England snubs its Nigerian options

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kali
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by kali »

Culture. A Nigerian kid born and raised in Europe is European. What they know about Nigeria is from family and intermittent visits. There is no reason they should play for Nigeria and if they do there is a vast gulf in standards of professionalism and organization. Nigeria should stop looking for the easy way out.There are 200 million Nigerians and at least 1-10 million play football. There are more Osihmens out there if we look. Westerhoff built the 1994 team by travelling the length and breadth of Nigeria to watch local matches. That is the kind of scouting Nigeria needs not watching EPL and European leagues and looking for Nigerian names.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Damunk »

mcal wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 2:32 am
Damunk wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 10:00 pm
mcal wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 9:36 pm ...see una dey squabble about players/kids trained and brought up with silver spoon to come play for a disarrayed organization. I hope una dey factor in your bad and poor NFA.
Silver spoon? :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
Maybe by Naija standards but Eze group up in a rough and deprived part of south east London (Deptford). I seem to recall reading it was a single parent family.
He probably grew up buying food from ‘Tomi’s Kitchen’, ‘Island Bukka’ and ‘Agege Bread’ - all Nigerian restaurants on the Deptford High Street, walking distance from his house.

He learnt his trade playing in “cages” - like captured animals with no escape. It was a thing, much like ‘set’ in Naija but in real steel cages with concrete floors

He ain’t no ajebota just becos he grew up in London.
...by "silver spoon" I meant general life and procedures in England vs Nigeria,
Those rough and deprived areas you mentioned above, I bet are better than the so called high class enclaves in Nigeria. At least Eze had 24/7 electricity and water running, plus healthcare within a phone call away.
Why are we even struggling to get these players, when they are there for the taken in their "rough and deprived" neighborhoods?
We waited until they get plucked out, polished, and thrive under circumstances they only know and understand, then we notice them.
I hear you, but it’s relative.
Some of those areas can be a nightmare to live. They might have constant electricity and prunning water but life and limb, even for kids can be hit and miss - drugs, gangs and the rest that come with it.
10 year old Damilola Taylor was brutally murdered by two other kids ages 12 and 13 on the stairwell of his council estate block in Peckham (‘mini Lagos’, just 2 miles up the road from Deptford). It made national headlines for years in the UK. Deptford and Peckham have a long history of deadly rivalry between Africans and Caribbeans.

So it’s not all roses and it’s simply a different kind of insecurity.
Nigerian players like Ndidi, Moffi, Chukwueze and Mikel didn’t necessarily grow up in extreme poverty like Osimhen, Ighalo and Awoniyi.

Finally, those rough areas might look ‘okay’ on the outside, but you need to go into the houses.
You go shock, my brother.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by mcal »

kali wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 6:06 am Culture. A Nigerian kid born and raised in Europe is European. What they know about Nigeria is from family and intermittent visits. There is no reason they should play for Nigeria and if they do there is a vast gulf in standards of professionalism and organization. Nigeria should stop looking for the easy way out.There are 200 million Nigerians and at least 1-10 million play football. There are more Osihmens out there if we look. Westerhoff built the 1994 team by travelling the length and breadth of Nigeria to watch local matches. That is the kind of scouting Nigeria needs not watching EPL and European leagues and looking for Nigerian names.
...thank you :clap: :clap:
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by wiseone »

Picking Maguire and Coady instead of Tomori, and Toney instead of Abraham, are head scratching decisions.

Eze’s best chance of international football is with Nigeria 🇳🇬. There is a massive queue of English AMs ahead of him (Foden, Mount, Maddison, Saka etc).
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by green4life »

Aswani wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 11:11 am I am not sure Eze and Iwobi can play together anyway.
They can definitely play together for a proper manager who understands how to deploy them.

Chukwuemeka, however, in all fairness is quite raw for now based on his appearances so far at Chelsea where he plays like a deer caught in headlights. He’ll be even more lost right now at the Super Eagles.

What’s the situation with Olise? He’s a player who can be useful for the SE. NFF has to try harder.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by bret- hart »

green4life wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 10:52 pm
Aswani wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 11:11 am I am not sure Eze and Iwobi can play together anyway.
They can definitely play together for a proper manager who understands how to deploy them.

