Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by highbury »

Having pondered on this, I believe it will be the biggest mistake Nigeria will make if Rohr is fired now! I looked at the FIFA window and we only have about 10 days of preparation before the AFCON. I am sorry no new coach has that much time to exert any meaningful change in the team. Don't get me wrong, I am of the opinion that he should be fired, but it should have be done earlier. Terminating his appointment is akin to making the right decision at the wrong time. Rohr pattern of thinking is anathema to our way of thinking. He makes his team and Nigerians feel inferior about the team. I believe the best time to terminate his appointment is after March if we don't qualify or after the World Cup. The national team is different from clubs. When a club coach gets fired he has time to prepare his team, but a National team coach is only bound by FIFA window which makes things a little complicated. We shouldn't make the same mistake of 2002 and 2010.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by vancity eagle »

The best thing would be for some kind of continuity.

A new coach, with Salisu and Yobo chiming in. No major changes in personnel.

Heck even bring someone in to assist Rohr.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by waka-man »

If the continuity had a chance, I’d stick with it too.

But continuing what we have risks embarrassment. And guarantees failure. It’s been such a downward spiral and it now has the team’s confidence shot.

Continuity for continuity sake makes no sense.

We’re not going to win Afcon. The best option now is to use the 10 days prep and 3 games we’re certain to get at the Afcon to build a playing system that has a chance to win a playoff. Because while we don’t have the best squad in Africa, we have one of the top three, and by Afcon as a prep, a new manager will be able to make us at least even odds to qualify for the big dance.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by Orion »

Of course, it would be a big mistake. This is not something new to us. We have lots of experience of this.

We did this in 1998, 2002, and 2010. We've done it multiple times and it has never worked, but we keep expecting a different result each time.

Unfortunately, the NFF often eventually caves in to the ignorant baying of the fans. We just hope there are calmer heads at the NFF who make decisions based on carefully analyzing the pros and cons of our situation. Such analysis would reveal what you mentioned here that fans may be completely oblivious to. 10 days for a new coach into a major tournament?? Even Westerhof at his peak had more time and he couldn't make it work.

We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences. This would be a complete change in mentality. The old mentality never worked for us in the first place so there is no point hanging on to it. Try something new.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by gochino »

highbury wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:49 am Having pondered on this, I believe it will be the biggest mistake Nigeria will make if Rohr is fired now! I looked at the FIFA window and we only have about 10 days of preparation before the AFCON. I am sorry no new coach has that much time to exert any meaningful change in the team. Don't get me wrong, I am of the opinion that he should be fired, but it should have be done earlier. Terminating his appointment is akin to making the right decision at the wrong time. Rohr pattern of thinking is anathema to our way of thinking. He makes his team and Nigerians feel inferior about the team. I believe the best time to terminate his appointment is after March if we don't qualify or after the World Cup. The national team is different from clubs. When a club coach gets fired he has time to prepare his team, but a National team coach is only bound by FIFA window which makes things a little complicated. We shouldn't make the same mistake of 2002 and 2010.
Quick question, does that team play like a team that has been together for 5yrs? If we go to the world cup and play exactly the way we do now, we would be disgraced, period!
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by Dammy »

What's most worrying for me, apart from the lethargic displays by the SE, is the comments of the coach. He refuses to acknowledge that the team is not playing well and saying that he sees positive signs in the Osimhen/Ighalo partnership, when most of us saw it differently. Like a CE posted, it's like he's trying to sabotage the team!
I am happy
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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Orion wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:33 am Of course, it would be a big mistake. This is not something new to us. We have lots of experience of this.

We did this in 1998, 2002, and 2010. We've done it multiple times and it has never worked, but we keep expecting a different result each time.

Unfortunately, the NFF often eventually caves in to the ignorant baying of the fans. We just hope there are calmer heads at the NFF who make decisions based on carefully analyzing the pros and cons of our situation. Such analysis would reveal what you mentioned here that fans may be completely oblivious to. 10 days for a new coach into a major tournament?? Even Westerhof at his peak had more time and he couldn't make it work.

