Rohr's opinion on the Super Eagles' loss to Tunisia

[Cellular]

The football elites are at it again. TXJ and Dammy.

This is almost like the argument folks have about non FBS schools and the HBCU. The bias that most good players are at FBS schools and only scrubs go to HBCU's and non FBS schools. But every now and then teams with good scouting department unearth gems... to the point that the NFL has made a concerted effort to scout and run a combine to give such players an opportunity. It is no different from Naijaria. We have fans, coaches and lazy administrators who want already made products that are seen on International TV. Those are the only good players...

Prof. is right. Finances is the primary reason why Africans go to the 'backwater' leagues. It is not ability. We have seen our talented youth players get signed off of performances at youth tournaments but never get to play for their parent clubs because of work permit issues. These were the lucky ones... the late bloomers who either didn't make the team or made the team but weren't deemed as good, end up going to places where they can earn a living. They end up either because of poor representation or hard luck in obscure leagues...

I shudder what would have happened to Sam Okwaraji, Uche Okafor, Mike Emenalo if their quality was judged based on the leagues they played in. And those were the days without the tight labor laws that made it harder to sign players without pedigree. Imagine today where to get a work permit is a herculean task.

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

The comparison of the situation of FBS and HBCUs to football standards between leagues is laughable to the point of stupidity.

But the deeper problem with u is that u are all about meaningless posturing. One moment u are talking about "choosing players" and "oga na chance" and another u are here yarning dust!!!

Economic considerations determine where African players go. But their performance level is directly tied to the level of competition they are exposed to. And if they have true ability, they typically go up the glide path from a lower to a higher tier league.

I laugh at the egs of Okwaraji and Emenalo. None of these guys were in Azerbaijan!

Yes we have talented players, but its never been about talent. Its the development of the talent.

When he made his debut what league was Okwaraji playing in? How many obscure leagues did he play in? What club was Emenalo playing in when he went to the WC?

The example of FBS and HBCUs is above your head. You don't get and you will NEVER get it.

It is about the intersection of talent and opportunity... you ought to climb down from your snooty perch and read some of the journeys of NFL players, many of who went the JuCo route to get to the NFL. Playing one season of FBS because it was the only pathway to be noticed and seen... and the work black athletes who are pushing for the NFL to recognize that FBS is not the only pathway to stardom. They recognize their good fortune and want to afford others the opportunity. If you don't see the parallels then I can't help you.

I agree with you on one thing, thou, it is about the development of talent. That is why we have to have a holistic approach to football development. Develop a scouting system that lets players know that regardless of where they ply their trade we will find them and look at them... that the NFF will help them secure good representation so that they are not exploited, used, and dumped because of the zero-sum game of the profession...

[txj]

The football elites are at it again. TXJ and Dammy.

This is almost like the argument folks have about non FBS schools and the HBCU. The bias that most good players are at FBS schools and only scrubs go to HBCU's and non FBS schools. But every now and then teams with good scouting department unearth gems... to the point that the NFL has made a concerted effort to scout and run a combine to give such players an opportunity. It is no different from Naijaria. We have fans, coaches and lazy administrators who want already made products that are seen on International TV. Those are the only good players...

Prof. is right. Finances is the primary reason why Africans go to the 'backwater' leagues. It is not ability. We have seen our talented youth players get signed off of performances at youth tournaments but never get to play for their parent clubs because of work permit issues. These were the lucky ones... the late bloomers who either didn't make the team or made the team but weren't deemed as good, end up going to places where they can earn a living. They end up either because of poor representation or hard luck in obscure leagues...

I shudder what would have happened to Sam Okwaraji, Uche Okafor, Mike Emenalo if their quality was judged based on the leagues they played in. And those were the days without the tight labor laws that made it harder to sign players without pedigree. Imagine today where to get a work permit is a herculean task.

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

The comparison of the situation of FBS and HBCUs to football standards between leagues is laughable to the point of stupidity.

But the deeper problem with u is that u are all about meaningless posturing. One moment u are talking about "choosing players" and "oga na chance" and another u are here yarning dust!!!

Economic considerations determine where African players go. But their performance level is directly tied to the level of competition they are exposed to. And if they have true ability, they typically go up the glide path from a lower to a higher tier league.

I laugh at the egs of Okwaraji and Emenalo. None of these guys were in Azerbaijan!

Yes we have talented players, but its never been about talent. Its the development of the talent.

When he made his debut what league was Okwaraji playing in? How many obscure leagues did he play in? What club was Emenalo playing in when he went to the WC?

The example of FBS and HBCUs is above your head. You don't get and you will NEVER get it.

It is about the intersection of talent and opportunity... you ought to climb down from your snooty perch and read some of the journeys of NFL players, many of who went the JuCo route to get to the NFL. Playing one season of FBS because it was the only pathway to be noticed and seen... and the work black athletes who are pushing for the NFL to recognize that FBS is not the only pathway to stardom. They recognize their good fortune and want to afford others the opportunity. If you don't see the parallels then I can't help you.

I agree with you on one thing, thou, it is about the development of talent. That is why we have to have a holistic approach to football development. Develop a scouting system that lets players know that regardless of where they ply their trade we will find them and look at them... that the NFF will help them secure good representation so that they are not exploited, used, and dumped because of the zero-sum game of the profession...