Chukwuemeka, however, in all fairness is quite raw for now based on his appearances so far at Chelsea where he plays like a deer caught in headlights. He’ll be even more lost right now at the Super Eagles.

What’s the situation with Olise? He’s a player who can be useful for the SE. NFF has to try harder.
Olise wants to play for France. He is with their U21s
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by green4life »

bret- hart wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 11:03 pm
green4life wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 10:52 pm
Aswani wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 11:11 am I am not sure Eze and Iwobi can play together anyway.
They can definitely play together for a proper manager who understands how to deploy them.

Chukwuemeka, however, in all fairness is quite raw for now based on his appearances so far at Chelsea where he plays like a deer caught in headlights. He’ll be even more lost right now at the Super Eagles.

What’s the situation with Olise? He’s a player who can be useful for the SE. NFF has to try harder.
Olise wants to play for France. He is with their U21s
Thanks for the update.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Lolly »

mcal wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 2:32 am
Damunk wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 10:00 pm
mcal wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 9:36 pm ...see una dey squabble about players/kids trained and brought up with silver spoon to come play for a disarrayed organization. I hope una dey factor in your bad and poor NFA.
Silver spoon? :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
Maybe by Naija standards but Eze group up in a rough and deprived part of south east London (Deptford). I seem to recall reading it was a single parent family.
He probably grew up buying food from ‘Tomi’s Kitchen’, ‘Island Bukka’ and ‘Agege Bread’ - all Nigerian restaurants on the Deptford High Street, walking distance from his house.

He learnt his trade playing in “cages” - like captured animals with no escape. It was a thing, much like ‘set’ in Naija but in real steel cages with concrete floors

He ain’t no ajebota just becos he grew up in London.
...by "silver spoon" I meant general life and procedures in England vs Nigeria,
Those rough and deprived areas you mentioned above, I bet are better than the so called high class enclaves in Nigeria. At least Eze had 24/7 electricity and water running, plus healthcare within a phone call away.
Why are we even struggling to get these players, when they are there for the taken in their "rough and deprived" neighborhoods?
We waited until they get plucked out, polished, and thrive under circumstances they only know and understand, then we notice them.
Again, you never disappoint. Did you ever live in Nigeria? Or should I ask where you grew up in Nigeria because you seem to have this warped believe that every Nigerian lives in a gutter.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Bigpokey24 »

Lolly wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 12:26 pm
mcal wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 2:32 am
Damunk wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 10:00 pm
mcal wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 9:36 pm ...see una dey squabble about players/kids trained and brought up with silver spoon to come play for a disarrayed organization. I hope una dey factor in your bad and poor NFA.
Silver spoon? :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
Maybe by Naija standards but Eze group up in a rough and deprived part of south east London (Deptford). I seem to recall reading it was a single parent family.
He probably grew up buying food from ‘Tomi’s Kitchen’, ‘Island Bukka’ and ‘Agege Bread’ - all Nigerian restaurants on the Deptford High Street, walking distance from his house.

He learnt his trade playing in “cages” - like captured animals with no escape. It was a thing, much like ‘set’ in Naija but in real steel cages with concrete floors

He ain’t no ajebota just becos he grew up in London.
...by "silver spoon" I meant general life and procedures in England vs Nigeria,
Those rough and deprived areas you mentioned above, I bet are better than the so called high class enclaves in Nigeria. At least Eze had 24/7 electricity and water running, plus healthcare within a phone call away.
Why are we even struggling to get these players, when they are there for the taken in their "rough and deprived" neighborhoods?
We waited until they get plucked out, polished, and thrive under circumstances they only know and understand, then we notice them.
Again, you never disappoint. Did you ever live in Nigeria? Or should I ask where you grew up in Nigeria because you seem to have this warped believe that every Nigerian lives in a gutter.
he was born in the village and had a different perspective, you cannot blame him
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Otitokoro »

This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
kali wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 6:06 am Culture. A Nigerian kid born and raised in Europe is European. What they know about Nigeria is from family and intermittent visits. There is no reason they should play for Nigeria and if they do there is a vast gulf in standards of professionalism and organization. Nigeria should stop looking for the easy way out.There are 200 million Nigerians and at least 1-10 million play football. There are more Osihmens out there if we look. Westerhoff built the 1994 team by travelling the length and breadth of Nigeria to watch local matches. That is the kind of scouting Nigeria needs not watching EPL and European leagues and looking for Nigerian names.
Last edited by Otitokoro on Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by airwolex »

Well said Otitokoro.

