The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

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The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by TonyTheTigerKiller »

Folks, let’s talk about this huge problem that led to our 2022 World Cup debacle.

Consider this. All the 2022 World Cup African representatives have indigenous coaches… and so far, they have been quite respectable. Senegal lost but Nigeria can only hope, in our wildest dreams, to move the ball the way the Senegalese do. Give them an Osimhen and an Iheanacho and they probably go to the semifinals, at least❗️


Cheers.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

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In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

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TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
Last edited by packerland on Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by packerland »

TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
Iheanacho that can’t control a ball…ok! Why not wait until the second or third group games are played. Ghana, Cameroon & Senegal haven’t played Senegal is one loss away from elimination.

I agree with your last statement but I doesn’t matter what’s in their policy. Unless they put away their salary for the next 3 years in a bank not controlled by Nigerians, it won’t work. The issue is that none of these players will come to Nigeria. We need to start small and rebuild our reputation with paying coaches on time before the Hiddinks can give us consideration.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by vancity eagle »

Senegal huffed and puffed and created ZERO chances

Tunisia sef were happy to settle for a draw in a setting that was highly intimidating to the Danes.

Yet A FOREIGN COACH, led Saudi Arabia to beat Argentina.

You guys never learn.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by Enugu II »

vancity eagle wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:53 am Senegal huffed and puffed and created ZERO chances

Tunisia sef were happy to settle for a draw in a setting that was highly intimidating to the dutch.

Yet A FOREIGN COACH, led Saudi Arabia to beat Argentina.

Africa has been doing "respectable performances" for decades. Asia will soon leave us behind.

You guys never learn.

LOL. And a foreign coach led Iran to.......

One day, you and others will learn it us not about whether a coach is foreign or local. IT is about the ability of each individual coach and not whether he or she is foreign or local.
Last edited by Enugu II on Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by vancity eagle »

Enugu II wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:56 am
vancity eagle wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:53 am Senegal huffed and puffed and created ZERO chances

Tunisia sef were happy to settle for a draw in a setting that was highly intimidating to the dutch.

Yet A FOREIGN COACH, led Saudi Arabia to beat Argentina.

Africa has been doing "respectable performances" for decades. Asia will soon leave us behind.

You guys never learn.

LOL. And a foreign coach led Iran to.......
So maybe it's not about foreign or local but just GOOD.

Crazy concept I know.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by TonyTheTigerKiller »

packerland wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:34 am
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
Iheanacho that can’t control a ball…ok! Why not wait until the second or third group games are played. Ghana, Cameroon & Senegal haven’t played Senegal is one loss away from elimination.

I agree with your last statement but I doesn’t matter what’s in their policy. Unless they put away their salary for the next 3 years in a bank not controlled by Nigerians, it won’t work. The issue is that none of these players will come to Nigeria. We need to start small and rebuild our reputation with paying coaches on time before the Hiddinks can give us consideration.
This is why Nigeria can’t really be one; such tribalistic bigotry. You guys have tried your Lookman and Dennis and all they could do was cost us the World Cup and disgrace us against Portugal. In a post about coaching, you couldn’t restrain yourself from an unwarranted jab at Iheanacho. It would be interesting if Nigeria, like Britain maintains regional soccer teams; then we’ll see which ones will have international success❗️


Cheers.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by vancity eagle »

TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:05 am
packerland wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:34 am
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
Iheanacho that can’t control a ball…ok! Why not wait until the second or third group games are played. Ghana, Cameroon & Senegal haven’t played Senegal is one loss away from elimination.

I agree with your last statement but I doesn’t matter what’s in their policy. Unless they put away their salary for the next 3 years in a bank not controlled by Nigerians, it won’t work. The issue is that none of these players will come to Nigeria. We need to start small and rebuild our reputation with paying coaches on time before the Hiddinks can give us consideration.
This is why Nigeria can’t really be one; such tribalistic bigotry. You guys have tried your Lookman and Dennis and all they could do was cost us the World Cup and disgrace us against Portugal. In a post about coaching, you couldn’t restrain yourself from an unwarranted jab at Iheanacho. It would be interesting if Nigeria, like Britain maintains regional soccer teams; then we’ll see which ones will have international success❗️


Cheers.
The same Nacho who tripped over himself when he had a half breakaway against Argentina in Russia.

The guy who cannot trap a ball.

God forbid. Useless underachieving player.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by TonyTheTigerKiller »

Enugu II wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:56 am
vancity eagle wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:53 am Senegal huffed and puffed and created ZERO chances

Tunisia sef were happy to settle for a draw in a setting that was highly intimidating to the dutch.

Yet A FOREIGN COACH, led Saudi Arabia to beat Argentina.