You do realize Okwaraji started in the youth setup of AS Roma? Besides, football today is not what it was in the early 80s.

U like to blow a lot of hot air...This is NOT American football.

The setup of the sport is vastly different from Association Football and is not localized in 1 country as it is with grid iron football.

No NT manager who is serious about winning is going to waste time and resources scouting players in 93 countries. You have the filter of the professional league system where players ascend the glide path based on proven ability as in their performance.

Economic reasons may determine the initial destination of the players not ability, but it is performance that validates that ability and propels them up the path.

You cannot base NT selection decision on what a player may have done back in Ikeduru or as a mature man playing with 17yr olds...

The focus should not be on scouting system but on developing the domestic league. If you have proper professional clubs and a competitive league, the talent will reveal itself.

[Enugu II]

The football elites are at it again. TXJ and Dammy.

This is almost like the argument folks have about non FBS schools and the HBCU. The bias that most good players are at FBS schools and only scrubs go to HBCU's and non FBS schools. But every now and then teams with good scouting department unearth gems... to the point that the NFL has made a concerted effort to scout and run a combine to give such players an opportunity. It is no different from Naijaria. We have fans, coaches and lazy administrators who want already made products that are seen on International TV. Those are the only good players...

Prof. is right. Finances is the primary reason why Africans go to the 'backwater' leagues. It is not ability. We have seen our talented youth players get signed off of performances at youth tournaments but never get to play for their parent clubs because of work permit issues. These were the lucky ones... the late bloomers who either didn't make the team or made the team but weren't deemed as good, end up going to places where they can earn a living. They end up either because of poor representation or hard luck in obscure leagues...

I shudder what would have happened to Sam Okwaraji, Uche Okafor, Mike Emenalo if their quality was judged based on the leagues they played in. And those were the days without the tight labor laws that made it harder to sign players without pedigree. Imagine today where to get a work permit is a herculean task.

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

The comparison of the situation of FBS and HBCUs to football standards between leagues is laughable to the point of stupidity.

But the deeper problem with u is that u are all about meaningless posturing. One moment u are talking about "choosing players" and "oga na chance" and another u are here yarning dust!!!

Economic considerations determine where African players go. But their performance level is directly tied to the level of competition they are exposed to. And if they have true ability, they typically go up the glide path from a lower to a higher tier league.

I laugh at the egs of Okwaraji and Emenalo. None of these guys were in Azerbaijan!

Yes we have talented players, but its never been about talent. Its the development of the talent.

When he made his debut what league was Okwaraji playing in? How many obscure leagues did he play in? What club was Emenalo playing in when he went to the WC?

The example of FBS and HBCUs is above your head. You don't get and you will NEVER get it.

It is about the intersection of talent and opportunity... you ought to climb down from your snooty perch and read some of the journeys of NFL players, many of who went the JuCo route to get to the NFL. Playing one season of FBS because it was the only pathway to be noticed and seen... and the work black athletes who are pushing for the NFL to recognize that FBS is not the only pathway to stardom. They recognize their good fortune and want to afford others the opportunity. If you don't see the parallels then I can't help you.

I agree with you on one thing, thou, it is about the development of talent. That is why we have to have a holistic approach to football development. Develop a scouting system that lets players know that regardless of where they ply their trade we will find them and look at them... that the NFF will help them secure good representation so that they are not exploited, used, and dumped because of the zero-sum game of the profession...

Cellular,

I think the problem Txj consistently demonstrates is some unwarranted belief in the Western systems as some Nirvana. Yet, over time in history the system recognizes its own deficiencies and continually improves on it. For me, it remains amazing to read this unwarranted belief in some perfect system.

First, NO HUMAN SYSTEM HAS EVER and WILL EVER be perfect. Underline WILL EVER. If you study isomorphy of sciences it is easy to understand that the higher systems like humans are far more complicated than lower systems such as machines. The more complicated, the less the predictability. It is simple logic. There will be continual improvement, however, in understanding these systems.

The scouting system of players is far from perfect. We know, for instance, that African players have different goals when compared to players born in Europe, for instance. These different goals are largely informed by economic experiences. This is exhibited in clubs to which most of these guys readily sign for, regardless of their talent. Thus, simply focusing on BS of Top 5 leagues does a disservice to African national teams. What African NTs need to do is recognize the effect of socioeconomic dictates and spread their scouting dragnets far wider that their European counterparts. That is not rocket science. It is mere logic.

[txj]

The football elites are at it again. TXJ and Dammy.

This is almost like the argument folks have about non FBS schools and the HBCU. The bias that most good players are at FBS schools and only scrubs go to HBCU's and non FBS schools. But every now and then teams with good scouting department unearth gems... to the point that the NFL has made a concerted effort to scout and run a combine to give such players an opportunity. It is no different from Naijaria. We have fans, coaches and lazy administrators who want already made products that are seen on International TV. Those are the only good players...

Prof. is right. Finances is the primary reason why Africans go to the 'backwater' leagues. It is not ability. We have seen our talented youth players get signed off of performances at youth tournaments but never get to play for their parent clubs because of work permit issues. These were the lucky ones... the late bloomers who either didn't make the team or made the team but weren't deemed as good, end up going to places where they can earn a living. They end up either because of poor representation or hard luck in obscure leagues...

