List of Local coaches for SE
Moderators: Moderator Team, phpBB2 - Administrators
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
For some odd reason, I am not a fan of his. There are others who may have achieved more.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Odas wrote: ↑Tue Dec 13, 2022 8:42 pmEmir, where is my name? Please add my name to the list, I want to coach the SE's team. I promise to win the AFCON CupEMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:57 pm Oya, attention all locos, pls list all Local coaches you think are good enough to Coach SE back to glory. Doesn’t matter where they coach as long as they’re Nigerian. Here’s a list of some we know of already.
Eguavoen
Siasia
Finidi
Amokachi
Salisu
Amunike
Oliseh
Oya add yours and pick 1. I want non of the above and below.
I will include you on my list. After all, you have a green pali.
And if you can talk loud, you will impress Nigerian fans and increase your chances of getting the job.
Please, make sure you have won a state Kindergarten soccer tournament.
"Ole kuku ni gbogbo wọn "
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Damunk,Damunk wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 8:17 amOdas wrote: ↑Tue Dec 13, 2022 8:42 pmEmir, where is my name? Please add my name to the list, I want to coach the SE's team. I promise to win the AFCON CupEMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:57 pm Oya, attention all locos, pls list all Local coaches you think are good enough to Coach SE back to glory. Doesn’t matter where they coach as long as they’re Nigerian. Here’s a list of some we know of already.
Eguavoen
Siasia
Finidi
Amokachi
Salisu
Amunike
Oliseh
Oya add yours and pick 1. I want non of the above and below.
I will include you on my list. After all, you have a green pali.
And if you can talk loud, you will impress Nigerian fans and increase your chances of getting the job.
Please, make sure you have won a state Kindergarten soccer tournament.
Not only have I won the tournaments you mentioned, but I have also won intra-city and interstates' tournaments, so I am fully qualified for the SE's job.
Thus, Emir and Damunk, please add my name in your lists
And the BIBLE says: The race is NOT for the swift, neither is the battle for the strong nor ... but time and chance makes them all.
Ecclesiastes 1:18: For in much wisdom is much grief and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow.
Ecclesiastes 1:18: For in much wisdom is much grief and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow.
- imehjunior
- Egg
- Posts: 7154
- Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:51 am
- Location: No man's land
- Contact:
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
From the list here yes I prefer foreign and I like the South African coach that coached Al Ahly .lacidi wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 11:17 amThe one that his own country does not want? Must you guys always want something foreign? Habapackerland wrote: ↑Sun Nov 27, 2022 9:13 pmTobi17 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 27, 2022 9:01 pm Maybe we need to try another approach and hire coaches from other African countries that have proven track records in the stronger leagues, there are decent coaches in Egypt, South Africa, Tunisia and Morocco we could try...unpopular submission but I'm tired of this European journeymen coaches that just want to use Nigeria to pimp up their poor CVs.
I want that South African guy.
"Nigeria's No.1 problem is that all the smart Nigerians and those who know the solutions to everything are hiding here on CE." 1naija
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
"Winning one trophy is good, I tell you. No matter what trophy it might be, you've got to take it.” - Sir Alex Ferguson
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
He's coaching a team in the Saudi 2nd division, same league as Emmanuel Egbo.imehjunior wrote: ↑Thu Dec 15, 2022 8:43 pmFrom the list here yes I prefer foreign and I like the South African coach that coached Al Ahly .lacidi wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 11:17 amThe one that his own country does not want? Must you guys always want something foreign? Habapackerland wrote: ↑Sun Nov 27, 2022 9:13 pmTobi17 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 27, 2022 9:01 pm Maybe we need to try another approach and hire coaches from other African countries that have proven track records in the stronger leagues, there are decent coaches in Egypt, South Africa, Tunisia and Morocco we could try...unpopular submission but I'm tired of this European journeymen coaches that just want to use Nigeria to pimp up their poor CVs.
