What a tragedy

[DAgrin]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

[Enugu II]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

DAgrin

I never believed in the hype about playing in this or that league. Totally meaningless to me for one primary reason -- players for the NT are selected based on individual ability and form and not on what their club does. Moreover, a lot of African players are not joining clubs based on ranking of those clubs. These players are everywhere even in second division clubs.


Let me note, however, that if anything we have to learn from the Moroccans then it is a fact that their players are comfortable with the ball at their feet. This is a major Achiless heel -- inability to inspire confidence on the ball when pressed -- that our center backs under Rohr exhibited. It matters. It is a big big problem especially when the other ream is pressing all over the field and not allowing you time on the ball. Would the SE resort to incessant hoofing of the ball in such circumstance? Your guess is as good as mine. Thus, we have to be better and that comes from seeking ball players. For years I thought Awaziem could be the solution but clearly he has faded badly and now we must look beyond. Bassey, in my mind, is a good option. Hopefully, he will be able to remain comfortable on the ball. Right now who is the other capable centerback?

[gochino]

Ofcourse it is nonsense! Rohr kept telling us we don't have players playing in the Champions league and we are at the world cup just to learn! That was bad because It was obvious he was saying all these just to buy time and even worse, many Nigerians plus the NFA believed him. Here we are today, he left us after 5 years with no foundation to build on. We don't have a keeper, poor defense, no real holding Midfielder plus wingers that can't even cross a ball. The first step would be to get a coach that can bring back the confidence in those guys and then focus on players that have confidence on the ball! Apart from Iwobi, I can't think of any other player in the team that can do this and that's the big issue.

[vancity eagle]

The people who said we don't have the players have always been yarning nonsense.

I said about this crop is that they are good enough to make a quarter final run with the right tactics, guidance, and luck(which all successful teams count on)

Yes it is true our defenders are not as bad as many claim.

But we have no keeper and that is a major problem and impediment to our success.

Also yes we need to get more players who are comfortable with the ball at their feet. This should be one of the major scouting criteria.

[Bigpokey24]

Ofcourse it is nonsense! Rohr kept telling us we don't have players playing in the Champions league and we are at the world cup just to learn! That was bad because It was obvious he was saying all these just to buy time and even worse, many Nigerians plus the NFA believed him. Here we are today, he left us after 5 years with no foundation to build on. We don't have a keeper, poor defense, no real holding Midfielder plus wingers that can't even cross a ball. The first step would be to get a coach that can bring back the confidence in those guys and then focus on players that have confidence on the ball! Apart from Iwobi, I can't think of any other player in the team that can do this and that's the big issue.

Please bro, stop saying that cursed and fake coach name. He destroyed our football and he killed our players psych for 6 long years. This will take time to overcome

[MAIDABOI]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

Imagine Morocco with Okoye or Uzoho in goal

[Kabalega]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

It all boils down to logistics and planning. Nothing new here.
Why else do you think the usual suspects qualify out of Africa.
There are exceptions, e.g. S. Africa. I think their problem is that they are insular.

Most of CAF’s reps at the WC self-sabotage with irregular compensation or other shenanigans.
Cameroon almost always has pay or some other distracting issue.

[Lolly]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

DAgrin

I never believed in the hype about playing in this or that league. Totally meaningless to me for one primary reason -- players for the NT are selected based on individual ability and form and not on what their club does.

Let me note, however, that if anything we have to learn from the Moroccans then it is a fact that their players are comfortable with the ball at their feet. This is a major Achiless heel -- inability to inspire confidence on the ball when pressed -- that our center backs under Rohr exhibited. It matters. It is a big big problem especially when the other ream is pressing all over the field and not allowing you time on the ball.

Is it a coincidence that the Argentina World Cup winning squad has 99% of them playing in the top leagues.

GOALKEEPERS:

Emiliano Martinez (Aston Villa)
Geronimo Rulli (Villarreal)
Franco Armani (River Plate)

DEFENDERS:

Nahuel Molina (Atletico Madrid)
Gonzalo Montiel (Sevilla)
German Pezzella (Real Betis)
Nicolas Otamendi (Benfica)
Cristian Romero (Tottenham)
Lisandro Martinez (Manchester United)
Nicolas Tagliafico (Lyon)
Marcos Acuna (Sevilla)
Juan Foyth (Villarreal)

MIDFIELDERS:

Guido Rodriguez (Real Betis)
Rodrigo De Paul (Atletico Madrid)
Exequiel Palacios (Bayer Leverkusen)
Alexis Mac Allister (Brighton)
Enzo Fernandez (Benfica)
Alejandro Gomez (Sevilla)
Leandro Paredes (Juventus)

