Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

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vancity eagle
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Re: Peseiro Names AFCON 25 but NFF Wants 27

Post by vancity eagle »

Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 10:45 am
anointed wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2023 6:07 pm What are the rationales for Francis Uzoho and Ahmed Musa being on this team?
Uzoho is understandable since we haven’t really tested any other goalkeepers and he has some tournament experience. Maybe the 2 weeks training camp can help him.

But Musa has no business being in the squad. It’s a real slap in the face for all SE supporters and the other players especially those who deserve to be in ahead of him. Shame on the NFF. They have forced Musa on Peseiro.
They forced Musa on Pissero, but why on earth is that eeediot coach only taking 25 players.

If they are forcing a defacto passenger on to you the least you can do is take the full compliment of players so that we don't ever have to be in a position where that wastepipe has to step on the pitch.

NFF and Pissero are a clown match made in heaven.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Lolly »

Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:07 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:34 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:14 am
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:09 am Why does a so called attacking team need 9 defenders and only four midfielders??? And not one of the midfielders is a creative or attacking midfielder. So I ask how will this team score goals? Who will provide the service to the attackers?
The coach is clueless but it’s also possible he didn’t have a freehand in the selection.

But saying that, almost all our previous coaches have overloaded the defence and attack, leaving the midfield bare. I suspect we don’t produce enough good central and creative midfielders.
Lolly

Have you not figured that it is you and others who are missing the logic.

In a squad of 25, what the manager does is select at least two players per position. Ofcourse, there are positions where you also have players with ability to play in multiple positions e.g. Iheanacho.

Nevertheless, what are you misreading. You assume that only central midfield is midfield. What about those who play in wide midfield areas? What are those? In a 4-4-2 which is the base Nigeria often uses because of plethora of strikers in the squad, there are two wide midfielders and those include Chukwueze and Moses for instance. Did you count those as midfielders or attackers? Just asking? In addition, is Lookman a forward or midfielder for Nigeria?
You still have not explained the point of having so many Centre half’s if ? You state two per position why does the squad have six?
It is already explained by the word 'atleast'. Having just two for each position = 22 players. However, there are 25 players named meaning some positions will ordinarily have more than two.

In fact Nigeria, in a 4-4-2, uses two central midfielders. Take a look at v the list and note that 5 players are named for this 2 positions! This does not even include a sixth player, Iheanacho, who also can player there. In essence, there should be enough flexibility.
So why not employ the “at least” in the central midfield positions?

Central midfield…

DM - Ndidi and Onyedika
CM- Onyeka and Aribo
AM - Iwobi

Defenders…

RB - Aina and Osayi
LB - Sanusi and Onyemaechi
CD - Ajayi, Omeruo, Bassey, Ekong, Awaziem

Wide Midfielders…

LW - Lookman and Simon
RW - Chukwueze and Musa


Strikers…

Osimhen, Boniface, Sadiq, Iheanacho

And more importantly, note that 3 out of the 5 central midfielders usually start in our 4-3-3 system, which leaves us with only 2 subs in case of injuries and suspensions.

I would have dropped once central defender (Awaziem) and one striker (Sadiq) for 2 extra midfielders namely Alhassan and Nwakali. Or at least take them along to make 27 players.

And please stop calling Iheanacho a central midfielder. That is his worst position when he usually just messes up all our attacks.
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"If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land."
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Enugu II »

Lolly wrote:
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:07 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:34 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:14 am
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:09 am Why does a so called attacking team need 9 defenders and only four midfielders??? And not one of the midfielders is a creative or attacking midfielder. So I ask how will this team score goals? Who will provide the service to the attackers?
The coach is clueless but it’s also possible he didn’t have a freehand in the selection.

But saying that, almost all our previous coaches have overloaded the defence and attack, leaving the midfield bare. I suspect we don’t produce enough good central and creative midfielders.
Lolly

Have you not figured that it is you and others who are missing the logic.

In a squad of 25, what the manager does is select at least two players per position. Ofcourse, there are positions where you also have players with ability to play in multiple positions e.g. Iheanacho.

