Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by txj »

I too thought it was a good friendly and have stated that here in several posts, but your geriatric self cannot tell the difference :rotf:

However it doesn't stop us from pointing out where and how we could do better...



1naija wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 1:36 am I don't regurgitate nonsensical formations that have no bearing on reality .... the personnel available. If anything, the coaching staff should be pleased with the performance of the team given the number of players that was missing. We all know exactly where the problem lies.
txj wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 1:01 am On another post, you were talking of a 4-2-4 and now you claim we had 4 players in MF?

Stick to making jokes...



1naija wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 12:53 am You sound like a short circuited robot... regurgitating repetitive rubbish. You don't even know the type of players the nonsensical formation you regurgitate requires. How would 4-3-3 made us effective when we could not dominate the midfied with 4 player.

This old man, you mumu o.

txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 11:37 pm
1naija wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 11:12 pm How woud 4-3-3 have changed the outcome of the game? How would it have prevented our so called professional goalkeeper from letting in a 50 yard shot? Did we not create several chances in the game with the formation we used? How would 4-3-3 have prevented injuries to some of our key players, which forced us to make the selection we made and the formation we played?

All these ATF analysis must stop.
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:35 pm
green4life wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:09 pm Overall it was a quality test given, unfortunately, we can't play & score 10 against Sao Tome every month.

Jokes aside, two glaring areas for improvement are goalie and midfield.

Also, we should be playing a 433 for better balance. No 5 at the back and no 442 biko.

Said it now for more than a year.

We are ripe for a transition to a 4-3-3, with Iwobi at the top of a triangle. He's come on in leaps and bounds and is very responsible on the ball, added to an increased work rate.

We cannot get anything more from Kele in this role...



You are so slow it is painful reading and responding to you.

The idea is that a 4-3-3 gives us greater balance in MF and allows us get the best of the talent we have.

Its not necessarily about any one match or any one result.

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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by Ugbowo »

txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by packerland »

Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

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packerland wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:48 pm
Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
Because we simply allowed them have the ball considering our numerical limitations in MF and inability to press them (I think this is where the importance of Ndidi and Etebo was missed)...Yusuf would have done a terrific job pressing the Algerians as he does relentless perfection at Antwerp, but he wasn't invited, a good opportunity missed. For all the possession Algeria had, I can't remember a great goal scoring opportunity or key save Uzoho had to make (aside from a Zaidu blooper of a attempted pass to Uzoho).
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by maceo4 »

Tobi17 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 4:31 pm
packerland wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:48 pm
Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
Because we simply allowed them have the ball considering our numerical limitations in MF and inability to press them (I think this is where the importance of Ndidi and Etebo was missed)...Yusuf would have done a terrific job pressing the Algerians as he does relentless perfection at Antwerp, but he wasn't invited, a good opportunity missed. For all the possession Algeria had, I can't remember a great goal scoring opportunity or key save Uzoho had to make (aside from a Zaidu blooper of a attempted pass to Uzoho).
So if it was Yusuf instead of Onyeka what would have really changed? The issue is the formation that the coach wants to play, because he only wants to use one DM next to Iwobi even if he had 100 different midfield options he would still only pick the best one (usually Ndidi) of them to partner Iwobi. So your griping about the number of midfielders invited is pointless due to the formation the coach was going to use anyways. If he wanted to play a formation that required 3 bonafide CMs I’m sure he would have invited 5-6 options. He hasn’t done that yet, in all his games it’s looked like 4-2-4, so he only needs a 2-3 of CMs to execute that, y’all need to get him to change his formation first then the obvious will follow…
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by Sunset »

maceo4 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 5:11 pm
Tobi17 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 4:31 pm
packerland wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:48 pm
Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
Because we simply allowed them have the ball considering our numerical limitations in MF and inability to press them (I think this is where the importance of Ndidi and Etebo was missed)...Yusuf would have done a terrific job pressing the Algerians as he does relentless perfection at Antwerp, but he wasn't invited, a good opportunity missed. For all the possession Algeria had, I can't remember a great goal scoring opportunity or key save Uzoho had to make (aside from a Zaidu blooper of a attempted pass to Uzoho).
So if it was Yusuf instead of Onyeka what would have really changed? The issue is the formation that the coach wants to play, because he only wants to use one DM next to Iwobi even if he had 100 different midfield options he would still only pick the best one (usually Ndidi) of them to partner Iwobi. So your griping about the number of midfielders invited is pointless due to the formation the coach was going to use anyways. If he wanted to play a formation that required 3 bonafide CMs I’m sure he would have invited 5-6 options. He hasn’t done that yet, in all his games it’s looked like 4-2-4, so he only needs a 2-3 of CMs to execute that, y’all need to get him to change his formation first then the obvious will follow…
The personnel does play a big part in how a formation works, I can't speak for Yusuf but an Etebo (for example) is far more useful player in a two man midfield than someone like Onyeka due his superior ball use and positional awareness, but for most of our CM's they function a lot better in a 3 man midfield so all we can do is find the best two in that case.
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by maceo4 »