ATTACKERS:

Lionel Messi (PSG)
Nicolas Gonzalez (Fiorentina)
Lautaro Martinez (Inter)
Paulo Dybala (Roma)
Julian Alvarez (Manchester City)
Joaquin Correa (Inter)
Angel Di Maria (Juventus)

And I agree with you on your second point. The lack of players who are not very comfortable on the ball is also a confirmation that we don’t have enough quality players. The great SE teams of old always had players comfortable on the ball. We just have too many players who appear to have a lot of energy and grit but not enough guile. That is what we say by lack of quality. And you can’t win big tournaments on energy and determination alone.

[Dammy]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

Organisation is the key. We can't be having off field shenanigans like owing coaches and players and expect the team to thrive. Handling the SE to the NFF is like handling the keys of a formula one racing car to an amateur.
The Federal Government needs to step in and fund the SE. They can be the image makers for Nigeria's battered international image. The most successful period in SE history when we qualified for the WC and won AFCON in Tunisia was funded by the FG through the office of the Vice-president Augustus Aikhomu. The VP ensured that Westerhoff's team lacked for nothing and the NFF were bypassed.
Even the Moroccan national team is heavily funded by the King of Morocco. The much touted training centre was funded by the King.
President Buhari was in the United States recently and watched the WC semifinal with President Joe Biden. That should give him an idea of how football is a powerful tool in global politics.
The NFF as it's currently constituted does not have what it takes to move Nigerian football forward. The positions were shared among political zones with none of them having a manifesto on how to move Nigerian football forward. The SE is one of the few things that unify Nigerians and should not be left in the hands of incapable people.

[wiseone]

I do not understand why people present Morocco as some Cinderella story of average players over-achieving. Is it that much of a surprise that a team whose full backs play for Bayern and PSG (AKA 2 teams that have won their leagues 18 times in the last 10 years between them) reached the World Cup semi-final? Morocco can legit make a case that they have the best FB pairing in the world.

Plus they have a playmaker who won the Champions League last year, a manic workaholic midfielder who was probably the best performing midfielder in this World Cup, and a solid GK.

If we made Nigerian players eligible for Morocco, Osimhen, Ndidi, Aribo, and Chukwueze are the only Nigerian players that would get into Morocco’s first 11.

[Dammy]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

DAgrin

I never believed in the hype about playing in this or that league. Totally meaningless to me for one primary reason -- players for the NT are selected based on individual ability and form and not on what their club does.

Let me note, however, that if anything we have to learn from the Moroccans then it is a fact that their players are comfortable with the ball at their feet. This is a major Achiless heel -- inability to inspire confidence on the ball when pressed -- that our center backs under Rohr exhibited. It matters. It is a big big problem especially when the other ream is pressing all over the field and not allowing you time on the ball.

Is it a coincidence that the Argentina World Cup winning squad has 99% of them playing in the top leagues.

GOALKEEPERS:

Emiliano Martinez (Aston Villa)
Geronimo Rulli (Villarreal)
Franco Armani (River Plate)

DEFENDERS:

Nahuel Molina (Atletico Madrid)
Gonzalo Montiel (Sevilla)
German Pezzella (Real Betis)
Nicolas Otamendi (Benfica)
Cristian Romero (Tottenham)
Lisandro Martinez (Manchester United)
Nicolas Tagliafico (Lyon)
Marcos Acuna (Sevilla)
Juan Foyth (Villarreal)

MIDFIELDERS:

Guido Rodriguez (Real Betis)
Rodrigo De Paul (Atletico Madrid)
Exequiel Palacios (Bayer Leverkusen)
Alexis Mac Allister (Brighton)
Enzo Fernandez (Benfica)
Alejandro Gomez (Sevilla)
Leandro Paredes (Juventus)

ATTACKERS:

Lionel Messi (PSG)
Nicolas Gonzalez (Fiorentina)
Lautaro Martinez (Inter)
Paulo Dybala (Roma)
Julian Alvarez (Manchester City)
Joaquin Correa (Inter)
Angel Di Maria (Juventus)

And I agree with you on your second point. The lack of players who are not very comfortable on the ball is also a confirmation that we don’t have enough quality players. The great SE teams of old always had players comfortable on the ball. We just have too many players who appear to have a lot of energy and grit but not enough guile. That is what we say by lack of quality. And you can’t win big tournaments on energy and determination alone.

