. If they merged with the South American division, the would not make another WC in our life time.

What holds Nigeria back in sports is poor administration. If we had that in check, garbage teams like USA would not touch us in football. Useless sports like Fake Football aka NFL OTOH....

Same old feeling based response. The USA has made it to the Q/finals of the world cup and Finals of the confederation cup involving teams outside the CONCACAF. Nigeria has outperformed the US when it comes to the youth level but when it comes to senior level, Nigeria is behind US.

Based on what exactly? 1 fluke qfinal appearance in 2002? I guess Senegal and Cameroon are ahead of Nigeria because like USA they stumbled into the Qfinals of the World Cup.

Nigeria is yet to smell the same Q/Final fluke appearance at the WC.

[GIN]

More talented players in the Nigerian premier league. The problem is our league is not well managed. I just saw some highlights of the Sunshine Stars vs Sharks game, exciting football, but empty stadium. All of our teams are doing well on the continent. Our age grade teams are doing well. Just look at the U23 team, all of them are in the NPL. The infrastructure has also improved a lot.

No serious soccer nation will have that kind of problem when it comes to attendance. Kano Pillars appears to be the only team in Nigeria with huge crowd turnout for their home league matches.

[bret- hart]

Rubbish. They play in the CONCACRAP division with the likes of Jamaica and Honduras. If they merged with the South American division, the would not make another WC in our life time.

What holds Nigeria back in sports is poor administration. If we had that in check, garbage teams like USA would not touch us in football. Useless sports like Fake Football aka NFL OTOH....

Same old feeling based response. The USA has made it to the Q/finals of the world cup and Finals of the confederation cup involving teams outside the CONCACAF. Nigeria has outperformed the US when it comes to the youth level but when it comes to senior level, Nigeria is behind US.

Based on what exactly? 1 fluke qfinal appearance in 2002? I guess Senegal and Cameroon are ahead of Nigeria because like USA they stumbled into the Qfinals of the World Cup.

Nigeria is yet to smell the same Q/Final fluke appearance at the WC.

So that means Senegal is better than Nigeria in football naw?

[GIN]

Rubbish. They play in the CONCACRAP division with the likes of Jamaica and Honduras. If they merged with the South American division, the would not make another WC in our life time.

What holds Nigeria back in sports is poor administration. If we had that in check, garbage teams like USA would not touch us in football. Useless sports like Fake Football aka NFL OTOH....

Same old feeling based response. The USA has made it to the Q/finals of the world cup and Finals of the confederation cup involving teams outside the CONCACAF. Nigeria has outperformed the US when it comes to the youth level but when it comes to senior level, Nigeria is behind US.

Based on what exactly? 1 fluke qfinal appearance in 2002? I guess Senegal and Cameroon are ahead of Nigeria because like USA they stumbled into the Qfinals of the World Cup.

Nigeria is yet to smell the same Q/Final fluke appearance at the WC.

So that means Senegal is better than Nigeria in football naw?

This thread is about US and Nigeria.

[tfco]

Rubbish. They play in the CONCACRAP division with the likes of Jamaica and Honduras. If they merged with the South American division, the would not make another WC in our life time.

What holds Nigeria back in sports is poor administration. If we had that in check, garbage teams like USA would not touch us in football. Useless sports like Fake Football aka NFL OTOH....

Same old feeling based response. The USA has made it to the Q/finals of the world cup and Finals of the confederation cup involving teams outside the CONCACAF. Nigeria has outperformed the US when it comes to the youth level but when it comes to senior level, Nigeria is behind US.

Based on what exactly? 1 fluke qfinal appearance in 2002? I guess Senegal and Cameroon are ahead of Nigeria because like USA they stumbled into the Qfinals of the World Cup.

Nigeria is yet to smell the same Q/Final fluke appearance at the WC.

So that means Senegal is better than Nigeria in football naw?

This thread is about US and Nigeria.

how many WC players has US produced?

How many of their current stars play top flight football?