I shudder what would have happened to Sam Okwaraji, Uche Okafor, Mike Emenalo if their quality was judged based on the leagues they played in. And those were the days without the tight labor laws that made it harder to sign players without pedigree. Imagine today where to get a work permit is a herculean task.

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

The comparison of the situation of FBS and HBCUs to football standards between leagues is laughable to the point of stupidity.

But the deeper problem with u is that u are all about meaningless posturing. One moment u are talking about "choosing players" and "oga na chance" and another u are here yarning dust!!!

Economic considerations determine where African players go. But their performance level is directly tied to the level of competition they are exposed to. And if they have true ability, they typically go up the glide path from a lower to a higher tier league.

I laugh at the egs of Okwaraji and Emenalo. None of these guys were in Azerbaijan!

Yes we have talented players, but its never been about talent. Its the development of the talent.

When he made his debut what league was Okwaraji playing in? How many obscure leagues did he play in? What club was Emenalo playing in when he went to the WC?

The example of FBS and HBCUs is above your head. You don't get and you will NEVER get it.

It is about the intersection of talent and opportunity... you ought to climb down from your snooty perch and read some of the journeys of NFL players, many of who went the JuCo route to get to the NFL. Playing one season of FBS because it was the only pathway to be noticed and seen... and the work black athletes who are pushing for the NFL to recognize that FBS is not the only pathway to stardom. They recognize their good fortune and want to afford others the opportunity. If you don't see the parallels then I can't help you.

I agree with you on one thing, thou, it is about the development of talent. That is why we have to have a holistic approach to football development. Develop a scouting system that lets players know that regardless of where they ply their trade we will find them and look at them... that the NFF will help them secure good representation so that they are not exploited, used, and dumped because of the zero-sum game of the profession...

Cellular,

I think the problem Txj consistently demonstrates is some unwarranted belief in the Western systems as some Nirvana. Yet, over time in history the system recognizes its own deficiencies and continually improves on it. For me, it remains amazing to read this unwarranted belief in some perfect system.

First, NO HUMAN SYSTEM HAS EVER and WILL EVER be perfect. Underline WILL EVER. If you study isomorphy of sciences it is easy to understand that the higher systems like humans are far more complicated than lower systems such as machines. The more complicated, the less the predictability. It is simple logic. There will be continual improvement, however, in understanding these systems.

The scouting system of players is far from perfect. We know, for instance, that African players have different goals when compared to players born in Europe, for instance. These different goals are largely informed by economic experiences. This is exhibited in clubs to which most of these guys readily sign for, regardless of their talent. Thus, simply focusing on BS of Top 5 leagues does a disservice to African national teams. What African NTs need to do is recognize the effect of socioeconomic dictates and spread their scouting dragnets far wider that their European counterparts. That is not rocket science. It is mere logic.

At this point it is clear to me your constant reference to Europe in any and every discussion with me is either a product of intellectual laziness or mere red herring.

Do you think African players are the only ones driven by economic circumstances in making their transfer decisions? There are more Brazilians across the world than any other country.

Why do you not see their managers scouting in Azerbaijan?

Year after year you keep spouting this nonsense...

[Lolly]

The football elites are at it again. TXJ and Dammy.

This is almost like the argument folks have about non FBS schools and the HBCU. The bias that most good players are at FBS schools and only scrubs go to HBCU's and non FBS schools. But every now and then teams with good scouting department unearth gems... to the point that the NFL has made a concerted effort to scout and run a combine to give such players an opportunity. It is no different from Naijaria. We have fans, coaches and lazy administrators who want already made products that are seen on International TV. Those are the only good players...

Prof. is right. Finances is the primary reason why Africans go to the 'backwater' leagues. It is not ability. We have seen our talented youth players get signed off of performances at youth tournaments but never get to play for their parent clubs because of work permit issues. These were the lucky ones... the late bloomers who either didn't make the team or made the team but weren't deemed as good, end up going to places where they can earn a living. They end up either because of poor representation or hard luck in obscure leagues...

I shudder what would have happened to Sam Okwaraji, Uche Okafor, Mike Emenalo if their quality was judged based on the leagues they played in. And those were the days without the tight labor laws that made it harder to sign players without pedigree. Imagine today where to get a work permit is a herculean task.

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

The comparison of the situation of FBS and HBCUs to football standards between leagues is laughable to the point of stupidity.

But the deeper problem with u is that u are all about meaningless posturing. One moment u are talking about "choosing players" and "oga na chance" and another u are here yarning dust!!!

Economic considerations determine where African players go. But their performance level is directly tied to the level of competition they are exposed to. And if they have true ability, they typically go up the glide path from a lower to a higher tier league.

I laugh at the egs of Okwaraji and Emenalo. None of these guys were in Azerbaijan!

Yes we have talented players, but its never been about talent. Its the development of the talent.

When he made his debut what league was Okwaraji playing in? How many obscure leagues did he play in? What club was Emenalo playing in when he went to the WC?

The example of FBS and HBCUs is above your head. You don't get and you will NEVER get it.

