Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Cito »

Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
I think the aesthetics of his play makes it easy for one to lose sight of his contributions.

Of a truth, I am not impressed by him. He has that new born giraffe clumsiness that makes one wonder if he has skates on his feet after a ‘leg day’ at the gym.

This clumsiness has been with him since he came on the scene as a younglin in the U-17 or so. Check his YouTube videos for his club, it’s the same.

He scores though and here is to hoping for more goals for SE.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by 1naija »

Most people here have a pedestrian idea of the game, thats why they go and pay tithes and do Thanksgiving when chelsea wins. So far Sadiq has been our most effective forward. In the 50 minutes he played, he gave us 3 or so corner kicks, 2 free kicks from dangerous spots, including the one Ajayi almost headed in, and one goal. Yet, to uncle Maceo he was not involved. Go figure...

Some people also see him as a threat to someone else playing. I am glad Eguavoen is a champion and can see real value and quality in a player. His post march comment on Sadiq's performace is all that matters.
gochino wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:48 am
maceo4 wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 11:37 pm Yep, looked much more involved than Sadiq and was eager to show something, was selfless and set up Moses and other teammates. But he doesn’t have the big name factor so no one seems to care lol…
I am confused I counted 4 chances that Sadiq was involved in plus the goal and he played just 50 mins!. If that's not involvement then I don't know what to say. You need to make the right runs and be in the best positions to get chances and Sadiq did just that.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by maceo4 »

1naija wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 2:43 pm Most people here have a pedestrian idea of the game, thats why they go and pay tithes and do Thanksgiving when chelsea wins. So far Sadiq has been our most effective forward. In the 50 minutes he played, he gave us 3 or so corner kicks, 2 free kicks from dangerous spots, including the one Ajayi almost headed in, and one goal. Yet, to uncle Maceo he was not involved. Go figure...

Some people also see him as a threat to someone else playing. I am glad Eguavoen is a champion and can see real value and quality in a player. His post march comment on Sadiq's performace is all that matters.
gochino wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:48 am
maceo4 wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 11:37 pm Yep, looked much more involved than Sadiq and was eager to show something, was selfless and set up Moses and other teammates. But he doesn’t have the big name factor so no one seems to care lol…
I am confused I counted 4 chances that Sadiq was involved in plus the goal and he played just 50 mins!. If that's not involvement then I don't know what to say. You need to make the right runs and be in the best positions to get chances and Sadiq did just that.
Onku, I know english no be awa first language, but saying one party was MORE involved than another is not equivalent to saying one party was NOT involved, theres actually a HUGE difference...ya gets me. You can disagree with me and argue for Sadiq being more involved but don't try to twist what I said to fit your agenda...
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by amafolas »

Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
when i said that he plays like a teenager adjusting to his body after a growth spurt, and that he needed to hit the gym to increase strength, and at this point, it's not obvious what he does really well, Enugu II and Damunk accused me of being biased.
Strange enough, that's exactly what others are seeing. I wonder who is really biased here.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Damunk »

amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:00 am
Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
when i said that he plays like a teenager adjusting to his body after a growth spurt, and that he needed to hit the gym to increase strength, and at this point, it's not obvious what he does really well, Enugu II and Damunk accused me of being biased.
Strange enough, that's exactly what others are seeing. I wonder who is really biased here.
My God!
When did I ‘accuse’ you of anything?
I might have disagreed with you on a point or two, but to ‘accuse’ you? That sounds harsh.
You’re not on my radar as one of those who have an entrenched and biased agenda.

If it is wrt your ‘No, No, No’ views on him (i.e) seeing NOTHING good enough in him, then that’s an extreme opinion which I am hoping will soon change.
It’s probably what they concluded at Rangers, to their regret.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Enugu II »

amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:00 am
Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
when i said that he plays like a teenager adjusting to his body after a growth spurt, and that he needed to hit the gym to increase strength, and at this point, it's not obvious what he does really well, Enugu II and Damunk accused me of being biased.
Strange enough, that's exactly what others are seeing. I wonder who is really biased here.
I doubt that I ever accused you of bias. Based on what? I simply do not share your view. I agree that Sadiq has not played to his optimum but I believe he will be better. I have also cited numerous SE who took time to adjust - Ighalo, Emenike, Aribo, Iwobi, etc. Why would Sadiq be different?
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by amafolas »