[GIN]

how many WC players has US produced?

How many of their current stars play top flight football?

The US might not have WC players at this moment playing top flight football, but they have managed to make it to two consecutive 2nd round appearances at the world cup.

[bret- hart]

Gin based on what criteria is USA better than Nigeria in mens Football? simple question. When it comes to WC performances, that's neither here nor there. U keep mentioning their qfinal appearance in 2002. aside from that, what have they done? In 2006 and 2010, they were well beaten by Ghana. In 2014, they were lucky to escape a shellacking by tiny Belgium. Nigeria and USA had identical Win loss ratio in 2014 WC but while Nigerians felt we ought to have done better, Americans were acting like they just won the damn thing. Let me put it this way, If Nigeria plays USA at a worldcup or Olympics, I expect 3 points in the bag because they are a team we expect to beat.

[ohenhen1]

More talented players in the Nigerian premier league. The problem is our league is not well managed. I just saw some highlights of the Sunshine Stars vs Sharks game, exciting football, but empty stadium. All of our teams are doing well on the continent. Our age grade teams are doing well. Just look at the U23 team, all of them are in the NPL. The infrastructure has also improved a lot.

No serious soccer nation will have that kind of problem when it comes to attendance. Kano Pillars appears to be the only team in Nigeria with huge crowd turnout for their home league matches.

The three factors that are affecting crowd attendance

1. Poor officiating - most fans are fed up with the poor officiating
2. Money - most people would rather stay home and watch the EPL. The Government also do a poor job promoting the games. There is also a high turnover of players every year.
3. Security - not enough police men on patrol to secure the venues. The police is not well trained and lack equipment.

[GIN]

Gin based on what criteria is USA better than Nigeria in mens Football? simple question. When it comes to WC performances, that's neither here nor there. U keep mentioning their qfinal appearance in 2002. aside from that, what have they done? In 2006 and 2010, they were well beaten by Ghana. In 2014, they were lucky to escape a shellacking by tiny Belgium. Nigeria and USA had identical Win loss ratio in 2014 WC but while Nigerians felt we ought to have done better, Americans were acting like they just won the damn thing. Let me put it this way, If Nigeria plays USA at a worldcup or Olympics, I expect 3 points in the bag because they are a team we expect to beat.

Bret, Nigeria has outperformed the US when it comes to the Under 17/20/23 categories, but when it comes to the Senior WC, Nigeria is behind the US. Nigeria reached the second round in 94, 98 and 2014, US reached the second round in 94, 2010, 2014 and Quarter finals in 2002. As per your point that if Nigeria should play the USA at the world cup or olympics, hey anything is possible. Ghana was supposed to beat the USA in 2014 and we know how that fantasy came crashing down.

[kalani JR]

The US team is better than Nigeria, you can argue til NEPA takes your light after realizing you probably don't deserve this.

[John Obi Moses]

Fair Analysis- Men only because we all know the USA is superior in the girls game!

Nigeria

World Cup- best Result Round of 16
Continental Titles: 3 titles in 7 Finals
Confed Cup: Nigeria 4th 1995
Youth- Superior


USA
World Cup- best Result Quarter Final 2002/ 3rd place 1930
Continental Titles: 5 Titles in 10 Finals
Confed Cup: USA 2nd 2009
Youth Inferior

I don't rate the Confed cup as a serious tournament and even Saudi Arabia and Australia have finished second before. Youth also is not weighed heavily due to the corruption in it from all nations and regions...



Regional Strength: This is where I am very sad

CONCACAF: Quarter Finalist - Mexico, Costa Rica, USA
CAF: Cameroon, Senegal, Ghana

Confederation Strength coefficient .85 for both...WEAK
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIFA_World ... l_strength


Africa's woes at the world cup makes it hard to say CAF is stronger than CONCACAF even though we all know it is. On top of that CONCACAF often sends more teams to the second round than CAF.


Thus, as annoying as it is the USA's 10 final games and 5 titles have to be weighted as if they did that in CAF.

