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How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
by Tobi17
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:24 am
by EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Because population is no indication of how a country will perform in anything, if it were India and china would dominate all sports. There’re probably more people living in mainland Lagos than Croatia but one is significantly more productive than the other. Nigeria is the most unproductive country on earth. Our football will continue to suffer until we begin to do better.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:34 am
by Tobi17
EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:24 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Because population is no indication of how a country will perform in anything, if it were India and china would dominate all sports. There’re probably more people living in mainland Lagos than Croatia but one is significantly more productive than the other. Nigeria is the most unproductive country on earth. Our football will continue to suffer until we begin to do better.
My brother,
The India and China is a bit of an outlier, yes those two countries put together account for perhaps nearly half of the world's total population, but they have invested in only certain sports that are more popular to them. China for example do well in various Olympic sports because they invest more in those games, India do well in cricket cause it's popular among them...there's no knowing if or not they will excel I'm football in the coming years if they decide to take it more seriously and invest more in it (like USA and Canada did over the years)...Nigeria is the most populous black nation with a crazy football following, what's our excuse for underperforming in football? is it a case of just lack of proper infrastructural and structural investments in our grassroot tier, or are we really unproductive as a nation? I refuse to believe the latter is the case because we thrived in football in the past INSPITE OF various adversities like terrible planning, government interference, corruption etc
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:37 am
by Scipio Africanus
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments,
I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa ...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Go read up on Dinamo Zagreb and Hajduk Split
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:56 am
by EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:34 am
EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:24 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Because population is no indication of how a country will perform in anything, if it were India and china would dominate all sports. There’re probably more people living in mainland Lagos than Croatia but one is significantly more productive than the other. Nigeria is the most unproductive country on earth. Our football will continue to suffer until we begin to do better.
My brother,
The India and China is a bit of an outlier, yes those two countries put together account for perhaps nearly half of the world's total population, but they have invested in only certain sports that are more popular to them. China for example do well in various Olympic sports because they invest more in those games, India do well in cricket cause it's popular among them...there's no knowing if or not they will excel I'm football in the coming years if they decide to take it more seriously and invest more in it (like USA and Canada did over the years)...Nigeria is the most populous black nation with a crazy football following, what's our excuse for underperforming in football? is it a case of just lack of proper infrastructural and structural investments in our grassroot tier, or are we really unproductive as a nation? I refuse to believe the latter is the case because we thrived in football in the past INSPITE OF various adversities like terrible planning, government interference, corruption etc
Planning,investment and focus also matter. Having 200m black people does not necessarily mean that we’ll exceed in sports, there’s no evidence that the race of a population gives it an advantage without adequate planning and investment. Jamaicans are black, they’re the 2nd most successful in sprint races at the Olympics after the US. The success they’ve enjoyed is because of their focus on sprint races and the investments made in infrastructure and developing young talent. There’re about 700m blacks in Africa, millions more in the Caribbean and South America,None are close to Jamaica in tract and field. Having the raw physical talent is no indication of future success.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 2:14 am
by oscar52
Because they learn the right technique/fundamentals and build on that so they get better with time. Its the old argument, which is more likely to succeed, nature or nurture or a mixture? Moses Simon allowed to wear the SE jersey yet at this level as a winger he cant cross. Ndidi plays the DM position and cannot do a basic maneuver to get pass his man in tight spots. Uzoho does not cross his leg when defending a low shot etc. and the list goes on. Add all that together and you have yourself a team vulnerable to a real schooling on the field my a more technical team. Not to mention the little finer arts like knowing when to stay on your feet after a rough tackle or go down, Its like they build on faulty foundations, so when the going gets tough, they leak at the seams. Looking at the NPFL alone will tell you all you need to know, very few there even use proper techniques to head the ball. Nervousness then is likely to creep up when they meet more technical teams and they see how those ones get the basics right and the game seems so easy for them. In my first year in Uni, I tried out for the school soccer team, there were these German international students (3 of them), they dont do much with the ball at their feet but the clean technical way they head ball, kick a ball, or tackle is a thing of beauty. Its all about perfecting techniques for them. Its not the Croatians alone also, its the same with the Danes, the same ones that played our WC98 set off the park with dazzling quick moves in the round of 16. Another big thing is the age cheats, they rob legitimate talents opportunity to shine and grow and take up their spots and so when they should be blooming, they are already in decline and Nigerians being who they are become nostalgic about their U17 heroics give then longer time to come through when all evidence suggests they might be ojoro.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:02 am
by YUJAM
Uruguay has a population of under 4 million. Costa Rica has a population of less than 4 million
I think it comes down to the level or organization at the grassroots level
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:39 am
by Enugu II
EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:56 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:34 am
EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 1:24 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Because population is no indication of how a country will perform in anything, if it were India and china would dominate all sports. There’re probably more people living in mainland Lagos than Croatia but one is significantly more productive than the other. Nigeria is the most unproductive country on earth. Our football will continue to suffer until we begin to do better.