Nevertheless, what are you misreading. You assume that only central midfield is midfield. What about those who play in wide midfield areas? What are those? In a 4-4-2 which is the base Nigeria often uses because of plethora of strikers in the squad, there are two wide midfielders and those include Chukwueze and Moses for instance. Did you count those as midfielders or attackers? Just asking? In addition, is Lookman a forward or midfielder for Nigeria?
You still have not explained the point of having so many Centre half’s if ? You state two per position why does the squad have six?
It is already explained by the word 'atleast'. Having just two for each position = 22 players. However, there are 25 players named meaning some positions will ordinarily have more than two.

In fact Nigeria, in a 4-4-2, uses two central midfielders. Take a look at v the list and note that 5 players are named for this 2 positions! This does not even include a sixth player, Iheanacho, who also can player there. In essence, there should be enough flexibility.
So why not employ the “at least” in the central midfield positions?

Central midfield…

DM - Ndidi and Onyedika
CM- Onyeka and Aribo
AM - Iwobi

Defenders…

RB - Aina and Osayi
LB - Sanusi and Onyemachi
CD - Ajayi, Omeruo, Bassey, Ekong, Awaziem

Wide Midfielders…

LW - Lookman and Simon
RW - Chukwueze and Musa


Strikers…

Osimhen, Boniface, Sadiq, Ineahacho

And more importantly, note that 3 out of the 5 central midfielders usually start in our 4-3-3 system, which leaves us with only 2 subs in case of injuries and suspensions.

I would have dropped once central defender and one striker for 2 extra midfielders namely Alhassan and Nwakali. Or at least take them along to make 27 players.
Lolly,

To answer the question it is important to know that Nigeria uses a base if 4 midfielders in a 4-4-2 which then can vary to 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1. Let's address those.

In a 4-4-2, you have 2 central midfielders e.g. Ndidi and Iwobi as starters. The other two are wide midfielders with Chukwueze and Lookman as starters. Not so? Then there are three reserve central midfielders listed already for Iwobi and Ndidi. For the wide midfielders there are also several including Simon.

Now in the variations: You have a striker drop a bit to lead the midfield, here is where you now can add both Iheanacho and Boniface who can and have been used there. Moreover, Aribo can and have also started there with Iheanacho used as his sub.

Lolly, the problem with loading the team with central midfielders, as many seem to be calling, is that you will have players without the pace to go down the wide areas. Remember how Iwobi was used there often by his English clubs. In Nigeria, these wide players are required to have pace and be able to get round their markers to cross the ball. Loading the midfield with central guys will mean you won't have players with this required skill in the way Nigeria wishes to play.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Sleaky72 »

As for Musa. Fock his ugly #$%. I hope he tears his Achilles. Piece of shi$
Guess when it’s considered that you wished death on Keshi,
anything is possible with you.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Sheikh »

Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 2:26 pm
Lolly wrote:
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:07 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:34 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:14 am
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:09 am Why does a so called attacking team need 9 defenders and only four midfielders??? And not one of the midfielders is a creative or attacking midfielder. So I ask how will this team score goals? Who will provide the service to the attackers?
The coach is clueless but it’s also possible he didn’t have a freehand in the selection.

But saying that, almost all our previous coaches have overloaded the defence and attack, leaving the midfield bare. I suspect we don’t produce enough good central and creative midfielders.
Lolly

Have you not figured that it is you and others who are missing the logic.

In a squad of 25, what the manager does is select at least two players per position. Ofcourse, there are positions where you also have players with ability to play in multiple positions e.g. Iheanacho.

Nevertheless, what are you misreading. You assume that only central midfield is midfield. What about those who play in wide midfield areas? What are those? In a 4-4-2 which is the base Nigeria often uses because of plethora of strikers in the squad, there are two wide midfielders and those include Chukwueze and Moses for instance. Did you count those as midfielders or attackers? Just asking? In addition, is Lookman a forward or midfielder for Nigeria?
You still have not explained the point of having so many Centre half’s if ? You state two per position why does the squad have six?
It is already explained by the word 'atleast'. Having just two for each position = 22 players. However, there are 25 players named meaning some positions will ordinarily have more than two.

In fact Nigeria, in a 4-4-2, uses two central midfielders. Take a look at v the list and note that 5 players are named for this 2 positions! This does not even include a sixth player, Iheanacho, who also can player there. In essence, there should be enough flexibility.
So why not employ the “at least” in the central midfield positions?