It is about the intersection of talent and opportunity... you ought to climb down from your snooty perch and read some of the journeys of NFL players, many of who went the JuCo route to get to the NFL. Playing one season of FBS because it was the only pathway to be noticed and seen... and the work black athletes who are pushing for the NFL to recognize that FBS is not the only pathway to stardom. They recognize their good fortune and want to afford others the opportunity. If you don't see the parallels then I can't help you.

I agree with you on one thing, thou, it is about the development of talent. That is why we have to have a holistic approach to football development. Develop a scouting system that lets players know that regardless of where they ply their trade we will find them and look at them... that the NFF will help them secure good representation so that they are not exploited, used, and dumped because of the zero-sum game of the profession...

Cellular,

I think the problem Txj consistently demonstrates is some unwarranted belief in the Western systems as some Nirvana. Yet, over time in history the system recognizes its own deficiencies and continually improves on it. For me, it remains amazing to read this unwarranted belief in some perfect system.

First, NO HUMAN SYSTEM HAS EVER and WILL EVER be perfect. Underline WILL EVER. If you study isomorphy of sciences it is easy to understand that the higher systems like humans are far more complicated than lower systems such as machines. The more complicated, the less the predictability. It is simple logic. There will be continual improvement, however, in understanding these systems.

The scouting system of players is far from perfect. We know, for instance, that African players have different goals when compared to players born in Europe, for instance. These different goals are largely informed by economic experiences. This is exhibited in clubs to which most of these guys readily sign for, regardless of their talent. Thus, simply focusing on BS of Top 5 leagues does a disservice to African national teams. What African NTs need to do is recognize the effect of socioeconomic dictates and spread their scouting dragnets far wider that their European counterparts. That is not rocket science. It is mere logic.

Kindly tell us how to scout 803 players spread across 95 countries? What criteria would you use to invite players for friendlies/tournaments/screening? Or would you suggest they filter the list by removing certain countries and certain divisions? Now add those playing in the NPFL to the list and you are easily looking at over 1000 professional footballers to scout.

[Dammy]

The football elites are at it again. TXJ and Dammy.

This is almost like the argument folks have about non FBS schools and the HBCU. The bias that most good players are at FBS schools and only scrubs go to HBCU's and non FBS schools. But every now and then teams with good scouting department unearth gems... to the point that the NFL has made a concerted effort to scout and run a combine to give such players an opportunity. It is no different from Naijaria. We have fans, coaches and lazy administrators who want already made products that are seen on International TV. Those are the only good players...

Prof. is right. Finances is the primary reason why Africans go to the 'backwater' leagues. It is not ability. We have seen our talented youth players get signed off of performances at youth tournaments but never get to play for their parent clubs because of work permit issues. These were the lucky ones... the late bloomers who either didn't make the team or made the team but weren't deemed as good, end up going to places where they can earn a living. They end up either because of poor representation or hard luck in obscure leagues...

I shudder what would have happened to Sam Okwaraji, Uche Okafor, Mike Emenalo if their quality was judged based on the leagues they played in. And those were the days without the tight labor laws that made it harder to sign players without pedigree. Imagine today where to get a work permit is a herculean task.

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

The comparison of the situation of FBS and HBCUs to football standards between leagues is laughable to the point of stupidity.

But the deeper problem with u is that u are all about meaningless posturing. One moment u are talking about "choosing players" and "oga na chance" and another u are here yarning dust!!!

Economic considerations determine where African players go. But their performance level is directly tied to the level of competition they are exposed to. And if they have true ability, they typically go up the glide path from a lower to a higher tier league.

I laugh at the egs of Okwaraji and Emenalo. None of these guys were in Azerbaijan!

Yes we have talented players, but its never been about talent. Its the development of the talent.

When he made his debut what league was Okwaraji playing in? How many obscure leagues did he play in? What club was Emenalo playing in when he went to the WC?

The example of FBS and HBCUs is above your head. You don't get and you will NEVER get it.

It is about the intersection of talent and opportunity... you ought to climb down from your snooty perch and read some of the journeys of NFL players, many of who went the JuCo route to get to the NFL. Playing one season of FBS because it was the only pathway to be noticed and seen... and the work black athletes who are pushing for the NFL to recognize that FBS is not the only pathway to stardom. They recognize their good fortune and want to afford others the opportunity. If you don't see the parallels then I can't help you.

I agree with you on one thing, thou, it is about the development of talent. That is why we have to have a holistic approach to football development. Develop a scouting system that lets players know that regardless of where they ply their trade we will find them and look at them... that the NFF will help them secure good representation so that they are not exploited, used, and dumped because of the zero-sum game of the profession...

Cellular,

I think the problem Txj consistently demonstrates is some unwarranted belief in the Western systems as some Nirvana. Yet, over time in history the system recognizes its own deficiencies and continually improves on it. For me, it remains amazing to read this unwarranted belief in some perfect system.

First, NO HUMAN SYSTEM HAS EVER and WILL EVER be perfect. Underline WILL EVER. If you study isomorphy of sciences it is easy to understand that the higher systems like humans are far more complicated than lower systems such as machines. The more complicated, the less the predictability. It is simple logic. There will be continual improvement, however, in understanding these systems.