When you add everything the USA wins.


If we are being honest we would decrease the weight of some of the USA's titles since not all of them are played with "A" teams if we took 2 titles away and 3 Finals way that would at best make both teams equal.


On top of that USA has the head to head and Nigeria has never beat the USA men or women

http://www.fifa.com/worldfootball/stati ... index.html



Final conclusion- Most of us believe Nigeria is better but the PURE numbers favor the USA. Nigeria has better athletes, better footballers but the USA gets most of the other things right.

I can also firmly say that in this modern era I will struggle to believe you if you said the USA would miss 2 or the last 3 CONCACAF Gold Cups. The lack of organization is killing Nigeria/

Nigeria's story is one of opportunities lost and the USA has had a bit of luck!! That being said, Nigeria has a much better youth system and does not need to nationalize numerous German-Americans to compete. Nigeria's U17 program looks promising and It seems Nigeria will continue to produce more talent thus, I would bet on Nigeria's talent getting lucky and winning the world cup before the USA's Organizational superiority. Pele said that though and he has not been proven right yet!!

[kolinzo]

The USA was playing and winning WC matches long before we even qualified. We are yet to defeat them at the senior level.

They have matched matched our best record if not bettered it at the WC level.

They have hosted the WC, gotten to the finals of the confederations cup, probably won as many continental titles as we have and have a much more lucrative league than we do.

So when exactly and on what objective terms were we ever a greater footballing nation than the US?

ol boi I wouldn't go than far; we definitely export more players and have been in and won more fifa organized tournaments than US will ever dream of

Are you very sure about the highlighted part? I want to tell you with confidence that you wrote that based on emotions and not fact. Check the records again and you will see what I mean. Nigeria can only dream of WINNING more organized tournaments, by FIFA, than the USA. This is a fact!

[kolinzo]

No doubt Nigeria has some of the most talented players at the grass roots level in the world, but this is nowhere enough at the highest level of the game.

To succeed at the highest level, your preparation needs to be optimal, and your football administration needs to be highly efficient. This is where Nigeria is grossly deficient. Nigeria failed to qualify for the ANC because of our lack of preparation, and we still have not done anything about it. How can you not have a coaching crew in place 9 months after a major tournament? Our football administrators are a total farce.

Say what you want about the USA and their ability to throw money at their local league and foreign talent. That is only a small reason for their success. They at least know how to build, administer and market a professional league and team, and chances are they will win a world cup while we are still wondering who our next coach is.

Charlie, is this based on fact or feelings? Have you seen USA grassroots?

[kolinzo]

yes I know this is a direct slap on your ego but facts are facts; the MLS generates a far more fund, has better stadia, better TV coverage, attracts more foreign players, boast more fans than than our so called Nigeria professional league could ever dream of

The USA has always been a "more soccer nation" than Nigeria.

Results wise they are arguably better at the world cup (not regarding age grade tourneys). We've won more continental titles but they play in the COPA against the likes of Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, etc. so...

League wise they are better organized, get more funding, grassroots/youth development, fan attendance blows us outta the water, better stadia, top players, etc.

This right here is the truth of the matter. No African country is more of a soccer nation than the USA. What our people here are getting confused is the level of passion of the fan base. Nigerians are crazy about soccer to the point of fighting each other, but you don't get that in America. They know a sport is just a sport.

[John Obi Moses]

yes I know this is a direct slap on your ego but facts are facts; the MLS generates a far more fund, has better stadia, better TV coverage, attracts more foreign players, boast more fans than than our so called Nigeria professional league could ever dream of

The USA has always been a "more soccer nation" than Nigeria.

Results wise they are arguably better at the world cup (not regarding age grade tourneys). We've won more continental titles but they play in the COPA against the likes of Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, etc. so...

League wise they are better organized, get more funding, grassroots/youth development, fan attendance blows us outta the water, better stadia, top players, etc.