Africa has been doing "respectable performances" for decades. Asia will soon leave us behind.

You guys never learn.

LOL. And a foreign coach led Iran to.......

One day, you and others will learn it us not about whether a coach is foreign or local. IT is about the ability of each individual coach and not whether he or she is foreign or local.
EII,

One important point appears to have been lost here. Indeed, it is about quality but if we are unable to get foreign coaches of the right caliber then we might as well stick with what we have locally. Obviously, at least to me, Rohr’s teams weren’t technically more proficient than teams put together by our local coaches. My problem with Eguavoen is not his technical ability. Rather, it is the fact that he is incapable of standing up for himself and was cajoled by external forces to overhaul his team with just a week to a crucial World Cup qualifier. Regardless of his technical acumen, such a coach is unfit for the Herculean job of coaching the SuperEagles❗️


Cheers.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by vancity eagle »

You guys are delusional.

Our local coaches have been responsible for all the worst things to happen to our football in decades. In case you forgot

Egu DNQ WC 2022
Egu worst afcon in 30 years 2021
Oliseh/SSS DNQ afcon 2017
Keshi DNQ afcon 2015
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

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We should have gone for Sainfeit, the Gambian coach
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by Damunk »

TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:05 am
packerland wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:34 am
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
Iheanacho that can’t control a ball…ok! Why not wait until the second or third group games are played. Ghana, Cameroon & Senegal haven’t played Senegal is one loss away from elimination.

I agree with your last statement but I doesn’t matter what’s in their policy. Unless they put away their salary for the next 3 years in a bank not controlled by Nigerians, it won’t work. The issue is that none of these players will come to Nigeria. We need to start small and rebuild our reputation with paying coaches on time before the Hiddinks can give us consideration.
This is why Nigeria can’t really be one; such tribalistic bigotry. You guys have tried your Lookman and Dennis and all they could do was cost us the World Cup and disgrace us against Portugal. In a post about coaching, you couldn’t restrain yourself from an unwarranted jab at Iheanacho. It would be interesting if Nigeria, like Britain maintains regional soccer teams; then we’ll see which ones will have international success❗️

Cheers.
Bros, his jabs at Iheanacho are just as justified as your jabs at Lookman.
Nothing tribalistic about that. I really don’t even know where that has come from.
For all you know, packerman could be from the same village as Nacho.

It’s an opinion not without merit.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by Damunk »

Enugu II wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:56 am
vancity eagle wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:53 am Senegal huffed and puffed and created ZERO chances

Tunisia sef were happy to settle for a draw in a setting that was highly intimidating to the dutch.

Yet A FOREIGN COACH, led Saudi Arabia to beat Argentina.

Africa has been doing "respectable performances" for decades. Asia will soon leave us behind.

You guys never learn.

LOL. And a foreign coach led Iran to.......

One day, you and others will learn it us not about whether a coach is foreign or local. IT is about the ability of each individual coach and not whether he or she is foreign or local.
Kpom.
But prof, isn’t this what we have been killing each other over - not just about coaches but even more so about players?
It’s the quality. Not the location, not the skin colour, not the colour of the passport, not the accent.
Just the quality.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by TonyTheTigerKiller »

Damunk wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 7:37 am
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:05 am
packerland wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:34 am
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
Iheanacho that can’t control a ball…ok! Why not wait until the second or third group games are played. Ghana, Cameroon & Senegal haven’t played Senegal is one loss away from elimination.

I agree with your last statement but I doesn’t matter what’s in their policy. Unless they put away their salary for the next 3 years in a bank not controlled by Nigerians, it won’t work. The issue is that none of these players will come to Nigeria. We need to start small and rebuild our reputation with paying coaches on time before the Hiddinks can give us consideration.
This is why Nigeria can’t really be one; such tribalistic bigotry. You guys have tried your Lookman and Dennis and all they could do was cost us the World Cup and disgrace us against Portugal. In a post about coaching, you couldn’t restrain yourself from an unwarranted jab at Iheanacho. It would be interesting if Nigeria, like Britain maintains regional soccer teams; then we’ll see which ones will have international success❗️

Cheers.
Bros, his jabs at Iheanacho are just as justified as your jabs at Lookman.
Nothing tribalistic about that. I really don’t even know where that has come from.
For all you know, packerman could be from the same village as Nacho.

It’s an opinion not without merit.
You’re right… but I find it awfully irritating when people veer from the issues just to push their own narrative❗️


Cheers.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by packerland »

TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 11:16 am
Damunk wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 7:37 am
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:05 am
packerland wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:34 am
TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
Iheanacho that can’t control a ball…ok! Why not wait until the second or third group games are played. Ghana, Cameroon & Senegal haven’t played Senegal is one loss away from elimination.