I want that South African guy.
-
- Eaglet
- Posts: 30087
- Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 10:39 am
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
When was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
OCCUPY NFF!!
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Well, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 amWhen was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
"Winning one trophy is good, I tell you. No matter what trophy it might be, you've got to take it.” - Sir Alex Ferguson
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Felarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 amWell, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 amWhen was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Ok, we know the ex-international route has worked for us and other African countries. Outside Africa, for sure it's a winning one, Scaloni and Deschamps. Per achievers in the country, if their experience is only in the NPFL, I doubt they'd make good candidates for reasons specified above. Atleast success on the continent needs to be demonstrated as the SE are an international team.Enugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:52 amFelarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 amWell, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 amWhen was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
"Winning one trophy is good, I tell you. No matter what trophy it might be, you've got to take it.” - Sir Alex Ferguson
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Enugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:52 amFelarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 amWell, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 amWhen was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
Success at what; in what environment?
Form is temporary; Class is Permanent!
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:03 amEnugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:52 amFelarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 amWell, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 amWhen was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
Success at what (coaching); in what environment (Nigeria)?
The difficulties of statistical thinking describes a puzzling limitation of our mind: our excessive confidence in what we believe we know, and our apparent inability to acknowledge the full extent of our ignorance and the uncertainty of the world we live in. We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events -- Daniel Kahneman (2011), Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Chief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.Enugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:31 amtxj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:03 amEnugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:52 amFelarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 amWell, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 amWhen was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
Success at what (coaching); in what environment (Nigeria)?
"Winning one trophy is good, I tell you. No matter what trophy it might be, you've got to take it.” - Sir Alex Ferguson
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
ENGLISH PREMIERSHIP CHAMP20NS, UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WINN3RS
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
A very apt description of Oliseh's career as a coach at International & club levelfelarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 7:22 amChief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.Enugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:31 amtxj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:03 amEnugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:52 amFelarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 amWell, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 amWhen was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:36 am The local NPFL coaches are overlooked because of the environment they're in. I wouldn't hire a local chemistry school teacher from a school of uncompleted buildings (cement block boxes) with a black board, no running water, no windows, no computers and unconnected. A teacher that practices in a lab with lack of test tubes, bunsen burners etc. Won't hire this teacher to teach kids in a modern classroom with facilities like whiteboards, acoustics and noise design, ventilation and air quality, smart lighting, temp control etc. Such a teacher would need to go prove himself first in this type of environment, sorry.
Our best bet if we want our own are Siasia or Oliseh or better still a combination of both...IMHO. It was a disgrace here when peeps (because of their disdain for Oliseh) overlooked the complete incompetence of the NFF and the rogue move publicly used to prove they had paid him. We let the NFF off the hook there and it's no wonder where we are today. Ofcourse once in a while a coach like Keshi will come along and achieve hence we foolishly think it's a workable environment to work in.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
Success at what (coaching); in what environment (Nigeria)?
The fact people still mention his name wrt coaching is hilarious to say the least.
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Sunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 8:28 amA very apt description of Oliseh's career as a coach at International & club levelfelarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 7:22 amChief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.Enugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:31 amtxj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:03 amEnugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:52 amFelarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 amWell, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.EMIR KONGI JAFFI JOFFA wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:33 am
When was the last time you saw Oliseh or Siasia coaching a team of pros? If we want to move forward we can’t keep bringing failed coaches back.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
Success at what (coaching); in what environment (Nigeria)?
The fact people still mention his name wrt coaching is hilarious to say the least.
His name keeps being mentioned cus we have very few homegrown options that are credible, if we want tbh with ourselves.
You cannot produce quality local coaches in the environment in which football is played/coached in Nigeria. That's a simple fact.
None of the clubs are competitive in the continental competitions; not even in CHAN...
In the 1990s I published a post WC review in The Guardian. I stated then that I expected Nigeria to continue using FCs for another 4-6yrs; long enough for the Keshi generation to retire and transition to coaching.