Damunk wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:49 am
amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:00 am
Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
when i said that he plays like a teenager adjusting to his body after a growth spurt, and that he needed to hit the gym to increase strength, and at this point, it's not obvious what he does really well, Enugu II and Damunk accused me of being biased.
Strange enough, that's exactly what others are seeing. I wonder who is really biased here.
My God!
When did I ‘accuse’ you of anything?
I might have disagreed with you on a point or two, but to ‘accuse’ you? That sounds harsh.
You’re not on my radar as one of those who have an entrenched and biased agenda.

If it is wrt your ‘No, No, No’ views on him (i.e) seeing NOTHING good enough in him, then that’s an extreme opinion which I am hoping will soon change.
It’s probably what they concluded at Rangers, to their regret.

i think we are misunderstanding each other. Apologies, I did inteprete your response to my comment as calling me biased.

Also, it's not I don't see anything good in him. I was asking what "stand-out" attributes he currently brings to the table. I was asking what things did he do better than the average relative to competition. It's not that he doesn't have those attributes. he's a professional football player, of course he does. But what above average attributes is he currently showing at this level for Nigeria. I still stand by my list of No's. I am waiting still waiting for those of disagree to point out anything on that list that you can debate that yes this is the one thing here that he does better than the other options we have. I also disagreed that with those that wanted to excuse his performance as jittery. Jittery can affect composure, technique and decision-making, it doesn't affect physical attributes (lack of acceleration, pace, strength and power) for the African game. Segunda mostly likely have lower physical requirements and maybe what he has is plenty good enough for that level.

I also genuinely feel you are personally invested (emotionally) in the young man's progress (which is a good thing), but it lets you view assessments of his game by others as unfairly critical. I am not a professional coach. But i really think, the young man's game can benefit from more power, which is something he can actually work on. He needs to hit the gym. I am glad others are pointing it out too.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by vancity eagle »

If Umar had a "bad game" despite scoring and getting himself into a good one on one position (something I'm yet to see from Awoniyi)

Then Nacho also had a "poor game" despite his assist, because his ball trapping skills were piss poor and he was largely anonymous other than the assist.

I've seen more poor aspects to Nachos game than Umar. Does Sadiq fumble simple balls unable to trap them consistently ?
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Damunk »

amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:24 pm
Damunk wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:49 am
amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:00 am
Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
when i said that he plays like a teenager adjusting to his body after a growth spurt, and that he needed to hit the gym to increase strength, and at this point, it's not obvious what he does really well, Enugu II and Damunk accused me of being biased.
Strange enough, that's exactly what others are seeing. I wonder who is really biased here.
My God!
When did I ‘accuse’ you of anything?
I might have disagreed with you on a point or two, but to ‘accuse’ you? That sounds harsh.
You’re not on my radar as one of those who have an entrenched and biased agenda.

If it is wrt your ‘No, No, No’ views on him (i.e) seeing NOTHING good enough in him, then that’s an extreme opinion which I am hoping will soon change.
It’s probably what they concluded at Rangers, to their regret.

i think we are misunderstanding each other. Apologies, I did inteprete your response to my comment as calling me biased.

Also, it's not I don't see anything good in him. I was asking what "stand-out" attributes he currently brings to the table. I was asking what things did he do better than the average relative to competition. It's not that he doesn't have those attributes. he's a professional football player, of course he does. But what above average attributes is he currently showing at this level for Nigeria. I still stand by my list of No's. I am waiting still waiting for those of disagree to point out anything on that list that you can debate that yes this is the one thing here that he does better than the other options we have. I also disagreed that with those that wanted to excuse his performance as jittery. Jittery can affect composure, technique and decision-making, it doesn't affect physical attributes (lack of acceleration, pace, strength and power) for the African game. Segunda mostly likely have lower physical requirements and maybe what he has is plenty good enough for that level.