I agree with your last statement but I doesn’t matter what’s in their policy. Unless they put away their salary for the next 3 years in a bank not controlled by Nigerians, it won’t work. The issue is that none of these players will come to Nigeria. We need to start small and rebuild our reputation with paying coaches on time before the Hiddinks can give us consideration.
This is why Nigeria can’t really be one; such tribalistic bigotry. You guys have tried your Lookman and Dennis and all they could do was cost us the World Cup and disgrace us against Portugal. In a post about coaching, you couldn’t restrain yourself from an unwarranted jab at Iheanacho. It would be interesting if Nigeria, like Britain maintains regional soccer teams; then we’ll see which ones will have international success❗️

Cheers.
Bros, his jabs at Iheanacho are just as justified as your jabs at Lookman.
Nothing tribalistic about that. I really don’t even know where that has come from.
For all you know, packerman could be from the same village as Nacho.

It’s an opinion not without merit.
You’re right… but I find it awfully irritating when people veer from the issues just to push their own narrative❗️


Cheers.
TTK,

So I’m a tribalist because I said iheanacho can’t control the ball? Then my next point is for you to cool down until the 2nd and 3rd WC games are played before we can say African team have done well. Then I somewhat agreed with you on criteria for selecting foreign coaches while adding my thoughts on how payment should be structured.
You’re just looking for trouble.

And by the way, without giving out where am from, Iheanacho has the same first name as my younger brother. I’m friends with Robbynice & king Futcha on social media and they can confirm.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by Damunk »

vancity eagle wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:21 am You guys are delusional.

Our local coaches have been responsible for all the worst things to happen to our football in decades. In case you forgot

Egu DNQ WC 2022
Egu worst afcon in 30 years 2021
Oliseh/SSS DNQ afcon 2017
Keshi DNQ afcon 2015
I think people conveniently forget (or for the very young, never realised) that these hirings have forever gone in cycles. Foreign today, local tomorrow, foreign the day after ad infinitum. It goes back decades. And what fuels this continuous merry go round? Less than perfect results in a restless population.
There’s always something and somebody to blame. And that person has to be labelled.

Whether we are looking for a solution to a problem or looking for a cause of one, it should be about performance alone. But what we’ve forever done is to hang the blame on whatever agenda is driving our sentiments.
If it’s not a coach’s nationality it’s about his ethnicity. If it’s not his ethnicity it’s about his ‘style’, ie the famous “Nigerian style” that nobody can actually define in technical terms. ‘Kick & Rush’ maybe?
Fortunately, religion hasn’t come into it yet.

Currently we are quickly approaching the local coach phase again. We’ve been here before. We’ll hire him, spend two or three years in the doldrums maybe punctuated by a modest achievement at some point, sack him for any reason that serves our sentiments (like we did to Amodu, Oliseh, Siasia and even Keshi) and then go hunting for a foreign coach again.

And the cycle continues….
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by Bigpokey24 »

is this thread about junk foreign coaches or Kele?
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by TonyTheTigerKiller »

Bigpokey24 wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 2:41 pm is this thread about junk foreign coaches or Kele?
Good question, for once🤔🤐❗️


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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

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Damunk wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 7:50 am
Enugu II wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:56 am
vancity eagle wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:53 am Senegal huffed and puffed and created ZERO chances

Tunisia sef were happy to settle for a draw in a setting that was highly intimidating to the dutch.

Yet A FOREIGN COACH, led Saudi Arabia to beat Argentina.

Africa has been doing "respectable performances" for decades. Asia will soon leave us behind.

You guys never learn.

LOL. And a foreign coach led Iran to.......

One day, you and others will learn it us not about whether a coach is foreign or local. IT is about the ability of each individual coach and not whether he or she is foreign or local.
Kpom.
But prof, isn’t this what we have been killing each other over - not just about coaches but even more so about players?
It’s the quality. Not the location, not the skin colour, not the colour of the passport, not the accent.
Just the quality.
It is a local v foreign talent discussion - a discussion going on around the world in many sectors, not just football. Yes, the premises that skin colour does not determine ability is not disputed. However that does not make the following topics redundant -

1. How to get locals coaching the national team and doing well

2. How to make sure that local coaches are treated as well as foreign coaches

These are relevant topics but when one raises them, they are called LC apologists. It is possible to raise these issues without being someone that hates foreign coaches.