You are wasting your time with E11, let him keep believing that players from obscure leagues can win major tournaments. No matter the evidence presented, he will still insist on his POV.
Even AFCON is won by the teams with players in the elite leagues. He will now go and open another thread using "empirical" evidence and stats to support his position which really has no bearing on facts!

[Bigpokey24]

Buhari will be out of office in February or march of next year, his bad luck towards the SE will be gone

[vancity eagle]

I do not understand why people present Morocco as some Cinderella story of average players over-achieving. Is it that much of a surprise what a team whose full backs play for Bayern and PSG (AKA 2 teams that have won their leagues 18 times in the last 10 years between them) reached the World Cup semi-final? Morocco can legit make a case that they have the best FB pairing in the world.

Plus they have a playmaker who won the Champions League last year, a manic workaholic midfielder who was probably the best performing midfielder in this World Cup, and a solid GK.

If we made Nigerian players eligible for Morocco, Osimhen, Ndidi, Aribo, and Chukwueze are the only Nigerian players that would get into Morocco’s first 11.

Morocco has a very good starting 11 on paper. It isn't much worse than Portugal or Spain so it shouldn't really be a surprise that they overcame those teams.

As for Nigerians making their 11, Aribo ? No way. Current Ndidi ? Absolutely not. Chukwueze that has never played well for SE ? Mba.

I maintain that only Osimehn and Iwobi would be shoe ins. The Ndidi of old yes, but even he isn't that dynamic and could easily be replaced by Amrabat who has more technical skills to offer.

None of our players are consistent other than Osimehn and Iwobi. Aina is usually pretty good, but he ain't starting over Hakimi.

[1naija]

Morocco had a goalkeeper that kept them in the games. We should applaud their performance at the world cup, but let's not get too carried away. Belgium, Spain and Portugal has several clear scoring opportunities again their 11 man in the box) defense, but the goalkeeper bailed them out. They lost the 2 game that he wasn't a superman in. No team can win a tournament based on the heroics of one player game in game out.

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

[folem]

Morocco had a goalkeeper that kept them in the games. We should applaud their performance at the world cup, but let's not get too carried away. Belgium, Spain and Portugal has several clear scoring opportunities again their 11 man in the box) defense, but the goalkeeper bailed them out. They lost the 2 game that he wasn't a superman in. No team can win a tournament based on the heroics of one player game in game out.

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

Morocco had several clear cut chances in those games as well. At the end, it is the lack of clinical firepower up front that stopped Morocco from going all the way.

[folem]

You are wasting your time with E11, let him keep believing that players from obscure leagues can win major tournaments. No matter the evidence presented, he will still insist on his POV.
Even AFCON is won by the teams with players in the elite leagues. He will now go and open another thread using "empirical" evidence and stats to support his position which really has no bearing on facts!

Obscure Leagues can't prepare you well enough for the intensity.

[wiseone]

This is an interesting topic, because I recall saying that if Mane, Aubameyang, or Osimhen were Moroccan, they would have beaten France (or at least made the scoreline much closer). Morocco’s biggest weaknesses are: lack of strength in depth beyond its first 11-12, and the lack of a clinical and mobile striker.

The defenders who came in for the injured Saiss, Mazraoui, and Aguerd were not as good as those they replaced (except Attiat-Allah who was excellent). Plus El-Nesyri up front does not suit Morocco’s fast counter-attacking style. They need a more mobile and free scoring striker against top class opposition.

If I had to pick a joint Morocco-Nigeria team it would be:

Bounou
Hakimi-Saiss-Aguerd*-Mazraoui
Amrabat-Ndidi
Ziyech-Aribo-Chukwueze
Osimhen

*outside shout for Bassey.

Morocco has a very good starting 11 on paper. It isn't much worse than Portugal or Spain so it shouldn't really be a surprise that they overcame those teams.

As for Nigerians making their 11, Aribo ? No way. Current Ndidi ? Absolutely not. Chukwueze that has never played well for SE ? Mba.

I maintain that only Osimehn and Iwobi would be shoe ins. The Ndidi of old yes, but even he isn't that dynamic and could easily be replaced by Amrabat who has more technical skills to offer.

None of our players are consistent other than Osimehn and Iwobi. Aina is usually pretty good, but he ain't starting over Hakimi.

[Enugu II]

You are wasting your time with E11, let him keep believing that players from obscure leagues can win major tournaments. No matter the evidence presented, he will still insist on his POV.
Even AFCON is won by the teams with players in the elite leagues. He will now go and open another thread using "empirical" evidence and stats to support his position which really has no bearing on facts!

Obscure Leagues can't prepare you well enough for the intensity.