This right here is the truth of the matter. No African country is more of a soccer nation than the USA. What our people here are getting confused is the level of passion of the fan base. Nigerians are crazy about soccer to the point of fighting each other, but you don't get that in America. They know a sport is just a sport.

Ghana, Cameroon,Nigeria and Egypt are close to being at the USA's level generally speaking... When you factor in the huge economic advantage the USA has that is not bad. In fact people would generally put these 5 nations in the same boat. upper Mid level teams that are not elite enough to hang with the big boys consistently but can give them a game.

If the USA wants to leave this group which also includes teams like Croatia, Japan, South Korea etc etc they have to do something unique.

If we are comparing teams within this group, then you can say maybe some are better overall but the difference is minimal. This is of course assuming we are only talking about the men. If by soccer nation you mean every inch of soccer then it is a different debate.

[kolinzo]

Now, Nigeria has yet to reach the level of a soccer loving nation. What we do in Nigeria is lust after the game. A soccer loving nation that cannot bring 1000 fans to watch a local team, is that a soccer loving nation? Hell to the no! Wake me up when Nigeria becomes a REAL soccer loving nation. As at this moment, we lack love for the game.

America is a soccer loving nation and we have the most soccer fans in the whole world -more than that of England and Spain combined- and it is still growing. MLS attendance is second to NFL - more than that of NBA and MLB. In America they are building soccer universities where kids will be able to go and learn and master the game. In fact they are building the most expensive soccer academy in the world as I type. Believe me, some of you people will have to wake up very soon and smell the coffee.

[kolinzo]

yes I know this is a direct slap on your ego but facts are facts; the MLS generates a far more fund, has better stadia, better TV coverage, attracts more foreign players, boast more fans than than our so called Nigeria professional league could ever dream of

The USA has always been a "more soccer nation" than Nigeria.

Results wise they are arguably better at the world cup (not regarding age grade tourneys). We've won more continental titles but they play in the COPA against the likes of Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, etc. so...

League wise they are better organized, get more funding, grassroots/youth development, fan attendance blows us outta the water, better stadia, top players, etc.

This right here is the truth of the matter. No African country is more of a soccer nation than the USA. What our people here are getting confused is the level of passion of the fan base. Nigerians are crazy about soccer to the point of fighting each other, but you don't get that in America. They know a sport is just a sport.

Ghana, Cameroon,Nigeria and Egypt are close to being at the USA's level... When you factor in the huge economic advantage the USA has that is not bad. In fact people would generally put these 5 nations in the same boat. upper Mid level teams that are not elite enough to hang with the big boys consistently.

Which level? Who cannot hang with the big boyz? Nigeria has proven for the past 3 world cups she cannot hang with the big boyz, not USA. Which big boyz? Ghana on the other hand proved to the world she could hang with the big boyz when they defeated the United States -deservedly so since the USA underestimated Ghana twice. But when USA smelled the coffee they planned a mock drill using Nigeria as the subject and suddenly beating Ghana was a piece of cake. USA have been beating African teams with ease. Abeg they are above African teams.

[John Obi Moses]

yes I know this is a direct slap on your ego but facts are facts; the MLS generates a far more fund, has better stadia, better TV coverage, attracts more foreign players, boast more fans than than our so called Nigeria professional league could ever dream of

The USA has always been a "more soccer nation" than Nigeria.

Results wise they are arguably better at the world cup (not regarding age grade tourneys). We've won more continental titles but they play in the COPA against the likes of Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, etc. so...

League wise they are better organized, get more funding, grassroots/youth development, fan attendance blows us outta the water, better stadia, top players, etc.

This right here is the truth of the matter. No African country is more of a soccer nation than the USA. What our people here are getting confused is the level of passion of the fan base. Nigerians are crazy about soccer to the point of fighting each other, but you don't get that in America. They know a sport is just a sport.

Ghana, Cameroon,Nigeria and Egypt are close to being at the USA's level... When you factor in the huge economic advantage the USA has that is not bad. In fact people would generally put these 5 nations in the same boat. upper Mid level teams that are not elite enough to hang with the big boys consistently.