Central midfield…

DM - Ndidi and Onyedika
CM- Onyeka and Aribo
AM - Iwobi

Defenders…

RB - Aina and Osayi
LB - Sanusi and Onyemachi
CD - Ajayi, Omeruo, Bassey, Ekong, Awaziem

Wide Midfielders…

LW - Lookman and Simon
RW - Chukwueze and Musa


Strikers…

Osimhen, Boniface, Sadiq, Ineahacho

And more importantly, note that 3 out of the 5 central midfielders usually start in our 4-3-3 system, which leaves us with only 2 subs in case of injuries and suspensions.

I would have dropped once central defender and one striker for 2 extra midfielders namely Alhassan and Nwakali. Or at least take them along to make 27 players.
Lolly,

To answer the question it is important to know that Nigeria uses a base if 4 midfielders in a 4-4-2 which then can vary to 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1. Let's address those.

In a 4-4-2, you have 2 central midfielders e.g. Ndidi and Iwobi as starters. The other two are wide midfielders with Chukwueze and Lookman as starters. Not so? Then there are three reserve central midfielders listed already for Iwobi and Ndidi. For the wide midfielders there are also several including Simon.

Now in the variations: You have a striker drop a bit to lead the midfield, here is where you now can add both Iheanacho and Boniface who can and have been used there. Moreover, Aribo can and have also started there with Iheanacho used as his sub.

Lolly, the problem with loading the team with central midfielders, as many seem to be calling, is that you will have players without the pace to go down the wide areas. Remember how Iwobi was used there often by his English clubs. In Nigeria, these wide players are required to have pace and be able to get round their markers to cross the ball. Loading the midfield with central guys will mean you won't have players with this required skill in the way Nigeria wishes to play.
Sorry. The structure you have outlined is quite outdated. Please which team has deployed just two midfielders (one DM, one DM) to win any major trophy of note in recent memory? These days the least number of central midfielders is 3; many 4 and Bayer Leverkusen who have been phenomenal in the Bundesliga use 6!. It is antiquated way of thinking that Rohr used to no effect, and Peseiro has even worsened. This is why we struggle against Rwanda and Lesotho these days; not because of the quality of the players. Please stop giving credence to this nonsense. Even as far back as 10 years ago, Keshi utilized 3 CMs (including a box to box) and Moses dropping back to support the midfield, to win AFCON. Our coach is crap. End of story. If we win anything, it would be down to only the sheer ability of the players,
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Lolly »

Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 2:26 pm
Lolly wrote:
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:07 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:34 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:14 am
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:09 am Why does a so called attacking team need 9 defenders and only four midfielders??? And not one of the midfielders is a creative or attacking midfielder. So I ask how will this team score goals? Who will provide the service to the attackers?
The coach is clueless but it’s also possible he didn’t have a freehand in the selection.

But saying that, almost all our previous coaches have overloaded the defence and attack, leaving the midfield bare. I suspect we don’t produce enough good central and creative midfielders.
Lolly

Have you not figured that it is you and others who are missing the logic.

In a squad of 25, what the manager does is select at least two players per position. Ofcourse, there are positions where you also have players with ability to play in multiple positions e.g. Iheanacho.

Nevertheless, what are you misreading. You assume that only central midfield is midfield. What about those who play in wide midfield areas? What are those? In a 4-4-2 which is the base Nigeria often uses because of plethora of strikers in the squad, there are two wide midfielders and those include Chukwueze and Moses for instance. Did you count those as midfielders or attackers? Just asking? In addition, is Lookman a forward or midfielder for Nigeria?
You still have not explained the point of having so many Centre half’s if ? You state two per position why does the squad have six?
It is already explained by the word 'atleast'. Having just two for each position = 22 players. However, there are 25 players named meaning some positions will ordinarily have more than two.

In fact Nigeria, in a 4-4-2, uses two central midfielders. Take a look at v the list and note that 5 players are named for this 2 positions! This does not even include a sixth player, Iheanacho, who also can player there. In essence, there should be enough flexibility.
So why not employ the “at least” in the central midfield positions?