Look at his generation and the ones that followed. How many of them can you credibly point to as realistic options outside Keshi, SS, SO...?
Now contrast that to CIV or Senegal, even Zambia and you see the likes of Charles Musonda from the Keshi generation. You see Kolo Toure and how he made the transition
Even Yaya Toure, who came thru Liverpool to understudy Klopp.
Compare that to our own ex-pros, like Kanu, JJ, Ikpeba, etc. They are just not interested...
Form is temporary; Class is Permanent!
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
I'm guessing Amunike must be playing golf.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 5:51 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 8:28 amA very apt description of Oliseh's career as a coach at International & club levelfelarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 7:22 amChief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.Enugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:31 amtxj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 4:03 amEnugu II wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:52 amFelarey,felarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:02 am
Well, one thing we know now is there is a pattern of success with ex internationals coaching. We see Regragui, Cisse, Song, Keshi and I'd add Siasia. Ex internationals that have "been there, done that" credentials and are able to connect with their players in a unique way. This seems to be an established path to success as seen in several countries and in our case, the best guys are Siasia and Oliseh. For me, I think it's very unfair to judge/condemn these guys giving the incompetence they had to deal with. Keshi achieved irrespective of this incompetence, but that is why we have nothing to work with today. Oliseh has not retired and is currently involved in the FIFA Technical Study Group. He's rubbing minds on every WC game with the likes of Arsene Wenger and Klinsmann. I dunno where Siasia is at with his FIFA problems.
There are successful coaches in Nigeria and they are by no means limited to ex-internationals. There are several achievers in the country that have not played a second for Nigeria. Let's not limited that pool.
Success at what (coaching); in what environment (Nigeria)?
The fact people still mention his name wrt coaching is hilarious to say the least.
His name keeps being mentioned cus we have very few homegrown options that are credible, if we want tbh with ourselves.
You cannot produce quality local coaches in the environment in which football is played/coached in Nigeria. That's a simple fact.
None of the clubs are competitive in the continental competitions; not even in CHAN...
In the 1990s I published a post WC review in The Guardian. I stated then that I expected Nigeria to continue using FCs for another 4-6yrs; long enough for the Keshi generation to retire and transition to coaching.
Look at his generation and the ones that followed. How many of them can you credibly point to as realistic options outside Keshi, SS, SO...?
Now contrast that to CIV or Senegal, even Zambia and you see the likes of Charles Musonda from the Keshi generation. You see Kolo Toure and how he made the transition
Even Yaya Toure, who came thru Liverpool to understudy Klopp.
Compare that to our own ex-pros, like Kanu, JJ, Ikpeba, etc. They are just not interested...
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Sunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:18 pmI'm guessing Amunike must be playing golf.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 5:51 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 8:28 amA very apt description of Oliseh's career as a coach at International & club levelfelarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 7:22 amChief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.
The fact people still mention his name wrt coaching is hilarious to say the least.
His name keeps being mentioned cus we have very few homegrown options that are credible, if we want tbh with ourselves.
You cannot produce quality local coaches in the environment in which football is played/coached in Nigeria. That's a simple fact.
None of the clubs are competitive in the continental competitions; not even in CHAN...
In the 1990s I published a post WC review in The Guardian. I stated then that I expected Nigeria to continue using FCs for another 4-6yrs; long enough for the Keshi generation to retire and transition to coaching.
Look at his generation and the ones that followed. How many of them can you credibly point to as realistic options outside Keshi, SS, SO...?
Now contrast that to CIV or Senegal, even Zambia and you see the likes of Charles Musonda from the Keshi generation. You see Kolo Toure and how he made the transition
Even Yaya Toure, who came thru Liverpool to understudy Klopp.
Compare that to our own ex-pros, like Kanu, JJ, Ikpeba, etc. They are just not interested...
I forgot him; also Egbo.