We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences. This would be a complete change in mentality. The old mentality never worked for us in the first place so there is no point hanging on to it. Try something new.
Not sure that’s how any ambitious organisation operates. We’ve been uncharacteristic in giving the man 5 years. No ambitious footballing nation anywhere would give him that sort of time.

So this would not be some knee-jerk response to baying fans; instead we need to make this move now or waste a talented generation.

The bigger failure here would be to not act despite concrete evidence that we are headed for failure.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by Benedict Iroha »

Nigeria doesn't produce players anymore, it's clear. It's like we just search for players like Paul Onaochu wtf...anybody playing a European club. This is where we get all these oyibo boys.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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Benedict Iroha wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 9:48 am Nigeria doesn't produce players anymore, it's clear. It's like we just search for players like Paul Onaochu wtf...anybody playing a European club. This is where we get all these oyibo boys.
I think this is a myth.
Apart from the 94 - 2000 generation, we’ve never had it better.
Osimhen and Ndidi could play for any team in the world.
Ejuke and Samu are mentioned amongst the brightest young’s talents in the game.
And Okoye is gradually building a reputation as one to watch out for.
Of course there are mediocre players around them, but it was ever so. But compared to the countries we’ve been struggling with, and compared to the last 20 years, this is actually a bit of a purple patch.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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Orion wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:33 am Of course, it would be a big mistake. This is not something new to us. We have lots of experience of this.

We did this in 1998, 2002, and 2010. We've done it multiple times and it has never worked, but we keep expecting a different result each time.

Unfortunately, the NFF often eventually caves in to the ignorant baying of the fans. We just hope there are calmer heads at the NFF who make decisions based on carefully analyzing the pros and cons of our situation. Such analysis would reveal what you mentioned here that fans may be completely oblivious to. 10 days for a new coach into a major tournament?? Even Westerhof at his peak had more time and he couldn't make it work.

We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences. This would be a complete change in mentality. The old mentality never worked for us in the first place so there is no point hanging on to it. Try something new.
He was given 5 years and yet the players are playing as if they just met. I was fully on board but I was underwhelmed during the world cup. I put it down to him trying to implement a structure before going to build with a solid base + exciting new talent. In 2019, I stood by him even when we lost to Madagascar (as I did when we lost to South Africa at home in the qualifiers). Even after we were outplayed by Algeria I saw it as a chance to build even though I was underwhelmed.

Since then we have seen a manager that has run out of ideas. We are not scoring so much but we are not shutting out teams either. The displays during the AFCON qualifiers were patchy but the WC qualifiers have been even worse (save a very good performance away yo Cape Verde). Against CAR at home, and Liberia away we struggled to create chances. We were decent in the first half at home against Cape Verde but stumbled back into the usual motion in the second half.

In all this time, Rohr has stuck to his favourites and refused to even attempt to change things. It is not correct to call the fans reaction knee jerk.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by mcal »

...only a desperate oyinbo or foreigner needing money will take on SE job.
But again na where una go find the money to pay am?
Fire Rohr give the job to local naijans you can control and not pay, that there will guarantee real heartache for the up coming ANC and WC qualifications.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by danfo driver »

We fought a civil war where millions died and the biggest mistake we will ever make is firing a worthless trash who spends his time violating our women, instead of doing his job. I ro ni? :lol: :lol:
metalalloy wrote: Does the SE have Gray, Mahrez or Albrighton on our team or players of their caliber?
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by highbury »