Central midfield…

DM - Ndidi and Onyedika
CM- Onyeka and Aribo
AM - Iwobi

Defenders…

RB - Aina and Osayi
LB - Sanusi and Onyemachi
CD - Ajayi, Omeruo, Bassey, Ekong, Awaziem

Wide Midfielders…

LW - Lookman and Simon
RW - Chukwueze and Musa


Strikers…

Osimhen, Boniface, Sadiq, Ineahacho

And more importantly, note that 3 out of the 5 central midfielders usually start in our 4-3-3 system, which leaves us with only 2 subs in case of injuries and suspensions.

I would have dropped once central defender and one striker for 2 extra midfielders namely Alhassan and Nwakali. Or at least take them along to make 27 players.
Lolly,

To answer the question it is important to know that Nigeria uses a base if 4 midfielders in a 4-4-2 which then can vary to 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1. Let's address those.

In a 4-4-2, you have 2 central midfielders e.g. Ndidi and Iwobi as starters. The other two are wide midfielders with Chukwueze and Lookman as starters. Not so? Then there are three reserve central midfielders listed already for Iwobi and Ndidi. For the wide midfielders there are also several including Simon.

Now in the variations: You have a striker drop a bit to lead the midfield, here is where you now can add both Iheanacho and Boniface who can and have been used there. Moreover, Aribo can and have also started there with Iheanacho used as his sub.

Lolly, the problem with loading the team with central midfielders, as many seem to be calling, is that you will have players without the pace to go down the wide areas. Remember how Iwobi was used there often by his English clubs. In Nigeria, these wide players are required to have pace and be able to get round their markers to cross the ball. Loading the midfield with central guys will mean you won't have players with this required skill in the way Nigeria wishes to play.
It is not always 4-4-2.

In our last game against Zimbabwe, we started with Onyeka, Iwobi and Aribo. And I expect him to rotate between 4-4-2, 4-3-3 and 4-4-1-1 at the start and changing it during the games.
"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life"

"If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land."
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Sheikh »

Sheikh wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 3:00 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 2:26 pm
Lolly wrote:
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:07 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:34 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:14 am

The coach is clueless but it’s also possible he didn’t have a freehand in the selection.

But saying that, almost all our previous coaches have overloaded the defence and attack, leaving the midfield bare. I suspect we don’t produce enough good central and creative midfielders.
Lolly

Have you not figured that it is you and others who are missing the logic.

In a squad of 25, what the manager does is select at least two players per position. Ofcourse, there are positions where you also have players with ability to play in multiple positions e.g. Iheanacho.

Nevertheless, what are you misreading. You assume that only central midfield is midfield. What about those who play in wide midfield areas? What are those? In a 4-4-2 which is the base Nigeria often uses because of plethora of strikers in the squad, there are two wide midfielders and those include Chukwueze and Moses for instance. Did you count those as midfielders or attackers? Just asking? In addition, is Lookman a forward or midfielder for Nigeria?
You still have not explained the point of having so many Centre half’s if ? You state two per position why does the squad have six?
It is already explained by the word 'atleast'. Having just two for each position = 22 players. However, there are 25 players named meaning some positions will ordinarily have more than two.

In fact Nigeria, in a 4-4-2, uses two central midfielders. Take a look at v the list and note that 5 players are named for this 2 positions! This does not even include a sixth player, Iheanacho, who also can player there. In essence, there should be enough flexibility.
So why not employ the “at least” in the central midfield positions?

Central midfield…

DM - Ndidi and Onyedika
CM- Onyeka and Aribo
AM - Iwobi

Defenders…

RB - Aina and Osayi
LB - Sanusi and Onyemachi
CD - Ajayi, Omeruo, Bassey, Ekong, Awaziem

Wide Midfielders…

LW - Lookman and Simon
RW - Chukwueze and Musa


Strikers…

Osimhen, Boniface, Sadiq, Ineahacho

And more importantly, note that 3 out of the 5 central midfielders usually start in our 4-3-3 system, which leaves us with only 2 subs in case of injuries and suspensions.

I would have dropped once central defender and one striker for 2 extra midfielders namely Alhassan and Nwakali. Or at least take them along to make 27 players.
Lolly,

To answer the question it is important to know that Nigeria uses a base if 4 midfielders in a 4-4-2 which then can vary to 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1. Let's address those.