I also genuinely feel you are personally invested (emotionally) in the young man's progress (which is a good thing), but it lets you view assessments of his game by others as unfairly critical. I am not a professional coach. But i really think, the young man's game can benefit from more power, which is something he can actually work on. He needs to hit the gym. I am glad others are pointing it out too.
Thanks amafolas.
Just seen this.
It might seem that I am “personally invested” in Sadiq as you put it, but like most fans, I see attributes and weaknesses in him that might differ from others.
My point really is that Sadiq has many really great attributes which might not be easily or fully appreciated until he sits on the big stage. I don’t think you have a bias against him in particular, but I think you are being a little hasty in your conclusions.

You say for instance he is slow, with poor acceleration.
I’ve watched him often enough to know it is not true.
It’s an optical illusion.
Long-legged players are always believed to be slower than they actually are. Kanu is a great example. In moving from point A to B, they require less paces/strides per unit distance. Put him in a straight 1v1 race for the ball and you’ll see he isn’t ‘slow’ at all.
I reckon he’ll outrun Awoniyi and Nacho. Probably not Osimhen who is fast!

That’s just one example. His close ball skills are impressive too.
He has his flaws obviously ( eg easily brought down/knocked over) but ultimately he has to keep improving and it’s about time he starts playing regularly with the Big Boyz. Hopefully, that will happen next season in La Liga after promotion if he doesn’t even get sold, but for now he is consistently banging in goals and his team is top of La Segunda.

It was the wrong match to watch objectively and I haven’t had the courage to go back to it, but I remember that he had a far better game vs Tunisia than any other. I’m sure more than a few would have noticed some things about his game that made them reconsider their initial assessments. But the emotions of the game might require us all to go back and rewatch for a more objective assessment.

But me, I never ready. :rotf:
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Lolly »

Damunk wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 8:25 am
amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:24 pm
Damunk wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:49 am
amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:00 am
Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
when i said that he plays like a teenager adjusting to his body after a growth spurt, and that he needed to hit the gym to increase strength, and at this point, it's not obvious what he does really well, Enugu II and Damunk accused me of being biased.
Strange enough, that's exactly what others are seeing. I wonder who is really biased here.
My God!
When did I ‘accuse’ you of anything?
I might have disagreed with you on a point or two, but to ‘accuse’ you? That sounds harsh.
You’re not on my radar as one of those who have an entrenched and biased agenda.

If it is wrt your ‘No, No, No’ views on him (i.e) seeing NOTHING good enough in him, then that’s an extreme opinion which I am hoping will soon change.
It’s probably what they concluded at Rangers, to their regret.

i think we are misunderstanding each other. Apologies, I did inteprete your response to my comment as calling me biased.

Also, it's not I don't see anything good in him. I was asking what "stand-out" attributes he currently brings to the table. I was asking what things did he do better than the average relative to competition. It's not that he doesn't have those attributes. he's a professional football player, of course he does. But what above average attributes is he currently showing at this level for Nigeria. I still stand by my list of No's. I am waiting still waiting for those of disagree to point out anything on that list that you can debate that yes this is the one thing here that he does better than the other options we have. I also disagreed that with those that wanted to excuse his performance as jittery. Jittery can affect composure, technique and decision-making, it doesn't affect physical attributes (lack of acceleration, pace, strength and power) for the African game. Segunda mostly likely have lower physical requirements and maybe what he has is plenty good enough for that level.

I also genuinely feel you are personally invested (emotionally) in the young man's progress (which is a good thing), but it lets you view assessments of his game by others as unfairly critical. I am not a professional coach. But i really think, the young man's game can benefit from more power, which is something he can actually work on. He needs to hit the gym. I am glad others are pointing it out too.
Thanks amafolas.
Just seen this.
It might seem that I am “personally invested” in Sadiq as you put it, but like most fans, I see attributes and weaknesses in him that might differ from others.
My point really is that Sadiq has many really great attributes which might not be easily or fully appreciated until he sits on the big stage. I don’t think you have a bias against him in particular, but I think you are being a little hasty in your conclusions.

You say for instance he is slow, with poor acceleration.
I’ve watched him often enough to know it is not true.
It’s an optical illusion.
Long-legged players are always believed to be slower than they actually are. Kanu is a great example. In moving from point A to B, they require less paces/strides per unit distance. Put him in a straight 1v1 race for the ball and you’ll see he isn’t ‘slow’ at all.
I reckon he’ll outrun Awoniyi and Nacho. Probably not Osimhen who is fast!