On Peserio, I was not impressed with our game against Portugal. It left me deflated. The issue wasn't even the scoreline, it was the flatness of the whole performance. Nonetheless, Peserio needs more time to understand the players who are willing to play for him. I want to see him do well.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by Damunk »

aruako1 wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 8:54 am It is a local v foreign talent discussion - a discussion going on around the world in many sectors, not just football. Yes, the premises that skin colour does not determine ability is not disputed. However that does not make the following topics redundant -

1. How to get locals coaching the national team and doing well

2. How to make sure that local coaches are treated as well as foreign coaches

These are relevant topics but when one raises them, they are called LC apologists. It is possible to raise these issues without being someone that hates foreign coaches.
But you have forgotten to mention that in the same debate, those that so much as make a case for foreign coaches are routinely ridiculed not to mention insulted. Dem even get name for us: WOWO.
Just to flip your statement, "it is possible to raise these issues without being someone that hates local coaches"- or 'worships' foreign ones. :idea:

Any honest person will know that its more about quality than strictly local vs foreign. There's a paucity of local coaching talent which too many are in denial of. We can't point to ONE Nigerian coach that has the pedigree that Keshi had when he was hired as the SE coach. None. So he is an anomaly in that sense. That is where the debate should lie, not all this 'apologists' vs 'WOWO' nonsense.
That's why I have repeatedly said it is not an honest debate. Its more about firing cheap shots, mostly in the WOWO direction. :lol:
On Peserio, I was not impressed with our game against Portugal. It left me deflated. The issue wasn't even the scoreline, it was the flatness of the whole performance. Nonetheless, Peserio needs more time to understand the players who are willing to play for him. I want to see him do well.
I agree. But there's going to be much more of that if and when we choose to go back to our local coaches, trust me.
And I have said countless times, Nigerians can't handle it. We don't do pain very well.

See...we are already calling for Peseiro's head.
It will only get louder if he doesn't start winning in the next few games.
Nigerian coaches have it far worse.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by fabio »

TonyTheTigerKiller wrote: Wed Nov 23, 2022 1:14 am In light of the very respectable performances by African teams at the World Cup, is it reasonable to keep expending our meager resources on mediocre foreign coaches? Isn’t it time for the NFF to make a policy decision that if a foreign coach must be hired then it should be a coach in the class of a Hiddink or an Ancelotti❓❗️


Cheers.
I can bet most of the foreign coaches in the WC live on the country that employed.

Rohr was a part time contractor as SE coach. He comes in just before a match and leaves after the match.

Living in the country that employed you as a football coach is extremely important as well.
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Re: The Nigerian Coaching Conondrum…

Post by aruako1 »

Damunk wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 10:14 am
aruako1 wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 8:54 am It is a local v foreign talent discussion - a discussion going on around the world in many sectors, not just football. Yes, the premises that skin colour does not determine ability is not disputed. However that does not make the following topics redundant -

1. How to get locals coaching the national team and doing well

2. How to make sure that local coaches are treated as well as foreign coaches

These are relevant topics but when one raises them, they are called LC apologists. It is possible to raise these issues without being someone that hates foreign coaches.
But you have forgotten to mention that in the same debate, those that so much as make a case for foreign coaches are routinely ridiculed not to mention insulted. Dem even get name for us: WOWO.
Just to flip your statement, "it is possible to raise these issues without being someone that hates local coaches"- or 'worships' foreign ones. :idea:

Any honest person will know that its more about quality than strictly local vs foreign. There's a paucity of local coaching talent which too many are in denial of. We can't point to ONE Nigerian coach that has the pedigree that Keshi had when he was hired as the SE coach. None. So he is an anomaly in that sense. That is where the debate should lie, not all this 'apologists' vs 'WOWO' nonsense.
That's why I have repeatedly said it is not an honest debate. Its more about firing cheap shots, mostly in the WOWO direction. :lol:
On Peserio, I was not impressed with our game against Portugal. It left me deflated. The issue wasn't even the scoreline, it was the flatness of the whole performance. Nonetheless, Peserio needs more time to understand the players who are willing to play for him. I want to see him do well.
I agree. But there's going to be much more of that if and when we choose to go back to our local coaches, trust me.
And I have said countless times, Nigerians can't handle it. We don't do pain very well.

See...we are already calling for Peseiro's head.
It will only get louder if he doesn't start winning in the next few games.
Nigerian coaches have it far worse.
I have supported several foreign coaches without being called WOWO. I praised Rorh when he did well and nobody called me WOWO. The WOWOs are those who stereotype local coaches as undesirable and foreign coaches as the vest thing since sliced bread. They are those that denigrate those who call for a level playing field for local coaches.

On Peserio, fans everywhere are fickle (see Arteta and Arsenal fans for instance). It is up to the NFF to agree a vision with Peserio and stick to it. I am desperate for us to do well again

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