In a 4-4-2, you have 2 central midfielders e.g. Ndidi and Iwobi as starters. The other two are wide midfielders with Chukwueze and Lookman as starters. Not so? Then there are three reserve central midfielders listed already for Iwobi and Ndidi. For the wide midfielders there are also several including Simon.

Now in the variations: You have a striker drop a bit to lead the midfield, here is where you now can add both Iheanacho and Boniface who can and have been used there. Moreover, Aribo can and have also started there with Iheanacho used as his sub.

Lolly, the problem with loading the team with central midfielders, as many seem to be calling, is that you will have players without the pace to go down the wide areas. Remember how Iwobi was used there often by his English clubs. In Nigeria, these wide players are required to have pace and be able to get round their markers to cross the ball. Loading the midfield with central guys will mean you won't have players with this required skill in the way Nigeria wishes to play.
Sorry. The structure you have outlined is quite outdated. Please which team has deployed just two midfielders (one DM, one DM) to win any major trophy of note in recent memory? These days the least number of central midfielders is 3; many 4 and Bayer Leverkusen who have been phenomenal in the Bundesliga use 6!. It is antiquated way of thinking that Rohr used to no effect, and Peseiro has even worsened. This is why we struggle against Rwanda and Lesotho these days; not because of the quality of the players. Please stop giving credence to this nonsense. Even as far back as 10 years ago, Keshi utilized 3 CMs (including a box to box) and Moses dropping back to support the midfield, to win AFCON. Our coach is crap. End of story. If we win anything, it would be down to only the sheer ability of the players,
Re underlined, meant to write "(one DM, one AM)"
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Enugu II »

Sheikh wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 3:00 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 2:26 pm
Lolly wrote:
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:07 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:34 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:14 am

The coach is clueless but it’s also possible he didn’t have a freehand in the selection.

But saying that, almost all our previous coaches have overloaded the defence and attack, leaving the midfield bare. I suspect we don’t produce enough good central and creative midfielders.
Lolly

Have you not figured that it is you and others who are missing the logic.

In a squad of 25, what the manager does is select at least two players per position. Ofcourse, there are positions where you also have players with ability to play in multiple positions e.g. Iheanacho.

Nevertheless, what are you misreading. You assume that only central midfield is midfield. What about those who play in wide midfield areas? What are those? In a 4-4-2 which is the base Nigeria often uses because of plethora of strikers in the squad, there are two wide midfielders and those include Chukwueze and Moses for instance. Did you count those as midfielders or attackers? Just asking? In addition, is Lookman a forward or midfielder for Nigeria?
You still have not explained the point of having so many Centre half’s if ? You state two per position why does the squad have six?
It is already explained by the word 'atleast'. Having just two for each position = 22 players. However, there are 25 players named meaning some positions will ordinarily have more than two.

In fact Nigeria, in a 4-4-2, uses two central midfielders. Take a look at v the list and note that 5 players are named for this 2 positions! This does not even include a sixth player, Iheanacho, who also can player there. In essence, there should be enough flexibility.
So why not employ the “at least” in the central midfield positions?

Central midfield…

DM - Ndidi and Onyedika
CM- Onyeka and Aribo
AM - Iwobi

Defenders…

RB - Aina and Osayi
LB - Sanusi and Onyemachi
CD - Ajayi, Omeruo, Bassey, Ekong, Awaziem

Wide Midfielders…

LW - Lookman and Simon
RW - Chukwueze and Musa


Strikers…

Osimhen, Boniface, Sadiq, Ineahacho

And more importantly, note that 3 out of the 5 central midfielders usually start in our 4-3-3 system, which leaves us with only 2 subs in case of injuries and suspensions.

I would have dropped once central defender and one striker for 2 extra midfielders namely Alhassan and Nwakali. Or at least take them along to make 27 players.
Lolly,

To answer the question it is important to know that Nigeria uses a base if 4 midfielders in a 4-4-2 which then can vary to 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1. Let's address those.

In a 4-4-2, you have 2 central midfielders e.g. Ndidi and Iwobi as starters. The other two are wide midfielders with Chukwueze and Lookman as starters. Not so? Then there are three reserve central midfielders listed already for Iwobi and Ndidi. For the wide midfielders there are also several including Simon.