gochino wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:56 am
highbury wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:49 am Having pondered on this, I believe it will be the biggest mistake Nigeria will make if Rohr is fired now! I looked at the FIFA window and we only have about 10 days of preparation before the AFCON. I am sorry no new coach has that much time to exert any meaningful change in the team. Don't get me wrong, I am of the opinion that he should be fired, but it should have be done earlier. Terminating his appointment is akin to making the right decision at the wrong time. Rohr pattern of thinking is anathema to our way of thinking. He makes his team and Nigerians feel inferior about the team. I believe the best time to terminate his appointment is after March if we don't qualify or after the World Cup. The national team is different from clubs. When a club coach gets fired he has time to prepare his team, but a National team coach is only bound by FIFA window which makes things a little complicated. We shouldn't make the same mistake of 2002 and 2010.
Quick question, does that team play like a team that has been together for 5yrs? If we go to the world cup and play exactly the way we do now, we would be disgraced, period!
To answer your question: NO. The team doesn't play like it's been together for 5 yrs. That is why I understand people who are clamoring for his resignation. They have a valid point. The point I am making is that it is the right decision to sack him but it's being done at the wrong time.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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waka-man wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 9:41 am
Orion wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:33 am Of course, it would be a big mistake. This is not something new to us. We have lots of experience of this.

We did this in 1998, 2002, and 2010. We've done it multiple times and it has never worked, but we keep expecting a different result each time.

Unfortunately, the NFF often eventually caves in to the ignorant baying of the fans. We just hope there are calmer heads at the NFF who make decisions based on carefully analyzing the pros and cons of our situation. Such analysis would reveal what you mentioned here that fans may be completely oblivious to. 10 days for a new coach into a major tournament?? Even Westerhof at his peak had more time and he couldn't make it work.

We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences. This would be a complete change in mentality. The old mentality never worked for us in the first place so there is no point hanging on to it. Try something new.
Not sure that’s how any ambitious organisation operates. We’ve been uncharacteristic in giving the man 5 years. No ambitious footballing nation anywhere would give him that sort of time.

So this would not be some knee-jerk response to baying fans; instead we need to make this move now or waste a talented generation.

The bigger failure here would be to not act despite concrete evidence that we are headed for failure.
Your statement makes too much sense! Cut our losses now. I agree that it would be a miracle if this team performs at AFCON or the world cup.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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highbury wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:17 pm
gochino wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:56 am
highbury wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:49 am Having pondered on this, I believe it will be the biggest mistake Nigeria will make if Rohr is fired now! I looked at the FIFA window and we only have about 10 days of preparation before the AFCON. I am sorry no new coach has that much time to exert any meaningful change in the team. Don't get me wrong, I am of the opinion that he should be fired, but it should have be done earlier. Terminating his appointment is akin to making the right decision at the wrong time. Rohr pattern of thinking is anathema to our way of thinking. He makes his team and Nigerians feel inferior about the team. I believe the best time to terminate his appointment is after March if we don't qualify or after the World Cup. The national team is different from clubs. When a club coach gets fired he has time to prepare his team, but a National team coach is only bound by FIFA window which makes things a little complicated. We shouldn't make the same mistake of 2002 and 2010.
Quick question, does that team play like a team that has been together for 5yrs? If we go to the world cup and play exactly the way we do now, we would be disgraced, period!
To answer your question: NO. The team doesn't play like it's been together for 5 yrs. That is why I understand people who are clamoring for his resignation. They have a valid point. The point I am making is that it is the right decision to sack him but it's being done at the wrong time.
Highbury, I think you are right to be concerned about the timing.
As you know, it has been the main thrust of my own arguments here.

I am not sure though that there is an 'ideal' time, apart from a time when there occurs a catastrophic failure, which hasn't happened and isn't likely to happen any time soon.

Above all, we don't know for sure, but it is quite possible that Rohr has 'lost the dressing room' as they say. We will only know after he has gone. But indications are that morale is low in that regard. Professional players know how to mask it off-field but it is harder to mask on-field. The SE's performances do not exactly suggest a team overflowing with confidence.

Anyway, in my opinion, if two key conditions are met, then I guess now is as good a time as any to sack him:
1. There is a ready and willing coach lined up that has a proven record of performance at the kind of level we expect to reach. No sentiment please. Not just someone that has 'been there' but failed. Not an act of 'Omo wa ni. E je ko se' (An old Yoruba 'parapo' saying, meaning 'Na awa pikin, Make him do am'). If youre going to make a change, make it for the better. Not for the same thing you are rejecting, or for something even worse. That just makes no sense.