The scouting system of players is far from perfect. We know, for instance, that African players have different goals when compared to players born in Europe, for instance. These different goals are largely informed by economic experiences. This is exhibited in clubs to which most of these guys readily sign for, regardless of their talent. Thus, simply focusing on BS of Top 5 leagues does a disservice to African national teams. What African NTs need to do is recognize the effect of socioeconomic dictates and spread their scouting dragnets far wider that their European counterparts. That is not rocket science. It is mere logic.

At this point it is clear to me your constant reference to Europe in any and every discussion with me is either a product of intellectual laziness or mere red herring.

Do you think African players are the only ones driven by economic circumstances in making their transfer decisions? There are more Brazilians across the world than any other country.

Why do you not see their managers scouting in Azerbaijan?

Year after year you keep spouting this nonsense...

Well done for taking E11 and his semantic nonsense to the cleaners! Good job

[Dammy]

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

A good example.

Eguavoen was in the stands watching a Nigerian league match. We were inundated with, why is he no unt in Europe scouting and calling player. How can be be scouting in Nigeria league. If those players are good enough, they would not be in the league. The cream would rise to the top.

So it doesn't make sense to you that he should be in Europe where our players are based? Must you defend a position to the point of being unreasonable? So you don't believe that Eguavoen's time is better spent getting the likes of Osimhen, Dennis, Etebo, Balogun etc, key players who missed AFCON up to speed with his plans for the crucial WCQs against Ghana and checking up on their fitness and availability?
Or you are of the opinion that local players should be scouted to play that crucial match.
I don't know about you but for those of us that are genuine fans of the SE, that is not a match to experiment with rather build on the decent showing in the 3 matches played at the group stage in Cameroon. If we bungle those matches, it's going to be a long and hard football season for SE fans.

[Dammy]

The football elites are at it again. TXJ and Dammy.

This is almost like the argument folks have about non FBS schools and the HBCU. The bias that most good players are at FBS schools and only scrubs go to HBCU's and non FBS schools. But every now and then teams with good scouting department unearth gems... to the point that the NFL has made a concerted effort to scout and run a combine to give such players an opportunity. It is no different from Naijaria. We have fans, coaches and lazy administrators who want already made products that are seen on International TV. Those are the only good players...

Prof. is right. Finances is the primary reason why Africans go to the 'backwater' leagues. It is not ability. We have seen our talented youth players get signed off of performances at youth tournaments but never get to play for their parent clubs because of work permit issues. These were the lucky ones... the late bloomers who either didn't make the team or made the team but weren't deemed as good, end up going to places where they can earn a living. They end up either because of poor representation or hard luck in obscure leagues...

I shudder what would have happened to Sam Okwaraji, Uche Okafor, Mike Emenalo if their quality was judged based on the leagues they played in. And those were the days without the tight labor laws that made it harder to sign players without pedigree. Imagine today where to get a work permit is a herculean task.

Again, our inability to scout for players is down to sheer laziness. Because I still marvel when I see quality players play for our youth teams (U21/U23) and wonder how did these guys avoid the radar. And most end up in backwater leagues because of the stringent nature of getting work permits... only for someone to claim that if they were good enough they wouldn't stay in such leagues for long. That is not how it works.

The comparison of the situation of FBS and HBCUs to football standards between leagues is laughable to the point of stupidity.

But the deeper problem with u is that u are all about meaningless posturing. One moment u are talking about "choosing players" and "oga na chance" and another u are here yarning dust!!!

Economic considerations determine where African players go. But their performance level is directly tied to the level of competition they are exposed to. And if they have true ability, they typically go up the glide path from a lower to a higher tier league.

I laugh at the egs of Okwaraji and Emenalo. None of these guys were in Azerbaijan!

Yes we have talented players, but its never been about talent. Its the development of the talent.

When he made his debut what league was Okwaraji playing in? How many obscure leagues did he play in? What club was Emenalo playing in when he went to the WC?

The example of FBS and HBCUs is above your head. You don't get and you will NEVER get it.

It is about the intersection of talent and opportunity... you ought to climb down from your snooty perch and read some of the journeys of NFL players, many of who went the JuCo route to get to the NFL. Playing one season of FBS because it was the only pathway to be noticed and seen... and the work black athletes who are pushing for the NFL to recognize that FBS is not the only pathway to stardom. They recognize their good fortune and want to afford others the opportunity. If you don't see the parallels then I can't help you.

I agree with you on one thing, thou, it is about the development of talent. That is why we have to have a holistic approach to football development. Develop a scouting system that lets players know that regardless of where they ply their trade we will find them and look at them... that the NFF will help them secure good representation so that they are not exploited, used, and dumped because of the zero-sum game of the profession...

You do realize Okwaraji started in the youth setup of AS Roma? Besides, football today is not what it was in the early 80s.

U like to blow a lot of hot air...This is NOT American football.

The setup of the sport is vastly different from Association Football and is not localized in 1 country as it is with grid iron football.

No NT manager who is serious about winning is going to waste time and resources scouting players in 93 countries. You have the filter of the professional league system where players ascend the glide path based on proven ability as in their performance.

Economic reasons may determine the initial destination of the players not ability, but it is performance that validates that ability and propels them up the path.

You cannot base NT selection decision on what a player may have done back in Ikeduru or as a mature man playing with 17yr olds...