Now in the variations: You have a striker drop a bit to lead the midfield, here is where you now can add both Iheanacho and Boniface who can and have been used there. Moreover, Aribo can and have also started there with Iheanacho used as his sub.

Lolly, the problem with loading the team with central midfielders, as many seem to be calling, is that you will have players without the pace to go down the wide areas. Remember how Iwobi was used there often by his English clubs. In Nigeria, these wide players are required to have pace and be able to get round their markers to cross the ball. Loading the midfield with central guys will mean you won't have players with this required skill in the way Nigeria wishes to play.
Sorry. The structure you have outlined is quite outdated. Please which team has deployed just two midfielders (one DM, one DM) to win any major trophy of note in recent memory? These days the least number of central midfielders is 3; many 4 and Bayer Leverkusen who have been phenomenal in the Bundesliga use 6!. It is antiquated way of thinking that Rohr used to no effect, and Peseiro has even worsened. This is why we struggle against Rwanda and Lesotho these days; not because of the quality of the players. Please stop giving credence to this nonsense. Even as far back as 10 years ago, Keshi utilized 3 CMs (including a box to box) and Moses dropping back to support the midfield, to win AFCON. Our coach is crap. End of story. If we win anything, it would be down to only the sheer ability of the players,
Sheikh

What I have outlined is not my thinking but actually what Nigeria deploys. And btw, it is still used globally along with many others. There is no single formation out there that all teams use. A team's formation is dictated by several variables -- manager's preference, team personnel, as well as the opponemt.

Importantly, if you breakdown the listed players you will clearly understand the plan. Thus, the discussion is not about the fanciest formation to play but about what Nigeria uses and will use and the rationale for the invited personnel.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

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"it is better to be excited now and disappointed later, than it is to be disappointed now and later." - Marcus Aurelius, 178AD
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Sheikh »

Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 3:05 pm
Sheikh wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 3:00 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 2:26 pm
Lolly wrote:
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm
Flex Swift wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:07 pm
Enugu II wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:34 am

Lolly

Have you not figured that it is you and others who are missing the logic.

In a squad of 25, what the manager does is select at least two players per position. Ofcourse, there are positions where you also have players with ability to play in multiple positions e.g. Iheanacho.

Nevertheless, what are you misreading. You assume that only central midfield is midfield. What about those who play in wide midfield areas? What are those? In a 4-4-2 which is the base Nigeria often uses because of plethora of strikers in the squad, there are two wide midfielders and those include Chukwueze and Moses for instance. Did you count those as midfielders or attackers? Just asking? In addition, is Lookman a forward or midfielder for Nigeria?
You still have not explained the point of having so many Centre half’s if ? You state two per position why does the squad have six?
It is already explained by the word 'atleast'. Having just two for each position = 22 players. However, there are 25 players named meaning some positions will ordinarily have more than two.

In fact Nigeria, in a 4-4-2, uses two central midfielders. Take a look at v the list and note that 5 players are named for this 2 positions! This does not even include a sixth player, Iheanacho, who also can player there. In essence, there should be enough flexibility.
So why not employ the “at least” in the central midfield positions?

Central midfield…

DM - Ndidi and Onyedika
CM- Onyeka and Aribo
AM - Iwobi

Defenders…

RB - Aina and Osayi
LB - Sanusi and Onyemachi
CD - Ajayi, Omeruo, Bassey, Ekong, Awaziem

Wide Midfielders…

LW - Lookman and Simon
RW - Chukwueze and Musa


Strikers…

Osimhen, Boniface, Sadiq, Ineahacho

And more importantly, note that 3 out of the 5 central midfielders usually start in our 4-3-3 system, which leaves us with only 2 subs in case of injuries and suspensions.

I would have dropped once central defender and one striker for 2 extra midfielders namely Alhassan and Nwakali. Or at least take them along to make 27 players.
Lolly,

To answer the question it is important to know that Nigeria uses a base if 4 midfielders in a 4-4-2 which then can vary to 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1. Let's address those.

In a 4-4-2, you have 2 central midfielders e.g. Ndidi and Iwobi as starters. The other two are wide midfielders with Chukwueze and Lookman as starters. Not so? Then there are three reserve central midfielders listed already for Iwobi and Ndidi. For the wide midfielders there are also several including Simon.