Do you have proof of that? I assume here tgat you are not referring to village leagues but some of the leagues that you find Nigerian players e.g. in the Scandinavia etc.

You have to note that football is not some perfect mathematical calculation. The migration to leagues is not driven by players seeking top leagues but for African players, particularly, it is driven by economics. For instance, I can bet that an Adrican player will sign a contract worth $1 million per annum in Saudi Arabia before a contract Wirth $300k in Sweden. It matters diddly to the player what you or anyone else thinks. His goal is about his family, first and foremost and not about some mythical big league

[1naija]

So you don't believe experience matters? Do you have example of a team of backwater league players that have won the World cup?

A player that has been involved in high pressure matches in big leagues will handle pressure far better than players from backwater leagues. Experience matters! The Nigerian game against Tunisia and Ghana are good examples of this. The moment we fell behind, our backwater league players started panicking. The Sierra Leone game is another perfect example of how backwater league players crumble under pressure.

You are wasting your time with E11, let him keep believing that players from obscure leagues can win major tournaments. No matter the evidence presented, he will still insist on his POV.
Even AFCON is won by the teams with players in the elite leagues. He will now go and open another thread using "empirical" evidence and stats to support his position which really has no bearing on facts!

Obscure Leagues can't prepare you well enough for the intensity.

Do you have proof of that? I assume here tgat you are not referring to village leagues but some of the leagues that you find Nigerian players e.g. in the Scandinavia etc.

You have to note that football is not some perfect mathematical calculation. The migration to leagues is not driven by players seeking top leagues but for African players, particularly, it is driven by economics. For instance, I can bet that an African player will sign a contract worth $1 million per annum in Saudi Arabia before a contract worth $300k in Sweden.

[Lolly]

You are wasting your time with E11, let him keep believing that players from obscure leagues can win major tournaments. No matter the evidence presented, he will still insist on his POV.
Even AFCON is won by the teams with players in the elite leagues. He will now go and open another thread using "empirical" evidence and stats to support his position which really has no bearing on facts!

Obscure Leagues can't prepare you well enough for the intensity.

Thank you. It can also be an indication of your quality. Let’s not deceive ourselves.

[Cellular]

The people who said we don't have the players have always been yarning nonsense.

I said about this crop is that they are good enough to make a quarter final run with the right tactics, guidance, and luck(which all successful teams count on)

Yes it is true our defenders are not as bad as many claim.

But we have no keeper and that is a major problem and impediment to our success.

Also yes we need to get more players who are comfortable with the ball at their feet. This should be one of the major scouting criteria.

You actually mentioned everything we needed.

Good goalkeeping and Better Luck!

It could be argued that the African team with the better goalkeeping (goalkeeper) went the furthest.

[Cellular]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

DAgrin

I never believed in the hype about playing in this or that league. Totally meaningless to me for one primary reason -- players for the NT are selected based on individual ability and form and not on what their club does.

Let me note, however, that if anything we have to learn from the Moroccans then it is a fact that their players are comfortable with the ball at their feet. This is a major Achiless heel -- inability to inspire confidence on the ball when pressed -- that our center backs under Rohr exhibited. It matters. It is a big big problem especially when the other ream is pressing all over the field and not allowing you time on the ball.

Is it a coincidence that the Argentina World Cup winning squad has 99% of them playing in the top leagues.

GOALKEEPERS:

Emiliano Martinez (Aston Villa)
Geronimo Rulli (Villarreal)
Franco Armani (River Plate)

DEFENDERS:

Nahuel Molina (Atletico Madrid)
Gonzalo Montiel (Sevilla)
German Pezzella (Real Betis)
Nicolas Otamendi (Benfica)
Cristian Romero (Tottenham)
Lisandro Martinez (Manchester United)
Nicolas Tagliafico (Lyon)
Marcos Acuna (Sevilla)
Juan Foyth (Villarreal)

MIDFIELDERS:

Guido Rodriguez (Real Betis)
Rodrigo De Paul (Atletico Madrid)
Exequiel Palacios (Bayer Leverkusen)
Alexis Mac Allister (Brighton)
Enzo Fernandez (Benfica)
Alejandro Gomez (Sevilla)
Leandro Paredes (Juventus)

ATTACKERS:

Lionel Messi (PSG)
Nicolas Gonzalez (Fiorentina)
Lautaro Martinez (Inter)
Paulo Dybala (Roma)
Julian Alvarez (Manchester City)
Joaquin Correa (Inter)
Angel Di Maria (Juventus)

And I agree with you on your second point. The lack of players who are not very comfortable on the ball is also a confirmation that we don’t have enough quality players. The great SE teams of old always had players comfortable on the ball. We just have too many players who appear to have a lot of energy and grit but not enough guile. That is what we say by lack of quality. And you can’t win big tournaments on energy and determination alone.