If you have a Nigerian passport, you can play for Nigeria if you wish. Yall can hate if you like. Whether we are 2nd or 3rd choice is irrelevant, as long as they are good enough.

If you guys don't want to see these boys play for Nigeria, create academies in Ibadan, Owerri, Kano so that all these guys you detest so much won't get in the team.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by airwolex »

Eze and Chukwuemeka are good enough to play for the Eagles, fullstop. Nothing any of you guys can do about it, they will waltz in the team if they decide to play for Nigeria.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

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Otitokoro wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:20 pm This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
I've often made this point. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

It does make you wonder what type of person questions the legitimacy of a foreign born Nigerian.
I have my theories.
TBH, Kali might not be one of them but for some people you can just sense the resentment.
Lets not even go into the mixed-race Nigerians....
"Ole kuku ni gbogbo wọn "
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by mcal »

Lolly wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 12:26 pm
mcal wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 2:32 am
Damunk wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 10:00 pm
mcal wrote: Sat Mar 18, 2023 9:36 pm ...see una dey squabble about players/kids trained and brought up with silver spoon to come play for a disarrayed organization. I hope una dey factor in your bad and poor NFA.
Silver spoon? :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
Maybe by Naija standards but Eze group up in a rough and deprived part of south east London (Deptford). I seem to recall reading it was a single parent family.
He probably grew up buying food from ‘Tomi’s Kitchen’, ‘Island Bukka’ and ‘Agege Bread’ - all Nigerian restaurants on the Deptford High Street, walking distance from his house.

He learnt his trade playing in “cages” - like captured animals with no escape. It was a thing, much like ‘set’ in Naija but in real steel cages with concrete floors

He ain’t no ajebota just becos he grew up in London.
...by "silver spoon" I meant general life and procedures in England vs Nigeria,
Those rough and deprived areas you mentioned above, I bet are better than the so called high class enclaves in Nigeria. At least Eze had 24/7 electricity and water running, plus healthcare within a phone call away.
Why are we even struggling to get these players, when they are there for the taken in their "rough and deprived" neighborhoods?
We waited until they get plucked out, polished, and thrive under circumstances they only know and understand, then we notice them.
Again, you never disappoint. Did you ever live in Nigeria? Or should I ask where you grew up in Nigeria because you seem to have this warped believe that every Nigerian lives in a gutter.
...nope, those rich Nigerians all loaded with their house maids and boy boys live in a bloated looking prison-like enclave that resemble council estates in the UK, or what we call section 8 ghettos in the US. I have been to your upscale VI and Lekkis, except I have never set foot in Abuja since that place was built, and don't plan on because that place is as glorified too.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by kali »

Damunk wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:50 pm
Otitokoro wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:20 pm This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
I've often made this point. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

It does make you wonder what type of person questions the legitimacy of a foreign born Nigerian.
I have my theories.
TBH, Kali might not be one of them but for some people you can just sense the resentment.
Lets not even go into the mixed-race Nigerians....
Nobody is saying ban foreign kids. What I am saying is stop leaning on ready made and start looking for talent domestically. In 1994 there were tons of Britush Nigerians playing EPL football. John Fashanu, John Salako,Efan Ekoku. Westerhoff SCOUTED. Osihmen would not have been discovered if Amunike depended on referrals. He had an open camp policy looking at hundreds of players.

The 1994 team produced Nigerias best winger to date Finidi George. Its best attacking midfielder JJ Okocha. Its best support striker Amokachi.

There are lots of Osihmens out there.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Damunk »

kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:41 am
Damunk wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:50 pm
Otitokoro wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:20 pm This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
I've often made this point. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

It does make you wonder what type of person questions the legitimacy of a foreign born Nigerian.
I have my theories.
TBH, Kali might not be one of them but for some people you can just sense the resentment.
Lets not even go into the mixed-race Nigerians....
Nobody is saying ban foreign kids. What I am saying is stop leaning on ready made and start looking for talent domestically. In 1994 there were tons of Britush Nigerians playing EPL football. John Fashanu, John Salako,Efan Ekoku. Westerhoff SCOUTED. Osihmen would not have been discovered if Amunike depended on referrals. He had an open camp policy looking at hundreds of players.