Now in the variations: You have a striker drop a bit to lead the midfield, here is where you now can add both Iheanacho and Boniface who can and have been used there. Moreover, Aribo can and have also started there with Iheanacho used as his sub.

Lolly, the problem with loading the team with central midfielders, as many seem to be calling, is that you will have players without the pace to go down the wide areas. Remember how Iwobi was used there often by his English clubs. In Nigeria, these wide players are required to have pace and be able to get round their markers to cross the ball. Loading the midfield with central guys will mean you won't have players with this required skill in the way Nigeria wishes to play.
Sorry. The structure you have outlined is quite outdated. Please which team has deployed just two midfielders (one DM, one DM) to win any major trophy of note in recent memory? These days the least number of central midfielders is 3; many 4 and Bayer Leverkusen who have been phenomenal in the Bundesliga use 6!. It is antiquated way of thinking that Rohr used to no effect, and Peseiro has even worsened. This is why we struggle against Rwanda and Lesotho these days; not because of the quality of the players. Please stop giving credence to this nonsense. Even as far back as 10 years ago, Keshi utilized 3 CMs (including a box to box) and Moses dropping back to support the midfield, to win AFCON. Our coach is crap. End of story. If we win anything, it would be down to only the sheer ability of the players,
Sheikh

What I have outlined is not my thinking but actually what Nigeria deploys. And btw, it is still used globally along with many others. There is no single formation out there that all teams use. A team's formation is dictated by several variables -- manager's preference, team personnel, as well as the opponemt.

Importantly, if you breakdown the listed players you will clearly understand the plan. Thus, the discussion is not about the fanciest formation to play but about what Nigeria uses and will use and the rationale for the invited personnel.
Enugu II,

It would be more accurate to say this is what Peseiro (not Nigeria) deploys. The structure you described, which is Peseiro's tactics, is used no doubt by many, but without success in the contemporary era. It is definitely not used by leading teams or managers of any worth.

My comments are not about fancy formations. It is much more elementary than that. There is definitely no single formation, but the era of 424 with two wingers is long gone. It is suicidal. With the talent at our disposal, we should be much better than that. What listed players are you referring to? None of our key players even play such achaic formation in their clubs (Napoli, Bayer Leverkusen, Fulham, Atalanta, Porto, Fernerbache, Boavista, Brentford, even Leicester do not do so), It is no wonder Peseiro's team is alarmingly disjointed when they play, easily defended against and very exposed on the counterplay, even by very below average teams.

We have 2 sets of talented wing backs (Osayi/Aina, Sanusi/Bruno) who are quick and are adept at crossing. Why waste personnel by having two additional wingers that are not strong at playing in the middle? Please do not mention Kelechi or Lookman. They are support strikers, not central midfielders.

With the listed 25, you should have Onyedika, Ndidi and Onyeka/Aribo in central midfield 3. Front 3 could be Osimhen and Boniface, with any one of Iwobi/Lookman/Kelechi/Moses supporting. Given that you need at least 3 midfielders on the pitch, I fully agree with Lolly that the list should have more midfielders (3 easily come to mind: Nwakali, Yusuf and Ifeanyi Matthew).

It is not fancy or rocket science, just obvious.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by kawawa »

This team will do well and Lookman and Vic O are about to have a heck of tournament and serve some much deserved pie especially Lookman.Not a bad list. I think Moffi probably over Sadiq but I blame his bad luck and omission on Bushboy.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Lolly »

danfo driver wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 4:23 pm
It's not about his body, it is whether he deserves a place above others he is competing with. He is primarily a wide attacking midfielder for the SE. And his form for the SE has deteriorated. Hence I would have taken Tella ahead of him.

And he is not even playing for his club as he claimed.

Image

He has served us well and would be remembered for his good works, leadership and goals.
Last edited by Lolly on Sat Dec 30, 2023 5:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by The YeyeMan »

Fed up with this team. I won't be watching.