Sunset wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 5:45 pm
maceo4 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 5:11 pm
Tobi17 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 4:31 pm
packerland wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:48 pm
Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
Because we simply allowed them have the ball considering our numerical limitations in MF and inability to press them (I think this is where the importance of Ndidi and Etebo was missed)...Yusuf would have done a terrific job pressing the Algerians as he does relentless perfection at Antwerp, but he wasn't invited, a good opportunity missed. For all the possession Algeria had, I can't remember a great goal scoring opportunity or key save Uzoho had to make (aside from a Zaidu blooper of a attempted pass to Uzoho).
So if it was Yusuf instead of Onyeka what would have really changed? The issue is the formation that the coach wants to play, because he only wants to use one DM next to Iwobi even if he had 100 different midfield options he would still only pick the best one (usually Ndidi) of them to partner Iwobi. So your griping about the number of midfielders invited is pointless due to the formation the coach was going to use anyways. If he wanted to play a formation that required 3 bonafide CMs I’m sure he would have invited 5-6 options. He hasn’t done that yet, in all his games it’s looked like 4-2-4, so he only needs a 2-3 of CMs to execute that, y’all need to get him to change his formation first then the obvious will follow…
The personnel does play a big part in how a formation works, I can't speak for Yusuf but an Etebo (for example) is far more useful player in a two man midfield than someone like Onyeka due his superior ball use and positional awareness, but for most of our CM's they function a lot better in a 3 man midfield so all we can do is find the best two in that case.
I agree, but if they are outnumbered they would still eventually buckle regardless of who is there, like how Etebo buckled vs Ghana. They are not super humans, its up to the coach to recognize they are outnumbered and provide them with help, which he didn't do. He had Onyedika on the bench who he could have thrown on to join Onyeka and Iwobi in order to wrestle control of the midfield back from Algerians, but it doesn't appear that is how Pesiero wants to play. Seems like he wants to counter rather than control the game. So all these calls for extra midfielders won't mean he's suddenly going to play more than 2 at one time, and that's the main issue...
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by vancity eagle »

txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
The quality out wide is there.

But they are wing forwards who will thrive more in a 433. They are not traditional wingers so again 442 is not our best formation with the players we have.
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by vancity eagle »

maceo4 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 5:11 pm
Tobi17 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 4:31 pm
packerland wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:48 pm
Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
Because we simply allowed them have the ball considering our numerical limitations in MF and inability to press them (I think this is where the importance of Ndidi and Etebo was missed)...Yusuf would have done a terrific job pressing the Algerians as he does relentless perfection at Antwerp, but he wasn't invited, a good opportunity missed. For all the possession Algeria had, I can't remember a great goal scoring opportunity or key save Uzoho had to make (aside from a Zaidu blooper of a attempted pass to Uzoho).
So if it was Yusuf instead of Onyeka what would have really changed? The issue is the formation that the coach wants to play, because he only wants to use one DM next to Iwobi even if he had 100 different midfield options he would still only pick the best one (usually Ndidi) of them to partner Iwobi. So your griping about the number of midfielders invited is pointless due to the formation the coach was going to use anyways. If he wanted to play a formation that required 3 bonafide CMs I’m sure he would have invited 5-6 options. He hasn’t done that yet, in all his games it’s looked like 4-2-4, so he only needs a 2-3 of CMs to execute that, y’all need to get him to change his formation first then the obvious will follow…
Nonsense.

Any coach should call up a flexible squad to be able to play multiple formations and not simply stuck on 442.

5 central midfielders is the absolute minimum. Also the fact that we should be finding better fits for these positions means we should be calling even more.

What use is calling up 7 central defenders we've seen over and over again and know are mostly rubbish.