The 1994 team produced Nigerias best winger to date Finidi George. Its best attacking midfielder JJ Okocha. Its best support striker Amokachi.
There are lots of Osihmens out there.
Bro we know there are lots of prototypes - but not Osimhens as we know him today.
Are you willing to wait for the Nigerian infrastructure to sufficiently develop before you find a ready-made Osimhen to slot into the SE? We are talking SE, not U-17 o. Let’s not get it twisted.

Osimhen himself left Nigeria as a mere kid - talented but undeveloped. It’s taken him 7 years to become what he is now. Seven years of growth and development with sports personnel and facilities that just don’t exist in Nigeria.

Let’s be real. Scouting talent locally and internationally are not mutually exclusive.
Across the board, all our top talents are jappa-ing for a reason and football is no exception.

Current examples are Orban and Akinsanmiro. Daga and Frederick (Benjamin) will soon join them. That’s four top young talents being creamed off for further ‘development’ abroad in a short space of time. There are dozens more.
It’s a hemorrhaging of talent and it is not going to slow down.
The only slowing down will be our football administered by authorities deploying misguided quota systems.
Meanwhile, the world moves on - Morocco. Algeria. Senegal. Ghana. And that’s just the African nations.

Yeah, let’s fix our system.
But wait! I remember saying this 20 years ago on this same forum. :lol:
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by kali »

Damunk wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 7:47 am
kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:41 am
Damunk wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:50 pm
Otitokoro wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:20 pm This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
I've often made this point. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

It does make you wonder what type of person questions the legitimacy of a foreign born Nigerian.
I have my theories.
TBH, Kali might not be one of them but for some people you can just sense the resentment.
Lets not even go into the mixed-race Nigerians....
Nobody is saying ban foreign kids. What I am saying is stop leaning on ready made and start looking for talent domestically. In 1994 there were tons of Britush Nigerians playing EPL football. John Fashanu, John Salako,Efan Ekoku. Westerhoff SCOUTED. Osihmen would not have been discovered if Amunike depended on referrals. He had an open camp policy looking at hundreds of players.

The 1994 team produced Nigerias best winger to date Finidi George. Its best attacking midfielder JJ Okocha. Its best support striker Amokachi.
There are lots of Osihmens out there.
Bro we know there are lots of prototypes - but not Osimhens as we know him today.
Are you willing to wait for the Nigerian infrastructure to sufficiently develop before you find a ready-made Osimhen to slot into the SE? We are talking SE, not U-17 o. Let’s not get it twisted.

Osimhen himself left Nigeria as a mere kid - talented but undeveloped. It’s taken him 7 years to become what he is now. Seven years of growth and development with sports personnel and facilities that just don’t exist in Nigeria.

Let’s be real. Scouting talent locally and internationally are not mutually exclusive.
Across the board, all our top talents are jappa-ing for a reason and football is no exception.

Current examples are Orban and Akinsanmiro. Daga and Frederick (Benjamin) will soon join them. That’s four top young talents being creamed off for further ‘development’ abroad in a short space of time. There are dozens more.
It’s a hemorrhaging of talent and it is not going to slow down.
The only slowing down will be our football administered by authorities deploying misguided quota systems.
Meanwhile, the world moves on - Morocco. Algeria. Senegal. Ghana. And that’s just the African nations.

Yeah, let’s fix our system.
But wait! I remember saying this 20 years ago on this same forum. :lol:
Osihmen left Nigeria at the same age as JJ Okocha as Sunday Oliseh. He is not Tammy Abraham with divided loyalty. Okocha was discovered also by accident in Enugu by German scouts.

The 1994 team had a whole lot of youth. Oliseh was 18. JJ was 21. Anokachi was 20. Finidi was 23.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by mcal »

Damunk wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 7:47 am
Bro we know there are lots of prototypes - but not Osimhens as we know him today.
Are you willing to wait for the Nigerian infrastructure to sufficiently develop before you find a ready-made Osimhen to slot into the SE? We are talking SE, not U-17 o. Let’s not get it twisted.

Osimhen himself left Nigeria as a mere kid - talented but undeveloped. It’s taken him 7 years to become what he is now. Seven years of growth and development with sports personnel and facilities that just don’t exist in Nigeria.