But my overall point remains. Just contrast this with the situation in other countries.
Form is temporary; Class is Permanent!
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
The idea that ex internationals that transition to coaching are credible doesn't hold much weight IMO, and a great reputation as a player won't hide the reality of an incompetent coach. Its not for everybody and there are too many examples of that being the case so i can't knock guys who aren't interested. And you literally mentioned at most 2 "potential options" in the Toure brothers from CIV while Musonda's a fitness coach for Congolese side. Seems like you're trying to exaggerate a point here.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:47 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:18 pmI'm guessing Amunike must be playing golf.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 5:51 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 8:28 amA very apt description of Oliseh's career as a coach at International & club levelfelarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 7:22 amChief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.
The fact people still mention his name wrt coaching is hilarious to say the least.
His name keeps being mentioned cus we have very few homegrown options that are credible, if we want tbh with ourselves.
You cannot produce quality local coaches in the environment in which football is played/coached in Nigeria. That's a simple fact.
None of the clubs are competitive in the continental competitions; not even in CHAN...
In the 1990s I published a post WC review in The Guardian. I stated then that I expected Nigeria to continue using FCs for another 4-6yrs; long enough for the Keshi generation to retire and transition to coaching.
Look at his generation and the ones that followed. How many of them can you credibly point to as realistic options outside Keshi, SS, SO...?
Now contrast that to CIV or Senegal, even Zambia and you see the likes of Charles Musonda from the Keshi generation. You see Kolo Toure and how he made the transition
Even Yaya Toure, who came thru Liverpool to understudy Klopp.
Compare that to our own ex-pros, like Kanu, JJ, Ikpeba, etc. They are just not interested...
I forgot him; also Egbo.
But my overall point remains. Just contrast this with the situation in other countries.
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
Sunset wrote: ↑Sat Dec 17, 2022 5:19 pmThe idea that ex internationals that transition to coaching are credible doesn't hold much weight IMO, and a great reputation as a player won't hide the reality of an incompetent coach. Its not for everybody and there are too many examples of that being the case so i can't knock guys who aren't interested. And you literally mentioned at most 2 "potential options" in the Toure brothers from CIV while Musonda's a fitness coach for Congolese side. Seems like you're trying to exaggerate a point here.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:47 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:18 pmI'm guessing Amunike must be playing golf.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 5:51 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 8:28 amA very apt description of Oliseh's career as a coach at International & club levelfelarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 7:22 amChief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.
The fact people still mention his name wrt coaching is hilarious to say the least.
His name keeps being mentioned cus we have very few homegrown options that are credible, if we want tbh with ourselves.
You cannot produce quality local coaches in the environment in which football is played/coached in Nigeria. That's a simple fact.
None of the clubs are competitive in the continental competitions; not even in CHAN...
In the 1990s I published a post WC review in The Guardian. I stated then that I expected Nigeria to continue using FCs for another 4-6yrs; long enough for the Keshi generation to retire and transition to coaching.
Look at his generation and the ones that followed. How many of them can you credibly point to as realistic options outside Keshi, SS, SO...?
Now contrast that to CIV or Senegal, even Zambia and you see the likes of Charles Musonda from the Keshi generation. You see Kolo Toure and how he made the transition
Even Yaya Toure, who came thru Liverpool to understudy Klopp.
Compare that to our own ex-pros, like Kanu, JJ, Ikpeba, etc. They are just not interested...
I forgot him; also Egbo.
But my overall point remains. Just contrast this with the situation in other countries.
Its not the only pathway to coaching, but it certainly is the most dominant pathway in the world.
And it is the pathway that has resulted in the most success, even while recognizing that there are a few exceptions.
In the continent, it is increasingly the most dominant. Which means that the more ex-pros you have transitioning to coaching, the greater your options.
Outside of this pathway, the local league is your most sustainable long term option. But you have to have a quality and competitive league, which incubates the coaches.