You are wasting your time with E11, let him keep believing that players from obscure leagues can win major tournaments. No matter the evidence presented, he will still insist on his POV.
Even AFCON is won by the teams with players in the elite leagues. He will now go and open another thread using "empirical" evidence and stats to support his position which really has no bearing on facts!

You people sef.

Argentina got lucky. PERIODT! Had nothing to do with where their players play. All the years of Messi winning Ballon d'Or it took the team getting lucky for him to win it.

The same team lost to Saudi Arabia. Where do the Saudis play?

If it was about the pedigree of players then Germany, Brazil, Belgium, England, Spain, etc would be in the Semis.

In this particular World Cup, it was a game of attrition. How deep is your bench?

[Lolly]

All the talk about our players being average and not ready for world class performances is actually nonsense. Morocco and other teams have shown that you just need to have defensive stability, a game plan, team chemistry and a coach the players look up to, to succeed. Most of our players are not world class. But a few are or have the potential to be. That are all the ingredients you need to succeed at the World Cup. With the right mixture players can grow and can perform better than we could ever imagine. In contrast to Morocco we even have a word class striker and very fast wingers (our defenders are not as bad as we make them)
But you need to get your act together. Without the organizational basics everything is lost.
My point is: I do not believe our players are not good enough to form a team that can compete with the best. Our asscociation doesn't offer the requirements to built a team around the players available because of its inconsistency.

DAgrin

I never believed in the hype about playing in this or that league. Totally meaningless to me for one primary reason -- players for the NT are selected based on individual ability and form and not on what their club does.

Let me note, however, that if anything we have to learn from the Moroccans then it is a fact that their players are comfortable with the ball at their feet. This is a major Achiless heel -- inability to inspire confidence on the ball when pressed -- that our center backs under Rohr exhibited. It matters. It is a big big problem especially when the other ream is pressing all over the field and not allowing you time on the ball.

Is it a coincidence that the Argentina World Cup winning squad has 99% of them playing in the top leagues.

GOALKEEPERS:

Emiliano Martinez (Aston Villa)
Geronimo Rulli (Villarreal)
Franco Armani (River Plate)

DEFENDERS:

Nahuel Molina (Atletico Madrid)
Gonzalo Montiel (Sevilla)
German Pezzella (Real Betis)
Nicolas Otamendi (Benfica)
Cristian Romero (Tottenham)
Lisandro Martinez (Manchester United)
Nicolas Tagliafico (Lyon)
Marcos Acuna (Sevilla)
Juan Foyth (Villarreal)

MIDFIELDERS:

Guido Rodriguez (Real Betis)
Rodrigo De Paul (Atletico Madrid)
Exequiel Palacios (Bayer Leverkusen)
Alexis Mac Allister (Brighton)
Enzo Fernandez (Benfica)
Alejandro Gomez (Sevilla)
Leandro Paredes (Juventus)

ATTACKERS:

Lionel Messi (PSG)
Nicolas Gonzalez (Fiorentina)
Lautaro Martinez (Inter)
Paulo Dybala (Roma)
Julian Alvarez (Manchester City)
Joaquin Correa (Inter)
Angel Di Maria (Juventus)

And I agree with you on your second point. The lack of players who are not very comfortable on the ball is also a confirmation that we don’t have enough quality players. The great SE teams of old always had players comfortable on the ball. We just have too many players who appear to have a lot of energy and grit but not enough guile. That is what we say by lack of quality. And you can’t win big tournaments on energy and determination alone.

You are wasting your time with E11, let him keep believing that players from obscure leagues can win major tournaments. No matter the evidence presented, he will still insist on his POV.
Even AFCON is won by the teams with players in the elite leagues. He will now go and open another thread using "empirical" evidence and stats to support his position which really has no bearing on facts!

You people sef.

Argentina got lucky. PERIODT! Had nothing to do with where their players play. All the years of Messi winning Ballon d'Or it took the team getting lucky for him to win it.

The same team lost to Saudi Arabia. Where do the Saudis play?

If it was about the pedigree of players then Germany, Brazil, Belgium, England, Spain, etc would be in the Semis.

In this particular World Cup, it was a game of attrition. How deep is your bench?

I see you mentioned the teams whose players populate the top leagues. Could Saudi or Qatar have lucked their way to the semis too?