Let’s be real. Scouting talent locally and internationally are not mutually exclusive.
Across the board, all our top talents are jappa-ing for a reason and football is no exception.

Current examples are Orban and Akinsanmiro. Daga and Frederick (Benjamin) will soon join them. That’s four top young talents being creamed off for further ‘development’ abroad in a short space of time. There are dozens more.
It’s a hemorrhaging of talent and it is not going to slow down.
The only slowing down will be our football administered by authorities deploying misguided quota systems.
Meanwhile, the world moves on - Morocco. Algeria. Senegal. Ghana. And that’s just the African nations.

Yeah, let’s fix our system.
But wait! I remember saying this 20 years ago on this same forum. :lol:
...why is that the underlined in the year 2023, and counting.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Damunk »

kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 10:16 pm Osihmen left Nigeria at the same age as JJ Okocha as Sunday Oliseh. He is not Tammy Abraham with divided loyalty. Okocha was discovered also by accident in Enugu by German scouts.

The 1994 team had a whole lot of youth. Oliseh was 18. JJ was 21. Anokachi was 20. Finidi was 23.
“Divided loyalty” is just spin.
These players have options which is a more accurate way of putting it.
Might as well accuse any skilled Nigerian living and working abroad of “divided loyalty”. I don’t know about you but for most of us, it’s an option we chose to take and nothing to do with “loyalty”.

That kind of unnecessary spin is part of the subliminal discrimination and demonisation of foreign-borns that bubbles beneath the surface.
If you are a foreign-born Nigerian like some of us, it can be quite infuriating.
It’s not as if we haven’t had Nigeria-born players disrespect the national call to duty in the past by not turning up or whatever.
And anyway, any shame that has been brought to our nation’s football image has exclusively been delivered by Nigerians born and bred at home.
So this ‘loyalty’ thing is a convenient diversion.
Nigeria needs your skills and my skills a hundred times more than it will ever need a footballer’s skills.
Yet we are out here doing our thing and no one is accusing us of “divided loyalties” or being outright disloyal.

Options bro. That’s all it is.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Adisboy »

kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 10:16 pm
Damunk wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 7:47 am
kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:41 am
Damunk wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:50 pm
Otitokoro wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:20 pm This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
I've often made this point. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

It does make you wonder what type of person questions the legitimacy of a foreign born Nigerian.
I have my theories.
TBH, Kali might not be one of them but for some people you can just sense the resentment.
Lets not even go into the mixed-race Nigerians....
Nobody is saying ban foreign kids. What I am saying is stop leaning on ready made and start looking for talent domestically. In 1994 there were tons of Britush Nigerians playing EPL football. John Fashanu, John Salako,Efan Ekoku. Westerhoff SCOUTED. Osihmen would not have been discovered if Amunike depended on referrals. He had an open camp policy looking at hundreds of players.

The 1994 team produced Nigerias best winger to date Finidi George. Its best attacking midfielder JJ Okocha. Its best support striker Amokachi.
There are lots of Osihmens out there.
Bro we know there are lots of prototypes - but not Osimhens as we know him today.
Are you willing to wait for the Nigerian infrastructure to sufficiently develop before you find a ready-made Osimhen to slot into the SE? We are talking SE, not U-17 o. Let’s not get it twisted.

Osimhen himself left Nigeria as a mere kid - talented but undeveloped. It’s taken him 7 years to become what he is now. Seven years of growth and development with sports personnel and facilities that just don’t exist in Nigeria.

Let’s be real. Scouting talent locally and internationally are not mutually exclusive.
Across the board, all our top talents are jappa-ing for a reason and football is no exception.

Current examples are Orban and Akinsanmiro. Daga and Frederick (Benjamin) will soon join them. That’s four top young talents being creamed off for further ‘development’ abroad in a short space of time. There are dozens more.
It’s a hemorrhaging of talent and it is not going to slow down.
The only slowing down will be our football administered by authorities deploying misguided quota systems.
Meanwhile, the world moves on - Morocco. Algeria. Senegal. Ghana. And that’s just the African nations.