The focus should not be on scouting system but on developing the domestic league. If you have proper professional clubs and a competitive league, the talent will reveal itself.

How many foreign based players did we then? That was era when we invited Chima Okorie and Emeka Ezeugo from INDIA!!

[nanijoe]

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

[txj]

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

Too many generalizations and not enough context or sufficiently deep understanding of the issues.

Systems are not permanent. They evolve over time.

Nigeria played differently under Otto Gloria than it did under Westerhof.

Brazil today plays differently from under Big Phil.

England of today is different from the days of Ron Greenwood.

Players can and do vary from one generation to another. The Nigerian wingers of today interpret the game differently from the likes of Segun Odegbami.

System convergence has been going on for more than 3 decades...

But contrasting philosophies still exist. But more than just between continents. Its between clubs and countries...

It's called system convergence...In the end it comes down to efficiency whatever the system...

[nanijoe]

I made the points I wanted to make..whats the deep understanding of the issues that counters my central point ?

At the core of my point is that following Rohr's logic, we dont stand a chance. There's no coach who can coach Nigeria like a European team, thats gong to make any meaningful progress, because in that context, we simply dont have the players.

We need a Coach who changes the context.

Of Course Nigeria played differently in different eras under different coaches..what has that got to do with anything I said?

These things are really not that complicated.

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

Too many generalizations and not enough context or sufficiently deep understanding of the issues.

Systems are not permanent. They evolve over time.

Nigeria played differently under Otto Gloria than it did under Westerhof.

Brazil today plays differently from under Big Phil.

England of today is different from the days of Ron Greenwood.

Players can and do vary from one generation to another. The Nigerian wingers of today interpret the game differently from the likes of Segun Odegbami.

System convergence has been going on for more than 3 decades...

But contrasting philosophies still exist. But more than just between continents. Its between clubs and countries...

It's called system convergence...In the end it comes down to efficiency whatever the system...

[Kneedeep]

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

Please repeat this again for those at the back...

[fabio]

So it doesn't make sense to you that he should be in Europe where our players are based? Must you defend a position to the point of being unreasonable? So you don't believe that Eguavoen's time is better spent getting the likes of Osimhen, Dennis, Etebo, Balogun etc, key players who missed AFCON up to speed with his plans for the crucial WCQs against Ghana and checking up on their fitness and availability?
Or you are of the opinion that local players should be scouted to play that crucial match.
I don't know about you but for those of us that are genuine fans of the SE, that is not a match to experiment with rather build on the decent showing in the 3 matches played at the group stage in Cameroon. If we bungle those matches, it's going to be a long and hard football season for SE fans.

It does not make sense to any rational person, that Eguavoen should be in Europe.

Where in Europe precisely?

Are you going to accommodate him?

Are you going to taking care of his daily needs and transport expenses?

Are you going to pay for his covid-19 test and periods in isolation?

Is Eguavoen fully vaccination?

Are European countries, accepting vaccination cards from Nigeria?

The last time, I checked.

Whatapp

Zoom

Webex etc

Are available for Eguavoen to use, We know that's what Rohr used to communicate and stay in touch with the players.

[Dammy]

So it doesn't make sense to you that he should be in Europe where our players are based? Must you defend a position to the point of being unreasonable? So you don't believe that Eguavoen's time is better spent getting the likes of Osimhen, Dennis, Etebo, Balogun etc, key players who missed AFCON up to speed with his plans for the crucial WCQs against Ghana and checking up on their fitness and availability?
Or you are of the opinion that local players should be scouted to play that crucial match.
I don't know about you but for those of us that are genuine fans of the SE, that is not a match to experiment with rather build on the decent showing in the 3 matches played at the group stage in Cameroon. If we bungle those matches, it's going to be a long and hard football season for SE fans.

It does not make sense to any rational person, that Eguavoen should be in Europe.

Where in Europe precisely?

Are you going to accommodate him?

Are you going to taking care of his daily needs and transport expenses?

Are you going to pay for his covid-19 test and periods in isolation?

Is Eguavoen fully vaccination?

Are European countries, accepting vaccination cards from Nigeria?

The last time, I checked.

Whatapp

Zoom

Webex etc

Are available for Eguavoen to use, We know that's what Rohr used to communicate and stay in touch with the players.

No be everything wey you suppose chook mouth! When the likes of Southgate go to Germany to watch Sancho when he as at Dortmund, or Tite visits his players in Europe from Brazil, I suppose it's because Zoom, Webex etc were not available?
There's what's called the personal touch in management. We have an all important match coming up in less than 8 weeks, I expect our coach to focus on the core set of players that will prosecute that match rather than play to the gallery by going to watch players who have no bearing on the match. It's simple logic but if you don't gerrit, forget abbourit!

[txj]

My point is that you do not seem to understand how football systems have evolved, and in the last several decades come closer together than at any other time previously.

And those systems continually evolve. So the idea that anyone can coach Nigeria to play the 'European system' appears not to understand that there's really no 'European system' or S. American system, but core principles of play around which the global game revolves.

Its then the talent and the differing qualities that the players bring to the game that defines the system that emerges, irrespective of the coach.

I made the points I wanted to make..whats the deep understanding of the issues that counters my central point ?