That’s just one example. His close ball skills are impressive too.
He has his flaws obviously ( eg easily brought down/knocked over) but ultimately he has to keep improving and it’s about time he starts playing regularly with the Big Boyz. Hopefully, that will happen next season in La Liga after promotion if he doesn’t even get sold, but for now he is consistently banging in goals and his team is top of La Segunda.

It was the wrong match to watch objectively and I haven’t had the courage to go back to it, but I remember that he had a far better game vs Tunisia than any other. I’m sure more than a few would have noticed some things about his game that made them reconsider their initial assessments. But the emotions of the game might require us all to go back and rewatch for a more objective assessment.

But me, I never ready. :rotf:
Doc, as you know there is a difference between speed and acceleration. The biggest tool a striker can have is acceleration and quick feet in tight spaces. You would rarely have space to gather speed to win like in a sprint race. It’s the acceleration that helps you lose your marker and create space for that quick pass. That was Obafemi Martin’s greatest skill. Before you blink, he has moved into space. I was in awe the first day I saw him play live for Inter. That’s why one of the top Italian defenders at the time rated him as the most difficult striker he had played against.

I strongly believe Sadiq’s problem is because he is playing in a weak league and is not challenged enough. I also don’t believe he will develop to be a top striker. Just my opinion based on what I have seen on TV, not close up. And you can see that he quickly found out in the first two matches he played that he needs to be stronger and more aggressive hence why he put in a good shift against Tunisia. Hopefully he will move on to a better league or get promoted to the Spanish top division and have the opportunity to improve.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Damunk »

Lolly wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:31 am Doc, as you know there is a difference between speed and acceleration. The biggest tool a striker can have is acceleration and quick feet in tight spaces. You would rarely have space to gather speed to win like in a sprint race. It’s the acceleration that helps you lose your marker and create space for that quick pass. That was Obafemi Martin’s greatest skill. Before you blink, he has moved into space. I was in awe the first day I saw him play live for Inter. That’s why one of the top Italian defenders at the time rated him as the most difficult striker he had played against.

I strongly believe Sadiq’s problem is because he is playing in a weak league and is not challenged enough. I also don’t believe he will develop to be a top striker. Just my opinion based on what I have seen on TV, not close up. And you can see that he quickly found out in the first two matches he played that he needs to be stronger and more aggressive hence why he put in a good shift against Tunisia. Hopefully he will move on to a better league or get promoted to the Spanish top division and have the opportunity to improve.
That's my point.
He needs time to adjust to the game at this level and on this continent.

One question I have always wanted to ask our footballers - especially those that are used to playing in Europe's top leagues and then come to Africa - is what is the most striking difference they discover to their shock/surprise when they hit the grass here?

It will be an interesting answer to hear.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Enyi »

This is not even a comparison….Olayinka is a Winn forward for his club never s striker until he met Eguaveon

Sadiq is the next best thing we have after Oshimen as strikers go.

Go no and check his stats and I don’t mean goals and assists….more in-depth stats…..

That will tell u why teams like a Barcalona looked at him….

This might help…..

https://totalfootballanalysis.com/artic ... is-tactics
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by amafolas »

Damunk wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 8:25 am
amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:24 pm
Damunk wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:49 am
amafolas wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:00 am
Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
when i said that he plays like a teenager adjusting to his body after a growth spurt, and that he needed to hit the gym to increase strength, and at this point, it's not obvious what he does really well, Enugu II and Damunk accused me of being biased.
Strange enough, that's exactly what others are seeing. I wonder who is really biased here.
My God!
When did I ‘accuse’ you of anything?
I might have disagreed with you on a point or two, but to ‘accuse’ you? That sounds harsh.
You’re not on my radar as one of those who have an entrenched and biased agenda.

If it is wrt your ‘No, No, No’ views on him (i.e) seeing NOTHING good enough in him, then that’s an extreme opinion which I am hoping will soon change.
It’s probably what they concluded at Rangers, to their regret.

i think we are misunderstanding each other. Apologies, I did inteprete your response to my comment as calling me biased.