Yeah, let’s fix our system.
But wait! I remember saying this 20 years ago on this same forum. :lol:
Osihmen left Nigeria at the same age as JJ Okocha as Sunday Oliseh. He is not Tammy Abraham with divided loyalty. Okocha was discovered also by accident in Enugu by German scouts.

The 1994 team had a whole lot of youth. Oliseh was 18. JJ was 21. Anokachi was 20. Finidi was 23.
Kali has just contradicted his own argument that Westerhoff scouted all these players. From the 1994 team only Amokachi & Finidi can be said to be scouted by Westerhoff. Okocha, Oliseh, Siasia, Ikpeba were already Europe based players when he noticed them. The likes of Yekini Rufai & Oliha were already big domestic stars years before and were playing in the African continent. The current fact is the teams currently dominating Africa are packed with foreign born players such as Morocco, Algeria, Senegal & Ghana. So we should be smart not myopic in this day & age. The truth is the Nigerian system can't produce a world class player. It can only produce raw materials that need to go abroad to be developed over years. Let's keep it real.
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Damunk
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Damunk »

Kali, by the way…
Okocha wasn’t a ‘local’ discovery by German scouts o.
He was in Germany visiting and watching a team’s training session of some sort and was invited to join in.
The rest is history…
"Ole kuku ni gbogbo wọn "
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by kali »

Adisboy wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 10:26 am
kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 10:16 pm
Damunk wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 7:47 am
kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:41 am
Damunk wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:50 pm
Otitokoro wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:20 pm This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
I've often made this point. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

It does make you wonder what type of person questions the legitimacy of a foreign born Nigerian.
I have my theories.
TBH, Kali might not be one of them but for some people you can just sense the resentment.
Lets not even go into the mixed-race Nigerians....
Nobody is saying ban foreign kids. What I am saying is stop leaning on ready made and start looking for talent domestically. In 1994 there were tons of Britush Nigerians playing EPL football. John Fashanu, John Salako,Efan Ekoku. Westerhoff SCOUTED. Osihmen would not have been discovered if Amunike depended on referrals. He had an open camp policy looking at hundreds of players.

The 1994 team produced Nigerias best winger to date Finidi George. Its best attacking midfielder JJ Okocha. Its best support striker Amokachi.
There are lots of Osihmens out there.
Bro we know there are lots of prototypes - but not Osimhens as we know him today.
Are you willing to wait for the Nigerian infrastructure to sufficiently develop before you find a ready-made Osimhen to slot into the SE? We are talking SE, not U-17 o. Let’s not get it twisted.

Osimhen himself left Nigeria as a mere kid - talented but undeveloped. It’s taken him 7 years to become what he is now. Seven years of growth and development with sports personnel and facilities that just don’t exist in Nigeria.

Let’s be real. Scouting talent locally and internationally are not mutually exclusive.
Across the board, all our top talents are jappa-ing for a reason and football is no exception.

Current examples are Orban and Akinsanmiro. Daga and Frederick (Benjamin) will soon join them. That’s four top young talents being creamed off for further ‘development’ abroad in a short space of time. There are dozens more.
It’s a hemorrhaging of talent and it is not going to slow down.
The only slowing down will be our football administered by authorities deploying misguided quota systems.
Meanwhile, the world moves on - Morocco. Algeria. Senegal. Ghana. And that’s just the African nations.

Yeah, let’s fix our system.
But wait! I remember saying this 20 years ago on this same forum. :lol:
Osihmen left Nigeria at the same age as JJ Okocha as Sunday Oliseh. He is not Tammy Abraham with divided loyalty. Okocha was discovered also by accident in Enugu by German scouts.

The 1994 team had a whole lot of youth. Oliseh was 18. JJ was 21. Anokachi was 20. Finidi was 23.
Kali has just contradicted his own argument that Westerhoff scouted all these players. From the 1994 team only Amokachi & Finidi can be said to be scouted by Westerhoff. Okocha, Oliseh, Siasia, Ikpeba were already Europe based players when he noticed them. The likes of Yekini Rufai & Oliha were already big domestic stars years before and were playing in the African continent. The current fact is the teams currently dominating Africa are packed with foreign born players such as Morocco, Algeria, Senegal & Ghana. So we should be smart not myopic in this day & age. The truth is the Nigerian system can't produce a world class player. It can only produce raw materials that need to go abroad to be developed over years. Let's keep it real.
Westerhof scouted and discovered Finidi who played for Sharks, Amokachi in Kaduna and Oliseh in Julius Berger the local league.
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Re: England snubs its Nigerian options