At the core of my point is that following Rohr's logic, we dont stand a chance. There's no coach who can coach Nigeria like a European team, thats gong to make any meaningful progress, because in that context, we simply dont have the players.

We need a Coach who changes the context.

Of Course Nigeria played differently in different eras under different coaches..what has that got to do with anything I said?

These things are really not that complicated.

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

Too many generalizations and not enough context or sufficiently deep understanding of the issues.

Systems are not permanent. They evolve over time.

Nigeria played differently under Otto Gloria than it did under Westerhof.

Brazil today plays differently from under Big Phil.

England of today is different from the days of Ron Greenwood.

Players can and do vary from one generation to another. The Nigerian wingers of today interpret the game differently from the likes of Segun Odegbami.

System convergence has been going on for more than 3 decades...

But contrasting philosophies still exist. But more than just between continents. Its between clubs and countries...

It's called system convergence...In the end it comes down to efficiency whatever the system...

[Damunk]

Personally, I think this whole 'European' system or "style of play", or the "Nigerian style" is all a myth. Teams can play to their strengths but boxing everything into a 'system' of some sort might sound interesting but on closer examination, is a vacuous argument.

What is the 'Nigerian' or 'African' "system" being spoken about that the world has never seen before or have not deployed themselves as and when required?
We might have speed and possibly strength as natural assets giving us a marginal advantage over others in those specific regards on occasion. But which countries in the modern game do not? European powerhouses that are packed to the brim with Africans?

There is no 'system' that we can define as 'African' or 'Nigerian'.
The England 'system' or the France system of today might as well be termed 'African' with all the African players sitting in their national teams.

My point is that you do not seem to understand how football systems have evolved, and in the last several decades come closer together than at any other time previously.

And those systems continually evolve. So the idea that anyone can coach Nigeria to play the 'European system' appears not to understand that there's really no 'European system' or S. American system, but core principles of play around which the global game revolves.

Its then the talent and the differing qualities that the players bring to the game that defines the system that emerges, irrespective of the coach.

[nanijoe]

I think maybe you should consider that Philosophy and system are not the same thing. I also know that people who are beholden to a specific way of thinking can have a hard time wrapping their minds around the fact that there can be a different way..

I'm going to let this back and forth rest here

My point is that you do not seem to understand how football systems have evolved, and in the last several decades come closer together than at any other time previously.

And those systems continually evolve. So the idea that anyone can coach Nigeria to play the 'European system' appears not to understand that there's really no 'European system' or S. American system, but core principles of play around which the global game revolves.

Its then the talent and the differing qualities that the players bring to the game that defines the system that emerges, irrespective of the coach.

I made the points I wanted to make..whats the deep understanding of the issues that counters my central point ?

At the core of my point is that following Rohr's logic, we dont stand a chance. There's no coach who can coach Nigeria like a European team, thats gong to make any meaningful progress, because in that context, we simply dont have the players.

We need a Coach who changes the context.

Of Course Nigeria played differently in different eras under different coaches..what has that got to do with anything I said?

These things are really not that complicated.

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

Too many generalizations and not enough context or sufficiently deep understanding of the issues.

Systems are not permanent. They evolve over time.

Nigeria played differently under Otto Gloria than it did under Westerhof.

Brazil today plays differently from under Big Phil.

England of today is different from the days of Ron Greenwood.

Players can and do vary from one generation to another. The Nigerian wingers of today interpret the game differently from the likes of Segun Odegbami.

System convergence has been going on for more than 3 decades...

But contrasting philosophies still exist. But more than just between continents. Its between clubs and countries...

It's called system convergence...In the end it comes down to efficiency whatever the system...

[Lolly]

Biko, can one of our football experts here who are always talking about scouting for those hidden talents kindly tell us how you "scout" and assess our 803 players spread across 95 countries outside Nigeria? Do you watch their YouTube highlights or full matches on tape? Do you visit some? What criteria would you use to invite players for friendlies/tournaments/screening? Or would you suggest they filter the list by removing certain countries and certain divisions? Now add those playing in the NPFL to the list and you are easily looking at over 1000 professional footballers to scout.

[Scipio Africanus]

All this talk of systems is just blowing a lot of smoke everywhere. In soccer as we all know, the objective is to score more than your opponent.

Broken down in simple terms, you need to maximize the number of dangerous chances created by your team while minimizing the number of dangerous chances created by the other team.

How do you maximize the number of dangerous chances created by your team? Get the ball into your opponents's danger areas AS QUICKLY AND AS OFTEN AS POSSIBLE.. Every second spent lingering on the ball, or completing unnecessary dribbles reduces your chances of success.

At the same time minimize the possibility of your opponent doing the same to you. This is why we have been crying, weeping and wailing on this board about the lack of understanding shown by our players in several matches. The aim of a winger is not to dribble, it should be to GET THAT BALL INTO THE BOX AS QUICKLY AND AS OFTEN AS POSSIBLE.

The aim of a striker should be to CONVERT CHANCES AS EFFICIENTLY AS POSSIBLE and have the JUDGEMENT to recognize when he is better off passing to a better positioned player. All this talk about systems and formations tend to obscure these basic objectives.