It's like we do not want to move forward.
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by txj »

Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.


Was a good game to watch; lots of substance to chew over tactically.

The high press was not really part of the plan- think from watching the fwds the goal was to 'show pressure' and then use the shape behind the ball to 'channel' the Algerians accordingly.

Worked well in 1HF. But the attacking design of play failed the team again and again, from individual mistakes and technical leftovers- Lookman/Moffi miscontrols, etc...

Had a lot of success shifting Lookman esp, Kele/Moffi into the zone behind the Algerie CMs to receive the ball.
Makes you wonder what if Iwobi was in this zone?

Also playing out from the back from the left side, as well as on the overlaps from Zaidu, his quality on the delivery, makes you wonder if we should shift to a back 3 and use Calvin as overlapping CD, similar to Madrid with Alaba...

In 2HF we appeared to tire a little; sit back more. We could've done more with this game IMO.
Like switch to 4-3-3 and see how it would work with Rafa and Alex on either side of Frank.

Plus we never really tried out diagonals and balls over the top to exploit the pace we had upfront..
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We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by Lolly »

I was not happy with our play yesterday. The Algerians looked liked Brazil while we looked like England.

We need to find some more quality in the middle. We can’t keep hold of the ball, we were slow and clumsy closing down our opponents, and our attacking play was disjointed too many times.
Last edited by Lolly on Thu Sep 29, 2022 6:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by maceo4 »

vancity eagle wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 7:47 pm
maceo4 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 5:11 pm
Tobi17 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 4:31 pm
packerland wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:48 pm
Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
Because we simply allowed them have the ball considering our numerical limitations in MF and inability to press them (I think this is where the importance of Ndidi and Etebo was missed)...Yusuf would have done a terrific job pressing the Algerians as he does relentless perfection at Antwerp, but he wasn't invited, a good opportunity missed. For all the possession Algeria had, I can't remember a great goal scoring opportunity or key save Uzoho had to make (aside from a Zaidu blooper of a attempted pass to Uzoho).
So if it was Yusuf instead of Onyeka what would have really changed? The issue is the formation that the coach wants to play, because he only wants to use one DM next to Iwobi even if he had 100 different midfield options he would still only pick the best one (usually Ndidi) of them to partner Iwobi. So your griping about the number of midfielders invited is pointless due to the formation the coach was going to use anyways. If he wanted to play a formation that required 3 bonafide CMs I’m sure he would have invited 5-6 options. He hasn’t done that yet, in all his games it’s looked like 4-2-4, so he only needs a 2-3 of CMs to execute that, y’all need to get him to change his formation first then the obvious will follow…
Nonsense.

Any coach should call up a flexible squad to be able to play multiple formations and not simply stuck on 442.

5 central midfielders is the absolute minimum. Also the fact that we should be finding better fits for these positions means we should be calling even more.

What use is calling up 7 central defenders we've seen over and over again and know are mostly rubbish.

It's like we do not want to move forward.
You basically echoed what I said but called it nonsense lol. The issue is the coach's rigid 424 formation he keeps playing game in game out. Clearly its not the best yet he keeps playing it. So take it up with the coach, bobo had Onyedika on the bench, he could have added him to help Onyeka and Iwobi, yet didn't continued with 2 CM's all game long.
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by txj »

vancity eagle wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 7:47 pm
maceo4 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 5:11 pm
Tobi17 wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 4:31 pm
packerland wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:48 pm
Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
You made some good points but gosh they had like 80% ball possession. Not sure about 2 of the best team in Africa. All our players are average but it’s ok.

We need to stop tinkering with our squad minus injuries, they are who they are. They need to play more games together to build chemistry.
Because we simply allowed them have the ball considering our numerical limitations in MF and inability to press them (I think this is where the importance of Ndidi and Etebo was missed)...Yusuf would have done a terrific job pressing the Algerians as he does relentless perfection at Antwerp, but he wasn't invited, a good opportunity missed. For all the possession Algeria had, I can't remember a great goal scoring opportunity or key save Uzoho had to make (aside from a Zaidu blooper of a attempted pass to Uzoho).
So if it was Yusuf instead of Onyeka what would have really changed? The issue is the formation that the coach wants to play, because he only wants to use one DM next to Iwobi even if he had 100 different midfield options he would still only pick the best one (usually Ndidi) of them to partner Iwobi. So your griping about the number of midfielders invited is pointless due to the formation the coach was going to use anyways. If he wanted to play a formation that required 3 bonafide CMs I’m sure he would have invited 5-6 options. He hasn’t done that yet, in all his games it’s looked like 4-2-4, so he only needs a 2-3 of CMs to execute that, y’all need to get him to change his formation first then the obvious will follow…
Nonsense.