We have a dysfunctional league in almost every material particular. Plus we do not have any truly professional clubs...
The NIS is a moribund institution and has been near dead for a long time.
So even when you train coaches, they have practically no credible environment to practice and grow..
Form is temporary; Class is Permanent!
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Liverpool, European Champions 2005.
We watched this very boring video, 500 times, of Sacchi doing defensive drills, using sticks and without the ball, with Maldini, Baresi and Albertini. We used to think before then that if the other players are better, you have to lose. After that we learned anything is possible – you can beat better teams by using tactics." Jurgen Klopp
Re: List of Local coaches for SE
The point is we have as much if not more former players venturing into coaching than those countries you mentioned. Its interesting that on one hand you complain about ex-internationals not being interested in coaching but then attempt to belittle one who's trying to go that same route. I can't be knocking anyones credentials its on how they apply themselves that really matters in the end.txj wrote: ↑Sat Dec 17, 2022 10:12 pmSunset wrote: ↑Sat Dec 17, 2022 5:19 pmThe idea that ex internationals that transition to coaching are credible doesn't hold much weight IMO, and a great reputation as a player won't hide the reality of an incompetent coach. Its not for everybody and there are too many examples of that being the case so i can't knock guys who aren't interested. And you literally mentioned at most 2 "potential options" in the Toure brothers from CIV while Musonda's a fitness coach for Congolese side. Seems like you're trying to exaggerate a point here.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:47 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 6:18 pmI'm guessing Amunike must be playing golf.txj wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 5:51 pmSunset wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 8:28 amA very apt description of Oliseh's career as a coach at International & club levelfelarey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 7:22 am
Chief, with sub par environments come certain limitations, no matter how good the individual is. It's not a shot on the individual but at the system. For instance a chef in a backyard kitchen with clay pots and wood burners could whip up correct peppersoup, efo riro and yam porridge. He could be excellent at it. But this chef can never make a good Texan smoked brisket that requires slow cooking. Put the same chef in a modern kitchen with Wolf appliances and he might just burn the house down.
The fact people still mention his name wrt coaching is hilarious to say the least.
His name keeps being mentioned cus we have very few homegrown options that are credible, if we want tbh with ourselves.
You cannot produce quality local coaches in the environment in which football is played/coached in Nigeria. That's a simple fact.
None of the clubs are competitive in the continental competitions; not even in CHAN...
In the 1990s I published a post WC review in The Guardian. I stated then that I expected Nigeria to continue using FCs for another 4-6yrs; long enough for the Keshi generation to retire and transition to coaching.
Look at his generation and the ones that followed. How many of them can you credibly point to as realistic options outside Keshi, SS, SO...?
Now contrast that to CIV or Senegal, even Zambia and you see the likes of Charles Musonda from the Keshi generation. You see Kolo Toure and how he made the transition
Even Yaya Toure, who came thru Liverpool to understudy Klopp.
Compare that to our own ex-pros, like Kanu, JJ, Ikpeba, etc. They are just not interested...
I forgot him; also Egbo.
But my overall point remains. Just contrast this with the situation in other countries.
Its not the only pathway to coaching, but it certainly is the most dominant pathway in the world.
And it is the pathway that has resulted in the most success, even while recognizing that there are a few exceptions.
In the continent, it is increasingly the most dominant. Which means that the more ex-pros you have transitioning to coaching, the greater your options.
Outside of this pathway, the local league is your most sustainable long term option. But you have to have a quality and competitive league, which incubates the coaches.
We have a dysfunctional league in almost every material particular. Plus we do not have any truly professional clubs...
The NIS is a moribund institution and has been near dead for a long time.
So even when you train coaches, they have practically no credible environment to practice and grow..
And Nigeria as a whole is not a place that respects professionalism which is why we're in this mess in the first place, so all we can do is support those that try to overcome the constraints of the system.
And Remo Stars for example are a professionally run club.