To illustrate we look at the head-to-head results between Brazil and Norway. Norway have never lost to Brazil. They have played 4 games against each other. They have beaten Brazil 4-2 in a friendly and 2-1 at the World Cup, and drawn 2 other times. The only country that has played Brazil and never lost.

Norway haven't produced any players or coaches anywhere close to the level produced by Brazil so how did Norway do it? They used long balls very effectively. Look above at the point about getting the ball into the danger area as quickly and as often as possible, while frustrating the hell out of your opponent defensively. Brazil weren't used to dealing with a barrage of accurately delivered long balls and were quickly overwhelmed. When Norway tried that same long ball tactic against their fellow Europeans who are used to that stuff, it didn't work and they were quickly put in their place.

The last 4 WC winners have been European. There is a reason for that.

Italy 2006 - Key game was against Germany in the semi-final. 2 extremely clinical finishes decided the game
Spain 2010 - Key game was against Germany in the semi-final. A clinically finished set piece decided the game
Germany 2014 - Key game was against France in the quarter final. A clinically finished set piece decided the game
France 2018 - Key game was against Belgium in the semi final. A clinically finished set piece decided the game

No team from any other confederation is able to come up with clutch finishes on set-piece opportunities in key games when all other avenues for getting goals have dried up. Not Brazil, not Argentina, not Uruguay and certainly not Nigeria, Cameroon or Morocco.

This is where the Europeans are heads and shoulders above everyone else, chance conversion. Of course to get chances, you have to create them. How do you create them? Again, GET THAT BALL INTO THE BOX AS QUICKLY AND AS OFTEN AS POSSIBLE.

Finish.

[Cellular]

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

They are abandoning their own soccer philosophy because most of their players play in Europe. They want to Out-European the Europeans in their own game.

The spontaneity that is the Brazilian game is gone.

No new great player that the Europeans haven't seen. No new tactics as everyone is emulating the Europeans.

[Cellular]

Personally, I think this whole 'European' system or "style of play", or the "Nigerian style" is all a myth. Teams can play to their strengths but boxing everything into a 'system' of some sort might sound interesting but on closer examination, is a vacuous argument.

What is the 'Nigerian' or 'African' "system" being spoken about that the world has never seen before or have not deployed themselves as and when required?
We might have speed and possibly strength as natural assets giving us a marginal advantage over others in those specific regards on occasion. But which countries in the modern game do not? European powerhouses that are packed to the brim with Africans?

There is no 'system' that we can define as 'African' or 'Nigerian'.
The England 'system' or the France system of today might as well be termed 'African' with all the African players sitting in their national teams.

My point is that you do not seem to understand how football systems have evolved, and in the last several decades come closer together than at any other time previously.

And those systems continually evolve. So the idea that anyone can coach Nigeria to play the 'European system' appears not to understand that there's really no 'European system' or S. American system, but core principles of play around which the global game revolves.

Its then the talent and the differing qualities that the players bring to the game that defines the system that emerges, irrespective of the coach.

If you watched the Naijaria vs Egypt game and not say this is our style or system of how the game should be played, then I can't help you.

[Cellular]

I made the points I wanted to make..whats the deep understanding of the issues that counters my central point ?

At the core of my point is that following Rohr's logic, we dont stand a chance. There's no coach who can coach Nigeria like a European team, thats gong to make any meaningful progress, because in that context, we simply dont have the players.

We need a Coach who changes the context.

Of Course Nigeria played differently in different eras under different coaches..what has that got to do with anything I said?

These things are really not that complicated.

Taking Rohr's Eurocentric viewpoint, Nigeria should really not bother to show u at the World Cup...I dont believe we have any hidden god players anywhere. I believe our best players are on display for all to see week in and week out..
In the context of the European game, most of our players are average or just above average..The job of our NT manager/coach is to present or create a context for them in which they excel.
If we just blindly copy the European flavor of the week..a loss is guaranteed. I know its hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around the fact that the European football people are not all knowing, but its true.

The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC.

For people who may not know this..Brazil's style of play was considered primitive in the 1950s before they taught the Europeans a few lessons with that primitive style

Too many generalizations and not enough context or sufficiently deep understanding of the issues.

Systems are not permanent. They evolve over time.

Nigeria played differently under Otto Gloria than it did under Westerhof.

Brazil today plays differently from under Big Phil.

England of today is different from the days of Ron Greenwood.

Players can and do vary from one generation to another. The Nigerian wingers of today interpret the game differently from the likes of Segun Odegbami.

System convergence has been going on for more than 3 decades...

But contrasting philosophies still exist. But more than just between continents. Its between clubs and countries...

It's called system convergence...In the end it comes down to efficiency whatever the system...

[Cellular]

All this talk of systems is just blowing a lot of smoke everywhere. In soccer as we all know, the objective is to score more than your opponent.


This is where the Europeans are heads and shoulders above everyone else, chance conversion. Of course to get chances, you have to create them. How do you create them? Again, GET THAT BALL INTO THE BOX AS QUICKLY AND AS OFTEN AS POSSIBLE.

Finish.

This is what Nanijoe wrote: "The world cup used to be a battle of philosophies but even the South Americans are abandoning their own philosophies and you can see the results in who's been winning the WC."


You then go on to define an European philosophy of how the game should be played.

Like it is the only philosophy and system that works.