2. Nigeria is READY to stay the course and weather any wobbles that will inevitably occur in the beginning - and that includes a possible AFCON failure and/or a non-qualification for the WC.
There should be no shakin'. No panicking. No sacking of a coach that obviously needs time to get to grips with what's on ground.

My view is Nigerians can agree and achieve the first but just can't and won't be able to handle the second.

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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by Bigpokey24 »

no this is the best time to fire him. Take a new coach to the AFCON , let him focus to get his tactics together.. now after the AFCON we now go full frontal for the playoffs... we have almost a year before Qatar. There aint no point keeping the coach . we aren't improving

are you people that slow or what.


Last edited by Bigpokey24 on Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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Orion wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:33 am We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences.
I really don't understand this mentality.

Imagine a captain of a ship heading towards an iceberg and says we should continue heading towards the iceberg and accept the consequences rather than doing what's possible to steer the ship away from its doom.

WC go sweet o
DNQ no good o

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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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The YeyeMan wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:06 pm
Orion wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:33 am We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences.
I really don't understand this mentality.

Imagine a captain of a ship heading towards an iceberg and says we should continue heading towards the iceberg and accept the consequences rather than doing what's possible to steer the ship away from its doom.
Okay. Let's take your analogy, which makes perfect sense.
Question is, is it an appropriate analogy though?

A ship known to be heading towards an iceberg will have real objective data to confirm this to be the case; not guesswork or just feelings. Even if uncertain, they'd make their decision on the balance of info available to them.

So what are your objective data in this case in a football sense?
(By the way, there is no prejudice coming with my question. :D )
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by TonyTheTigerKiller »

Orion wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:33 am Of course, it would be a big mistake. This is not something new to us. We have lots of experience of this.

We did this in 1998, 2002, and 2010. We've done it multiple times and it has never worked, but we keep expecting a different result each time.

Unfortunately, the NFF often eventually caves in to the ignorant baying of the fans. We just hope there are calmer heads at the NFF who make decisions based on carefully analyzing the pros and cons of our situation. Such analysis would reveal what you mentioned here that fans may be completely oblivious to. 10 days for a new coach into a major tournament?? Even Westerhof at his peak had more time and he couldn't make it work.

We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences. This would be a complete change in mentality. The old mentality never worked for us in the first place so there is no point hanging on to it. Try something new.
Stop being disingenuous. There is a big difference between 1998, 2002, 2010 and the impending 2022, if we ever get there. 1998 was pure bad luck. Bora Militionović ended up with an injury-riddled team that was much better on paper than they actually were. 2002 and 2010 happened because the powers that be were hell bent on not allowing Shuaibu Amodu to take the SuperEagles to the World Cup. These coaching changes were made despite the lack of any coaching issues. Presently, we do have a serious coaching issue that needs to be addressed before we get to the World Cup❗️


Cheers.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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highbury wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:49 am Having pondered on this, I believe it will be the biggest mistake Nigeria will make if Rohr is fired now! I looked at the FIFA window and we only have about 10 days of preparation before the AFCON. I am sorry no new coach has that much time to exert any meaningful change in the team. Don't get me wrong, I am of the opinion that he should be fired, but it should have be done earlier. Terminating his appointment is akin to making the right decision at the wrong time. Rohr pattern of thinking is anathema to our way of thinking. He makes his team and Nigerians feel inferior about the team. I believe the best time to terminate his appointment is after March if we don't qualify or after the World Cup. The national team is different from clubs. When a club coach gets fired he has time to prepare his team, but a National team coach is only bound by FIFA window which makes things a little complicated. We shouldn't make the same mistake of 2002 and 2010.
I do understand it takes time for some of you to see things that are evidently clear from the onset. You can't win with this guy because his nature as a coach is to be risk-averse and to play down to his opposition.

This dude went to the World Cup to LEARN. And you natives lapped it up. He went to the AFCON and won the Golden Bronze and you all said, he did well, he should be given more time.

He has had 5 years to build a team and his team has regressed to the point he is calling players who are playing retirement footie. Are those players the future? Are those players going to be relevant going forward?