My brother,
The India and China is a bit of an outlier, yes those two countries put together account for perhaps nearly half of the world's total population, but they have invested in only certain sports that are more popular to them. China for example do well in various Olympic sports because they invest more in those games, India do well in cricket cause it's popular among them...there's no knowing if or not they will excel I'm football in the coming years if they decide to take it more seriously and invest more in it (like USA and Canada did over the years)...Nigeria is the most populous black nation with a crazy football following, what's our excuse for underperforming in football? is it a case of just lack of proper infrastructural and structural investments in our grassroot tier, or are we really unproductive as a nation? I refuse to believe the latter is the case because we thrived in football in the past INSPITE OF various adversities like terrible planning, government interference, corruption etc
Planning,investment and focus also matter. Having 200m black people does not necessarily mean that we’ll exceed in sports, there’s no evidence that the race of a population gives it an advantage without adequate planning and investment. Jamaicans are black, they’re the 2nd most successful in sprint races at the Olympics after the US. The success they’ve enjoyed is because of their focus on sprint races and the investments made in infrastructure and developing young talent. There’re about 700m blacks in Africa, millions more in the Caribbean and South America,None are close to Jamaica in tract and field. Having the raw physical talent is no indication of future success.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:48 am
by Sunset
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Its called culture! Something money or a large population can't buy and you must be mistaken if you think the best african leagues are better than the Croatian league. They might be more lucrative but aren't as good if we're talking about the actual level of football being played and that reflects on the national team.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:02 am
by EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA
Sunset wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:48 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Its called culture! Something money or a large population can't buy and you must be mistaken if you think the best african leagues are better than the Croatian league. They might be more lucrative but aren't as good if we're talking about the actual level of football being played and that reflects on the national team.
Kpom. Here we are in 2022. Clubs like Rangers, 3sc, Eyimba etc are on their last legs. Yet you expect a supply of quality players to SE? Gtfoh! No way.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:31 am
by Tobi17
EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:02 am
Sunset wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:48 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Its called culture! Something money or a large population can't buy and you must be mistaken if you think the best african leagues are better than the Croatian league. They might be more lucrative but aren't as good if we're talking about the actual level of football being played and that reflects on the national team.
Kpom. Here we are in 2022. Clubs like Rangers, 3sc, Eyimba etc are on their last legs. Yet you expect a supply of quality players to SE? Gtfoh! No way.
But it's not an entirely useless situation right? A club like Remo stars for instance is doing quite well with infrastructural development, player development and they are now investing more in maintaining ultra-modern sporting facilities...I know it's still not enough but that's a good start, hopefully other clubs can learn from the Remo model and develop their own structures (wishful thinking though).
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:35 am
by Tobi17
Sunset wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:48 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Its called culture! Something money or a large population can't buy and you must be mistaken if you think the best african leagues are better than the Croatian league. They might be more lucrative but aren't as good if we're talking about the actual level of football being played and that reflects on the national team.
Interesting take, I would have thought that with a massive population, it wouldn't be hard to always find and select a team of 11 talented players who can play well under a good coach, we were always made to believe that all the good players in Nigeria can be found on the streets and not in some fancy club or academy.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 7:55 am
by Sunset
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:35 am
Sunset wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:48 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Its called culture! Something money or a large population can't buy and you must be mistaken if you think the best african leagues are better than the Croatian league. They might be more lucrative but aren't as good if we're talking about the actual level of football being played and that reflects on the national team.
Interesting take, I would have thought that with a massive population, it wouldn't be hard to always find and select a team of 11 talented players who can play well under a good coach, we were always made to believe that all the good players in Nigeria can be found on the streets and not in some fancy club or academy.
The talent is no doubt there but without proper organization plus proper scouting, it all won't amount to much in the long run. The system as a whole is why we can't look at these things in an ideal manner. The reality remains that the domestic league where the best players in the country should be facing each other has been on a 4 month long break with no announced date of the new season so all they've been able to do is play pre season matches which is far a less competitive environment & puts them on the backfoot amongst their FB counterparts in match sharpness.
The talent is a plus but experience is what takes players to that next level, something most Nigerian players in general are lacking.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 8:11 am
by Damunk
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:35 am
Sunset wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:48 am
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Its called culture! Something money or a large population can't buy and you must be mistaken if you think the best african leagues are better than the Croatian league. They might be more lucrative but aren't as good if we're talking about the actual level of football being played and that reflects on the national team.