Which level? Who cannot hang with the big boyz? Nigeria has proven for the past 3 world cups she cannot hang with the big boyz, not USA. Which big boyz? Ghana on the other hand proved to the world she could hang with the big boyz when they defeated the United States -deservedly so since the USA underestimated Ghana twice. But when USA smelled the coffee they planned a mock drill using Nigeria as the subject and suddenly beating Ghana was a piece of cake. USA have been beating African teams with ease. Abeg they are above African teams.

2-1 is a piece of cake?

2-1 where Ghana dominated every statistical category??

Stats:
http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/matches/ro ... stics.html

The Yanks were hiding in their holes when the Black Stars were hunting and had it not been for luck the Yanks would have paid the price!

Ghana unfortunately paid the price for nationalism and instead of switching out a mediocre local coach for Avram Grant the team kept Appiah and suffered for it. Switch Kwesi Appiah with Avram Grant and it would have been the same old story my friend.


Kwesi Appiah's team conceded on set pieces in nearly every match and also did it in qualifiers for the AFCON. In only 1 month Avram Grant fixed what Kwesi Appiah could not in two years... Nationalism, my friend, is the downfall of any team. Had Ghana smartened up a bit...

[wale1974]

The only level USA is better than Nigeria is senior womens

When was the last time we beat them

[yannick]

yes I know this is a direct slap on your ego but facts are facts; the MLS generates a far more fund, has better stadia, better TV coverage, attracts more foreign players, boast more fans than than our so called Nigeria professional league could ever dream of

The USA has always been a "more soccer nation" than Nigeria.

Results wise they are arguably better at the world cup (not regarding age grade tourneys). We've won more continental titles but they play in the COPA against the likes of Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, etc. so...

League wise they are better organized, get more funding, grassroots/youth development, fan attendance blows us outta the water, better stadia, top players, etc.

This right here is the truth of the matter. No African country is more of a soccer nation than the USA. What our people here are getting confused is the level of passion of the fan base. Nigerians are crazy about soccer to the point of fighting each other, but you don't get that in America. They know a sport is just a sport.

Ghana, Cameroon,Nigeria and Egypt are close to being at the USA's level generally speaking... When you factor in the huge economic advantage the USA has that is not bad. In fact people would generally put these 5 nations in the same boat. upper Mid level teams that are not elite enough to hang with the big boys consistently but can give them a game.

If the USA wants to leave this group which also includes teams like Croatia, Japan, South Korea etc etc they have to do something unique.

If we are comparing teams within this group, then you can say maybe some are better overall but the difference is minimal. This is of course assuming we are only talking about the men. If by soccer nation you mean every inch of soccer then it is a different debate.



-----

kwame forehead you are everywhere you troll

[ohenhen1]

The only level USA is better than Nigeria is senior womens

When was the last time we beat them

They should play Nigeria outside the US maybe Europe. We go see who has the better side.

[GIN]

More talented players in the Nigerian premier league. The problem is our league is not well managed. I just saw some highlights of the Sunshine Stars vs Sharks game, exciting football, but empty stadium. All of our teams are doing well on the continent. Our age grade teams are doing well. Just look at the U23 team, all of them are in the NPL. The infrastructure has also improved a lot.

No serious soccer nation will have that kind of problem when it comes to attendance. Kano Pillars appears to be the only team in Nigeria with huge crowd turnout for their home league matches.

The three factors that are affecting crowd attendance

1. Poor officiating - most fans are fed up with the poor officiating
2. Money - most people would rather stay home and watch the EPL. The Government also do a poor job promoting the games. There is also a high turnover of players every year.
3. Security - not enough police men on patrol to secure the venues. The police is not well trained and lack equipment.

None of your 3 factors has affected Kano Pillar ability to fill the house whenever they play at home. If Kano Pillars can do it then what is stopping the rest of the league from doing the same?