Also, it's not I don't see anything good in him. I was asking what "stand-out" attributes he currently brings to the table. I was asking what things did he do better than the average relative to competition. It's not that he doesn't have those attributes. he's a professional football player, of course he does. But what above average attributes is he currently showing at this level for Nigeria. I still stand by my list of No's. I am waiting still waiting for those of disagree to point out anything on that list that you can debate that yes this is the one thing here that he does better than the other options we have. I also disagreed that with those that wanted to excuse his performance as jittery. Jittery can affect composure, technique and decision-making, it doesn't affect physical attributes (lack of acceleration, pace, strength and power) for the African game. Segunda mostly likely have lower physical requirements and maybe what he has is plenty good enough for that level.

I also genuinely feel you are personally invested (emotionally) in the young man's progress (which is a good thing), but it lets you view assessments of his game by others as unfairly critical. I am not a professional coach. But i really think, the young man's game can benefit from more power, which is something he can actually work on. He needs to hit the gym. I am glad others are pointing it out too.
Thanks amafolas.
Just seen this.
It might seem that I am “personally invested” in Sadiq as you put it, but like most fans, I see attributes and weaknesses in him that might differ from others.
My point really is that Sadiq has many really great attributes which might not be easily or fully appreciated until he sits on the big stage. I don’t think you have a bias against him in particular, but I think you are being a little hasty in your conclusions.

You say for instance he is slow, with poor acceleration.
I’ve watched him often enough to know it is not true.
It’s an optical illusion.
Long-legged players are always believed to be slower than they actually are. Kanu is a great example. In moving from point A to B, they require less paces/strides per unit distance. Put him in a straight 1v1 race for the ball and you’ll see he isn’t ‘slow’ at all.
I reckon he’ll outrun Awoniyi and Nacho. Probably not Osimhen who is fast!

That’s just one example. His close ball skills are impressive too.
He has his flaws obviously ( eg easily brought down/knocked over) but ultimately he has to keep improving and it’s about time he starts playing regularly with the Big Boyz. Hopefully, that will happen next season in La Liga after promotion if he doesn’t even get sold, but for now he is consistently banging in goals and his team is top of La Segunda.

It was the wrong match to watch objectively and I haven’t had the courage to go back to it, but I remember that he had a far better game vs Tunisia than any other. I’m sure more than a few would have noticed some things about his game that made them reconsider their initial assessments. But the emotions of the game might require us all to go back and rewatch for a more objective assessment.

But me, I never ready. :rotf:
theres a difference between speed and acceleration. Due to physics, shorter guys have a natural advantage with acceleration. see Moses Simon vs Egypt and that other country. A tall leggy guy like Sadiq is going to always be at a disadvantage in accelaration. At 40-50 yards + , full sprint, is he likely beating out even people like Moses Simon, possibly. Watch Awoniyi, his first few steps aren't quick. But by 15 to 20 yards, he is at full sprint and his top speed is actually good.

Honestly, I think the one thing Sadiq could really help his game is more power. It would definitely help his acceleration, may not change his top end speed, but it will also help his balance and lets him not get shoved off the ball easily.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Odas »

1naija wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 2:06 am There goes the "holdup-playability" again.

We want our forwards to score, not hold up play. So far only Sadiq has scored among the new forwards. Awoniyi's goal should be credited to whoever hit his head with the ball.😁
mojojojo wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 9:48 pm I was really impressed with Peter's contribution.

His hold up play and passing is top notch. Reminds me of Utaka. I am not sure of his goal return though, but perhaps he should be second choice behind Awoniyi.

I have seen what Sadiq can offer. Perhaps he will get better. However I am very interested to see what Olayinka will bring to the team.
:agree: :agree: I don't think Awoniyi knew he scored :lol: :lol: that's how 'accidental' or fortunate the goal the goal was.
And the BIBLE says: The race is NOT for the swift, neither is the battle for the strong nor ... but time and chance makes them all.
Ecclesiastes 1:18: For in much wisdom is much grief and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow.
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Enugu II »

Damunk wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:38 am
Lolly wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:31 am Doc, as you know there is a difference between speed and acceleration. The biggest tool a striker can have is acceleration and quick feet in tight spaces. You would rarely have space to gather speed to win like in a sprint race. It’s the acceleration that helps you lose your marker and create space for that quick pass. That was Obafemi Martin’s greatest skill. Before you blink, he has moved into space. I was in awe the first day I saw him play live for Inter. That’s why one of the top Italian defenders at the time rated him as the most difficult striker he had played against.