Post by Adisboy »

kali wrote: Thu Mar 23, 2023 12:34 pm
Adisboy wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 10:26 am
kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 10:16 pm
Damunk wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 7:47 am
kali wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:41 am
Damunk wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:50 pm
Otitokoro wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 2:20 pm This has to be the one of the myopic and obtuse statements I have seen on this site in quite a while.
Its bad enough these kids face incredible racism in Europe and elsewhere. Yet, they are despised by people like you who claim to be from the motherland.
Whether you like it or not, these kids have Nigerian blood pulsing through their veins and as such, ARE Nigerians, albeit living in another country.
Its reasoning like yours that has led to the country being backward and can never progress.

People like you keep talking about the 'thousand Osimhen's and co' every day but we never see them. You are okay with the west plundering the resources of the continent but you're not okay when the continent rightfully takes back its very own.
Warped case of the Stockholm Syndrome!
I've often made this point. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

It does make you wonder what type of person questions the legitimacy of a foreign born Nigerian.
I have my theories.
TBH, Kali might not be one of them but for some people you can just sense the resentment.
Lets not even go into the mixed-race Nigerians....
Nobody is saying ban foreign kids. What I am saying is stop leaning on ready made and start looking for talent domestically. In 1994 there were tons of Britush Nigerians playing EPL football. John Fashanu, John Salako,Efan Ekoku. Westerhoff SCOUTED. Osihmen would not have been discovered if Amunike depended on referrals. He had an open camp policy looking at hundreds of players.

The 1994 team produced Nigerias best winger to date Finidi George. Its best attacking midfielder JJ Okocha. Its best support striker Amokachi.
There are lots of Osihmens out there.
Bro we know there are lots of prototypes - but not Osimhens as we know him today.
Are you willing to wait for the Nigerian infrastructure to sufficiently develop before you find a ready-made Osimhen to slot into the SE? We are talking SE, not U-17 o. Let’s not get it twisted.

Osimhen himself left Nigeria as a mere kid - talented but undeveloped. It’s taken him 7 years to become what he is now. Seven years of growth and development with sports personnel and facilities that just don’t exist in Nigeria.

Let’s be real. Scouting talent locally and internationally are not mutually exclusive.
Across the board, all our top talents are jappa-ing for a reason and football is no exception.

Current examples are Orban and Akinsanmiro. Daga and Frederick (Benjamin) will soon join them. That’s four top young talents being creamed off for further ‘development’ abroad in a short space of time. There are dozens more.
It’s a hemorrhaging of talent and it is not going to slow down.
The only slowing down will be our football administered by authorities deploying misguided quota systems.
Meanwhile, the world moves on - Morocco. Algeria. Senegal. Ghana. And that’s just the African nations.

Yeah, let’s fix our system.
But wait! I remember saying this 20 years ago on this same forum. :lol:
Osihmen left Nigeria at the same age as JJ Okocha as Sunday Oliseh. He is not Tammy Abraham with divided loyalty. Okocha was discovered also by accident in Enugu by German scouts.

The 1994 team had a whole lot of youth. Oliseh was 18. JJ was 21. Anokachi was 20. Finidi was 23.
Kali has just contradicted his own argument that Westerhoff scouted all these players. From the 1994 team only Amokachi & Finidi can be said to be scouted by Westerhoff. Okocha, Oliseh, Siasia, Ikpeba were already Europe based players when he noticed them. The likes of Yekini Rufai & Oliha were already big domestic stars years before and were playing in the African continent. The current fact is the teams currently dominating Africa are packed with foreign born players such as Morocco, Algeria, Senegal & Ghana. So we should be smart not myopic in this day & age. The truth is the Nigerian system can't produce a world class player. It can only produce raw materials that need to go abroad to be developed over years. Let's keep it real.
Westerhof scouted and discovered Finidi who played for Sharks, Amokachi in Kaduna and Oliseh in Julius Berger the local league.
As I pointed out earlier, only Finidi & Amokachi was discovered by Westerhoff. Oliseh was already playing in Belgium when he was called up in 1993. It was not Westerhoff.

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