Any coach should call up a flexible squad to be able to play multiple formations and not simply stuck on 442.

5 central midfielders is the absolute minimum. Also the fact that we should be finding better fits for these positions means we should be calling even more.

What use is calling up 7 central defenders we've seen over and over again and know are mostly rubbish.

It's like we do not want to move forward.




This is not how it works.

Let me try and use a specific match to illustrate. This is the 2nd leg of the 2007/8 UCL S.Final second leg b/w Barca and ManU at the Camp Nou.

If you click the link below it will show you the tactical lineup.

Nominally Fergurson is playing with 4 attacking players and therefore you would say, a 4-2-4.

But in the game itself it was more a 4-5-1 and they sat so deep some might have thought they were defending the goal in the Espanyol stadium!

You'll note that on the bench he had Anderson and was using Hargreaves as a right back in the game, a role he often played going back to his Munich days.

The point here is that its not about bean counting the number of CMs, or even the formation. Its about the roles.

ROLES, not positions, but ROLES.


https://www.transfermarkt.us/fc-barcelo ... icht/90882


1Edwin van der Sar
4Owen Hargreaves 73'
3Patrice Evra
6Wes Brown
5Rio Ferdinand

16Michael Carrick
18Paul Scholes
13Park Ji-Sung
10Wayne Rooney

7Cristiano Ronaldo
32Carlos Tevez


SUBSTITUTES
76'17 Nani
85'11 Ryan Giggs

29Tomasz Kuszczak
27Mikael Silvestre
8Anderson
22John O'Shea
19Gerard Piqué
Form is temporary; Class is Permanent!
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.

We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
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Re: Algeria vs Nigeria (2-1)

Post by Enugu II »

Ugbowo wrote: Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:18 pm
txj wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:44 pm Liked what I saw of Onyeka in this game. His vertical movement, coverage and work between the defensive lines was very good.

Also liked the partnership b/w Bassey and Akpoguma. For a first time partnership it did look good and were never caught out by either a wall pass or ball over the top, except for the Mahrez missed control...

Concerned about our quality out wide; its just not there atm
I thought Onyeka was very very good especially in the first half. Best game he has played for the SE. I think Iwobi deep in a game we were not seeing the ball is counter productive. We were ripe for a switch.

Overall it was such a treat watching both teams in a tactical battle.

I dont think Belmadi expected a flat 4-4-2 from us but boy did he adjust quickly. His creation of overloads in the middle and Lookman's indecision on who and when to press (along with Kelechi wasting a millisecond trying to tell Moffi where to be, affecting his pressing movement) allowed them to have continuous joy playing out from the left back. It was great watching the tactical jigsaw. We pressed in lines and sat behind the ball once the first line was broken...pushing Iwobi deep and giving them time on the ball. Onyeka was massive covering the gaps and putting them under pressure but sometimes he was coming in just a tad late.

When we tried to play out the back, more often than not it was abysmal. W had issues playing to feet in defence and finding Iwobi and Onyeka. But when we did and they played the 1-2s we had success but attacks started to break down on heavy touches. You can see the semblance of a pattern developing. Lookman is an enigma right now. A talented player trying to understand his teammates. When he gets it, he'll be great for us. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

By gosh these looked like 2 of the best teams in Africa (our goalkeeping woes aside) and it's a shame neither of them are going to Qatar.
Ugbowo,

I could see what Peseiro did i.e. playing out of the back, with pace, and it was not a poor decision.

Remember, the Algerians were working the ball a tad slow in possession attempting to seek holes, as we defended deep. My thought is Peseiro attempted to take advantage of this with very quick counters, as soon as we had the ball and often it came from our left side. Yes, it broke down frequently but the idea itself was warranted, given the flow of the game (attempting to cut out the Algerians who were far up the field). On Lookman, he miscued atleast two of such countering opportunities when it came to his side. I am not sure that he was fully focused or just maybe he just had not worked enough with the others.

One thing to add is that Peseiro kept his wide backs defending except when we went as goal behind. At the time we went down, he had the CD go up and he was cut off and it could well have been costly.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics

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