Interesting take, I would have thought that with a massive population, it wouldn't be hard to always find and select a team of 11 talented players who can play well under a good coach, we were always made to believe that all the good players in Nigeria can be found on the streets and not in some fancy club or academy.
With no structure everything relies on chance findings.
All the Nigerian sporting superstars have just been lucky to have been spotted and groomed with other factors falling in their favor. Our top athletes have almost exclusively moved out to the US and peaked from there, unlike the Jamaicans.
As for footballers, you only need to read the stories of Ighalo, Osimhen, Awoniyi, Nacho, Nwakali to see how simply fortunate they were to get spotted in the first place.
Both Nwakali and Awoniyi have been humble enough to say there were players much better than them that weren’t so fortunate.
Don’t get me wrong, they worked really hard, but in a country of 200m, we are really playing a game of chance.
Sure, we will always find talent, but not optimally. Too much waste.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 9:16 am
by waka-man
Good thread.
Here’s what I’ll say.
Yes we could do a better job of identifying and nurturing talent.
But even with the talent we currently have, we should be doing much better.
The biggest challenge is we don’t have the institutions and practices that create the conditions for success.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 4:06 pm
by TonyTheTigerKiller
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
If Anambra and Imo were countries, they would probably have won the World Cup by now. No quota systems to contend with
Cheers.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 4:22 pm
by EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:27 pm
by delisyomie don
they are part of old Yugoslavia which was a powerhouse in football. Specifically, the six republics that made up the federation - Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia (including the regions of Kosovo and Vojvodina), and Slovenia. It's probably Croatia that takes the chunk of excellent football players. As we all said population does not make your country a football country it takes a lot of effort not at the moment in Nigeria so many factors affecting football in Nigeria at moment.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:40 pm
by Sunset
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 9:34 pm
by Cellular
YUJAM wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:02 am
Uruguay has a population of under 4 million. Costa Rica has a population of less than 4 million
I think it comes down to the level or organization at the grassroots level
You think say the natives no know this?
Maybe na Juju?
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 10:26 pm
by King Futcha
Cellular wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 9:34 pm
YUJAM wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 3:02 am
Uruguay has a population of under 4 million. Costa Rica has a population of less than 4 million
I think it comes down to the level or organization at the grassroots level
You think say the natives no know this?
Maybe na Juju?
if only it were this simple mr president.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 4:31 am
by Cmoke
How come China and India are not World Cup champions?
Cmoke
Tobi17 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:36 am
Are achieving such unimaginably impressive feats in football? these is a country of only 4 million people (not even up to the population of the smallest state in the South East of Nigeria) talk-less of Nigeria, yet they are getting to the finals of major tournaments, I don't even think their local football league is better than the best football league here in Africa...so how are they churning out all these world class players? The thing really amazes me honestly.
Re: How come Croatia with a tiny population
Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2022 10:13 am
by deanotito
oscar52 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 2:14 am
Because they learn the right technique/fundamentals and build on that so they get better with time. Its the old argument, which is more likely to succeed, nature or nurture or a mixture? Moses Simon allowed to wear the SE jersey yet at this level as a winger he cant cross. Ndidi plays the DM position and cannot do a basic maneuver to get pass his man in tight spots. Uzoho does not cross his leg when defending a low shot etc. and the list goes on. Add all that together and you have yourself a team vulnerable to a real schooling on the field my a more technical team. Not to mention the little finer arts like knowing when to stay on your feet after a rough tackle or go down, Its like they build on faulty foundations, so when the going gets tough, they leak at the seams. Looking at the NPFL alone will tell you all you need to know, very few there even use proper techniques to head the ball. Nervousness then is likely to creep up when they meet more technical teams and they see how those ones get the basics right and the game seems so easy for them. In my first year in Uni, I tried out for the school soccer team, there were these German international students (3 of them), they dont do much with the ball at their feet but the clean technical way they head ball, kick a ball, or tackle is a thing of beauty. Its all about perfecting techniques for them. Its not the Croatians alone also, its the same with the Danes, the same ones that played our WC98 set off the park with dazzling quick moves in the round of 16. Another big thing is the age cheats, they rob legitimate talents opportunity to shine and grow and take up their spots and so when they should be blooming, they are already in decline and Nigerians being who they are become nostalgic about their U17 heroics give then longer time to come through when all evidence suggests they might be ojoro.
You make so much sense. You need some “nature”, but without good “nurture”, you’ll always underperform.
High Population plus nurturing should outperform Low Population plus nurturing, but if you don’t have nurturing, your population will just waste