I strongly believe Sadiq’s problem is because he is playing in a weak league and is not challenged enough. I also don’t believe he will develop to be a top striker. Just my opinion based on what I have seen on TV, not close up. And you can see that he quickly found out in the first two matches he played that he needs to be stronger and more aggressive hence why he put in a good shift against Tunisia. Hopefully he will move on to a better league or get promoted to the Spanish top division and have the opportunity to improve.
That's my point.
He needs time to adjust to the game at this level and on this continent.

One question I have always wanted to ask our footballers - especially those that are used to playing in Europe's top leagues and then come to Africa - is what is the most striking difference they discover to their shock/surprise when they hit the grass here?

It will be an interesting answer to hear.
Damunk & Lolly,

The point you make above is like picking an arbitrary variable and then reifying it as the cause. Mind you we have had players from EPL who arrived at the SE and played below par fort several games before adjusting. Others from other top leagues with the same issue. Given those struggles, why is Sadiq's early struggle then attributed to the fact that he does not played in a top division? As you see that is an arbitrary conclusion of a cause. The more logical conclusion that explains early struggle is not the league but the fact that there has to be an adjustment period for some players given the fact thsat they have to build chemistry with new team mates. What is unknown though is why it appears to affect some and not the others. However, I am almost certain given Aribo's, Akpohuma's, Iwobi's (etc.) early struggles, that it is not down to playing in a non-premier league.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by 1naija »

Watch the game with clear eye.

Sadiq will be a beast for the Super Eagles. He has qualities that none of our other forwards have ...he is deceptively fast for a player his size. What you are calling clumsiness is fixable. What you cant easily fix that he has is putting himself in positions to score. Thats why we are talking about chances he fluffed instead of complaining that he didnt get service. He is the back up to Osimhen ,period.

Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by Cellular »

1naija wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 7:37 pm Watch the game with clear eye.

Sadiq will be a beast for the Super Eagles. He has qualities that none of our other forwards have ...he is deceptively fast for a player his size. What you are calling clumsiness is fixable. What you cant easily fix that he has is putting himself in positions to score. Thats why we are talking about chances he fluffed instead of complaining that he didnt get service. He is the back up to Osimhen ,period.

Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
He had a much better game against the Tunisians. :thumb:
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Re: Peter Olayinka vs Sadiq Umar

Post by 1naija »

Than the GB game he scored in? Remember he has played only less that 100 minutes for the SE!
Cellular wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 7:59 pm
1naija wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 7:37 pm Watch the game with clear eye.

Sadiq will be a beast for the Super Eagles. He has qualities that none of our other forwards have ...he is deceptively fast for a player his size. What you are calling clumsiness is fixable. What you cant easily fix that he has is putting himself in positions to score. Thats why we are talking about chances he fluffed instead of complaining that he didnt get service. He is the back up to Osimhen ,period.

Cellular wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 pm
airwolex wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:00 am
jette1 wrote: Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:48 am SADIQ needs to live in the gym and work his leg muscles; too clumsy
You read my mind. This guys issue might just be that he lacks leg and core strength. He needs to spend one off season not seeing a ball, and working on his balance problems. Dude is like a baby giraffe right now.

I am shocked that he has made it this far, he must have good determination and talent.
Dude lacks a lot of things.

I am sorry to say, he fails the eye and smell test.

I don't know what he does well.

Just not Eagles material.

Olayinka and Ndah in the little minutes they both played showed more...

My gross with Sadiq is that he is battling for consideration in a position that he could have made a case for... he hasn't thus far.

I mean, what can you say he does better or as well as the other center forwards?

Tripping over himself and easily knocked off the ball... is it his pressing game? Hold up play? Passing? Running the channels? Positional awareness? Physicality? Agression? Heading?
He had a much better game against the Tunisians. :thumb:
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