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Re: Peseiro Names AFCON 25 but NFF Wants 27

Post by anointed »

Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:10 am
anointed wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 10:58 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 10:45 am
anointed wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2023 6:07 pm What are the rationales for Francis Uzoho and Ahmed Musa being on this team?
Uzoho is understandable since we haven’t really tested any other goalkeepers and he has some tournament experience. Maybe the 2 weeks training camp can help him.

But Musa has no business being in the squad. It’s a real slap in the face for all SE supporters and the other players especially those who deserve to be in ahead of him. Shame on the NFF. They have forced Musa on Peseiro.
Uzoho was tested and he passed?
Yes, he has been tested but is not consistent. Some days he is good, others he is bad. But we don’t know what the others are capable of doing. And we have 3 goalkeepers, so it is likely Uzoho would be benched the moment he stumbles again.
Consistently bad or which day was he good?
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Re: Peseiro Names AFCON 25 but NFF Wants 27

Post by Lolly »

anointed wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 5:48 pm
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:10 am
anointed wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 10:58 am
Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 10:45 am
anointed wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2023 6:07 pm What are the rationales for Francis Uzoho and Ahmed Musa being on this team?
Uzoho is understandable since we haven’t really tested any other goalkeepers and he has some tournament experience. Maybe the 2 weeks training camp can help him.

But Musa has no business being in the squad. It’s a real slap in the face for all SE supporters and the other players especially those who deserve to be in ahead of him. Shame on the NFF. They have forced Musa on Peseiro.
Uzoho was tested and he passed?
Yes, he has been tested but is not consistent. Some days he is good, others he is bad. But we don’t know what the others are capable of doing. And we have 3 goalkeepers, so it is likely Uzoho would be benched the moment he stumbles again.
Consistently bad or which day was he good?
50/50.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Tbite »

Must has already padded his resume with undeserved caps. Those saying he deserves a farewell are missing that point.
He has already been given special treatment.
At this point he is just exploiting Nigeria.
I do not wish him well.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Lolly »

Tbite wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 6:02 pm Must has already padded his resume with undeserved caps. Those saying he deserves a farewell are missing that point.
He has already been given special treatment.
At this point he is just exploiting Nigeria.
I do not wish him well.
Not good. You and VE need to watch it. Some things shouldn't be tolerated here.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by iworo »

anointed wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 9:33 am
imehjunior wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:14 pm
That can't be Leke but an insane man. Even outfield players don't do that
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: Houston, we have a problem! :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by vancity eagle »

danfo driver wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 4:23 pm
Look at this lying piece of shi$ criminal.

"If the coach doesn't want to call me anymore"

The coach doest want your wastepipe #$% you are forcing yourself on the team with your political connections.

"I am always playing with my club"

No you are not you rotten thief. You don't even make the bench for your club you stupid loser.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Tobi17 »

Musa needs to fock off

Pisseiro isn't lasting a second after the AFCON, for the love of God he needs to be gone. I hope NFF have a new coach ready to start the WCQ cause I've written off this AFCON already. No sane coach goes to a tough tournament like this with ONLY 5 midfielders when every CAF team listed 6-7 except us having the lowest numbers. Pisseiro is either an imbec*le or just wants to sabotage us intentionally cause he knows he won't last any way.
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by Lolly »

iworo wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 6:14 pm
anointed wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 9:33 am
imehjunior wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2023 7:14 pm
That can't be Leke but an insane man. Even outfield players don't do that
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: Houston, we have a problem! :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: This is criminal
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Re: Peseiro names 25 man 2023 AFCON squad

Post by danfo driver »

Lolly wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 6:05 pm
Tbite wrote: Sat Dec 30, 2023 6:02 pm Must has already padded his resume with undeserved caps. Those saying he deserves a farewell are missing that point.
He has already been given special treatment.
At this point he is just exploiting Nigeria.
I do not wish him well.
Not good. You and VE need to watch it. Some things shouldn't be tolerated here.
I think there is a stack difference between what Tbite has said and what VE said.

Its not by force to wish someone well. Is it by force??? Not everyone you meet will wish you well and that is okay. He never said he wishes him evil or bad. He just will not wish him well. I think thats okay. No be by force for anyone to waive to you on the street, not by force for anyone to greet you on the road, and not by force for anyone to wish you well.

There is a great difference between refusing to greet someone on the road AND pouring hot oil on the person on the road.
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