For some reason, you guys think he will get in a few months what he didn't get in 6 years?

Teams with the ambition to win don't MANAGE a coach...

You talk about clubsides but you forgot to mention Algeria. They won their first-ever AFCON making a coaching change. They did not hold on to a mistake for fear of being labeled impetuous.

What you guys are suffering from is paralysis by over analysis... holding onto this guy will leave us at this exact point.

He is OLD!

Old people don't change... you can't change his mindset of how the game should be played. You can't change his mindset about Naijarian players not being all that... you can't change his mindset that we shouldn't aspire to be amongst the best in the world.

How can you win with a coach with such a mindset?
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:30 pm
Orion wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:33 am Of course, it would be a big mistake. This is not something new to us. We have lots of experience of this.

We did this in 1998, 2002, and 2010. We've done it multiple times and it has never worked, but we keep expecting a different result each time.

Unfortunately, the NFF often eventually caves in to the ignorant baying of the fans. We just hope there are calmer heads at the NFF who make decisions based on carefully analyzing the pros and cons of our situation. Such analysis would reveal what you mentioned here that fans may be completely oblivious to. 10 days for a new coach into a major tournament?? Even Westerhof at his peak had more time and he couldn't make it work.

We need to have the courage to see things through and accept the consequences. This would be a complete change in mentality. The old mentality never worked for us in the first place so there is no point hanging on to it. Try something new.
Stop being disingenuous. There is a big difference between 1998, 2002, 2010 and the impending 2022, if we ever get there. 1998 was pure bad luck. Bora Militionović ended up with an injury-riddled team that was much better on paper than they actually were. 2002 and 2010 happened because the powers that be were hell bent on not allowing Shuaibu Amodu to take the SuperEagles to the World Cup. These coaching changes were made despite the lack of any coaching issues. Presently, we do have a serious coaching issue that needs to be addressed before we get to the World Cup❗️


Cheers.
Slight point of correction.
THE FANS were also hell-bent on getting rid of Amodu.
We discussed this a few weeks ago and I dug up press reports from back then.
The new narrative today is that "it was all the NFA's fault".
Not true.
Amodu was unfairly dismissed and the fans played a huge part in making that happen.
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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

Post by Cellular »

Benedict Iroha wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 9:48 am Nigeria doesn't produce players anymore, it's clear. It's like we just search for players like Paul Onaochu wtf...anybody playing a European club. This is where we get all these oyibo boys.
The teams you were struggling against have better players playing in better leagues and for better teams?

You natives have allowed **** to convince you that you ain't $#%. For that alone, he ought to be fired.
THERE WAS A COUNTRY...

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Re: Biggest Mistake Ever Made!!

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highbury wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:49 am Having pondered on this, I believe it will be the biggest mistake Nigeria will make if Rohr is fired now! I looked at the FIFA window and we only have about 10 days of preparation before the AFCON. I am sorry no new coach has that much time to exert any meaningful change in the team. Don't get me wrong, I am of the opinion that he should be fired, but it should have be done earlier. Terminating his appointment is akin to making the right decision at the wrong time. Rohr pattern of thinking is anathema to our way of thinking. He makes his team and Nigerians feel inferior about the team. I believe the best time to terminate his appointment is after March if we don't qualify or after the World Cup. The national team is different from clubs. When a club coach gets fired he has time to prepare his team, but a National team coach is only bound by FIFA window which makes things a little complicated. We shouldn't make the same mistake of 2002 and 2010.
In my view, the timing matters in some aspects and that is if the entire Technical crew is dismissed. But dismissing Rohr should not matter for this reason:

If he is responsible for the downturn of the team, does it not make sense to replace him?


Now, it is true that there is danger in overhauling the team very close to the competition. But overhauling the team does not necessarily follow the removal of the Manager especially if the key assistants are still in place. In fact if the Manager is dismissed and Assistants in place, you maintain the core of the team and re-energize them. That aspect of re-energiing the team is questionable when you keep the Manager.
Last edited by Enugu II on Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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